Too much hysteria ruining Spurs

[provence]

It is not Levy. It is not Ramos. It is not the players. It is not even Comolli. Because they are all doing what they can to resurrect the sleeping giant which is Tottenham Hotspur. The elements that are blocking Spurs’ way are the newspaper- and fan-driven hysteria that has erupted on the basis of a few bad results.

Why is it that a lot of fans can see no longer than the score line? Booing your favourite team is not acceptable in my book. We stand by the team at all times – even more so in troubled times. And you always have to ask yourself: Did the players put in the effort?

Right now, the team is struggling to find the flow in their game. But how can it be any different with so many new players? Ask yourself how fast you adopted to full use when you last changed jobs. The game plan for Spurs this season has to be totally different without Keane/Berbatov. But it will take a while to get that going. Accept that and keep perspective. We are not relegated a couple of weeks into October. In fact we are still competing in all four competitions.

OK, so we are not playing to our full potential. But it will come – not least with the competent help of enthusiastic and positive supporters. Don’t get carried away by the media coverage.

Why is it that reporters and pundits are totally unable to analyse beyond the score line? Well, they have their fixed agenda: they think that drama sells newspapers. And they will dramatise everything they get their hands on.

This means that they have specific modus operandi for the situation in which Spurs find themselves right now: That is to foresee the imminent sacking of the manager, to go back 92 years in the annals for completely irrelevant statistics, to take players’ quotes out of context to highlight the angle which holds most drama etc…and then to excel in the media's latest favourite pass time: To quote each other relentlessly with no questions asked – and thus creating a veritable storm out of even the slightest breeze.

But nowhere in the M.O. is there a place for perspective and for intelligent analysis. Because that is far too complex for anyone in the media. And it doesn’t serve their purpose.

When we are subjected to this one-dimensional hot air media coverage, we have to keep our own perspective. I, for one, purposely avoid reading any of it. I have no use for it. It is in my book simply useless. It has no relevant purpose. It doesn’t offer anything positive or constructive.

I know that wins in the end are all that matter. And I like Spurs to win just as much as the next supporter. But ‘in the end’ really means May. And we will climb up the table before that. But until we do, the team need unconditional support, and the players will gel eventually.

Ramos did not become a lousy manager over night. The players did not lose their huge potential over night. Levy might have been a little too fixated on getting the most out of player sales this summer. But we can’t use any of the Monday morning quarterbacking or other hindsight right now. All the negative hype that the more fickle minded supporters and the media create will only serve to undermine the team and the results we really want. So get behind the team and don’t get sucked into the all-destroying media spiral.

[Brettles]

fantastic, bravo sir.

[JimmyG2]

Totally agree.However mistakes have been made and here is the place to analyse them.
I'm pretty certain that Ramos and hes the man that matters will pay no attention to the press or the fans for that matter.Levy is another matter. We must in public and especially at WHL support the players the club and the team.
If we were to ignore the press ,especially on here,there would be more room for informed analysis,between friends rather than responding to todays press vendetta,whatever it happens to be .
This week its England and Ashley Cole so we may get some breathing space.

[mawspurs]

Great post provence. As I have said on other threads lets stop the blame culture and get on with being positive and backing our team. They will click and when they do we will be able to take on anybody.

[Shirtfront]

While I agree with your analysis of the press, and it's vested interest in creating drama, I see no more analysis or thought in your article than in theirs. I admire your intention; but where is the analysis? "Give it time and it will all come right"?

You say Levy, Commolli and Ramos are doing all they can and that therefore this is not their fault. Nonsense. Of course they are doing what they think is right. The question, and one you completely neglect to address, is: is what they think is right, actually right?

