New Stadium Details And Discussions

spursfan77 · Nov 1, 2018

Saoirse said:
Let's be entirely honest. If you left this up to Levy and Lewis, Love Lane would be knocked down quicker than you can say Emmanuel Adebayor to be replaced by a budget block in the back of beyond. No way do they want council housing in the way of the main access point to their shiny new development. And fundamentally they want the local area to be gentrified to push up the local property values. Haringey want to improve the area for local people, Tottenham want to improve the local people for the area.

Haringey want to leave it as a run down area, it suits their modus operandi. They don’t care about the people living their either. If they did they wouldn’t have abolished the multi million pound plans for a new community space because it was going to be built by a developer and not them.

The type of people living in the area have always changed, the demographic has massively changed there in the last 5 years compared to the previous 30. It wasn’t always a really poor area either, not when my (now deceased) grandparents were living there pre Second World War and my father afterwards. It’s since then the policies from different governments and councils have let it degenerate to this point. The club should be applauded for their actions, not condemned for them.

NickHSpurs · Nov 1, 2018

I can't wait until the front is finished, already looking so much better!

Saoirse · Nov 1, 2018

spursfan77 said:
Haringey want to leave it as a run down area, it suits their modus operandi. They don’t care about the people living their either. If they did they wouldn’t have abolished the multi million pound plans for a new community space because it was going to be built by a developer and not them.

The type of people living in the area have always changed, the demographic has massively changed there in the last 5 years compared to the previous 30. It wasn’t always a really poor area either, not when my (now deceased) grandparents were living there pre Second World War and my father afterwards. It’s since then the policies from different governments and councils have let it degenerate to this point. The club should be applauded for their actions, not condemned for them.

I honestly don't think they want it run-down. Apart from anything else a fair whack of the new councillors there after most of the Labour grouping was replaced last year are locals who, if anything, could be criticised for lacking any political nous or experience. The problem is that it's near-impossible with current government policy to redevelop an area on the scale proposed without gentrifying it. There's no realistic mechanism for them to ensure a large amount of social or even genuinely affordable housing, for instance: they can't borrow money, can't subsidise it, can't impose rent controls, can't even define the word "affordable" which, in this context, means "80% of the local market rate whether that's remotely affordable to existing residents or not". In other words, if property values double, so does the cost of "affordable" housing for purchase or rent while the income of people in Tottenham obviously doesn't. I think the best thing for the interests of people already living there is the somewhat more limited redevelopment proposed, focussing on local amenities rather than further attractions to the area, until such a time as central government policy changes.

Jimmypearce7 · Nov 1, 2018

davidmatzdorf said:
This contains a lot of interesting stuff about the three way tug-of-war between the council, local residents and THFC over the wider regeneration plans for the neighbourhood. I can't vouch for the veracity of every paragraph, but none of it strikes me as bullshit or obviously distorted.

https://www.theguardian.com/footbal...pur-stadium-redevelopment-haringey-neighbours

Yes, like David Conn articles generally, thoroughly researched and thought provoking. I went to the launch of Tottenham's Trojan Horse because i was told it was a book launch about Tottenham's new ground and it was only when i got there that i realised it was a protest forum. Concerns from residents about being forced out- understandable of course and uncertainty about your home is a very stressful but i was left with the impression that it is only the club doing anything to actually improve Tottenham and that if they were allowed to get on with it, that was the best chance of the whole area improving.

thekneaf · Nov 1, 2018

Saoirse said:
I honestly don't think they want it run-down. Apart from anything else a fair whack of the new councillors there after most of the Labour grouping was replaced last year are locals who, if anything, could be criticised for lacking any political nous or experience. The problem is that it's near-impossible with current government policy to redevelop an area on the scale proposed without gentrifying it. There's no realistic mechanism for them to ensure a large amount of social or even genuinely affordable housing, for instance: they can't borrow money, can't subsidise it, can't impose rent controls, can't even define the word "affordable" which, in this context, means "80% of the local market rate whether that's remotely affordable to existing residents or not". In other words, if property values double, so does the cost of "affordable" housing for purchase or rent while the income of people in Tottenham obviously doesn't. I think the best thing for the interests of people already living there is the somewhat more limited redevelopment proposed, focussing on local amenities rather than further attractions to the area, until such a time as central government policy changes.

Was going to weigh in, but this covers it more eloquently.

I support the club in it's football endeavours and this includes the stadium build. However, the politics of redevelopment are way more complicated and I would hope that the club and council, over the coming decades, can help to improve the area for local residents. Tottenham needs to change, but it should bring residents with them (there are still plenty of brownfield sites for luxury nonsense too).

DJS · Nov 1, 2018

Latest overhead pictures look good and it doesn’t look like a toilet seat so much anymore ???

Lou3000 · Nov 1, 2018

With the veil work progressing and those remaining seats finally going in the south stand, we're almost to the end of visible construction progress. I'll miss these construction cameras when there is nothing left look at.

Even the pitch is really bedding in and looks fully playable.

dovahkiin · Nov 1, 2018

edmonton on that guardian arcticle posted above: I won’t go into the politics as per the thread title but the Club have a long-standing vision for the area and the community which is very impressive but not widely shared.
With the support originally expected at the start the transformation would have been complete by now.

southlondonyiddo · Nov 1, 2018

worcestersauce said:
Haringey council, the people that brought you Bernie Grant and Jeremy Corbyn.

