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Ratings vs Chelsea

MOTM

  • Lloris

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Walker

    Votes: 1 0.2%
  • Toby

    Votes: 5 1.0%
  • Verts

    Votes: 7 1.5%
  • Dier

    Votes: 1 0.2%
  • Rose

    Votes: 8 1.7%
  • Wanyama

    Votes: 240 50.2%
  • Dembele

    Votes: 2 0.4%
  • Eriksen

    Votes: 70 14.6%
  • Dele

    Votes: 98 20.5%
  • Kane

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Winks

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Sissoko

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Son

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • All Deserved

    Votes: 46 9.6%
  • None Deserved

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Undecided

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    478

THFCSPURS19

The Speaker of the Transfer Rumours Forum
Jan 6, 2013
37,886
130,485
Maturing Nicely

I said at half time that was a really good half of football. Two well balanced teams, tactically proficient and well set up, making for a really tight tussle, no quarter given, but not in a reckless hell for leather way, more like watching speed chess, or an Italian league game from about 25 years ago. We were the team taking the initiative, moving the ball better, constantly probing but Chelsea were that well drilled machine who always carried menace, not allowing us to get carried away, and to our credit we never did, it was tactically a superb and mature performance. And that's the most pleasing aspect, as it was immaturity and naivety that saw us come unstuck the last two times we played them, at heavy cost.

I guess this would be called a 3421 in the playbook, but watching it and looking at the position matrix, I'd call it more a 313111 that played out more like this:

Dier-------TA--------JV
Wanyama-----
Walker-------Dembele-----Rose
Eriksen---------------
----------------Alli
Kane
And it was tactically superb, Chelsea never got to grips with it. Our young coach went toe to toe with one of the best coaches in Europe, and came out on top.

Considering who we were playing, how strong they are tactically and what was at stake, the tensions this fixture carried, that first 45 minutes has to rank very, very highly in the Pochettino Oeuvre. This isn't a side that allows you to tear them apart, to try and do so would have been folly, they are designed for anything but that to happen, but what we did do in that first half was suffocate, play and probe, we showed patience; it was a grown up performance that despite not having much goal mouth action was hugely impressive and was thoroughly gripping throughout.

Also impressive was the phase after we scored our second goal, where instead of thinking "oh fuck we're two up, lets shell" Wanyama and Eriksen just kept us playing football and we just smothered any come back momentum at the embryonic stage.

I have to doff my cap to Poch, for much of last and the start of this season I was saying that he has to be more flexible tactically. After a couple of games of watching Wanyama, I said he was a player who could facilitate this, and tonight was the best evidence of that against the best possible test. He was fucking outstanding tonight, he was a voracious animal, hunting, gathering with a dynamism that none of our other CM's can match. The first half his tenacity was always initiating offensive actions, the second half it was breaking up Chelsea's momentum, unflustered, he also footballed his (and our) way cooly out of trouble at times with a panache under pressure that was a joy to watch.

Eriksen is so under rated, not just by some spurs fans, but by football's fanfare machine too. This guy is only bettered creatively over the last couple of years by players like Hazard and Ozil (and Payet last year), but none of those come anywhere close to having the metronomic influence that he has on team performances. None of the other players of his ilk in this league get through so much of the ball, work all over the pitch, like a CM/AM hybrid. This was another masterclass from Eriksen, and he's not a flat track bully either, he does it in the big games too, none bigger than tonight, and he delivered, the industry, conducting play then providing the two moments of precision that put the opposition to the sword.

I thought Vertonghen was also superb tonight, and is having a really good season, probably his best (he's always been a bit under rated too IMO) in his Spurs career. He set the tempo early on with a steaming interception and then carrying the ball forward and was authoritative throughout. He's been our best CB all season, even when TA has been playing.