You ask us to be patient; to give it time. That short sited, short term reactions to temporary problems are no way to achieve long term success. I couldn't agree more; and was saying exactly that this time last year.....when Levy decided to fire Jol for only managing to come 5th, two seasons in a row. How can you expect the fans to take a long term view when their Chairman patently and expressly took such a short term one? When he decided, utterly prematurely, to undermine Jol and dismantle his squad on the premise that Jol had "taken us as far as he could". It was his hysterical (greedy) management, not the fans, that sacrificed all the progress we had made since the Hoddle era. We were still singing Jol's name ffs.

So before you look at the fans as the source of knee jerk, short termist, get rich quick attitudes try looking at the people who, long before this crisis, decided that the right thing to do was duplicitously and unscrupulously undermine the man who had brought us the most success since Birkenshaw and dismantle the sqaud that won us our first trophy in a decade.

[Garm]

So before you look at the fans as the source of knee jerk, short termist, get rich quick attitudes try looking at the people who, long before this crisis, decided that the right thing to do was duplicitously and unscrupulously undermine the man who had brought us the most success since Birkenshaw and dismantle the sqaud that won us our first trophy in a decade.

:clap:

[Azrael]

While I agree with your analysis of the press, and it's vested interest in creating drama, I see no more analysis or thought in your article than in theirs. I admire your intention; but where is the analysis? "Give it time and it will all come right"?

You say Levy, Commolli and Ramos are doing all they can and that therefore this is not their fault. Nonsense. Of course they are doing what they think is right. The question, and one you completely neglect to address, is: is what they think is right, actually right?

You ask us to be patient; to give it time. That short sited, short term reactions to temporary problems are no way to achieve long term success. I couldn't agree more; and was saying exactly that this time last year.....when Levy decided to fire Jol for only managing to come 5th, two seasons in a row. How can you expect the fans to take a long term view when their Chairman patently and expressly took such a short term one? When he decided, utterly prematurely, to undermine Jol and dismantle his squad on the premise that Jol had "taken us as far as he could". It was his hysterical (greedy) management, not the fans, that sacrificed all the progress we had made since the Hoddle era. We were still singing Jol's name ffs.

So before you look at the fans as the source of knee jerk, short termist, get rich quick attitudes try looking at the people who, long before this crisis, decided that the right thing to do was duplicitously and unscrupulously undermine the man who had brought us the most success since Birkenshaw and dismantle the sqaud that won us our first trophy in a decade.I absolutely agree. Although I do agree with one aspect of the opening post...and that's that fans should never boo the players under any circumstances. If they have a problem they should focus it at the manager/DOF/chairman triumverate only.

[NeverRed]

I absolutely agree. Although I do agree with one aspect of the opening post...and that's that fans should never boo the players under any circumstances. If they have a problem they should focus it at the manager/DOF/chairman triumverate only.

Yes but if a player turns up disinterested in a match, and only gives a fraction of the effort they could, then perhaps they would deserve it. Players are not unaccountable too, they get paid a fortune to perform for us. In the same breath though, I am not in agreement with booing after a loss in which the team has tried hard for victory. It has become too common place at spurs, and the final result is not all we should look at... i mean these days we even boo going into half time at 1-0... it would be much more effective to scream support for 90 minutes and show the players our commitment - leading by example if you like

[Azrael]

Yes but if a player turns up disinterested in a match, and only gives a fraction of the effort they could, then perhaps they would deserve it. Players are not unaccountable too, they get paid a fortune to perform for us. In the same breath though, I am not in agreement with booing after a loss in which the team has tried hard for victory. It has become too common place at spurs, and the final result is not all we should look at... i mean these days we even boo going into half time at 1-0... it would be much more effective to scream support for 90 minutes and show the players our commitment - leading by example if you like

I agree that a player who doesn't put in his all deserves what he gets. But the problem is, as you hint at, that most of the boo boys can't tell the difference between a sweat and all performance and a lazy one so they boo them all. I would rather us always support the team and the lazy players get dropped by the manager.

[battspur]

While I agree with your analysis of the press, and it's vested interest in creating drama, I see no more analysis or thought in your article than in theirs. I admire your intention; but where is the analysis? "Give it time and it will all come right"?

