What's new

Come on Daniel admit it now DOF means DOFW does not work

Spurs_Q8

Well-Known Member
May 21, 2005
3,161
139
STOP THIS!!! What is this nonsense? Comolli has done a great job for this Club, and it is a shame that supporters cannot understand that!

Just delete this post, because it is very unfair to Comolli.

so let's explain ..

how much we paid for Chimbonda ? and how much wigan paid for him ? and how much West Ham paid for Lucas Neil ?

how much we paid for Ekotto ? and how much Blackburn paid for Warnock ?

how much we paid for Zokora ? and how much

how much we paid for Malbranque when Milner was available for only 4m ? and for which price Rosicky & Hleb were available ?

how much we paid for Bent ? and how much Man city paid for Elano & Petrov ?

tell me Comolli is doing a great jon here ?

note: his good signings are Taarabt, Boateng & Pekhart .. none of them starting XI players. these 7-10m of more than 50m paid under Comolli :wink:

our best players:

Robinson .. Pleat
King .. from the club
Dawson .. Pleat/Arnesen
Lee .. MJ
Lennon .. Pleat
Huddlestone .. Pleat/Arnesen
Jenas .. Levy ( recomended by Eriksson )
Keane .. Glenn Hoddle
Defoe .. Pleat
Berbatov .. MJ

so, what's Comolli job ?
 

nidge

Sand gets everywhere!!!!!
Staff
Jul 27, 2004
24,858
11,358
Two top 5 finishes says you are wrong.

Comolli had very little to do with the first top 5 finish. He came in at X-Mas and brought Danny Murphy and Ghaly, neither had any impact on our season.

Then the second 5 place Chimbonda is hardly a great find, Berbatov well there is disagreement over who was more responsibly for that signing. Zokora has polarised debate more on this site and any other player in recent times. So far Comolli work on the first team has been patchy at best. Now I don't wholly blame Comolli for this as I am sure his hand are tied to a certain extent by Levy but, it is just too simplistic to say Comolli gave us 2 fifth place finishes.
 

etcheverry

Banned
Dec 23, 2004
106
0
so, what's Comolli job ?



Life, which you so nobly serve,
comes from destruction. Look at this empty
glass.



Here it is... peaceful... serene...
but if it is...


Destroyed...




...Look at all these little things...
so busy all of a sudden.
Notice how each one is useful.
What a lovely ballet, so full of form
and color. So full of..life!







by creating a little destruction,
Cum-Ole is, in fact, encouraging life!
 

Barmy_in_Palmy

El Presidente In Absentia
Jun 6, 2005
16,254
17,215
so let's explain ..

how much we paid for Chimbonda ? and how much wigan paid for him ? and how much West Ham paid for Lucas Neil ? Fuck all because hr had 6 months left on his contract and would have left Blackburn for free, he went to West Ham because they were willing to pay his 60k/week wages which we weren't and fair enough.

how much we paid for Ekotto ? and how much Blackburn paid for Warnock ?

how much we paid for Zokora ? and how much

how much we paid for Malbranque when Milner was available for only 4m ? and for which price Rosicky & Hleb were available ? Milner was never available, Villa wanted him and he wanted to go back to Villa where he had been on loan, but Newcastle refused to sell him. Also where do you get the 4m figure from?

Even the Gooners hate Hleb, and we can't offer CL football to Rosicky.

how much we paid for Bent ? and how much Man city paid for Elano & Petrov ?

tell me Comolli is doing a great jon here ?

note: his good signings are Taarabt, Boateng & Pekhart .. none of them starting XI players. these 7-10m of more than 50m paid under Comolli :wink: WTF?

our best players:

Robinson .. Pleat
King .. from the club
Dawson .. Pleat/Arnesen
Lee .. MJ?
Lennon .. Pleat - was Arnesen
Huddlestone .. Pleat/Arnesen
Jenas .. Levy ( recomended by Eriksson )
Keane .. Glenn Hoddle
Defoe .. Pleat
Berbatov .. MJ?

so, what's Comolli job ?

Director of Football.

