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A headache for Wenger & a lesson for everyone else

Bill_Oddie

Everything in Moderation
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Feb 1, 2005
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Cesc Fabregas looks likely to leave Arsenal for Barcelona in the near future and his departure creates not only a large hole in the Top 4 side's midfield but also a big headache for Arsene Wenger.

The constraints of a 25-man squad have been well documented and Premier League teams have been feeling their way somewhat in learning how to deal with being limited to 25 players over the age of 21 for match-day squads. Teams have sent established, experienced international players out on loan to both save them being idle and attempt to raise their value for future sales.

Cesc Fabregas doesn't need any help in that department. His impressive Premier League career has seen him likely to move to the European Champions for around 35million pounds.

This is a sizeable amount of money for Wenger to rebuild and rumours are that he is close to bringing in Argentinian Ricardo Alvarez as a direct replacement.

Alvarez' fee is unknown but speculated to be around 10-15m. That leaves Wenger with plenty of change to invest in other areas of his squad.

However, in swapping Fabregas for Alvarez, Wenger has created a new problem for himself. Fabregas, under Premier League rules, is qualified as "homegrown". He learnt his trade playing in England for more than three years before turning 21. The same cannot be said of Alvarez.

Last season, Arsenal had no trouble hitting the clause of the Premier League's 25-man squad rule that states that eight of their squad must be "homegrown". They had seven 'first teamers' - Fabregas, Gael Clichy, Denilson, Alex Song, Johan Djourou, Alex Mannone and Niklas Bendtner - plus any five from their many youth team players (they named only twenty out of the possible twenty-five 'first teamers' in 2010/11).

But take another look at that list. Fans of transfer speculation will see the extent of Wenger's headache. In addition to the likely departure of Fabregas, Gael Clichy has been heavily linked with a move to Manchester City, Denilson was reported to be allowed to leave and the likelihood of Bendtner ever pulling on a Gunners' shirt again is remote at best after he has numerously and publicly voiced his desire to get away from The Emirates.

If those players were to leave, Arsenal would have Song, Djourou and Mannone as their only "homegrown" players. A small mercy is that Theo Walcott, Kieran Gibbs and Armand Traore are now old enough to be members of a First Team Squad. However, that still means that Arsenal must sign two English trained and qualified footballers just to have a squad that is eligible to start this season.

The current market for English footballers has seen Jordan Henderson - a player recently outclassed by his Spanish equivalents, themselves unlikely to usurp Fabregas for club or country any time soon - sign for Liverpool for 20million pounds.

Meanwhile, Wenger has in the past twelve months jettisoned promising young players such as Mark Randall, Thomas Cruise, Jay Simpson, Roarie Deacon, and Luke Ayling for the sole reason that he could not find a place for them in his 25-man squad. An academy which has had the football world excited and expecting big things is threatened with petering out before it becomes clear just how good some of its graduates are. Wenger is known to be angry about being forced to release these players but is powerless to prevent situations such as the one that saw Kerrea Gilbert stuck at Arsenal for a year after his 23rd birthday but unable to participate in first team affairs.

So, who will Wenger turn to to fill his quota of homegrown players? Scott Parker and Gary Cahill are two names that have been linked and would provide some much needed leadership experience. However, the required outlay for the pair added to the Alvarez sum does nothing more than cancel out all the money received for Fabregas. And leaves serious questions about whether Arsenal are any better prepared for a Premier League title challenge. Further investment seems mandatory.

And that question becomes even deeper if the likes of Samir Nasri and Andrei Arshavin leave The Emirates as has been mooted.

Not least because if this does happen, Arsene Wenger is only one move away from having to replace them with an English equivalent. And as anyone who has watched the national side or their Under-21 compatriots recently will tell you: the pickings there are slim.
 

Bronno

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Jul 11, 2004
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I don't really understand (but I didn't get much sleep last night so probably my fault), surely they would just register a smaller squad. They wouldn't be required to sign English players to have an eligible team.
 