Pochettino deserves the biggest credit though. This was yet another feather in his managerial cap. Few coaches manage to combine being good coaches and tactically proficient. We've seen the evidence of Poch's coaching ability. I've been watching Spurs for nearly 50 years and he's the first coach we've had (maybe bar Pleaty for a year) who has this team consistently and habitually doing the ugly stuff, and doing it cohesively, playing like a team without the ball as well as with it. But this season he's adding tactical variety to that coached ethos and has now added the scalp of Conte to Guardiola's. This is my favourite Spurs side of any I've watched, and we are what we are entirely because of him. And despite calling the flaws and errors (as I see them) let me make this clear, he is the best coach I've seen at this club.

Individual

Lloris - Not loads to do. Still wish he wouldn't scare us every game with at least one or two dodgy kick outs.

Walker - Not so great first half, coughed up the ball a couple of times sloppily, but got better and had a decent game defensively.

Dier - Good game.

TA - Good game.

Vertonghen - Excellent game, best CB on the pitch tonight.

Rose - He didn't deliver much in terms of actual attacking quality or product but nights like tonight you just love his feistyness and dynamism, it sets a tempo, adds a delicious friction that unsettles the opposition, gets the crowd going, and you know he's fucking up for it and it makes the night crackle. Good game.

Wanyama - Fucking marvellous. 90 minutes of cool headed rapacity. MOTM 1

Dembele - He had a couple of moments but was a little bit disappointing. This was a tough game to come back to, and I think he just always seemed a little bit off the pace, still did a couple of decent things and was generally robust defensively but second half seemed to be reduced to a slow amble in deeper areas.

Eriksen - He did bottle a challenge early on, but after that was outstanding, like a little maestro, popping up wherever a pocket of oxygen appeared, always available, deep areas, middles of the pitch and forward areas. Two delicious balls for the goals. MOTM 2

Alli - I thought this was his best game of the season. Not because he contributed loads and loads all over the pitch, he didn't, and he's not going to, but he was efficient tonight, much less of the silly bollocks and more concentration on doing what he's best at, which is keeping it simple and ghosting into the box from hard to pick up positions, and he finished his chances with aplomb. That first goal was real class, harder than whacking a volley from 20 yards. He also worked better without the ball tonight as well. Good game.

Kane - Got to be honest, he wasn't wanting for effort but, footballing wise, he was really poor tonight. Like he was playing in flippers.
A couple of other things:

1. I think you've been harsh on Dembele. Yeah, he wasn't as good as Wanyama, but as the article @Flashspur posted points out, that was probably the first time Kante has been dominated in a match by a midfield (substituted off for the first time since September 2015, apart from an injury, made only 1 interception, lost possession 16 times) - and Dembele was a big part of that. Can't see how he was 'disappointing'.

2. Do you think that was our best defensive performance under Pochettino?
 

ohtottenham!

Well-Known Member
Aug 15, 2013
7,497
13,029
Maturing Nicely

I said at half time that was a really good half of football. Two well balanced teams, tactically proficient and well set up, making for a really tight tussle, no quarter given, but not in a reckless hell for leather way, more like watching speed chess, or an Italian league game from about 25 years ago. We were the team taking the initiative, moving the ball better, constantly probing but Chelsea were that well drilled machine who always carried menace, not allowing us to get carried away, and to our credit we never did, it was tactically a superb and mature performance. And that's the most pleasing aspect, as it was immaturity and naivety that saw us come unstuck the last two times we played them, at heavy cost.

I guess this would be called a 3421 in the playbook, but watching it and looking at the position matrix, I'd call it more a 313111 that played out more like this:

Dier-------TA--------JV
Wanyama-----
Walker-------Dembele-----Rose
Eriksen---------------
----------------Alli
Kane
And it was tactically superb, Chelsea never got to grips with it. Our young coach went toe to toe with one of the best coaches in Europe, and came out on top.

Considering who we were playing, how strong they are tactically and what was at stake, the tensions this fixture carried, that first 45 minutes has to rank very, very highly in the Pochettino Oeuvre. This isn't a side that allows you to tear them apart, to try and do so would have been folly, they are designed for anything but that to happen, but what we did do in that first half was suffocate, play and probe, we showed patience; it was a grown up performance that despite not having much goal mouth action was hugely impressive and was thoroughly gripping throughout.