Look, this is what I just don't fucking get when people argue between Comolli and Jol.

Comolli signs the players and Jol coaches them. Thats it.

When people try to promote Jol over Comolli they always fuck up by saying that all the good signings were done by Jol and all the crap ones by Comolli.

Comolli signed all the players and and Jol signed none of the players. Davids excepted since we didn't have a DOF at that time.

So frankly, your argument means fuck all.
 

Spurs_Q8

Well-Known Member
May 21, 2005
3,161
139
Barmy_in_Palmy

Lucas Neil: wanted out before winter transfer window and West ham not interested, if he was going to look at non french players, he can get him, why only trying for Chimbonda and not that one ?

Milner: Reoder agreed to sell him for Villa for that price and Fee agreed, they changed their mind in last day of transfer window, but if we want him, we will get him. Newcastle can't do that if we offered good deal with them. They did it because injuries and bad deals in last day.

Hleb & Rosicky: so How we signed Kaboul, Zokora, Taarabt etc in spite of Arsenal interest ? Berbatov was also wanted by Man Utd and we can't offer CL football for them too !

----

asking why i said 50m ?
Chimbonda 5m - Kaboul 8m - Ekotto 3.5m - Malbranque 3m - Boateng 5.4m - Zokora 7m - Taarabt 3.5m - Bent 16m ( let alone Alnewick, Dervitte, Pekhart etc .. ) how much these signings ?

----

Lee .. no DoF in that time, signed by Martin Jol

Lennon .. heard in the past here about Pleat was in talks with Leeds to sign him, but any way.. this isn't 100% Comolli signing !

Berbatov .. when we signed him, MJ said that he is watching Bundsliga and he was deseprate to get him even for that price. Did he said the same with Kaboul for example ?

Ian Wright said that he had sources for the club.. Only Bale was agreed by MJ this summer and we wanted other players likes Elano and Petrov.

anyway, if Comolli make all of these signings as you said.. then, it's a bigger problem because the manager needs to get his own players whick help his tacticals, does Comolli knows more than Martin Jol or other managers ?!
 

phil

Well-Known Member
Oct 25, 2004
2,038
1,239
so let's explain ..

how much we paid for Chimbonda ? and how much wigan paid for him ? and how much West Ham paid for Lucas Neil ?

how much we paid for Ekotto ? and how much Blackburn paid for Warnock ?

how much we paid for Zokora ? and how much

how much we paid for Malbranque when Milner was available for only 4m ? and for which price Rosicky & Hleb were available ?

how much we paid for Bent ? and how much Man city paid for Elano & Petrov ?

tell me Comolli is doing a great jon here ?

note: his good signings are Taarabt, Boateng & Pekhart .. none of them starting XI players. these 7-10m of more than 50m paid under Comolli :wink:

our best players:

Robinson .. Pleat
King .. from the club
Dawson .. Pleat/Arnesen
Lee .. MJ
Lennon .. Pleat
Huddlestone .. Pleat/Arnesen
Jenas .. Levy ( recomended by Eriksson )
Keane .. Glenn Hoddle
Defoe .. Pleat
Berbatov .. MJ

so, what's Comolli job ?

Not sure what your point is. I think Malbranque cost £2M, whereas Rosicky cost £7M and Hleb £10M. Doubt if Rosicky would have come to us instead of Arsenal.

Why do you believe that all our unsuccessful buys were down to Comolli but the successful one were down to Jol?

Jol has gone. Get over it.
 

ShadyRay

Be Nice, I'm New
Sep 10, 2005
5,738
9
so let's explain ..

how much we paid for Chimbonda ? and how much wigan paid for him ? and how much West Ham paid for Lucas Neil ?

how much we paid for Ekotto ? and how much Blackburn paid for Warnock ?

how much we paid for Zokora ? and how much

how much we paid for Malbranque when Milner was available for only 4m ? and for which price Rosicky & Hleb were available ?

how much we paid for Bent ? and how much Man city paid for Elano & Petrov ?