You say Levy, Commolli and Ramos are doing all they can and that therefore this is not their fault. Nonsense. Of course they are doing what they think is right. The question, and one you completely neglect to address, is: is what they think is right, actually right?

You ask us to be patient; to give it time. That short sited, short term reactions to temporary problems are no way to achieve long term success. I couldn't agree more; and was saying exactly that this time last year.....when Levy decided to fire Jol for only managing to come 5th, two seasons in a row. How can you expect the fans to take a long term view when their Chairman patently and expressly took such a short term one? When he decided, utterly prematurely, to undermine Jol and dismantle his squad on the premise that Jol had "taken us as far as he could". It was his hysterical (greedy) management, not the fans, that sacrificed all the progress we had made since the Hoddle era. We were still singing Jol's name ffs.

So before you look at the fans as the source of knee jerk, short termist, get rich quick attitudes try looking at the people who, long before this crisis, decided that the right thing to do was duplicitously and unscrupulously undermine the man who had brought us the most success since Birkenshaw and dismantle the sqaud that won us our first trophy in a decade.

Do you really understand to what degree the constant negative press has had on every player employee & supporter of this club over the past 2 years.
We all thought Jol was a great guy, but his record was not perfect by any stretch of the imagination.
The press generated & kept alive all the negative elements that helped lead to the loss of 2 of our best players. Spurs and relegation meltdown have been back page fodder for weeks. What analysis do you want John Motson.

Things have happened behind closed doors that we dont know about so how can anyone really know.

That said, having a bit of a strong minded hard bastard in Midfield as an option is the one main aspect that has been missing for years and would be a good thing right now, (- not quite 'analysis' but a bit obvious dont you think, Oh and a bit of luck would not go a miss !)

[stemark44]

There must be an awful lot of Tottenham fans who also go and give a lack of support to the England team too!

[JoeT]

Good article; one maybe that we need to read every now and then....and good for you for being one of the first supporters 'mawspurs'; your posts are for the most part positive and constructive.
As for the Jol talk, can't we finally let it go? Yes the way in which he was undermined and fired was unethical to say the least, but in my mind he had 'lost the plot' as far as his tactical decisions in games was concerned......and a lot of you on here thought so as well. He has landed another - pretty good - coaching assignment and is having some success there. We are all pleased for him. Now let's make sure that the same thing doesn't happen to our present coach!

[DC_Boy]

good post provence - but as jg says this and other forums are the place to debate the team etc - at the ground support not debate and analysis should be the priority

[eddiebailey]

The press is what it is. If a club as powerful as Spurs find themselves at bottom of the table, the press are going to have a feeding frenzy; if they find themselves at the bottom of the table having sacked a popular manager and spent a lot of money on glamorous signings, then that is jam on it.

No time for fans who boo players, but the club is getting the press it can expect.

[pablo73]

The press is what it is. If a club as powerful as Spurs find themselves at bottom of the table, the press are going to have a feeding frenzy; if they find themselves at the bottom of the table having sacked a popular manager and spent a lot of money on glamorous signings, then that is jam on it.

No time for fans who boo players, but the club is getting the press it can expect.

absolutely spot on. while I agree with the general sentiment of the thread, I think it's very naive. The tabloid press are the lowest of the low and are more prone to feeding frenzies but by god do we make it easy for them.

It is Levy's fault. of course it is. The buck stops with him and the only coach he did not choose was by far the most successful (so far) and then he sacked him. He decided, in his infinite wisdom that we needed a director of football and it hasn't worked. I don't know if Daniel Levy has a lot of relatives on this site but the support he gets amazes me. I think he is pulling the wool over a lot of eyes and laughing all the way to the bank.

[gibb]

In theory what you are saying is totally correct & i cant argue with it,
but in reality if we lose to stoke on sunday then we all know what kind of posts we will be reading on this site - Ramos is clueless, jenas its all your fault, bentley go back to blackurn u suck etc. etc.

