Summer Transfer Wish List - 2017

Bus-Conductor · Mar 28, 2017

Tucker said:
You've already proven my point that the stats are meaningless by posting one showing Naughton is "better" than Walker. Just because some good players come from these sub standard leagues, it doesn't make it of comparable quality. Because it isn't. It's laughable that you even mention the Scottish league as if that's somehow relevant. Are you trying to say the standard of the Scottish league, or indeed League 1 is the same as the Premier League? Because that's garbage.

The French league is much the same. Players just aren't coming up against the same quality of opposition on a week by week basis.

How's Hooper doing? He was amazing in the Scottish League, did fuck all for Norwich though did he. How did Stambouli do? He looked great in the French league. What about Janssen? Soldado? etc etc etc.

Now this isn't to say quality players won't succeed when moving from these inferior leagues, they clearly do. But even if the French league was of the same standard, a statistical comparison does nothing because the sample area just isn't the same.

As Trix said a couple of pages back, stats are only really worthwhile when comparing players in the same position in the same team. Even then there's so many variables that it's mostly worthless.

The stats are only meaningless if you don't have the intelligence to contextualise them. Most reasonably rational people understand this (it wasn't me that posted Fekir's stats by the way). As we do the ramifications that go with signing players from different leagues.

But thank you again for telling me stuff and whatnot.

beats1 · Mar 28, 2017

Shadydan said:
at people who want to get rid of Son

Snarfalicious said:
You don't get rid of a guy like Son who can score 20 goals across all competitions when you're trying to compete across 4 competitions a season. He is absolutely vital to our squad, in my opinion.

TBF to the poster, he never said get rid of Son

He said if he got £30m+ for Son then he would consider letting go if we could get a quality replacement in

Bus-Conductor · Mar 28, 2017

Trix said:
The Premium is there because he is far less of a risk. With our current standing and budget, we can't afford to keep taking expensive gambles on players because like now, we can't ever rectify the problem until the following Summer.

OK, but we are into nuances and degrees of risk now aren't we, and my point was, if neither Fekir nor Barkley are guaranteed first team starters and we pay 30m for Barkley and 100k per week, or 20m for Fekir and 50k per week, what deal is better value ?

If they demand more for Barkley (than the 30m we paid for the PL experienced Sissoko) and Fekir costs a little bit less, then it gets even more interesting doesn't it ?? Risk/reward wise. Isn't that why/how we end up with the Lloris's, Vertonghen's, Alderwierelds, Eriksen's, Dier's. In fact very few of our first team have been bought as experienced PL players (Alderweireld - one season - Wanyama 2, Dembele - all of those originally from overseas) and none of our first team purchased were English with regular PL experience.

Shadydan · Mar 28, 2017

beats1 said:
TBF to the poster, he never said get rid of Son

He said if he got £30m+ for Son then he would consider letting go if we could get a quality replacement in

I think that goes without saying but that quality replacement just isn't going to come here, Son is one of the last people we should be looking to sell.

millsey · Mar 28, 2017

Trix said:
The Premium is there because he is far less of a risk. With our current standing and budget, we can't afford to keep taking expensive gambles on players because like now, we can't ever rectify the problem until the following Summer. With Barkley and Zaha, the manager hopefully pretty much knows exactly what he's getting.

And the idea is he improves them both. I think they both have a way to go to there potential

millsey · Mar 28, 2017

Bus-Conductor said:
OK, but we are into nuances and degrees of risk now aren't we, and my point was, if neither Fekir nor Barkley are guaranteed first team starters and we pay 30m for Barkley and 100k per week, or 20m for Fekir and 50k per week, what deal is better value ?

If they demand more for Barkley (than the 30m we paid for the PL experienced Sissoko) and Fekir costs a little bit less, then it gets even more interesting doesn't it ?? Risk/reward wise. Isn't that why/how we end up with the Lloris's, Vertonghen's, Alderwierelds, Eriksen's, Dier's. In fact very few of our first team have been bought as experienced PL players (Alderweireld - one season - Wanyama 2, Dembele - all of those originally from overseas) and none of our first team purchased were English with regular PL experience.

