SandroClegane
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- Jun 27, 2012
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Most kids his age just like the attention and retweet anything that mentions them. I wouldn't read that far into it.
The Spurs Youth Thread - 2017/2018
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THFCSPURS19
The Speaker of the Transfer Rumours Forum
- Jan 6, 2013
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FFS I was half-way into my post about why we should dismantle our Academy.
Spurzinho
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As big a fan of our youth as I am, and I've been researching, watching and supporting them since 1999ish I find it hard to moan too much about the lack of progress of our kids simply because, as a club, we're doing so well. I've seen us flirt with relegation and survive on the last day. I've seen us play Gary Doherty up front, I've watched Anthony Gardner pushed out onto the wing, I've watched Goran Bunjevcevic played in central midfield and a central midfield consisting of Gus Poyet and Darren Anderton, I've watched Scum Campbell tease and tantalise us about signing a contract extension only to saunter down the road to that lot for nothing and then win big bloody trophies!!!, I've prayed to the football gods that Jamie Slabber would be our "20 goal a season" striker, I've watched us get tonked by the Gooners and Chelski more times than is strictly good for my health. I've watched us be the punchline to every joke, the softest touch in the Premier League. I've heard the sniggers, the laughs, the scoffs, the withering put downs, dismissals and contemptuous insults.
If Poch doesn't think KWP & Onomah are good enough yet then, tbh, I'm just not going to lose my mind over it. Not any more.
If Poch doesn't think KWP & Onomah are good enough yet then, tbh, I'm just not going to lose my mind over it. Not any more.
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Hercules
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- Jul 23, 2014
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Excellent post.
Cornpattbuck
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- Jul 23, 2013
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Ditto.
I remember being a very annoying kid (probably!) and telling every man and his dog how good Campbell was going to be when he was still getting shunted out to full back etc.
And then telling people it didn't matter that he was a **** because we had Ledley and Alton Thelwell coming through plus Anthony Gardner!!!
Seems a lifetime ago.
BPR_U16
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- Jun 28, 2006
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No one was mentioning Griffiths as being a potential squad member at start of the season. Admittedly he has scored a few goals this year but not at highest levels.
It can be argued that he should be being tried out at these but he has to prove that he warrants selection, that's both in play and attitude. If coaches prefer Sterling are they wrong or does he offer more to the team dynamic.
At what appears to be the first test there are suggestions that he wants to move on and some are saying he, and others. should as the 'way is blocked'.
What if Harry had done that, rather than grafting and improving - can Griffiths not see that is the best way to progress, it can't all just be laid out on a plate in front of them.
And is his road blocked? Believe the papers and Harry will be off in 1 to 2 years and Griffiths will still only be 19/20. Hopefully H will stay but we would still require someone to cover/rotate and we would all love it to be another of our own.
I am all for trying to bring youth through but it must not be to the detriment of the first team. I too have seen many a player wearing our shirt who I would rather forget, i even remember our season in the old Div 2.
We currently have the best squad I have seen and it makes it difficult for any youth player to break through.
If they have the talent, desire and determination to follow his philosophy then Poch will give them opportunities and they must make the most of whatever is given.
It can be argued that he should be being tried out at these but he has to prove that he warrants selection, that's both in play and attitude. If coaches prefer Sterling are they wrong or does he offer more to the team dynamic.
At what appears to be the first test there are suggestions that he wants to move on and some are saying he, and others. should as the 'way is blocked'.
What if Harry had done that, rather than grafting and improving - can Griffiths not see that is the best way to progress, it can't all just be laid out on a plate in front of them.
And is his road blocked? Believe the papers and Harry will be off in 1 to 2 years and Griffiths will still only be 19/20. Hopefully H will stay but we would still require someone to cover/rotate and we would all love it to be another of our own.
I am all for trying to bring youth through but it must not be to the detriment of the first team. I too have seen many a player wearing our shirt who I would rather forget, i even remember our season in the old Div 2.
We currently have the best squad I have seen and it makes it difficult for any youth player to break through.
If they have the talent, desire and determination to follow his philosophy then Poch will give them opportunities and they must make the most of whatever is given.
WindyCOYS
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- Feb 24, 2016
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I was told it might be a sibling as Omolabi had been on crutches since November, but he didn't look good enough in his performances for us so perhaps he recovered and it is him.
