Dembele is better as a holding midfielder

[heelspurs]

Bump... @DaSpurs?

haha great bump. I had never seen this thread and was reading it as if it was new. Let's just say I was getting even more frustrated than usual with the ignorant, misguided, and just plain silly opinions of many that actually think they know something. Much crow being digested today I bet. That is by those big enough to reconsider their previous opinions. By that I mean those intelligent enough to take on new evidence and adjust appropriately.

He is still frustrating and lacks consistency but I'd have him in my team. When trying to explain his deficiencies @DaSpurs hit it on the head with his "horses for courses" argument. Dembele is most effective against teams that play and open up. A corollary to this is, like lamella, with more intelligent and faster forward players giving more options he may not hold on to the ball. When playing bus-parking teams maybe Poch needs to look elsewhere.

 

[mano-obe]

I'm not convinced just after one good game, he does this a lot then goes back to being bog standard. He almost cost us a point last week with his sloppy play and played out of his skin against Liverpool, I just cannot work him out, the fact he's been here all these years and people argue where his best position is still

 

[Gaz_Gammon]

He can't tackle though, nor does he read the play particularly well. He's not a holding midfielder imo, he's a CM who doesn't work in our team

Agreed he is shit at tackling...........should be barred from WHL as a minimum punishment.............strung up by his balls and tarred and feathered........



Brought in alongside Alli, Dembele was superb against Liverpool. No player made more tackles in the match and no player won possession more often. More impressive still was his ball retention. Look at the total number of times the game’s midfielders lost possession of the ball (using Opta data):

• 
  
  
  • James Milner – 25
  • Philippe Coutinho – 23
  • Adam Lallana – 23
  • Clinton N’Jie – 23
  • Christian Eriksen – 21
  • Dele Alli – 20
  • Erik Lamela – 17
  • Emre Can – 17
  • Lucas Leiva – 15
  • Moussa Dembele – 8

 

[Gaz_Gammon]

Dembele would be absolutely incredible for a mid to lower PL team. I used to think maybe it's just he needs to be in a 4-3-3 but I'm not sure it's that. I just genuinely think no matter how talented he is he just hasn't got that extra bit of something that separates the good players from the outstanding ones. He has the attributes but I'm not sure he's got the mind.

He's playing for one right now.

 

[eViL]

It's a complete myth that Dembele can't defend. Just because he doesn't go to ground ala Mason or kicking 7 shades out of everyone ala Lamela doesn't mean he can't tackle either.

He's always been a great tackler in one on one situations; it's his decision making and lack of aggression going forward that is questionable.

Still one of my favourite players; but I've always been a sucker for talent over application.

 

[Lufti]

Agreed he is shit at tackling...........should be barred from WHL as a minimum punishment.............strung up by his balls and tarred and feathered........



Brought in alongside Alli, Dembele was superb against Liverpool. No player made more tackles in the match and no player won possession more often. More impressive still was his ball retention. Look at the total number of times the game’s midfielders lost possession of the ball (using Opta data):

• 
  
  
  • James Milner – 25
  • Philippe Coutinho – 23
  • Adam Lallana – 23
  • Clinton N’Jie – 23
  • Christian Eriksen – 21
  • Dele Alli – 20
  • Erik Lamela – 17
  • Emre Can – 17
  • Lucas Leiva – 15
  • Moussa Dembele – 8

Surely you're not quoting a post from almost a year ago and using stats from a few days ago to try and disprove that point. Oh no wait, yes, that's exactly what you're doing. I love how after one game everyone's going crazy, this has happened literally every season since he's been at the club. He has a few good games, people go on about how amazing he is, then we play some relegation fodder side and he looks disinterested, picks up a knock and goes back to being mediocre. I'll get excited if he's still playing the same way in 10 games time.

Also full marks on that ball retention point, you really got me there. I was an idiot for saying he gave the ball away too easily hahahaha, oh no I didn't say that

 

[barry]

Moose is a great defensive mid, depending on the ref. Some realise this is a man's game and allow his fair, but robust challenges, others don't, and his challenges are penalised a lot, sometimes resulting in fk in dangerous positions.
His challenges look Foulish because of his tremendous strength, usually resulting with the tackled on the ground. Big players have similar problems.

 

[wishkah]

Think we all get held up with specialisms these days about what a player should be. I see dembers as an all rounder-a transition player if we really need to go down that route

 

[HodisGawd]

... but I've always been a sucker for talent over application.