Barkley is not getting 100k a week. He simply won't be paid more than Alli and Eriksen. Not to mention others

panoma · Mar 28, 2017

Tucker said:
But he's better on sqwaka Trix!!111!!! Think of the stats!

You're spot on though. The French league is not at all comparable to the English League.

Not to mention our track record when buying french outfield players or players from the french league have been shocking the last few years: Sissoko, GKN, Stambouli, Capoue and N'jie..

Thats some depressing stuff

beats1 · Mar 28, 2017

millsey said:
Barkley is not getting 100k a week. He simply won't be paid more than Alli and Eriksen. Not to mention others

When you sign players they will tend to get bigger contracts than players developed at the club

Sissoko has been said to be on around £90k a week, people are going to say thats crazy but is it? We paid Bentley £60-70k a week and didnt have tv money back then

According to the Daily Mail, Barkley signed a 4 year contract in 2014 with a wage of £60k a week. He will want an increase on that and even if that is a bit high, its worth noting that everton are said to pay Lukaku around £90k a week at the moment and offering him a deal over £100k and Barkley will probably get offered at least a good deal by everton.

Also worth remembering their new owners are saying they are happy to invest a lot in to the club, everton fans dont think he is leaving but who knows

Trix · Mar 28, 2017

Bus-Conductor said:
OK, but we are into nuances and degrees of risk now aren't we, and my point was, if neither Fekir nor Barkley are guaranteed first team starters and we pay 30m for Barkley and 100k per week, or 20m for Fekir and 50k per week, what deal is better value ?

If they demand more for Barkley (than the 30m we paid for the PL experienced Sissoko) and Fekir costs a little bit less, then it gets even more interesting doesn't it ?? Risk/reward wise. Isn't that why/how we end up with the Lloris's, Vertonghen's, Alderwierelds, Eriksen's, Dier's. In fact very few of our first team have been bought as experienced PL players (Alderweireld - one season - Wanyama 2, Dembele - all of those originally from overseas) and none of our first team purchased were English with regular PL experience.

Yes but even in there short time in the Prem both Toby and Vic had proved to have settled and adapted no problem.

Tucker · Mar 28, 2017

Bus-Conductor said:
The stats are only meaningless if you don't have the intelligence to contextualise them. Most reasonably rational people understand this (it wasn't me that posted Fekir's stats by the way). As we do the ramifications that go with signing players from different leagues.

But thank you again for telling me stuff and whatnot.

Yet another arrogant reply from you BC.

The point is, you aren't contextualising the stats at all, especially when you try to claim that the French and Scottish leagues are of comparable quality to the English Premier League.

I'm an advocate of the old axiom that there are lies, damned lies, and statistics. You can pretty much prove any argument you want with statistics as long as you are willing to pick and choose the ones you use and refuse to put them into context.

We should be signing players based on what values and skills they bring to OUR team and how they could potentially perform against the kind of opposition we face week in week out. A statistical comparison between two players in two different leagues just can't do that I'm afraid. It's like comparing chalk and cheese.

LexingtonSpurs · Mar 28, 2017

beats1 said:
When you sign players they will tend to get bigger contracts than players developed at the club

Sissoko has been said to be on around £90k a week, people are going to say thats crazy but is it? We paid Bentley £60-70k a week and didnt have tv money back then

According to the Daily Mail, Barkley signed a 4 year contract in 2014 with a wage of £60k a week. He will want an increase on that and even if that is a bit high, its worth noting that everton are said to pay Lukaku around £90k a week at the moment and offering him a deal over £100k and Barkley will probably get offered at least a good deal by everton.

Also worth remembering their new owners are saying they are happy to invest a lot in to the club, everton fans dont think he is leaving but who knows

IF Barkley signs here - a big IF - it will not be because of the money. It will be because of Pochettino - and specifically what Pochettino has been able to do with young English talent in terms of preparing them for the national team.

If Barkley is only interested in the money, I imagine he will end up at Man City, or stay at Everton on a new contract. The fact that Barkley has allowed his contract to run down suggests to me he is looking for another opportunity. We would still have to be competitive with wages, but he will get higher offers from other teams.

lol · Mar 28, 2017

LexingtonSpurs said:
IF Barkley signs here - a big IF - it will not be because of the money. It will be because of Pochettino - and specifically what Pochettino has been able to do with young English talent in terms of preparing them for the national team.

