Just Don't See It Myself......

jamesinashby · Jul 30, 2017

As a more than competent footballer, especially as he lacked height, I always thought of him as one of the best to put on an England football shirt. He was a gutsy player and was a pretty consistent player whose bad games were far and few between. I personally didn't particularly like him as a person especially after he refused to play for his country when he was still at the top of his game. But you can't take away from him that he did and still does do a lot for charitable causes and along with other United ex players, they have put money into getting Salford moving up the leagues. Despite now being very rich, he is still one of the 'blokes' and has forgotten his roots and has not become too full of himself as the likes of Beckham have. So, despite having no real regard for the guy, I do actually support those who see him as one of the better English players but bot necessarily quite up there with the very best ~ but certainly well above the average.

Gassin's finest · Jul 30, 2017

Marty said:
I agree but Scholes' career has been subject to a lot of revisionism thanks to the tiki-taka revolution, he's thought of more highly now than he was e.g. when he left the England setup in 2004. For a great bit of analysis on his career "The Mixer" by Michael Cox is a superb book on PL tactics and players since '92 with a good chapter that deals with all three of Scholes, Gerrard and Lampard.

I actually thought scholes was at his best under Keegan for England. Played with freedom and scored goals for fun.

Marty · Jul 30, 2017

Gassin's finest said:
I actually thought scholes was at his best under Keegan for England. Played with freedom and scored goals for fun.

You're not wrong there, Keegan built his team around Scholes and was rewarded with some very good performances from him, especially the play-off against Scotland. Gerrard's emergence and the 5-1 v Germany, where Scholes was pretty quiet, gave Sven a conundrum he never managed to solve.

goughie1966 · Jul 31, 2017

Andy Cole - I remember Lineker responding to something about how good Cole was by saying he'd have scored 50 goals a season playing with Beckham and Giggs on the wings and Scholes in the middle

Spurrific · Jul 31, 2017

If you don't see 'it' in Muller, Gerrard or Neymar you're off your 'ead. All incredible players.

nailsy · Jul 31, 2017

I bet a lot of non-Tottenham fans would put Dembele in the list of overrated players because of his goalscoring record. Imagine how much he'd be worth if he was scoring goals as well!

DanielCHillier · Jul 31, 2017

nailsy said:
I bet a lot of non-Tottenham fans would put Dembele in the list of overrated players because of his goalscoring record. Imagine how much he'd be worth if he was scoring goals as well!

That's essentially what Utd thought they were getting with Pogba.

TottenhamMattSpur · Jul 31, 2017

Non Spurs
David Beckham.

Spent the 2nd half of his career riding the wave of the first half.
Annoyed the shit out of me how much he played for England when he was doing next to nothing towards the end. Having a player on the pitch that was good at free kicks is daft and sacrifices a position for a player who does something the rest of the time. Even the American with their handball bring on and take off a kicker as and when needed rather than play him the whole game.

For Spurs
Robbie Keane. Missed sitters, fell on his arse too often with his hands in the air
Michael Dawson. 150% committed and loved him. But he was a poor defender that was made to look good by various partners such as King.

Gbspurs · Jul 31, 2017

TottenhamMattSpur said:
Non Spurs
David Beckham.

Spent the 2nd half of his career riding the wave of the first half.
Annoyed the shit out of me how much he played for England when he was doing next to nothing towards the end. Having a player on the pitch that was good at free kicks is daft and sacrifices a position for a player who does something the rest of the time. Even the American with their handball bring on and take off a kicker as and when needed rather than play him the whole game.

For Spurs
Robbie Keane. Missed sitters, fell on his arse too often with his hands in the air
Michael Dawson. 150% committed and loved him. But he was a poor defender that was made to look good by various partners such as King.

I'm not sure how a spurs fan who lived through the dross of the late 90s/ early 00s couldn't rate Robbie Keane for us. I know he tarnished his rep with the Liverpool bollocks but for my money he is one of the most talented forwards to have graced the PL this century.

King of Otters · Jul 31, 2017

Spurrific said:
If you don't see 'it' in Muller, Gerrard or Neymar you're off your 'ead. All incredible players.

I don't see Muller as an incredible player, personally. Reminds me a bit of Alli in that he just seems to pop up with goals when it matters, while not doing much else of note throughout the game.