Are we talking about the Lucas Neill who turned his back on Liverpool after agreeing to sign, because West ham offered him 60k a week? Or the Petrov who turned us down for Man City, because they offered him around the same? Are you complaining because we're not prepared to pay well over the odds for mercenary players?

Or the Hleb who cost more than Berbatov, and would have been our record signing? You're comparing the £2mill Malbranque with the £11mill Hleb? How about the Rosicky who we were after, but who chose Arsenal over us (not surprising to be fair)?

Or the Elano who's probably been the best buy in the world this season? You're critising our Sporting Director because of a player who not only slipped through our net, but also that of every other top football club in the world. Any argument based on Elano that you level at Comolli can equally be used on Ferguson, Wenger, Rikjaard, Mancini, Acelotti etc.

Basically, you're pathetic argument has more holes in it than a fine Berne Emmental.
 

ShadyRay

Be Nice, I'm New
Sep 10, 2005
5,738
9
I see others are as embarrassed by Q8's nonsense as I am.

Incidentally, I typed and posted that ages ago but it was just left hanging for some reason. I hadn't noticed so I watched an episode of Mysterious Cities of Gold while I did my ironing, and when I came back I found it was still hanging. So apologies for repeating points that BiP and Phil most excellently made before me.

Q8, just put on your oversized shoes and your curly red wig, jump on your tiny tiny bicycle, and leave the intelligent people to discuss football.
 

SpurSince57

Well-Known Member
Jan 20, 2006
45,213
8,229
I have it on pretty good authority that Petrov is actuallly on £30k-£35k a week at City, but yes, Q8's 'argument' is tosh.
 

Banjo

Member
May 29, 2005
778
10
:hello:

Jol Has some interesting things to say in today's Observer on the DoF/SD issue.

[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif]Pride after the fall[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif]Deposed manager on how it went wrong at Spurs, his continued affection for the club - and chairman - and his hopes of remaining in England[/FONT]
[FONT=Geneva,Arial,sans-serif]Duncan Castles[/FONT]
[FONT=Geneva,Arial,sans-serif]Sunday November 4, 2007[/FONT]

[FONT=Geneva,Arial,sans-serif]Observer[/FONT]