Spurzinho
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- Jan 24, 2016
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Well, he's listed as Royin Omolabi, so it would be weird if it was a brother.
beats1
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- Feb 22, 2010
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I dont think anyone is realistically saying he should be a starter now
Also regarding your last sentence, where is the evidence for this?
No one is saying, we should throw in kids that will harm our first team success
For a lot of us, this is a great period in our history but I personally do find it tiring on this board that people use the 90's ever since we started to be good since Jol as an excuse to justify how we should be grateful for the current period
In terms of this thread specifically, it relates to the academy, so players getting a lack of opportunity is something that does concern this thread specifically. It shouldn't really keep going back to we are successful now, so it doesnt matter as much.
Its funny how for years, people on this thread bemoaned how chelsea where a disgrace that they would have talented players that they were never going to give an opportunity and now we are in a successful period, people say thats the price of having a great team(despite the fact we arent as successful as chelsea were, yet)
I think its a fair gripe that some of the weaker first team players are undeserving of their place and in the long term it would be better to have some youth players.
I dont think Onomah and KWP, deserve to automatically made first team players but if they both have potential to be top players like our academy coaches believe, I find it disappointing we are doing our best to achieve that. KWP isnt better than Aurier as long as he is unproven and is hard to drop but in the long term we have potentially a better player in KWP.
For example, we wanted to sign Origi in 2014, who says he went to our club but turned us down. Origi after his world cup showing was considered a much better player than Kane but had we signed Origi, Kane would have been loaned out and unlikely we would have Kane breakthrough our team. In the end Kane was given an opportunity to show he could reach his potential and did.
I feel the problem is that the club's culture isnt to produce players and under ramsey and timmy, which unfortunately did go down too well with Redknapp and AVB but if went for that period, we wouldn't have the players we do now and not to mention it was the academy players who stuck up for Poch against the old guard as well.
Waxman
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- Nov 14, 2003
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Gustavo poyet?
Spurzinho
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Indeed. Corrected.
I think Kane has made us believe anything is possible. So everyone is hungry for the next cab off the rank. Ultimately if a player is great I think him being “one of our own” or bought has very little difference really. I doubt Liverpool fans could be anymore in love with Salah than they are had he come through their academy. I think the only benefit of bringing a superstar through the academy is it gives you a bit more hope he went f*** off to Real Madrid.
IGSpur
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- Jan 11, 2013
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But all of these players came through and got chances under Rednapp, AVB and Sherwood. They all played PL and when we realised they weren't going to continue to play at the level we wanted PL and Championship clubs wanted them having seen their level. Our current players aren't getting an opportunity to showcase themselves so why would PL clubs take risks on them when our own manager who sees them all the te won't. So we won't be a very good platform for them as the likes of Onomah and KWP could leave with a combined 300mins between em.
If we now just start keeping our talebted players around for quoata's sake we'd be doing the very thing we moan at the top clubs for doing stifling careers with no onentention to play them so we're inline with the rules
IGSpur
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I agree with this but it's not relevant to the likes of Griffiths and our academy players. If we don't want to play them as we think they're not good enough then fine, but isn't the discussion about whether they stock around. We could never play another academy player again, which o think would be a loss, but then I'd advocate for all of them leaving the club as soon as. Wouldn't you? Onomah and KWP and likely Shashoua and TOB have been sold a dream. No one particularly cares but then people shouldn't complain when players start talking about looking elsewhere
Bus-Conductor
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- Oct 19, 2004
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Who can s AJ Tracey?
DanielCHillier
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Rapper/grime artist and Spurs fan.
coy-spurs1882
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it seems that poch wants young players to have similar influence as dele or even kane before they can secure a place in first team and that's why i disagree with poch's view on youth loan, it is very difficult for young players to make a difference for us without any first team experience.
Bus-Conductor
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On the face of it this is a lovely post, and I get the sentiment, but ultimately it's just the "as good as it gets" mantra with hundreds and thousands sprinkled on top.
As someone who's lived through that Spurs (for the record I go back even further, I've watched a Spurs get relegated) and doesn't want to see it again, you can't be too glib about watching a midfield consisting of Sissoko and Dier.