Very good player, no doubt, but not up with the greats for me, even though his stats suggest otherwise.

mattdefoe · Aug 1, 2017

Roberto carlos

Riandor · Aug 1, 2017

King of Otters said:
I don't see Muller as an incredible player, personally. Reminds me a bit of Alli in that he just seems to pop up with goals when it matters, while not doing much else of note throughout the game.

Very good player, no doubt, but not up with the greats for me, even though his stats suggest otherwise.

Agree with this.
He goes through spells of failing to get into the Bayern team purely because he has a tendancy to be ineffective in his all round contribution, but yes, he is a bit of a goal machine none the less. Definitely the type of player that flourishes at International level.

TottenhamMattSpur · Aug 1, 2017

Gbspurs said:
I'm not sure how a spurs fan who lived through the dross of the late 90s/ early 00s couldn't rate Robbie Keane for us. I know he tarnished his rep with the Liverpool bollocks but for my money he is one of the most talented forwards to have graced the PL this century.

It's not so much that I didn't rate him. I just thought he was over rated. He peaked and was on his way down before he went to Liverpool and he never came back. I was happy we'd fleased a bunch of bin dippers for £20m (forgetting we only got Frazer Campbell in)

Spurrific · Aug 1, 2017

King of Otters said:
I don't see Muller as an incredible player, personally. Reminds me a bit of Alli in that he just seems to pop up with goals when it matters, while not doing much else of note throughout the game.

Very good player, no doubt, but not up with the greats for me, even though his stats suggest otherwise.

Maybe not incredible, but he clearly has "it", imo. I think his technique is underrated because he's a bit languid and awkward, but he's got a bit of everything. Great in the air, good strike on him, can cross, decent dribbler, good passer and one of the best football brains in the world for me.

talkshowhost86 · Aug 1, 2017

I'll be honest I always associate English football fans who don't rate the likes of Scholes and Carrick as the sorts of people who prefer Carling to a decent craft beer and probably voted Brexit.

But enough about my prejudices...

I'm completely on board with whoever said Benzema. I think he lucked out by scoring loads of goals in a very weak league, and then has been playing in a Madrid side where Postiga would have got goals since then.

I've also rarely seen Cavani have a good game, although his stats are very impressive.

Kiedis · Aug 1, 2017

Don't like Vincent Kompany all that much. Injuries have obviously ravaged him, but I find him very rash, overly aggressive and easily pulled out of position.
The same with Van Dijk. He's heralded as the best CB in the league, but every time I see him, he's just riddled with a series of minor flaws that you just don't see in players like Alderweireld, Vertonghen, Azpilicueta and Luiz. He's good at giving an impression of being dominant which probably throws some people off the fact that he's very rough around the edges.

Gb160 · Aug 1, 2017

Sergio Ramos...no doubt a good CB but i honestly can't see what all the fuss is about.

TaoistMonkey · Aug 1, 2017

Pogba.

al_pacino · Aug 1, 2017

Spurs' Pipe Dreams said:
Cantona for me, good, sometimes great but never in the best of all time category some put him in. Maradonna, Pele and now Ronaldo and Messi. I'm not even sure he's in the Zidane, Figo, Puskas, Greaves, Best, Ronaldo (9) category behind the GOAT contenders. Maybe in the Gascoigne, Shearer, Klinsmann level imho.

Of course, I may be wrong but it's an argument I regularly have down the pub and his stats just don't live up to the legend and there were many games I watched when he hardly had any influence at all.....

I remember the first time I saw him in person while he was still at Leeds and every time he got the ball he had so much time and space, no one got near him all game. That sort of quality wont show up in the stats. I do agree about where you place him though, he must mean much more to Man U fans as being the catalyst for all the success that followed during and after he left them.

Spurs' Pipe Dreams · Aug 1, 2017

al_pacino said:
I remember the first time I saw him in person while he was still at Leeds and every time he got the ball he had so much time and space, no one got near him all game. That sort of quality wont show up in the stats. I do agree about where you place him though, he must mean much more to Man U fans as being the catalyst for all the success that followed during and after he left them.

Agreed, he was a good sometimes genius player but Manure fans treat him as a god

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