There is a lot of misinformation about Chelsea's youth teams. Firstly Chelsea play predominantly Under 17's in the Youth league we play in. To give you some idea of their strength Spurs played Aston Villa Youth recently and lost 1-2, the same Villa Youth team played Chelsea (basically U17 side) and got hammered 8-3 at Villa's ground a week later. ( Note also the return fixture played in October ended up 12-2 to Chelsea. Quite staggering at this level). What is significant is the majority of 2nd year scholars play for Chelsea U21's regularly and of course in the Europa Youth League. To give further comparisons Chelsea have 5 players in the current Under 19 England squad and 3 in the U18 squad. Spurs have 1 (Winks or 2 if you include Alli) in the England U19's and 2 in the U18's (Walker-Peters and Onomah). They are very strong favourites to win the FA Youth Cup this year. Man City are also very very strong (I have watched them 3 times this year). Mourinho has said recently that if 4 of these young players don't become full England Internationals under his watch he would be failing as a manager ( These are Isiah Brown, Dominic Solanke, Ruben Loftus- Cheek & Charlie Colkett/ Lewis Baker). Of course what really matters for young players successful development to First Team stardom is opportunity and luck and a real desire for the Club to sincerely want to develop their own. Again I sometimes think of Man U and their generation of Butt, Neville (G), Neville(P), Beckham & Giggs and the courage of Feguson to keep playing them even when initially the team was failing. Would Spurs fans be so tolerant of Pochettino if Mason, Bentaleb, Kane and say Onomah and Carter-Vickers were all playing regularly but failing. I have watched Harry Kane play regularly in the Youth team and saw is obvious talent, but what alarmed me was the criticism this very young player was subjected to initially by Spurs fans (many on the Spurs Community though fortunately not on this sub-section of the website).
The All New Spurs U21, U18 & Other Youth News Thread
- Thread starter Spursidol
- Start date
The Spurs team that lost to Villa was a much weakened team.
Our U21's deservedly beat Chelsea's U21's earlier this season.
They do indeed have more young players with international recognition from England. But it's perfectly apparent that the people responsible for picking England youth teams have not been paying sufficient attention to Spurs - as the extraordinary failure to cap Cameron Carter Vickers proves.
Our U21's deservedly beat Chelsea's U21's earlier this season.
They do indeed have more young players with international recognition from England. But it's perfectly apparent that the people responsible for picking England youth teams have not been paying sufficient attention to Spurs - as the extraordinary failure to cap Cameron Carter Vickers proves.
SlickMongoose
Copacetic
- Feb 27, 2005
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I've always thought there was something odd about Chelsea's youth setup. They seem to be very strong, winning trophies and have pundits raving, every year. But nobody ever breaks through. Are they really focused on player development, or just on being the best youth team?
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beats1
Well-Known Member
- Feb 22, 2010
- 30,021
- 29,583
I also tend to watch alot of chelsea but don't forget that Spurs have been playing young players in the U21 and can go top if we win our game in hand.
We had recently a 16 year old CB captaining our U21's in CCV. The main players of our U21 team are still young much younger than the team that finished in the final, hence not alot of people raving about them. This is the age of the players at the start of the season:
Ball (18)
Winks (18)
Miller (18)
Oduwa (18)
Onomah (17)
CCV (16)
Oglivie (18)
Walker-Peters (17)
Sonupe (18)
We beat Chelsea earlier this season in the U21's in a very tight match and here were the two teams
Beeney (19)
Dabo (19) Aina (18) Kane(21) Davey(19)
Houghton (18) Loftus-Cheek (18)
Kiwomya (18) Boga (17) Musonda (18)
Solanke (17)
Dabo (19) Aina (18) Kane(21) Davey(19)
Houghton (18) Loftus-Cheek (18)
Kiwomya (18) Boga (17) Musonda (18)
Solanke (17)
Cebellos (21)
Miller (18) Onomah (17) Sonupe (18)
Winks (18) Lesniak (18)
Oglivie (18) CCVickers (16) Ball (19) McQueen (19)
McGee (19)
Wait, Lesniak/Oglivie/McQueen/Sonupe are all U20?
Is there a proper resource to find out these things? How old are the entire Academy?