If Barkley is only interested in the money, I imagine he will end up at Man City, or stay at Everton on a new contract. The fact that Barkley has allowed his contract to run down suggests to me he is looking for another opportunity. We would still have to be competitive with wages, but he will get higher offers from other teams.

so glad he got snubbed for england. he knows if he comes here he's almost guaranteed a place in the england squad.

DezFitz · Mar 28, 2017

lol said:
so glad he got snubbed for england. he knows if he comes here he's almost guaranteed a place in the england squad.

He's already in the England squad.

Shadydan · Mar 28, 2017

DezFitz said:
He's already in the England squad.

Hasn't been picked to play for 7 matches which is what I suspect he meant.

scat1620 · Mar 28, 2017

beats1 · Mar 28, 2017

LexingtonSpurs said:
IF Barkley signs here - a big IF - it will not be because of the money. It will be because of Pochettino - and specifically what Pochettino has been able to do with young English talent in terms of preparing them for the national team.

If Barkley is only interested in the money, I imagine he will end up at Man City, or stay at Everton on a new contract. The fact that Barkley has allowed his contract to run down suggests to me he is looking for another opportunity. We would still have to be competitive with wages, but he will get higher offers from other teams.

Did I say he was coming here for the money?

Equally I dont think you will expect him to come here and say I will take a low wage just so that I can work with Pochettino

Also the wages that we will offer and Man City will offer are hugely different. We can offer Barkley 100k a week which is high for us, Man City would offer him around £150k a week which is ok for them

Everton have a good manager who has done well with young talent, in Koeman and he has worked well with him over the past 12 months. If he leaves he will come to us knowing he will have to fight to get in our first 11.

lol said:
so glad he got snubbed for england. he knows if he comes here he's almost guaranteed a place in the england squad.

He isn't guaranteed a place in our first 11, I dont see how he would come to us and automatically become 1st choice for england

Unless we go 4231, Barkley isn't starting for us as we only have two spots which are taken by Alli and Eriksen with Son and Lamela waiting behind them

Shadydan · Mar 28, 2017

beats1 said:
Did I say he was coming here for the money?

Equally I dont think you will expect him to come here and say I will take a low wage just so that I can work with Pochettino

Also the wages that we will offer and Man City will offer are hugely different. We can offer Barkley 100k a week which is high for us, Man City would offer him around £150k a week which is ok for them

Everton have a good manager who has done well with young talent, in Koeman and he has worked well with him over the past 12 months. If he leaves he will come to us knowing he will have to fight to get in our first 11.

He isn't guaranteed a place in our first 11, I dont see how he would come to us and automatically become 1st choice for england

Unless we go 4231, Barkley isn't starting for us as we only have two spots which are taken by Alli and Eriksen with Son and Lamela waiting behind them

Are Man City interested in him?

beats1 · Mar 28, 2017

Shadydan said:
Are Man City interested in him?

I dont think they are nor do they need him but the op mentioned them

Arsenal might be interested if Ozil leaves

Dharmabum · Mar 28, 2017

millsey said:
Would rather pay 30 million for a talented English player who's played the prem all his life, to 25 mill talented players who's only played in a crap French league. You are simply taking too high a risk he can cope

Just for your information, that "crap league" has produced more world-class and top-notch players for the EPL - as well as other leagues around Europe - than all the EPL clubs together

And that "crap" league happen to have a team that knocked out both Spurs and ManC from the CL.

Dharmabum · Mar 28, 2017

Snarfalicious said:
You don't get rid of a guy like Son who can score 20 goals across all competitions when you're trying to compete across 4 competitions a season. He is absolutely vital to our squad, in my opinion.

I see your point....but the fact is that Son has NEVER averaged 20 goals in any of his seasons (in Europe). In all fairness, he's not played regulalry for Spurs this season and many of his appearances has been as a sub.

@allpaths I don't see any point of your WTF, unless you just are in a grumpy state of mind and wana p*** me off. Sorry, you didn't.
I was simply stating a true fact about Son, duh

But you may be one of those who can't stand the truth

However, if you felt good about your WFT rating and it helped defuse your negative state of mind and thus preventing you from lashing out at people mores close to you, I am happy be of some (def)use

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