Also impressive was the phase after we scored our second goal, where instead of thinking "oh fuck we're two up, lets shell" Wanyama and Eriksen just kept us playing football and we just smothered any come back momentum at the embryonic stage.

I have to doff my cap to Poch, for much of last and the start of this season I was saying that he has to be more flexible tactically. After a couple of games of watching Wanyama, I said he was a player who could facilitate this, and tonight was the best evidence of that against the best possible test. He was fucking outstanding tonight, he was a voracious animal, hunting, gathering with a dynamism that none of our other CM's can match. The first half his tenacity was always initiating offensive actions, the second half it was breaking up Chelsea's momentum, unflustered, he also footballed his (and our) way cooly out of trouble at times with a panache under pressure that was a joy to watch.

Eriksen is so under rated, not just by some spurs fans, but by football's fanfare machine too. This guy is only bettered creatively over the last couple of years by players like Hazard and Ozil (and Payet last year), but none of those come anywhere close to having the metronomic influence that he has on team performances. None of the other players of his ilk in this league get through so much of the ball, work all over the pitch, like a CM/AM hybrid. This was another masterclass from Eriksen, and he's not a flat track bully either, he does it in the big games too, none bigger than tonight, and he delivered, the industry, conducting play then providing the two moments of precision that put the opposition to the sword.

I thought Vertonghen was also superb tonight, and is having a really good season, probably his best (he's always been a bit under rated too IMO) in his Spurs career. He set the tempo early on with a steaming interception and then carrying the ball forward and was authoritative throughout. He's been our best CB all season, even when TA has been playing.

Pochettino deserves the biggest credit though. This was yet another feather in his managerial cap. Few coaches manage to combine being good coaches and tactically proficient. We've seen the evidence of Poch's coaching ability. I've been watching Spurs for nearly 50 years and he's the first coach we've had (maybe bar Pleaty for a year) who has this team consistently and habitually doing the ugly stuff, and doing it cohesively, playing like a team without the ball as well as with it. But this season he's adding tactical variety to that coached ethos and has now added the scalp of Conte to Guardiola's. This is my favourite Spurs side of any I've watched, and we are what we are entirely because of him. And despite calling the flaws and errors (as I see them) let me make this clear, he is the best coach I've seen at this club.

Individual

Lloris - Not loads to do. Still wish he wouldn't scare us every game with at least one or two dodgy kick outs.

Walker - Not so great first half, coughed up the ball a couple of times sloppily, but got better and had a decent game defensively.

Dier - Good game.

TA - Good game.

Vertonghen - Excellent game, best CB on the pitch tonight.

Rose - He didn't deliver much in terms of actual attacking quality or product but nights like tonight you just love his feistyness and dynamism, it sets a tempo, adds a delicious friction that unsettles the opposition, gets the crowd going, and you know he's fucking up for it and it makes the night crackle. Good game.

Wanyama - Fucking marvellous. 90 minutes of cool headed rapacity. MOTM 1

Dembele - He had a couple of moments but was a little bit disappointing. This was a tough game to come back to, and I think he just always seemed a little bit off the pace, still did a couple of decent things and was generally robust defensively but second half seemed to be reduced to a slow amble in deeper areas.

Eriksen - He did bottle a challenge early on, but after that was outstanding, like a little maestro, popping up wherever a pocket of oxygen appeared, always available, deep areas, middles of the pitch and forward areas. Two delicious balls for the goals. MOTM 2

Alli - I thought this was his best game of the season. Not because he contributed loads and loads all over the pitch, he didn't, and he's not going to, but he was efficient tonight, much less of the silly bollocks and more concentration on doing what he's best at, which is keeping it simple and ghosting into the box from hard to pick up positions, and he finished his chances with aplomb. That first goal was real class, harder than whacking a volley from 20 yards. He also worked better without the ball tonight as well. Good game.

Kane - Got to be honest, he wasn't wanting for effort but, footballing wise, he was really poor tonight. Like he was playing in flippers.