Never mind the crap that will be printed in the tabloids

I for one promise to post a positive comment after sundays game,
win, lose or draw......

THFC....

[SouthLondonSpur]

Thanks Provence, nice to read some positive vibes on here. Its all doom and gloom lately. Whilst I am downbeat about our play, we are making an effort. If players did not seem bothered about losing I would be really worried.

The next few weeks are going to be difficult.

[battspur]

good post provence - but as jg says this and other forums are the place to debate the team etc - at the ground support not debate and analysis should be the priority
What are you on about. Have you been drinking:beer:?

[Paxtonite]

While I agree with your analysis of the press, and it's vested interest in creating drama, I see no more analysis or thought in your article than in theirs. I admire your intention; but where is the analysis? "Give it time and it will all come right"?

You say Levy, Commolli and Ramos are doing all they can and that therefore this is not their fault. Nonsense. Of course they are doing what they think is right. The question, and one you completely neglect to address, is: is what they think is right, actually right?

You ask us to be patient; to give it time. That short sited, short term reactions to temporary problems are no way to achieve long term success. I couldn't agree more; and was saying exactly that this time last year.....when Levy decided to fire Jol for only managing to come 5th, two seasons in a row. How can you expect the fans to take a long term view when their Chairman patently and expressly took such a short term one? When he decided, utterly prematurely, to undermine Jol and dismantle his squad on the premise that Jol had "taken us as far as he could". It was his hysterical (greedy) management, not the fans, that sacrificed all the progress we had made since the Hoddle era. We were still singing Jol's name ffs.

So before you look at the fans as the source of knee jerk, short termist, get rich quick attitudes try looking at the people who, long before this crisis, decided that the right thing to do was duplicitously and unscrupulously undermine the man who had brought us the most success since Birkenshaw and dismantle the sqaud that won us our first trophy in a decade.

Here here. :clap:

And whilst i can see certain merits in the original article the point of fact is we HAVE had the worst start in our history since 1912; we ARE no wins in SEVEN games and we ARE bottom of the table.

A few games ago a win would have seen us jump to mid table. Now we need a couple of back to back wins to get there and if we don't start winning soon we shall soon need more than that.

We need to see progress on the pitch soon because unfortunately the whole game has become "short-termist".

[Paxtonite]

In theory what you are saying is totally correct & i cant argue with it,
but in reality if we lose to stoke on sunday then we all know what kind of posts we will be reading on this site - Ramos is clueless, jenas its all your fault, bentley go back to blackurn u suck etc. etc.

Never mind the crap that will be printed in the tabloids

I for one promise to post a positive comment after sundays game,
win, lose or draw......

THFC....

Admirable of you but positivity is not always a solution to the harsh realities of life (and of our clubs current predicament).

Only a win will do this Sunday. Nothing more nothing less.

[guate]

Provence, excellent article, thoroughly enjoyed reading it. However I have to admit Shirtfront really nailed on the head our present situation and I find myself totally identifying with everything he says.

[miso_kool]

on the basis of a few bad results.

Stopped reading there.

[Reg]

[quote=Paxtonite;1093434]Here here. :clap:

Where? Where?

[Jonesey]

Ummm, I think the boo-ing supporters are probably boo-ing the 'triumverate' too.

Our situation is dire and all of them need to take responsibility as it is all of their fault that we are in this situation in the first place, including the players who just don't fight enough or 'want it' enough on the pitch.

We are a terrible, terrible football team (the Chelsea and Hull games aside where I thought we played well and were unlucky respectively) and, based on what I've seen on Match of the Day and Sky, Stoke will beat us on Sunday unless the players go out there for a fight to the death.

If that happens, then we'll be REALLY f**ked.

[liewser]

Admirable of you but positivity is not always a solution to the harsh realities of life (and of our clubs current predicament).