It's the Tottenham way...

 

[Gaz_Gammon]

Surely you're not quoting a post from almost a year ago and using stats from a few days ago to try and disprove that point. Oh no wait, yes, that's exactly what you're doing. I love how after one game everyone's going crazy, this has happened literally every season since he's been at the club. He has a few good games, people go on about how amazing he is, then we play some relegation fodder side and he looks disinterested, picks up a knock and goes back to being mediocre. I'll get excited if he's still playing the same way in 10 games time.

Also full marks on that ball retention point, you really got me there. I was an idiot for saying he gave the ball away too easily hahahaha, oh no I didn't say that

You stated he couldn't tackle.

@luftiHe can't tackle though, nor does he read the play particularly well

Then again why let the facts get in the way of a good argument. I'm' not saying that you are an idiot either. Your original post should leave no one in any doubt about that.

 

[Lufti]

You stated he couldn't tackle.



Then again why let the facts get in the way of a good argument. I'm' not saying that you are an idiot either. Your original post should leave no one in any doubt about that.

...

Reading clearly not one of your strengths.

You can see from pretty much every comment on the first page that my opinion was well agreed upon. Just cause he had one good game against a side very poor in possession, nothing's changed. Like I said before, if he can maintain it then great, but I'm not about to wipe away 3 years or so of inconsistent form because of one game. Also find it funny that out of the many comments you chose mine to reply to, but better luck next time. Even a broken clock's right twice a day so I'm sure your time will come

 

[rabbikeane]

Dembele kills off games, we'll want him around if we're ever one nil up in a cup final.

 

[Hazelton]

Say what you want about him, but he's ridiculously smooth on the ball. I've only ever seen a few players that can glide past opponents like he can, almost at ease.

 

[npearl4spurs]

I suppose our fans need it said 100 times for it to really sink it:

Mousa Dembele - great for needing a result out of top 6-9 teams. not great for teams we should be beating who will try to just get a draw from us.

 

[Trix]

I suppose our fans need it said 100 times for it to really sink it:

Mousa Dembele - great for needing a result out of top 6-9 teams. not great for teams we should be beating who will try to just get a draw from us.

It really is that simple. He is not an ideal CM for our needs but he is without doubt very useful. As I have said before, I never worry about us a sing the midfield battle if he's playing no matter who it is against.

 

[Mullers]

We spent half the Modric money for a box to box/attacking midfielder not a DM.

 

[DaSpurs]

We spent half the Modric money for a box to box/attacking midfielder not a DM.

Well, unfortunately, we attempted to go for a BTB midfielder and came out with what would ultimately amount to a DM. Seemed rather clear that the move for Dembele was a bit of a scramble, as he wasn't a like-for-like replacement whatsoever but would be easy to reel in.

 

[Trix]

Well, unfortunately, we attempted to go for a BTB midfielder and came out with what would ultimately amount to a DM. Seemed rather clear that the move for Dembele was a bit of a scramble, as he wasn't a like-for-like replacement whatsoever but would be easy to reel in.

Keane
RVN
Beckham
Schmeicel
Scholes
Ronaldo

None of these were replaced like-for-like, instead quality players were brought in and the team evolved to suit that. You can not replace certain players like-for-like without dropping a huge amount in terms of quality, and Modric was one such player.

 

[DaSpurs]

Keane
RVN
Beckham
Schmeicel
Scholes
Ronaldo

None of these were replaced like-for-like, instead quality players were brought in and the team evolved to suit that. You can not replace certain players like-for-like without dropping a huge amount in terms of quality, and Modric was one such player.

Yeah I get that, but we didn't replace quality - or qualities. Hence, the rest is history. I'm of the belief that if we had attempted the latter with more focus, as the former was nearly impossible, that we'd have had less problems from midfield since that point.

This is, IMO Trix, one of the worst mistakes of the club in recent years.

 

[Trix]

Yeah I get that, but we didn't replace quality - or qualities. Hence, the rest is history. I'm of the belief that if we had attempted the latter with more focus, as the former was nearly impossible, that we'd have had less problems from midfield since that point.

This is, IMO Trix, one of the worst mistakes of the club in recent years.

Thing is though at the time of purchase Dembele was taking the league by storm. It's now clear that was because at Fulham no teams sat back and he had the freedom to play in the same way as he did against Pool, and has done numerous times against other top sides. It's again easy to say in hindsight, but the fact is he was never tested at a club who would have to break down deep defensive sides which is where he struggles.