Reece

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May 27, 2005
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I don't really understand (but I didn't get much sleep last night so probably my fault), surely they would just register a smaller squad. They wouldn't be required to sign English players to have an eligible team.

I think they MUST have 8 players registered in their squad that are first teamers (over 21), but that were trained for 3 years before the age of 21 in england. Apparently many of which arsenal do not have ...
 

chrissivad

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May 20, 2005
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you dont have to have 8. Bronno is correct, if you cant name 8 then you have a reduced squad
 

Bronno

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Jul 11, 2004
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I think they MUST have 8 players registered in their squad that are first teamers (over 21), but that were trained for 3 years before the age of 21 in england. Apparently many of which arsenal do not have ...

Only 8 of a maximum registered squad size of 25 players over the age of 21 are required to be homegrown. I thought that was pretty much the sole reason the rule was accepted by the clubs, since it effectively changes very little.
 

Bill_Oddie

Everything in Moderation
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Feb 1, 2005
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Yeah, sorry, that wasn't clear. Instead of eligible I meant capable. The question is one of quality. The reason Wenger's life is becoming so much more difficult as a result of the new squad rules is two-fold. firstly, if he wants to replace the likes of Clichy and Fabregas, he really has to do so with a "Homegrown" player. At worst he should bring an alternative into the squad. But in doing so, he compromises the quality of his team. Either the quality decreases... which it will. Or the quantity of "homegrown" players will, which means the number of individuals in his squad will, which also leaves him less able to mount a decent campaign.

To Wenger, missing out of Jones or even Henderson was bad news. For Arsenal to be suitably prepared for success this season (which is surely 4th or bust), they have to consider the likes of Parker, Cahill or even a Gareth Barry-type figure.

Meanwhile the likes of Lansbury and Emmanuel-Thomas face a make-or-break 12 months in which they either prove themselves worthy of a 25-man squad place or get forever released from the Professor's clutches.
 

brasil_spur

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Aug 25, 2006
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the rule is that you can only name a maximum of 17 non-homegrown players in a squad of 25.

from memory chelsea only named a 21 man squad last season because of this.
 

Bill_Oddie

Everything in Moderation
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Feb 1, 2005
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the rule is that you can only name a maximum of 17 non-homegrown players in a squad of 25.

from memory chelsea only named a 21 man squad last season because of this.

Quite a few sides went with fewer than 25.

You have to wonder why though. Unless the U21s are ridiculously good. And in Arsenal's case, they are releasing more players at 22 for zero fees. Hence why Wenger is getting upset at this squad ruling and why Arsenal will find it harder and harder to be competitive. Especially in a summer where they lose the likes of Fabregas and Clichy. I can't think of many "homegrown" equivalents as good as them.
 

Dharmabum

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Aug 16, 2003
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This new squad rule (only applied in the EPL) is ridiculous really and,as usual, it's the rich clubs which buys themselves around the new rule .... by simply buying up young, English talent - at over inflated prices - and keeping them on hold or sending them out loan as well as "steal" top international talent (something Gooners have specialized themselves at - particularly from Barca); and they thus are secured to fill their 25 man squads with quality talent who all "qualifies" within the stupid new rules.
It won't benefit the English national team.
 

StartingPrice

Chief Sardonicus Hyperlip
Feb 13, 2004
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Perhaps adds to the speculation that he might move for Defoe.

Makes it even more imperative that we get Cahill.

Surely, though, this ruling was muted as being in the offing a few years ago - why is a club as big as the Goons not prepared for it. I am fairly certain that one of the reasons given for Comolli buying up all of the available British talent while at the Lane was that it would ensure we had no difficulties with this ruling.

Perhaps we could sell them Bentley (£25 M, if Henderson is £20 M:shrug:) - y'know, like, do our neighbours a favour and help them out a bit:wink:
 

Reece

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May 27, 2005
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Only 8 of a maximum registered squad size of 25 players over the age of 21 are required to be homegrown. I thought that was pretty much the sole reason the rule was accepted by the clubs, since it effectively changes very little.