I only have Wikipedia to go by and that just lists at what level these guys are at.
Where are our 20 year olds? All out on loan? Anyone got a link to a database for their age/games started?
Is there a proper resource to find out these things? How old are the entire Academy?
I only have Wikipedia to go by and that just lists at what level these guys are at.
Where are our 20 year olds? All out on loan? Anyone got a link to a database for their age/games started?
Blake Griffin
Well-Known Member
- Oct 3, 2011
- 14,157
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u18s - http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/tottenham-hotspur-u18/startseite/verein/6928
u21s - http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/tottenham-hotspur-u21/startseite/verein/9254
1st team out on loan - http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/tottenham-hotspur/leihspieler/verein/148
there's a couple others like oduwa and sonupe hidden away in "players on loan" on the squad drop down box for the u18s and u21s too.
IGSpur
Well-Known Member
- Jan 11, 2013
- 7,939
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Took a while but heres mine.
Everyone watched the game so I dont need to really talk anyone through it.
There were a few fans chanting today and made it quite a good laugh. a lot of them aimed at the ref and man I subs. As Mitchell warmed up in front of us a keener eyed fan chanted to the tune of 'he's got the whole word in his hands', he's got his bib on, inside out, he's got his biiib on, inside out. Which everyone including ours and thei. Subs laughed at and applauded. Another aimed at Mitchell was a couple of Valencia chants which were funny.
As Azzaoui cooled down they asked for him to give a wave then when he didn't as he was prob trying to keep it professional. They sung 'lost in translation it was lost in translation ' followed by we know you love us Ishmael. Near the end when KWP came to take a throw they started signing a song for him and I you could see a big grin on his face before he tried to hide it again haha.
Anyway
Voss 5 flapped at a cross and fumbled a smother. Didn't look as assured as normal.
KWP 9- has been our most consistent player in the last two rounds but I think thiis was his best attacking performance. His dribbling is sooo good and there are few players who I've ever seen dominate a game from fullback. The ball to release Georgiou was brilliant too. I thought he was fouled but haven't seen replays was another good run though.
Maghoma 7 really good performance bon his first game back. Can't really think of a better cb partnership at this age group. Almost scored too.
CCV 7 also great to have him back. neither of them looked troubled today against a pacey attack. Neither had a lot to do though
Walkes - 7.5 thought he performed really well. Have been impressed with his last couple of games. Has been cutting out a lot of his nonsense. But also he was at lb so less culpbable for any mistakea. Regardless he looked solid and supported the attacks well. So good on him.
Amos 8 close to my MOTM. It was only near the end of the game when he intercepted or tackled someone and brought it forward and I thought there's Amos again. Did I realise how good a game he was having. He was literally shutting down everything and I think was largely the reason for the CBs having a quiet night. He has a lot of ability but this waa the best I've seen him play.
Stylianides 7 guess he had a good game. He pressed well and showed for the ball. Hes the water carrier type and did his job quietly
Onomah 7.5 after the Wolves match after his first team debut he had a poor game and I thought it may be psychological issue where he feels the need to impress. Again at the start of this match he was very sloppy again and I thought its be a repeat performance. But as the game wore on he went back to his best. Some nice dribbles and good vision in his languid style. It looked like he could do more but I always leave feeling that with him. His class shone through on the day and even when he seems to have a poor match he affects the game for the team which I'd the sign of a class player. Annoyingly when he gave the ball away I heard a massive groan from a fan. If that happens at youth games I fear a youngster making a mistake at first team level.
Georgiou 8 really good game from him. Never fails to create problems or effect games. I think he is one of the more underrated players in our team as I have never really seen him have a bad game. Got a brace as well which was good to see.
Azzaoui 8 along with Georgiou was our biggest threat at the start. His close control, pace and dribbling was too much for Man Us defence and genuinely got the crowd of their seats. Got a goal with a lovely finish too.
Harrison 7 struggled to have a major impact on the game but linked up and held the ball up when he could. Got off a few shots too.