Only a win will do this Sunday. Nothing more nothing less.

Totally agree - sometimes fans can be harsh but i scratch my head at all the calls for constant positivity regardless of what's at least performance if not result.

We have so far this season taken more or less what we deserved from our performances, Hull being the one exception, but that would still leave us down the bottom of the league. With every mediocre performance that go by the calls for positivity sound ever more ridiculous.
To write something positive on sunday regardless of the result is pointless.

If we lose 4-0 in a shocking performance how will being positive solve anything? Ignoring a cancer will not cure it, and I'm not saying we're in such a severe position but my sentiment is along those lines.

[JimmyG2]

I think the calls for positivity fall into two catagories
(1) Support the team on the pitch.Try to make the crowd an extra player as they do at Liverpool. Make WHL a fortress as they say not a place that players who are struggling fear to come to.

(2) Use the forums to try to analyse the play and the players and think of ways forward. Slagging the team, individual players,Levy or Comolli off in terms such as Jenas,Bent or whoever is 'crap' gets us nowhere.
It might make you feel better briefly but this a Tottenham fansite not a therapy exercise. Perhaps we should have a separate thread for people to swear and slag Jenas off.
Im not saying don't criticise but lets have some reasons and discussion and solutions.
Bent is a limited player but he was bought to score goals and he has before and will do so again.Just to say he is 'rubbish' is of no interest or benefit to anyone.
Now is the moment to support the team, its easy when you are winning.
In every team performance and individual players for that matter there is good and bad.Nobody is 'crap'for a whole game or a team
Lets pick out the good bits,criticise the bad and take the situation forward.
I often get negative,walk round the garden swearing and looking for a cat to kick when we lose to a late goal. But when I post on here I try to get things into perspective,and after coming up for 60 years as a Spurs fan, perhaps I have a bit more than some.
Before someone posts 'But Jenas is crap' I'll get in first. He is not.Disappointing ,not reaching his potential, not as suited as vice captain as say Woodgate maybe. But without him over the past three seasons we would not have achieved two fifth place finishes or the Carling Cup win.

[liewser]

I think the calls for positivity fall into two catagories
(1) Support the team on the pitch.Try to make the crowd an extra player as they do at Liverpool. Make WHL a fortress as they say not a place that players who are struggling fear to come to.

(2) Use the forums to try to analyse the play and the players and think of ways forward. Slagging the team, individual players,Levy or Comolli off in terms such as Jenas,Bent or whoever is 'crap' gets us nowhere.
It might make you feel better briefly but this a Tottenham fansite not a therapy exercise. Perhaps we should have a separate thread for people to swear and slag Jenas off.
Im not saying don't criticise but lets have some reasons and discussion and solutions.
Bent is a limited player but he was bought to score goals and he has before and will do so again.Just to say he is 'rubbish' is of no interest or benefit to anyone.
Now is the moment to support the team, its easy when you are winning.
In every team performance and individual players for that matter there is good and bad.Nobody is 'crap'for a whole game or a team
Lets pick out the good bits,criticise the bad and take the situation forward.
I often get negative,walk round the garden swearing and looking for a cat to kick when we lose to a late goal. But when I post on here I try to get things into perspective,and after coming up for 60 years as a Spurs fan, perhaps I have a bit more than some.
Before someone posts 'But Jenas is crap' I'll get in first. He is not.Disappointing ,not reaching his potential, not as suited as vice captain as say Woodgate maybe. But without him over the past three seasons we would not have achieved two fifth place finishes or the Carling Cup win.


completely agree with your two outlines of "positivity", i have no complaints with either. there are definitely too many people who will write "Jenas is crap" and nothing more, and i cant defend that. However people who say "jenas is crap because..." are too oftened viewed as just being ignorant when ok maybe their wording was blunt but if they have some decent rationale i cant deny someone their opinion. I personally think Jenas is key but I'm not gona tell someone they need to think differently because i think differently.