Great assessment BC. See what you're saying about Kane. For me, his sharpness and awareness ain't there right now. But still, his very presence draws defenders to him, and just that allowed Dele space for both goals.
 

yusrisafri

Well-Known Member
Jun 27, 2004
6,369
7,548
I can only think of 3 different ratings.

Wanyama - 9
Alli, Eriksen - 8.5
All others - 8

Maybe Kane was below par than all others but its just not fair to do so after this magnificent victory.
 

dynamoSpurs

Well-Known Member
Aug 29, 2006
2,718
895
Can I mention Rose? He was so lively, as he always is and it was his side where everything was happening for the majority of the first half and boy did he take some tumbles for it! Pedro was branding his name into his shins the little bitch.

A true trooper and another contest fought with seemingly every bit if passion possible.

He can do no wrong right now.
 

dudu

Well-Known Member
Jan 28, 2011
5,314
11,048
Nope, everyone's getting carried away with this victory tonight. We were very good defensively and every player put in a shift but imo we could of used the ball better in the final third and created more chances and I don't think we dominated the game which seems to be the general opinion.

Bring on the disagrees :sneaky:

its a valid point - one that goes for both sides. We certainly saw more of the ball and had better chances than they did in the first half.

But being sloppy at times doesnt mean it wasnt an incredible performance - They are a hard team to beat, this Chelsea side and on the night we were less sloppy than they were.

And i think every player did more than put in a shift - they all stood up to be counted and played with such maturity it was a joy to behold.

I wasnt even nervous the last 20 mins.
 

sparx100

Well-Known Member
Jan 8, 2007
4,612
6,646
Kane couldnt impose himself into the game, but he worked hard and kept the Chelsea centre backs busy. Not productive but he contributed. Same with Costa up the other end.
 

spids

Well-Known Member
Jul 19, 2015
6,647
27,841
Everyone played really well, apart from Kane and Dembele. No real criticism of them, they can both play better though and both worked hard. Dembele seemed to have a role to sit on Kante which may explain why he was quieter going forwards than normal. Everyone else was at the top of their game (9's). I thought Wanyama, Eriksen and Rose were the three standouts, and obviously Alli for his two goals. Hard to pick a MOTM, but Wanyama (9.75) just edged Eriksen (9.5) for me. Wanyama was a beast last night, totally dominated the middle third of the pitch.

Lloris 8
Walker 9
Dier 9
Toby 9
Verts 9
Rose 9.25
Demebele 7.5
Wanyama 9.75
Eriksen 9.5
Alli 9
Kane 7

EDIT: More appreciation for Dembele than I originally gave having read other posts and reports, and re-watched highlights. He did a solid job in the middle of the park and was mainly tasked with shoring up the middle.
 
Last edited:

TheSpillage

Well-Known Member
Dec 26, 2013
892
2,543
I thought Eriksen's dead ball deliveries were superb throughout the night. It's not often we can say that. There were two free kicks in particular I remember from the first half that he whipped into excellent areas.
 

JonnySpurs

SC Veteran
Jun 4, 2004
5,345
12,398
Maturing Nicely

I said at half time that was a really good half of football. Two well balanced teams, tactically proficient and well set up, making for a really tight tussle, no quarter given, but not in a reckless hell for leather way, more like watching speed chess, or an Italian league game from about 25 years ago. We were the team taking the initiative, moving the ball better, constantly probing but Chelsea were that well drilled machine who always carried menace, not allowing us to get carried away, and to our credit we never did, it was tactically a superb and mature performance. And that's the most pleasing aspect, as it was immaturity and naivety that saw us come unstuck the last two times we played them, at heavy cost.

I guess this would be called a 3421 in the playbook, but watching it and looking at the position matrix, I'd call it more a 313111 that played out more like this:

Dier-------TA--------JV
Wanyama-----
Walker-------Dembele-----Rose
Eriksen---------------
----------------Alli
Kane
And it was tactically superb, Chelsea never got to grips with it. Our young coach went toe to toe with one of the best coaches in Europe, and came out on top.

