ENIC...

Cream · Aug 19, 2021

vegassd said:
Cream, I'm not sure if you are aware of how your writing style comes across, but to me it reads as sarcastic and snide. I would hope that isn't your intention but I'm sure there are other posters who interpret it the same way, and in this thread in particular it's always likely to spark a bit of conflict!

I don't think BBLG was saying that the naming rights isn't "worth" having an opinion. But you asked about why it wasn't in place and he's saying he doesn't know anywhere near enough about what is going on behind the scenes to be able to comment on that.

I'm sure that most fans would agree it's better to get a good naming rights deal rather than just the quickest thing available for any money. Nobody wants to be going to the "LIDL Stadium", especially if we're only picking up an extra £10m or whatever each year as a club.

On top of that, I think we can all agree that during the pandemic and subsequent unpredictability in the world, it's not really surprising that companies aren't falling over themselves to offer big bucks for what is essentially a hyped up sponsorship deal.

There are other factors such as how a named sponsor might want to have more of a hook up than just their name on the roof given that the stadium is state of the art. But there's an entire section on the forum for discussion of the stadium and a thread specifically for naming rights.

As to your original post:

I think you allude to the issues right there - it's about the "challenge for glory". Unfortunately that seems to be more based on spending money that actual sporting merit any more, so if we truly want to be competitive long term we need deals that are beneficial... not just any old deal we can get over the line.

The stadium will help to put us on a level playing field with some of the other big spenders in the league, and then with time hopefully it becomes a competitive advantage. If our stadium does more than others then we should end in a position where a naming rights partner is an actual partner and not just a name on the roof. More money, more publicity, more pull etc. But that's going to take time.

It's better to get it done well than get it done quick in my view.

I can fully appreciate that Levy is a very risk averse operator and that things under his leadership tend to take time. I can also appreciate that a lot of football fans don't view patience as much of a virtue! But if somebody can appreciate the long-term benefits over short-term gains I don't think that makes them an apologist of any sort.

Great reply.

Thank you.

But I have an issue with the context in the sense that if Levy didn't get his extra 10m a year. Then we're already down that 20m plus the, say 25m a year so 50m.

And I honestly think 300m over a ten year period wasn't/isn't out of perspective.

It's costing us him prevaricating. Like he always does.

Imagine having 300m plus Kanes 150m to build a side inside ffp rules this season out of all seasons to compete.

He's a nightmare.

Cream · Aug 19, 2021

McFlash said:
First off, do you actually try to be insulting, or is it your normal manner?
Being offensive but saying "no offence" is pretty childish really.

Secondly, where are you pulling 300m from?
You think someone's giving us 300m in a lump sum for the stadium?

Lastly, we had what? One full attendance season in the stadium?
There was no immediate rush to sell the naming rights, what was important was to get the right deal and it was quite nice to have it known as The Tottenham Hotspur Stadium for a while.
It'll get sold and when it does, it'll be for a massive amount. I don't know why you're so impatient for it to happen, apart from it being something to moan about.

No. We wouldn't get 300m in one go. But we would have a contract we could take to the bank and borrow off the strength of that.

Cream · Aug 19, 2021

Stuart Leathercock said:
I think the answer is reasonably obvious. The price demanded was more than the market was prepared to pay. The rumours going round the Corporate world were that THFC were looking at £25m+ per season, which would’ve been biggest stadium sponsorship deal ever I believe.

Etihad paid a huge £400m for a complete sponsorship package with Man City over a ten-year period, including shirt sponsorship and stadium naming rights. Many bemoaned the fact that it was way over valuation and claimed that City's owners used their relationship with Etihad's top dogs to get a bigger deal to circumvent FFP rules

i do think 300m isn't ridiculous compared to this which was 9 years ago.

Cream · Aug 19, 2021

dudu said:
Here, let me flip this on its heads, why do you think that is the case? There isn't a chance in hell that we don't want naming rights and naming rights cash so why, using critical thinking without whatever confirmation bias you have, do you think it is taking so long?