Subs
Edwards 7 got a nice run out gave a few people their first glimpses I think. I haven't seen him a lot for us mainly England but again his talent is obvious the ball can stick to his feet. He also tried a trick or two. tried to create a few chances but they were intercepted. He is one of those players who is not happy unless they are doing something productive very direct
Sterling 7 liking him more and more. Quick, quite strong and again direct. Didn't see his link up play today but tried to get himself involved. I think he could learn a trick or two to shake off and learn to beat a man to give himself a yard to get a shot off. As at the moment it doesn't look like he has that but there is a lot of potential there.
Owens 6 did not have to or do much I don't think. Just carried on where Stylianides left off.
I repeat was a very dominating performance and felt like we were camped in their end for the whole match. a highlight for me was seeing Onomah and Edwards playing together for a decent amount of time. Both class. Like Onomah passing the mantle on.
I read a few comments about people noticing our pressing style. We have been doing that for the last couple of years I believe and they are all used to it. I don't know if people want to go into the semantics about when they press or of it is in a certain style but it can certainly be seen the high pressing from u14 level last year and is carried through to the other age groups. I think this is why Poch was chosen.I believe managers are being selected who fit or adapt to what our youth are doing and not vice versa.
I also saw Jaden Brown at the match and Reece Oxford which is nice that their teammates are coming to support.
The players clapped the fans off at the end and seemed really appreciative. I've recorded the match on sky so I'll watch it from another perspective later.
It's really good that MUTV gave the opportunity for a lot of our fans to see our youth team and its a shame SpursTV don't do it. I know many won't get to see much other than highlights here and there so will give a better idea if the talent available. The hype is very much real and there are about 3 or 4 players in this age group who I reckon could be playing for us next year. Look forward to the next match. All going so well at our club atm. Hopefully a decent result against pool tibigt COYS
Everyone watched the game so I dont need to really talk anyone through it.
There were a few fans chanting today and made it quite a good laugh. a lot of them aimed at the ref and man I subs. As Mitchell warmed up in front of us a keener eyed fan chanted to the tune of 'he's got the whole word in his hands', he's got his bib on, inside out, he's got his biiib on, inside out. Which everyone including ours and thei. Subs laughed at and applauded. Another aimed at Mitchell was a couple of Valencia chants which were funny.
As Azzaoui cooled down they asked for him to give a wave then when he didn't as he was prob trying to keep it professional. They sung 'lost in translation it was lost in translation ' followed by we know you love us Ishmael. Near the end when KWP came to take a throw they started signing a song for him and I you could see a big grin on his face before he tried to hide it again haha.
Anyway
Voss 5 flapped at a cross and fumbled a smother. Didn't look as assured as normal.
KWP 9- has been our most consistent player in the last two rounds but I think thiis was his best attacking performance. His dribbling is sooo good and there are few players who I've ever seen dominate a game from fullback. The ball to release Georgiou was brilliant too. I thought he was fouled but haven't seen replays was another good run though.
Maghoma 7 really good performance bon his first game back. Can't really think of a better cb partnership at this age group. Almost scored too.
CCV 7 also great to have him back. neither of them looked troubled today against a pacey attack. Neither had a lot to do though
Walkes - 7.5 thought he performed really well. Have been impressed with his last couple of games. Has been cutting out a lot of his nonsense. But also he was at lb so less culpbable for any mistakea. Regardless he looked solid and supported the attacks well. So good on him.
Amos 8 close to my MOTM. It was only near the end of the game when he intercepted or tackled someone and brought it forward and I thought there's Amos again. Did I realise how good a game he was having. He was literally shutting down everything and I think was largely the reason for the CBs having a quiet night. He has a lot of ability but this waa the best I've seen him play.
Stylianides 7 guess he had a good game. He pressed well and showed for the ball. Hes the water carrier type and did his job quietly
Onomah 7.5 after the Wolves match after his first team debut he had a poor game and I thought it may be psychological issue where he feels the need to impress. Again at the start of this match he was very sloppy again and I thought its be a repeat performance. But as the game wore on he went back to his best. Some nice dribbles and good vision in his languid style. It looked like he could do more but I always leave feeling that with him. His class shone through on the day and even when he seems to have a poor match he affects the game for the team which I'd the sign of a class player. Annoyingly when he gave the ball away I heard a massive groan from a fan. If that happens at youth games I fear a youngster making a mistake at first team level.