Considering who we were playing, how strong they are tactically and what was at stake, the tensions this fixture carried, that first 45 minutes has to rank very, very highly in the Pochettino Oeuvre. This isn't a side that allows you to tear them apart, to try and do so would have been folly, they are designed for anything but that to happen, but what we did do in that first half was suffocate, play and probe, we showed patience; it was a grown up performance that despite not having much goal mouth action was hugely impressive and was thoroughly gripping throughout.

Also impressive was the phase after we scored our second goal, where instead of thinking "oh fuck we're two up, lets shell" Wanyama and Eriksen just kept us playing football and we just smothered any come back momentum at the embryonic stage.

I have to doff my cap to Poch, for much of last and the start of this season I was saying that he has to be more flexible tactically. After a couple of games of watching Wanyama, I said he was a player who could facilitate this, and tonight was the best evidence of that against the best possible test. He was fucking outstanding tonight, he was a voracious animal, hunting, gathering with a dynamism that none of our other CM's can match. The first half his tenacity was always initiating offensive actions, the second half it was breaking up Chelsea's momentum, unflustered, he also footballed his (and our) way cooly out of trouble at times with a panache under pressure that was a joy to watch.

Eriksen is so under rated, not just by some spurs fans, but by football's fanfare machine too. This guy is only bettered creatively over the last couple of years by players like Hazard and Ozil (and Payet last year), but none of those come anywhere close to having the metronomic influence that he has on team performances. None of the other players of his ilk in this league get through so much of the ball, work all over the pitch, like a CM/AM hybrid. This was another masterclass from Eriksen, and he's not a flat track bully either, he does it in the big games too, none bigger than tonight, and he delivered, the industry, conducting play then providing the two moments of precision that put the opposition to the sword.

I thought Vertonghen was also superb tonight, and is having a really good season, probably his best (he's always been a bit under rated too IMO) in his Spurs career. He set the tempo early on with a steaming interception and then carrying the ball forward and was authoritative throughout. He's been our best CB all season, even when TA has been playing.

Pochettino deserves the biggest credit though. This was yet another feather in his managerial cap. Few coaches manage to combine being good coaches and tactically proficient. We've seen the evidence of Poch's coaching ability. I've been watching Spurs for nearly 50 years and he's the first coach we've had (maybe bar Pleaty for a year) who has this team consistently and habitually doing the ugly stuff, and doing it cohesively, playing like a team without the ball as well as with it. But this season he's adding tactical variety to that coached ethos and has now added the scalp of Conte to Guardiola's. This is my favourite Spurs side of any I've watched, and we are what we are entirely because of him. And despite calling the flaws and errors (as I see them) let me make this clear, he is the best coach I've seen at this club.

Individual

Lloris - Not loads to do. Still wish he wouldn't scare us every game with at least one or two dodgy kick outs.

Walker - Not so great first half, coughed up the ball a couple of times sloppily, but got better and had a decent game defensively.

Dier - Good game.

TA - Good game.

Vertonghen - Excellent game, best CB on the pitch tonight.

Rose - He didn't deliver much in terms of actual attacking quality or product but nights like tonight you just love his feistyness and dynamism, it sets a tempo, adds a delicious friction that unsettles the opposition, gets the crowd going, and you know he's fucking up for it and it makes the night crackle. Good game.

Wanyama - Fucking marvellous. 90 minutes of cool headed rapacity. MOTM 1

Dembele - He had a couple of moments but was a little bit disappointing. This was a tough game to come back to, and I think he just always seemed a little bit off the pace, still did a couple of decent things and was generally robust defensively but second half seemed to be reduced to a slow amble in deeper areas.

Eriksen - He did bottle a challenge early on, but after that was outstanding, like a little maestro, popping up wherever a pocket of oxygen appeared, always available, deep areas, middles of the pitch and forward areas. Two delicious balls for the goals. MOTM 2

Alli - I thought this was his best game of the season. Not because he contributed loads and loads all over the pitch, he didn't, and he's not going to, but he was efficient tonight, much less of the silly bollocks and more concentration on doing what he's best at, which is keeping it simple and ghosting into the box from hard to pick up positions, and he finished his chances with aplomb. That first goal was real class, harder than whacking a volley from 20 yards. He also worked better without the ball tonight as well. Good game.