Levy is inept

McFlash · Aug 19, 2021

Cream said:
No. We wouldn't get 300m in one go. But we would have a contract we could take to the bank and borrow off the strength of that.

I see your point that it's a couple of years lost and understand that. This is why the pandemic has hurt us more than many.

I do think, however, that we could still borrow against the projected deal and I still think that with it being a "multi-use" stadium, it's going to be a massive deal.

That's why I believe it's being delayed, we've not yet managed to show off the facilities to their full potential and Levy will want this to be a record-breaking deal.
I think that's worth waiting for.

Neon_Knight_ · Aug 19, 2021

Cream said:
No it's not.

For instance I might infer from that post you are smooth brained. But for me to call you smooth brained would be an insult.

I'm not going to insult you. I will say you seem hyper sensitive and looking to be offended.

Would you actually care to reply to the actual post?

Why haven't we got naming rights to our stadium?

I am interested in your opinion.

I'd be fascinated know your thoughts. And please leave the petty insults and shit posting out of it.

If you can.

Thanks.

Your initial post was at best unintentionally passive-aggressive and condescending. At worst, you were going out of your way to start an argument.

If you had actually wanted constructive replies regarding the stadium naming rights, why did you choose to phrase your question so provocatively? The most plausible answer to that is you didn't want constructive replies and were gas-lighting to entertain yourself.
In your own words: "I don't get it. Need it broken down."

If you're not a bigot, you certainly gave a very strong impression of being one, so @BringBack_leGin was quite right to call you out for it. If he'd been aiming to insult you, rather than call out your behaviour using an extremely accurate descriptor, I'm sure he could have come up with a far more insulting word than "bigot".
Rather than complaining about being insulted by someone who did nothing more than use the English language to accurately describe your behaviour, perhaps you should instead reflect on your attitude - then people might have less reason to describe you with words that you dislike.

Conversely, calling someone "hyper sensitive" for what was a very reasonable response is insulting.
Again, in your own words: "please leave the petty insults and shit posting out of it."

TorontoYid · Aug 19, 2021

As entertaining as it is, let's stop with the insults. I don't know why we have not named the stadium yet so by all means, please enlighten me. I am interested to know what people think

Cream · Aug 19, 2021

Neon_Knight_ said:
Your initial post was at best unintentionally passive-aggressive and condescending. At worst, you were going out of your way to start an argument.

If you had actually wanted constructive replies regarding the stadium naming rights, why did you choose to phrase your question so provocatively? The most plausible answer to that is you didn't want constructive replies and were gas-lighting to entertain yourself.
In your own words: "I don't get it. Need it broken down."

If you're not a bigot, you certainly gave a very strong impression of being one, so @BringBack_leGin was quite right to call you out for it. If he'd been aiming to insult you, rather than call out your behaviour using an extremely accurate descriptor, I'm sure he could have come up with a far more insulting word than "bigot".
Rather than complaining about being insulted by someone who did nothing more than use the English language to accurately describe your behaviour, perhaps you should instead reflect on your attitude - then people might have less reason to describe you with words that you dislike.

Conversely, calling someone "hyper sensitive" for what was a very reasonable response is insulting.
Again, in your own words: "please leave the petty insults and shit posting out of it."

Thanks for the advice? Musings?

Whats your opinion on the naming rights?

SirHarryHotspur · Aug 19, 2021

Once all the current events due to be staged go out on worldwide TV, i.e concerts , NFL , boxing etc the benefit of having your company/brand attached to the stadium might encourage someone to come in with a very big offer, perhaps that's what ENIC are waiting for.