[FONT=Geneva,Arial,sans-serif]A master of the one-liner, Jol jokes about that affinity. He is dressed in a burgundy shirt, similar in colour to Arsenal's centenary kit of two seasons ago. 'This is the first time I wear this colour, it's unbelievable,' says Jol. 'But that is what they put into you when you are at Spurs. If I would have £2billion I would buy Arsenal. And I'd make a big parking place from the Emirates and make a new stadium for Spurs. Or for another club, you know. That is a nice one!' [/FONT]
[FONT=Geneva,Arial,sans-serif]Far nicer, he clearly feels, than the manner in which Tottenham dispensed with the services of their most successful modern-era manager. At odds with key board members despite guiding the team to within a nauseous afternoon of Champions League football, Jol feels he was steadily undermined by his directors. They unsuccessfully approached Juande Ramos to replace him in August, failed again the following month but finally installed the Spanish coach last weekend. [/FONT]
[FONT=Geneva,Arial,sans-serif]Sitting back in a white sofa, taking a large draught of his wife's coffee with both painted paeans to Spurs in view, Jol is clearly not over that 10-week stint on managerial death row. He still looks jaded, a slight sadness to the eye and a marked hesitance to his words. [/FONT]
[FONT=Geneva,Arial,sans-serif]'I feel very tired, but maybe that's normal,' he says. 'I saw myself on television and thought "bloody hell". I looked at my picture compared to last season. It was maybe more than I realised... For example, Thursday I felt like I was beaten.' [/FONT]
[FONT=Geneva,Arial,sans-serif]That was the night of long knives. The Uefa Cup tie with Getafe, when word of Jol's demise spread round White Hart Lane, when the crowd repeatedly chanted his name and defamed chairman Daniel Levy's - aware of the Dutchman's fate before it had actually been communicated to him. The following days' papers reported that a disconsolate Jol had been fired before the game, or after. That his players knew before kick-off, or after. That he had called Levy every name under the sun. [/FONT]
[FONT=Geneva,Arial,sans-serif]'Everybody got it wrong about that night,' he says. 'They said I stayed on the bench, but I didn't go to the touchline because the German bugger of a fourth official wouldn't let me. Spurs fans were singing my name but they always sang my name, so at first I didn't think it was anything unusual. People say I was crying, but I swear to God I didn't know - it was probably a windy night. I was stressed but that was because I didn't want to lose, but maybe the players had an idea. Daniel was embarrassed and that made me feel better - he said he regretted how it had all come out. If he'd sat me down eight weeks ago and said we've got someone who can do better that would have been OK.' [/FONT]
[FONT=Geneva,Arial,sans-serif]While Jol did not expect the axe to fall on the night of a European tie, he knew the blade was raised, had heard that Spurs had sent an English teacher to Spain to work on Ramos's language skills. He paints a picture of a club that had got ahead of itself, which believed the natural consequence of consecutive fifth-place league finishes was a march into the top four and the revenues of the Champions League, yet refused to alter a business strategy of buying young, semi-formed talents on limited wages. [/FONT]
[FONT=Geneva,Arial,sans-serif]'If you are in a club like Southend for example and you achieve what you want you get a big celebration. In our club it is different - it is next target. There were conversations about me being more outspoken about Champions League ambitions, but I didn't want to put too much pressure on the younger players. Of course I wanted to be in the top four, but I would also one day want us to be champions. But is that realistic? Ambition needs to be measured by what you're working with. [/FONT]
[FONT=Geneva,Arial,sans-serif]'In a way I don't mind because it's a management style and Daniel is a manager. That is not a problem, the problem is that if, for example, we still had [former sporting director] Frank Arnesen, as a football man, he would have said to them it doesn't work like that, we need some time. David Moyes was fourth with Everton three seasons ago, next season he was fourteenth. Now he's got strong players, he's got his final sort of article, now he can stay in the top six. But for me, to stay in the top six would have been fantastic. A couple of years ago my target was to be structurally top six every season and we did that. Perhaps with the younger players we could achieve more but we'll never know.' [/FONT]
[FONT=Geneva,Arial,sans-serif]Levy pursued a policy of purchasing young, preferably English, players and building them into stars who could act as centrepoints for the team or be sold at significant profit. Michael Carrick, Michael Dawson, Jermaine Jenas, Tom Huddlestone, Darren Bent and Gareth Bale all arrived during his tenure as the balance sheet blossomed. Jol, whose team grew younger each season, respected the policy. He simply wanted a balance between profit-making development and reaching the top four. Tottenham confused short-term business aims with the long-term football objective of Champions League qualification. [/FONT]
[FONT=Geneva,Arial,sans-serif]If it did not help that Levy was also looking to sell the club to foreign suitors, Jol's working life became more difficult when his friend Arnesen resigned to join Chelsea in 2005. Yet he still achieved two fifth-place finishes as the Dane was replaced by Damien Comolli, an inexperienced ex-Arsenal scout almost two decades his junior. [/FONT]
[FONT=Geneva,Arial,sans-serif]Though Jol is reluctant to go into details, it is clear that his dealings with the Frenchman were fraught. 'It's been portrayed that I spent the money,' says Jol. 'I don't fix the fees and I don't even know what they earn, that's not our structure. Frank was more of a right-hand man and he would come in and say "why did you do this?" in a game. Frank was my friend so I would answer. I had nothing against Damien, we just didn't have that kind of relationship.' [/FONT]
[FONT=Geneva,Arial,sans-serif]Tottenham hired a headhunter to draw up a 50-strong list of potential replacements for Arnesen. Jol promoted the candidacy of a couple of Dutchmen, including Marcel Brands of AZ Alkmaar and Hans van der Zee, then of PSV Eindhoven, now chief scout at Ajax, and had no problems with the principle of working with a sporting director. [/FONT]
[FONT=Geneva,Arial,sans-serif]'It is a model that can work everywhere,' he says. 'But the director has to appoint the manager. Otherwise, if the manager is already there and knows all the ins and out, all the players, when somebody else comes in it's difficult. That's why I changed my contract [in 2006] and became manager so I would report to Daniel. And that's not ideal because it means the football director is then only a sort of super scout. Now Ramos is head coach and Damien is his boss, he's a proper football director again and maybe that will work better.' [/FONT]
[FONT=Geneva,Arial,sans-serif]There has been much talk of Jol suffering at the hands of vice-chairman Paul Kemsley and communications director Donna Cullen, he is surprisingly warm in his appraisal of Levy. 'If I had something with Daniel I'd tell him. Sometimes they don't like that, but I still worked in his structure because he's the best businessman ever.' [/FONT]
[FONT=Geneva,Arial,sans-serif]Jol has been less impressed with reports that he had fallen out with Dimitar Berbatov after the club prevented the forward signing for Manchester United in the summer. 'I loved Berbatov,' he counters. 'He was my player. Berba came to me after the first two defeats this season and said: "Boss I want to achieve something. I'm not worse than Eto'o or Rooney or Tevez." And he's right. But, I said to him, "You have to make the difference and win us prizes. You need to be more consistent in your play." Last year he scored 12 in the league and with his ability he could score 20.' [/FONT]
[FONT=Geneva,Arial,sans-serif]There is a similar reaction to claims that his team's frequent concession of late goals was because of sub-standard stamina training. 'The fitness coach of Ramos was there on Monday and said "No, they don't look fit". They'd played four games in 10 days, how can you see that after a game? You can see that probably in the next couple of weeks if there's no game. But we played 59 games last season and never lost the third game at the end of the week. What does that prove? I can tell you we were always fit. Though we weren't fit in that last match against West Ham!' [/FONT]
[FONT=Geneva,Arial,sans-serif]The day of Upton Park food poisoning that cost Spurs a top-four slot in 2006 is one regret; failing to defeat Arsenal another. Jol also wonders if he was outmanoeuvred by the club in their respective dealings with the media. [/FONT]