That is a bit harsh

Bernie Grant did some great things for the people of Tottenham and has been greatly missed. There is a need for the Bernie Grants of this World. They try and keep a reign on the Joe Lewis of this World!!

worcestersauce · Nov 1, 2018

southlondonyiddo said:
That is a bit harsh

Bernie Grant did some great things for the people of Tottenham and has been greatly missed. There is a need for the Bernie Grants of this World. They try and keep a reign on the Joe Lewis of this World!!

Nah, he was incompetent, he said he did some great things for the people of Tottenham but he didn't. Unless you were tongue in cheek in which case

I just look at the council and see people without the nouse to get beyond tired old politics, this is a great opportunity and like it or not not everybody coming to the Spurs and even fewer attending other events want to queue up in the rain outside chick king and the like.

SirHarryHotspur · Nov 1, 2018

southlondonyiddo said:
That is a bit harsh

Bernie Grant did some great things for the people of Tottenham and has been greatly missed. There is a need for the Bernie Grants of this World. They try and keep a reign on the Joe Lewis of this World!!

Bernie Grant was a disgrace after his comments when a police officer was murdered.

From The Guardian ...
In 1985 when a riot exploded on Tottenham's Broadwater Farm estate and a policeman, Keith Blakelock, was murdered, Bernie commented that the youths on the estate felt that the police had received "a bloody good hiding." The remark made him a notorious hate figure in the pages of the tabloids.

PS. One of the latest Labour Haringey councillors has just resigned , guilty of drug dealing, fantastic council running Haringey.

Trees · Nov 1, 2018

this is getting into a blue or red debate

Saoirse · Nov 1, 2018

SirHarryHotspur said:
Bernie Grant was a disgrace after his comments when a police officer was murdered.

From The Guardian ...
In 1985 when a riot exploded on Tottenham's Broadwater Farm estate and a policeman, Keith Blakelock, was murdered, Bernie commented that the youths on the estate felt that the police had received "a bloody good hiding." The remark made him a notorious hate figure in the pages of the tabloids.

PS. One of the latest Labour Haringey councillors has just resigned , guilty of drug dealing, fantastic council running Haringey.

Did he agree with them or just say that's how they felt? Because if it's the latter I dare say he was right. And as for said councillor, he was found guilty of "possession with intent to supply", but not dealing per se - the court was eventually satisified that he'd been bringing the drugs into a festival for himself and a group of friends (hence the supply) rather than to sell. In any case he has quite rightly resigned.

worcestersauce · Nov 1, 2018

Trees said:
this is getting into a blue or red debate

I take you're point but I am not blue in that sense at all.

Saoirse said:
Did he agree with them or just say that's how they felt? Because if it's the latter I dare say he was right. And as for said councillor, he was found guilty of "possession with intent to supply", but not dealing per se - the court was eventually satisified that he'd been bringing the drugs into a festival for himself and a group of friends (hence the supply) rather than to sell. In any case he has quite rightly resigned.

He didn't just say what the youths were saying, he pretty much boasted it, no point putting a worthy gloss on it. However that's not why my opinion of him was always low, he'd already convinced me in my opinion of him before he hit the headlines. It's one of the drawbacks of reaching my age, I remember. My fear is that after a period of sensible local politics of actual achievement Haringey is reverting to type and that ain't good for the club or the local residents.

Tottenhamboy85 · Nov 1, 2018

Big screen on the west stand (outside) starting to go up

wakefieldyid · Nov 1, 2018

[P.S. One of the latest Labour Haringey councillors has just resigned , guilty of drug dealing, fantastic council running Haringey.[/QUOTE] Given the quantities of dope he was carrying when he was arrested, he was very very fortunate that the authorities accepted his claim that it was for his own consumption. Clearly nothing to do with the fact that his mother's the Shadow Cabinet Minister, Kate Osamor....

Saoirse · Nov 1, 2018

wakefieldyid said:
[P.S. One of the latest Labour Haringey councillors has just resigned , guilty of drug dealing, fantastic council running Haringey.

Given the quantities of dope he was carrying when he was arrested, he was very very fortunate that the authorities accepted his claim that it was for his own consumption. Clearly nothing to do with the fact that his mother's the Shadow Cabinet Minister, Kate Osamor....

[/QUOTE]
They didn't accept that, he didn't even claim it. He was taking the drugs in for himself and a large group of friends at a festival - apparently he had a VIP pass and thought it'd mean he was searched less thoroughly. Really can't see how that conspiracy would work, I highly doubt senior judges are exactly the most favourable demographic to Corbyn's Labour.

Flashspur · Nov 2, 2018

Trees said:
this is getting into a blue or red debate

No it’s stating the bleeding obvious - the council is incompetent. Forty to fifty years of incompetence deemed to be repeated by f wits with the same mentality as the ones that went before. They won’t break the cycle. I’d hate to be sitting here in 10 years saying that the opportunity to work together to regenerate the area after the riots was lost expect for Spurs efforts, because of these morons not being able to get their shit together.

coys200 · Nov 2, 2018

Veil is going on pretty quickly. I’d say end of this month it’s gonna look virtually complete inside the bowl and out. Hard to imagine it would then be 9 months till we play a game there. Hopefully be just 2 months.

Dougal · Nov 2, 2018

New thread here as we move away from Stadium discussion to local issues.

http://spurscommunity.co.uk/index.php?threads/the-regeneration-of-tottenham-thread.134714/

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