Neon_Knight_ · Aug 19, 2021

Stuart Leathercock said:
Interestingly there was another (far cheaper) option to have a multi purpose venue…. A false floor going over the top of the pitch with the grow lamps etc underneath. Of course though this wouldn’t have worked for NFL. I guess the question is therefore whether the money coming in from NFL counters the… what?…. £100m to £200m for the sliding pitch solution? Providing we continue with the NFL contract past the initial 10 years then I would say, on balance, it was money reasonably well spent.

Do you have any information on the false floor option? I hadn't heard about this before, but am struggling to envisage how it would be supported above a turf pitch without either:
a) Having numerous supports that rest on the turf (and therefore cause damage that couldn't be rectified in a matter of days/weeks); or
b) using a similar sliding pitch solution (turf and artificial surfaces are simply switched).

I'm genuinely interested, because use of interchangeable surfaces is a recurring dilemma for sports and entertainment venues. In every example I have seen, the most fragile surface is always overlaid above the most resilient surface (e.g. modular tiles of specialist sprung flooring laid on top of a solid wooden / concrete sports hall floor).

McFlash · Aug 19, 2021

SirHarryHotspur said:
Once all the current events concerts , NFL , boxing etc start to go out on worldwide TV the benefit of having your company/brand attached to the stadium might encourage someone to come in with a big offer perhaps that what ENIC are waiting for.

I think that's exactly what they're waiting for.
We managed what, a couple of nfl games before the world ground to a halt.
This year, we've got more nfl, rugby, a world title boxing match and a couple of globally famous bands/artists performing.

I'm sure nobody really wanted to spend millions on sponsoring an empty stadium but with it now being active again, I'd expect things to happen sooner, rather than later.

Lighty64 · Aug 19, 2021

Cream said:
So you think the fact we have had a stadium in place for nearly 3 years now without naming rights is not worth an opinion?

Why are you on a Spurs forum? Apart from being professionally offended hourly?

nearly 3 yrs?

the 1st year we opened with only 5 PL matches left and we're lucky to have an extra 2 in the run to the CL Final

the 2nd season was disrupted with 6-7 PL games left before Covid closed us down, and last season we had 3 games with 6k total allowed in.

Levy was okay with it being known as "The Tottenham Hotspur Stadium" putting the name Tottenham more on the map. he has also set a figure he wants on it, especially if it's going to be extra promoted with anything that happens with the other events. he doesn't want a silly figure like Arsenal agree to

Cream · Aug 19, 2021

Lighty64 said:
nearly 3 yrs?

the 1st year we opened with only 5 PL matches left and we're lucky to have an extra 2 in the run to the CL Final

the 2nd season was disrupted with 6-7 PL games left before Covid closed us down, and last season we had 3 games with 6k total allowed in.

Levy was okay with it being known as "The Tottenham Hotspur Stadium" putting the name Tottenham more on the map. he has also set a figure he wants on it, especially if it's going to be extra promoted with anything that happens with the other events. he doesn't want a silly figure like Arsenal agree to

Here is a piece from April 2 and a half years ago.

How much new Tottenham stadium naming rights could be worth to Spurs

A look at how much Spurs could earn from selling naming rights to Tottenham Hotspur Stadium

www.football.london

A recent report from global advisory firm, Duff & Phelps claimed that the value of the naming rights market in the Premier League had risen by 80% in just five years – from £74.6million in 2013 to £135.6million in 2017, with the English top flight's 'big six' accounting for more than three-quarters of that sum.

Levy is inept.

Neon_Knight_ · Aug 19, 2021

Cream said:
Thanks for the advice? Musings?

Whats your opinion on the naming rights?

Once again, your tone is unnecessarily passive-aggressive and condescending, so I have no interest in attempting to engage in a constructive conversation with you.
Also, your responses to others in this thread who have bitten (e.g. "Levy is inept") do little to convince me that you want a constructive discussion. If you're not going to give meaningful and thought out responses to anyone who disagrees with your views, this suggests to me that you're unlikely to be putting much thought into reading and considering their comments either (yet more confirmation that @BringBack_leGin was right about your bigotry by the way).