---------------------------------------------
[EDITED]
So perhaps DoF can only work if the head coach and DoF are big buddies?
 

Spurs_Q8

Well-Known Member
May 21, 2005
3,161
139
paying £5m for Chimbonda & £3.5m for Ekotto & £2m for Malbranque & £4m Mido was a mistake. I'm not calling to get both of Rosicky and Hleb. But while we paif these money for them.

- Chimbonda: was very good for Wigan but that's didn't mean he is good for us and paying £5m for him while he is 27-28 year old for Fullbacl. He can look for other options. West Ham weren't after Lucas Neil in that summmer as Magnesson wasn't there. I know Chimbonda did well in last 3 games but can you look at our ratings for him in since March ?

- Ekotto: people saying why i said MJ made beter signings and Comolli made the bad ones, so, Lee £1.3m who is better player and we paying more than double for that price for him. ( SS77, you said it one week ago about Lee is far better than Ekotto )

- Malbranque: I like his work rate, but he isn't good player for us, a waste for the space, always liked to round around himself to past one player and made our attemps to slow. if Comolli was that good as i some people think, he should be able to save some of these money by getting cheaper players with smilar qualities which mean he can get proven talanted player like Rosicky or Van der Vaart or Shnejder.

Let alone paying £7m for Zokora who isn't DM .. and £4m for Mido as just for 4th Striker. ( some people said before that, it's step back, and it was )

IF Comolli is that Good, he can save £16m for Bent by getting more needed players likes GK, DM, LM .. also, how we missed Geremi, Viduka when they were available for free .. they can do decent job here !
 

gibbs131

Banned
May 20, 2005
8,870
11
I just want to know, as a shareholder:

EXACTLY WHO RECOMMENDED THE PLAYER IN THE FIRST PLACE.

I don't care if Jol etc then agreed that it would be a good choice because it looks like Comoli could sell sand to an Arab.

Because I want to see EXACTLY who brought the player to the boards attention in the first place. THEN we can truly see the impact an individual is making.