Kane - Got to be honest, he wasn't wanting for effort but, footballing wise, he was really poor tonight. Like he was playing in flippers.

Lovely stuff this week BC.

As others have said, I'd have been kinder to Dembele and Kane. @THFCSPURS19 has nailed it in regards to Dembele and how he impacted upon Kante's performance.

As far as Kane goes I'd argue that he worked his ass off and whilst I agree that his touch wasn't really there tonight, he still had some nice hold up play and made sure he occupied Cahill and Luiz a great deal which one could argue helped to free Alli to ghost into the box to get his two goals with only Moses & Azpilicueta for company.

All in all though your review is bang on and exactly how I saw the game so there's no need for me to chip in any more than the above.

Wanyama MOTM for me, one of the absolute best, most dominant performances I've ever seen from a Spurs CM.

EDIT: re. Dembele, just saw this in the F365 article - "From there, Dembele would dominate the midfield. He made three tackles, misplaced just one of his 33 passes, and won all but two of his duels. It was a wonderful performance."
 
Last edited:

am_yisrael_chai

Well-Known Member
Feb 18, 2006
6,409
10,931
At some point the penny will drop for the pundits that it isn't coincidence that every team we play is deemed to play badly. We aren't just having a great run of luck where teams play badly against us in the midst of playing well. We are making teams look bad. Annoys the hell out of me that supposed experts can't see this.
 

NEVILLEB

Well-Known Member
Nov 6, 2006
6,733
6,335
Lloris - 7
Walker - 8
Ald - 8
Dier - 8
Verts - 8
Rose - 9
Wanyama - 9
Dembele - 8
Eriksen - 9
Alli - 8
Kane - 6
 

southlondonyiddo

My eyes have seen some of the glory..
Nov 8, 2004
12,599
15,012
Wanyama my MOTM

Eriksen brilliant

Have to mention Alli too, took his goals well and was always a threat. Didn't see any silly nutmegs either...

Fantastic disciplined team performance with a lot left in the tank (unlike Stamford Bridge when we were spent after 50mins)
 

Japhet

Well-Known Member
Aug 30, 2010
19,232
57,389
Should have mentioned Poch in my earlier ratings. He gets a massive 10. Their weak spot was Moses at wing back and Poch capitalised on that. Alli v Moses on far post crosses was where we were going to score. Poch recognised it and Conti didn't.
 

THFCjosh

Well-Known Member
Aug 22, 2013
632
2,229
Agree with most posts above. Extremely professional performance from the boys. For me it was clear to see Chelsea were trying to wind our players up from the start hoping to try and emulate what happened last season at the Bridge but to no avail. The boys were solid and clearly on a mission, judging by the interview from Dele after the match there is a lot he wanted to say about how much all the players hate Chelsea and it clearly showed.

Lloris - 7 Distribution not as bad as recent games except one clearance, didn't really have much to do
Dier - 9 solid nothing was going past him last night
Verts - As above
Toby - As above, really cannot fault our defence last night at all
Walker - 8 Solid in defence, gave the ball away a bit in the 1st half, improved in the 2nd. Chelsea's tactics were to nullify him and Rose which led to the space for Eriksen
Rose - 8.5 Great display 0.5 better than Walker as he didn't give the ball away. Love tis guy
Wanyama - 9.5 - He was everywhere fantastic performance, would've given a 10 if he wasn't booked
Dembele - Tasked with stopping Kante, task completed in my eyes. Kante disposed 14 times says it all really
Eriksen - 9 He has 100% turned the corner and is making things tick game to game. Set pieces were a lot better today as well
Alli - 9 Does what he does best, finds space and scores. Clinical tonight.
Kane - 8 I think people are being harsh on him tonight. Yes, a few loose touches and stray passes, but every time he got the ball he had 3 players on him. This left space for Alli to score. Worked his socks off.

Subs
Winks - 7 brought on for the tired Dembele, didn't really notice him, what you want from a player who comes on to shore up the win
Sissoko - NET
Son - NET

Conclusion: COYMFS
 
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