However, at the same time there are also a fair few who merely comment "you're a crap fan support your team be optimistic", and dismiss everything critical. To me when i read a comment that blindly says "be optimistic", it's just as useless as someone saying "we are crap".

[DC_Boy]

good post as usual jg - have some rep :-)

[JimmyG2]

Thats about the third time you given me some 'rep' but as one untutored in the ways of Spurs Community what does it mean? Does it go straight into my bank account or arrive throught the post? Where the hell is it?
But thanks anyway.

[Dharmabum]

Taking the pressure from the press - particularly after such a poor start - is part of the job, and something players should be able to handle.
However, agree totally that one should be positive and that the potential is still there and will be "expressed" if given time (not "too" much though).
It sure takes time for players to adjust to a new league and team-mates, so have still some patience.

[DC_Boy]

Thats about the third time you given me some 'rep' but as one untutored in the ways of Spurs Community what does it mean? Does it go straight into my bank account or arrive throught the post? Where the hell is it?
But thanks anyway.

:-) jg

check out your account - it's next to Home on your 'toolbar' at the top of the page - just under the scrabblesque 'community'

you'll see who's giving you rep and any comments if you missed them

I'm in there far too often - cos it's where you edit your 'ignore list' too

you can also send PMs from there- oh there's loads of stuff - it's like your own little Aladdin's cave :-)

it's very easy to give rep BTW - it's the middle symbol above the post reply button - a pair of scale for positive or neg rep

[2bearis2do]

While I agree with your analysis of the press, and it's vested interest in creating drama, I see no more analysis or thought in your article than in theirs. I admire your intention; but where is the analysis? "Give it time and it will all come right"?

You say Levy, Commolli and Ramos are doing all they can and that therefore this is not their fault. Nonsense. Of course they are doing what they think is right. The question, and one you completely neglect to address, is: is what they think is right, actually right?

You ask us to be patient; to give it time. That short sited, short term reactions to temporary problems are no way to achieve long term success. I couldn't agree more; and was saying exactly that this time last year.....when Levy decided to fire Jol for only managing to come 5th, two seasons in a row. How can you expect the fans to take a long term view when their Chairman patently and expressly took such a short term one? When he decided, utterly prematurely, to undermine Jol and dismantle his squad on the premise that Jol had "taken us as far as he could". It was his hysterical (greedy) management, not the fans, that sacrificed all the progress we had made since the Hoddle era. We were still singing Jol's name ffs.

So before you look at the fans as the source of knee jerk, short termist, get rich quick attitudes try looking at the people who, long before this crisis, decided that the right thing to do was duplicitously and unscrupulously undermine the man who had brought us the most success since Birkenshaw and dismantle the sqaud that won us our first trophy in a decade.

:clap::clap::clap:

[2bearis2do]

I absolutely agree. Although I do agree with one aspect of the opening post...and that's that fans should never boo the players under any circumstances. If they have a problem they should focus it at the manager/DOF/chairman triumverate only.

I´m sorry but I have to stongly disagree! The subject of booing is an interesting one, not a black and white ´should NEVER boo´ statement.

Booing is as old as the game itself. As paying members of the theatre that is WHL, we reserve the right to freedom of speech and the right to boo, should we feel the performance is rubbish! It is all part of the game, like bad refereeing. You can´t just suddenly say no one should ever boo the team. Booing can also be positive.

It is the type of booing that needs debate. There is nothing better than good natured booing and nothing worse than mindless spiteful, racist, homophobic booing.

Despite all our woes, the fans at the games have been brilliant. soaring coruses of ¨¨When the Spurs go Marching in,¨ slow beats of ¨¨ÿids¨¨ etc etc all the encouragement that any player could wish for, and then the final whistle. And the right to boo, to boo a result, to boo a performance, to boo a player who has disrespected the shirt, to boo the referee, to boo opposition players on their return.

To boo is not taboo!

It is all part of the game and always has been.