Georgiou 8 really good game from him. Never fails to create problems or effect games. I think he is one of the more underrated players in our team as I have never really seen him have a bad game. Got a brace as well which was good to see.
Azzaoui 8 along with Georgiou was our biggest threat at the start. His close control, pace and dribbling was too much for Man Us defence and genuinely got the crowd of their seats. Got a goal with a lovely finish too.
Harrison 7 struggled to have a major impact on the game but linked up and held the ball up when he could. Got off a few shots too.
Subs
Edwards 7 got a nice run out gave a few people their first glimpses I think. I haven't seen him a lot for us mainly England but again his talent is obvious the ball can stick to his feet. He also tried a trick or two. tried to create a few chances but they were intercepted. He is one of those players who is not happy unless they are doing something productive very direct
Sterling 7 liking him more and more. Quick, quite strong and again direct. Didn't see his link up play today but tried to get himself involved. I think he could learn a trick or two to shake off and learn to beat a man to give himself a yard to get a shot off. As at the moment it doesn't look like he has that but there is a lot of potential there.
Owens 6 did not have to or do much I don't think. Just carried on where Stylianides left off.
I repeat was a very dominating performance and felt like we were camped in their end for the whole match. a highlight for me was seeing Onomah and Edwards playing together for a decent amount of time. Both class. Like Onomah passing the mantle on.
I read a few comments about people noticing our pressing style. We have been doing that for the last couple of years I believe and they are all used to it. I don't know if people want to go into the semantics about when they press or of it is in a certain style but it can certainly be seen the high pressing from u14 level last year and is carried through to the other age groups. I think this is why Poch was chosen.I believe managers are being selected who fit or adapt to what our youth are doing and not vice versa.
I also saw Jaden Brown at the match and Reece Oxford which is nice that their teammates are coming to support.
The players clapped the fans off at the end and seemed really appreciative. I've recorded the match on sky so I'll watch it from another perspective later.
It's really good that MUTV gave the opportunity for a lot of our fans to see our youth team and its a shame SpursTV don't do it. I know many won't get to see much other than highlights here and there so will give a better idea if the talent available. The hype is very much real and there are about 3 or 4 players in this age group who I reckon could be playing for us next year. Look forward to the next match. All going so well at our club atm. Hopefully a decent result against pool tibigt COYS
Mouse!
Fookin' Legend in Gin Alley
- Aug 29, 2011
- 6,303
- 19,263
As in West Ham player Reece Oxford?
DaSpurs
Well-Known Member
- Jan 20, 2013
- 11,816
- 13,655
Excellent, thanks for the read and I agree with all of it.
Just a couple things I wanted to add:
1) Agreed entirely about Georgiou being underrated. As this was my first U-18 full match, if there was one player who's performance I thought entirely disproportionate with the hype I've seen prior to the match, it was hands down Georgiou. The boy was absolutely immense yesterday, and on both wings for the full 90 no less. Again, I feel the brace almost does him discredit as it overshadows just how strong of a performance I thought he had. Was extremely dynamic and unpredictable, as he could attack from any angle from either wing, and I was very much caught off guard by how rapid he is. I love the balance of he paired with Azzaoui, as Azza is the trickster with no fear to run at defenses and the ability to cut across, while Georgiou can provide immense stretch with how quick he is to move the ball into space from any angle. Even when he was flipped back to the left side to a traditional winger role, you still had no idea whether he was going to cut in or drop his shoulder down the touchline, and he was always making good decisions and finding space. Came away thoroughly impressed with him.
2) I have to admit, sometimes I see some of you adamant followers of the youth setup and without seeing as many of the games am led to wondering if you guys are a bit optimistic when it comes to how the kids will turnout and their first team impact. But after seeing that match, I have to then admit that it was my presentiment which was off-basis, and these players deserve all the credit they receive and you fellas all the credit for persevering with your views and assessments in the face of so many declaring things along the lines of our current youth wave to come through was lucky and it cannot persist. So my props, fellas.
Still buzzing. Have never been this excited for the future of this club.