It's precisely because Ive experienced that Spurs that it vexes me when I know we have just spent 40+ million in transfer and wages on a RB, when I know it would have cost nothing and about a quarter of the wages and in 12 months we'd have had as good a RB, and in 24 a better one.
We all know how football works, it can turn to shit very quickly, a few decisions, poor recruitment, poor management of resources, and we don't have the revenues to guarantee uber status regardless of circumstances.
We might have the revenues to not become Leeds or Notts Forest, but we could easily become that Spurs again. Look at Arsenal now or Liverpool over the last 10 years. And they have had better resources than we have.
If we don't ever want to see that Spurs again, we have to care about the details, if not immensely, then at least a little.
Vincent30
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- Aug 31, 2012
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I get your gripe about KWP, but what other top 4 clubs would has developed 3 english youth players (ok two of them we paid for and both under 5m, but still it needs to be recognised that we took punts on these players when others didn't and we gave them first team opportunities):
Kane - A youth prospect being loaned to the likes of Millwall and due to Spurs one of the top 3 strikers in world football
Dele - We took a big leap of faith on this kid and in no way been detrimental to his development, from a youth prospect in league one to one of the most exciting young players in world football due to Spurs
Dier - Rejected by Everton, we took a punt on him and now one an England regular and a vital part to our starting 11 who has developed into one of the most versatile players in the league due to Spurs.
Who have Liverpool, Chelsea, City or United developed like this? We can't compare ourselves to other smaller clubs because you can't penalise quality just to give a youth player a chance.
Giving 3 young English players a chance to thrive is ridiculous in the current financial climate of Premier League football. This doesn't include the likes of Winks, Foyth and KWP to a smaller degree.
Currently i find it difficult to understand any negative comments around our youth development, is it perfect, of course not, but it's a solid 8/10.
I said in the Harry Winks post, if the likes of Winks or Onomah want to be a starting CM for Tottenham Hotspur football club, a club now cementing itself as one of the top 4 clubs in the country, mixing it with the best European teams. Then THEY have to prove that they are better than Dembele / Dier / Wanyama etc. They need to get to training earlier and leave later, they need to be better in training and when they get time on the pitch or time away on loan, they need to prove themselves.
That's all it comes down to now, we aren't a top 10 club anymore, we aren't a charity club for youth players to get at least 10 starts a season in their preferred position. We are a big club, if a player comes on in a position that isn't his, show the manager you want it, show you want to make. It's all about application.
The only part i agree with in a lot of the posts i have read in this topic, is the development of KWP. I would have enjoyed to see him more. But who are we to judge what his attitude is like and how hard he trains compared to Serge / Tripps, a lot of unknowns.
But we piss all over the over top 4 clubs so lets celebrate that a little please.
IGSpur
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- Jan 11, 2013
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Again you are conflating academy development and young player development.
If we go by what you say, Liverpool have done something similar, with Sterling and Coutinho, and are currently working on Gomez and TAA. The rest of the clubs don't need to develop young players as they can buy finished products, but players like Sane, Stones, Lingard, Fosu-Mensah, Jesus have all developed well over the last year.
So other clubs are also developing young players but they don't necessarily need to and other than Liverpool haven't done it as successfully and regularly as us. but noone has questioned the youth development and Poch's ability to improve the young players we buy.
This thread is about the academy so his ability to develop players that have at around 20 first team games for various clubs isn't relevant. In fact it is what gets people so frustrated that we have this excellent coach and yet he does not appear to give the academy players a chance.
So if we are talking about our academy, in the last 4 years other clubs have done a lot better with their academy than we have and so we are not pissing over anyone. If someone wants to start a thread on Young player development and make these comments then that's OK, I'll go in myself and wax lyrical about Poch, but that isn't what this thread is about or the discussion.
We are at a massive financial disadvantage to other clubs, so we can't outspend them we need to make use of one of the best academies in the world. Secondly, if we're going to go around and talk about how we are different to other clubs as we are growing organically and brag about it, like we did when we had Mason etc. then we need to start using the academy. If we are instead going to just go out and buy other players, like other clubs, then we can stop bragging. We are no different. They can buy young players, we can buy young players, they can just buy more expensive, but we already know that. So like I say we need to be smarter.
The rest of your post has been done to death and will just create one of those debates no one is really interested in.