Ahhh i see. Seems a little stupid to me. I would of thought making it imperative that you have a minimum required amount would guarantee more young players coming through.. Even so i suppose the rule mentions nothing about them being british so as someone else said it doesn't really benefit the national team at all.
 

karennina

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Nov 24, 2004
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They might just promote Traore, who is homegrown, in place of Clichy. He's the one the goon fans seem unconcerned about leaving. Whether they're right or not, I couldn't say.
 

Bill_Oddie

Everything in Moderation
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Feb 1, 2005
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This new squad rule (only applied in the EPL) is ridiculous really and,as usual, it's the rich clubs which buys themselves around the new rule .... by simply buying up young, English talent - at over inflated prices - and keeping them on hold or sending them out loan as well as "steal" top international talent (something Gooners have specialized themselves at - particularly from Barca); and they thus are secured to fill their 25 man squads with quality talent who all "qualifies" within the stupid new rules.
It won't benefit the English national team.

Yeah, in fact, seeing as due to the circumstances that are presently arising, you find young players worth far more than ever (Carroll, Henderson, etc), thus forcing them more into public awareness and giving them increased pressure before they know how to deal with it. You could argue this is actually counter-productive to the interests of the national side.

They might just promote Traore, who is homegrown, in place of Clichy. He's the one the goon fans seem unconcerned about leaving. Whether they're right or not, I couldn't say.

This is exactly what has been mooted but is exactly the situation I'm talking about. They are nigh-on forced to bring through a young kid with limited experience and limited quality to replace a proven international who has performed consistently in the Premier League.

Wenger, due to having a maximum squad size and cap on "non-homegrown" players has a straightforward choice between bringing an un-tested Traore into his squad or releasing him (throwing away any potential fee as no-one would pay big for Traore at the moment, even if he turns into a huge player in years to come) and spending on an English replacement (Ashley Cole or Wayne Bridge, sir?) or getting an overseas player, who if he's not first choice uses up a squad place that they need elsewhere while blocking the development of Kieran Gibbs. And if he's not is not adding the quality that they need to sustain a title challenge.

As I say, a headache.
 

beats1

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Feb 22, 2010
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Yeah, in fact, seeing as due to the circumstances that are presently arising, you find young players worth far more than ever (Carroll, Henderson, etc), thus forcing them more into public awareness and giving them increased pressure before they know how to deal with it. You could argue this is actually counter-productive to the interests of the national side.



This is exactly what has been mooted but is exactly the situation I'm talking about. They are nigh-on forced to bring through a young kid with limited experience and limited quality to replace a proven international who has performed consistently in the Premier League.

Wenger, due to having a maximum squad size and cap on "non-homegrown" players has a straightforward choice between bringing an un-tested Traore into his squad or releasing him (throwing away any potential fee as no-one would pay big for Traore at the moment, even if he turns into a huge player in years to come) and spending on an English replacement (Ashley Cole or Wayne Bridge, sir?) or getting an overseas player, who if he's not first choice uses up a squad place that they need elsewhere while blocking the development of Kieran Gibbs. And if he's not is not adding the quality that they need to sustain a title challenge.

As I say, a headache.

I think Traore is a very good player who did very well for harry at portsmouth, who I think harry wanted when he first came here
 

Spursking

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May 16, 2004
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It is not really a headache for Wenger. He will probably sign a player I have wanted at Spurs for such a long time - Gervinho.

If you know the market, it is no problem losing players like Fabregas.
 

Jody

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Sep 11, 2004
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It is not really a headache for Wenger. He will probably sign a player I have wanted at Spurs for such a long time - Gervinho.

If you know the market, it is no problem losing players like Fabregas.


Wanted by Barca, but he won't really be missed :lol:
 
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