Romulus
Well-Known Member
- Jun 14, 2012
- 6,955
- 11,147
he's very good mates with Marcus Edwards
DaSpurs
Well-Known Member
- Jan 20, 2013
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Indeed. Chelsea may win more of the youth trophies with their methods, but we're breeding the more long term model of success both with respect to financial gain, but more importantly that parents will see our model of bringing through youth at a big club and will actively seek to get their kids into our program, thereby attracting more and better talents to the club in the future.
leffe186
Well-Known Member
- Sep 2, 2004
- 5,358
- 1,819
Cheers.
Just watched (most of) it. I actually thought the third goal was a better highlight - knocking it around at the back, a player gets it in a tight position out wide but puts a beautiful ball over the fullback and Georgiou was clinical. Not much Man U could have done about it. At about 1:22 or thereabouts.
TBH, I thought it looked like a very even match, until we scored the second. Then we really looked full of confidence. I was particularly impressed with Stylianides and the centre-backs.
Spursidol
Well-Known Member
- Sep 15, 2007
- 12,636
- 15,834
- Thread starter
- #5,196
Agree Chelsea have satarted to bring inn a lot of good young players who are now up to the age 18, but think you are maybe slightly overstating this.
Chelsea also have zillions of players (mainly boiught in) out on loan.
The only way the young players are going to develop is to play first team football at the age of about 19 onwards. So question next season is whether Jose is prepared to play youngsters in its first team or he adds them to the zillions of loanees. He says he's going to play them - but if he does play them much it will be a change for him !
IGSpur
Well-Known Member
- Jan 11, 2013
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Agree with the general sentiment of this. Due to Chelsea not really bringing anyone through their setup is underrated though it is not much better if at all than ours. They have done brilliantly recently and their u18s and u21s have some good players, however ours are just as good or better than theirs. I also think with regards to England they still have club reputation that get their players in the Eng set up. For us it needs to be our absolute standout players to get into the national team where as their 'very good' players can get in. I don't think Kiwomya is better than Oduwa but he plays for the u19s.
Also their setup is very much a lottery of buying loads of talent and hoping it pays off. Ours is made up of talent gerenally from the 'local' area being supplemented by one or two internationals. RLC isn't better than Onomah, Brown was bought from WBA and is very powerful and dominated u18s last year but we will see how he progresses. Solanke is a year older than CCV and still in is backpocket yet CCV isn't even being picked up by England. I still think the work gone into ours is more honest, and they still are able to flex their financial muscles to bring in the best, and as it is our players are just as good.
Ye. This is major. Things is since last year for u18s I would love to see the stats but he was constantly in the news feeds as being invovled or assisting. And any matches I saw he always played well without fail and he also got an opportunity against Norwich u21s and did well when he came on, whcih shows he is getting acknowledgement, hwoever last year Oduwa was on the other wing. Plus we had Onomah, Winks, Sonupe ahead of him and the other top players in that age group who over shadowed him. Now this year, we ahve Azzaoui who ivery much a flair player and Edwards coming trhough and so again the hype is on those two, and while most acknowledge his performances he still isn't talked about. However, similar to Miller if he was at any other academy he would be raved about. I said earlier and I stand buy it I think he deserves and England call up. Would be great for him. Def one not to be written off, though noone is
.
I really like this and it's why I think more outside of this thread should pay attention. I know as Spurs fans we have been conditioned to be pessimistic and I am, however our setup is very much something to be optimistic about. You and the others in this thread keep yourself updated though sometimes unable to see some matches due to either time or location, but others aren't really interested. So when some of us reel off a list of players we think should be given a chance, most people, understandably so, will say yes but they can't all make it assuming we are just making some scatter gun decisions. To think you have come away after this match thinking there are 3/4 top players who could do a job in cup games now or next season, plus 7 more either on loan or age group above that could do the same, and that is excluding Azzaoui, Edwards, Georgiou, Maghoma, Harrison, and others who impressed like Amos, Stylianides and Sterling not forgetting Yahaya. We really do have a massive job on our hands integrating these in the future.
DaSpurs
Well-Known Member
- Jan 20, 2013
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No, but put your hat back on and tip it with a smug smirk. I like that one.
IGSpur
Well-Known Member
- Jan 11, 2013
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YAY! Now to try and get people singing it. Was so chuffed with myself haha