McFlash · Aug 19, 2021

Lighty64 said:
nearly 3 yrs?

the 1st year we opened with only 5 PL matches left and we're lucky to have an extra 2 in the run to the CL Final

the 2nd season was disrupted with 6-7 PL games left before Covid closed us down, and last season we had 3 games with 6k total allowed in.

Levy was okay with it being known as "The Tottenham Hotspur Stadium" putting the name Tottenham more on the map. he has also set a figure he wants on it, especially if it's going to be extra promoted with anything that happens with the other events. he doesn't want a silly figure like Arsenal agree to

I couldn't remember and couldn't be bothered to check but if the stadium has had such little use since it was opened, it makes complete sense as to why nobody has bothered spending millions of pounds on it.

I think anyone trying to berate Levy for the situation is clutching, to be honest.
And it doesn't help when they're making stuff up!

McFlash · Aug 19, 2021

Cream said:
Here is a piece from April 2 and a half years ago.

How much new Tottenham stadium naming rights could be worth to Spurs

A look at how much Spurs could earn from selling naming rights to Tottenham Hotspur Stadium

www.football.london

A recent report from global advisory firm, Duff & Phelps claimed that the value of the naming rights market in the Premier League had risen by 80% in just five years – from £74.6million in 2013 to £135.6million in 2017, with the English top flight's 'big six' accounting for more than three-quarters of that sum.

Levy is inept.

Again, your missing out the handy fact that the stadium has been out of use for most of the time.
Yes, stadium sponsorship has increased but who's going to pay through the nose to have their name attached to an empty stadium?

SirHarryHotspur · Aug 19, 2021

Using Man City naming rights as a comparison for any naming rights deal is a bit dubious even 10 years on , it was met with scepticism at the time by many including our old friend Whinger.
Man City's financial dealings are clouded in suspicion and the PL are still trying to investigate them. Little piece from Forbes a respected source I believe...
I'm sure when a deal is finally reached Levy will achieve the best available.

Manchester City’s Infamous 10-Year Deal Enters Its Final Chapter

Etihad often felt like a supporting character in Manchester City’s legal drama with UEFA, but the past decade has been equally eventful for the Abu Dhabi-government owned carrier.

www.forbes.com

Cream · Aug 19, 2021

McFlash said:
Again, your missing out the handy fact that the stadium has been out of use for most of the time.
Yes, stadium sponsorship has increased but who's going to pay through the nose to have their name attached to an empty stadium?

You are missing the point. I doubt that's on purpose though so it's all good.

We should have had the naming rights secured way before we even kicked a ball in the stadium. You know, like EVERY other club has done.

The stadium hasn't been out of use at all. Remember the games we played last season? At the stadium?

Crowds being there is irrelevant to naming rights.

The amount of insults I get and I just bite my tongue. Imagine if I'd have said something so daft?

Lol.

You guys!

BringBack_leGin · Aug 19, 2021

Cream said:
The amount of insults I get and I just bite my tongue. Imagine if I'd have said something so daft?

Please could you give some examples of these insults you say you’ve received?

You should probably report posts that you think are insulting you.

McFlash · Aug 19, 2021

Cream said:
You are missing the point. I doubt that's on purpose though so it's all good.

We should have had the naming rights secured way before we even kicked a ball in the stadium. You know, like EVERY other club has done.

The stadium hasn't been out of use at all. Remember the games we played last season? At the stadium?

Crowds being there is irrelevant to naming rights.

The amount of insults I get and I just bite my tongue. Imagine if I'd have said something so daft?

Lol.

You guys!

But our stadium isn't like every other stadium, it's different.
And again, would you want to spend millions for a mention on Sky Sports every couple of weeks?
Or would you rather wait until it gives you the global publicity for concerts, boxing matches etc.
Yes, it's been in use to some extent but if you think that's enough to justify such corporate expenditure, you're missing something.

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