It's so convoluted that Comoli can hide behind the "Well the Head coach has the final say" excuse every time.

If the head coach has been dizzied by highlight reels and match reports from scouts (the players always know when this is a scout watching and they bust a gut) then i think its BS.

At the moment it is designed to avert blame from an individual when we spend insane amounts of money on players.
 

rez9000

Any point?
Feb 8, 2007
11,942
21,098
I think the problem that some Spurs fans have with Comolli and the 'European structure' at Spurs stems from the fact that a) it's not something we're used to; b) we don't know exactly what Comolli is responsible for and under what circumstances he would be held accountable for poor performance and; c) the very real perception that he was in part responsible for the humiliation that Martin Jol suffered in the drawn-out saga of his sacking.

In terms of not being used to the European system, I say that that's something that will take time to adjust to, even though my own personal belief is that it's not a good model for English football, for the very reason that fans find it difficult to accept.

Comolli's accountability is a very important issue and I don't think it's defined properly. We need to know exactly what he does, exactly how he fits into the management structure and under what circumstances he would be sacked. My own feeling is that if Martin Jol bears responsibility for our poor start to the season, then so does Comolli. Yet, Jol is gone but Comolli is still there.
 

Spursking

Well-Known Member
May 16, 2004
5,431
2,457
Because of Comolli's work, Ramos and the new management are able to work with top quality players to build around. We have a great squad, but we still are waiting for players to come back from injury.

Assou-Ekotto, King, Bale, are important pieces in our team. We also wait for player's development - such as Boateng, Taarabt, Kaboul, Huddlestone, etc... I would like to see Rose and Maghoma in connections with the first team soon aswell....
 

C0YS

Just another member
Jul 9, 2007
12,780
13,817
Rose and Maghoma are far too young to be involved in the main team.

Their is only one reason I dont like camolli and thats because I think he played a big part in jols saking, by not taking half the blame for tottenham's poor start to the season, also he is buying too young players when what we need is an experianced CM (Requelme anyone?), but I admit I dont know how much of this is Levys fault.
 

Kendall

Well-Known Member
Feb 8, 2007
38,502
11,933
The Mido buy was not a mistake in my opinion. he'd done really well the season before & it's not often you can get a regular Premiership scorer for under £4m, especially at age 23.

It just didn't work out as he couldn't play WITH Berbatov. Shit happens.
 

Kendall

Well-Known Member
Feb 8, 2007
38,502
11,933
Because of Comolli's work, Ramos and the new management are able to work with top quality players to build around. We have a great squad, but we still are waiting for players to come back from injury.

Assou-Ekotto, King, Bale, are important pieces in our team. We also wait for player's development - such as Boateng, Taarabt, Kaboul, Huddlestone, etc... I would like to see Rose and Maghoma in connections with the first team soon aswell....

While I generally agree with your views on Comolli's players what we need now is for our experienced players to thrive, but also for Comolli to land us a reasonably well experienced 'string puller' for a a decent sum. We have our far share of real quality young potential, but we haven't got the experienced players required to balance it out and show charachter during the tough times, like now. And for that reason, no players like Rose, Maghoma, Taarabt, Pekhart etc.. should be anywhere near the first team.
 

Spursking

Well-Known Member
May 16, 2004
5,431
2,457
While I generally agree with your views on Comolli's players what we need now is for our experienced players to thrive, but also for Comolli to land us a reasonably well experienced 'string puller' for a a decent sum. We have our far share of real quality young potential, but we haven't got the experienced players required to balance it out and show charachter during the tough times, like now. And for that reason, no players like Rose, Maghoma, Taarabt, Pekhart etc.. should be anywhere near the first team.

Players like Rose, Maghoma, Pekhart is probably not ready yet? What I mean, is that players like Rose and Maghoma have some of the attributes the first team is looking for, and therefore should be followed closely and maybe get into connection. Taarabt has been in connection with the first team, and I miss him in the team. I hope that Taarabt will be at least a substitute, as he is a player who can come on and change a game to our advantage. He is a special talent with a lot of skills.
 
Top