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It's official - I'm fed up with Harry.

Coyboy

The Double of 1961 is still The Double
Dec 3, 2004
15,506
5,032
Get a grip, you sound like some Massa's little lackey there...

I wonder how many points would Sir Harold have got in the circumstances at the start of that season, with lost again Bent and Man U youth reserve as the only 2 real strikers, self-centred Bentley playing crap and stirring up shit behind the scenes, King fresh from nightclub scandal and still not fit/sharp enough, Modric and Gomes just starting in EPL, Corluka having just arrived and all of them trying to settle in, the whole team trying to come to terms with losing captain Keane and Berbatov and with the new faces/system (as Ramos was forced to play 4-5-1 more than he may have wanted because of lack of forwards until late September when Pav came in after injury) and the players not responding to what the manager was trying to do.

I would dare guess he would not have been so smug about bleating on and on about "2 points from 8 games and look where I took the team", fooling those who did not want to consider all those circumstances.

However, despite all of that, I also think we must see how things will develop and give Harry more time and more chance to bring more organisation and balance into the way our team is performing. The kind of chance that was not afforded to Ramos. The kind of chance that Harry does not afford certain players out of his favour but is all too ready to give players he does favour (Crouch being the prime example).

What absolute crap. How long will you try to pass this off as true? What King nightclub scandal, that was one game where Ramos decided to bench him? How do you know Bentley was stirring up trouble? Keane was not our captain King was. Ramos was reportedly not bothered about losing him nor Defoe, that's as much credible as the players ass fucking Ramos. Stop trying to mitigate his disastrous reign.

The chances are that Redknapp would have done better with those players, as he wouldn't have played Bent off GDS and so forth, and would have played to their strengths and communicated to them better than Ramos-which isn't saying much. Modric and Gomes were new to the league, but Redknapp got them playing well pretty sharpish. Just leave it two years later already, you backed the wrong horse. Fucking move on.

And Redknapp earned his chance in the CL, it was not given to him. Ramos got nowhere near when he was brought in to do what Jol supposedly couldn't.

As for the OP, just have some patience. We have started indifferently but it is very early and the table is pretty distorted still and will be for a while. We had a great start last year and then a mediocre mid-winter after xmas. Teams go through bad form every season, hopefully this is ours coupled with injuries and fixture congestion (being key reasons I believe).
 

2bearis2do

Well-Known Member
Apr 22, 2006
3,820
2,317
Interesting line up. BAE playing as a centre half? Playing two centre halves who are currently injured?

If you are going to post your champ man side as part of a front page Article slating a manager, at least work with what 'arry has got; not what you would like.

Well, it looks like all may be available for Saturday. (Kaboul the only doubt)
BAE as part of a 3 centre back team - could work. But then again it may not and perhaps of our 3 available players, you could go Corluka, Kaboul, Bassong.

It was more an attempt to show that a different formation (other than 4-4-2 or 4-5-1) could benefit our very talented midfield.

You get Hutton and Bale working the flanks, supporting attacks and dropping back to support defence, creating more space for the midfield to play their game and with two up front - you'd hope for a few more goals than we've been scoring.

What would you do Shirtfront? Humour me.
 

spurs_viola

Rui Costa,dreamspurs no10
Mar 10, 2005
2,454
0
What absolute crap. How long will you try to pass this off as true? What King nightclub scandal, that was one game where Ramos decided to bench him? How do you know Bentley was stirring up trouble? Keane was not our captain King was. Ramos was reportedly not bothered about losing him nor Defoe, that's as much credible as the players ass fucking Ramos. Stop trying to mitigate his disastrous reign.

The chances are that Redknapp would have done better with those players, as he wouldn't have played Bent off GDS and so forth, and would have played to their strengths and communicated to them better than Ramos-which isn't saying much. Modric and Gomes were new to the league, but Redknapp got them playing well pretty sharpish. Just leave it two years later already, you backed the wrong horse. Fucking move on.

And Redknapp earned his chance in the CL, it was not given to him. Ramos got nowhere near when he was brought in to do what Jol supposedly couldn't.

As for the OP, just have some patience. We have started indifferently but it is very early and the table is pretty distorted still and will be for a while. We had a great start last year and then a mediocre mid-winter after xmas. Teams go through bad form every season, hopefully this is ours coupled with injuries and fixture congestion (being key reasons I believe).

I know it is useless to have a debate with you coyboy, but what the hell - for the benefit of the forum discussion, let me try.

You go off on a rant as usual, as soon as I give my detailed take on the situation at the start of season 2008-09 - so instead of actually trying to think about it reasonably, your main argument is "it's all absolute crap because I don't believe it". Nothing new there.

For instance, you still believe that Ramos wanted Bentley and that Bentley did not stir things up behind the scenes once he found himself behind Lennon in Ramos' plans. I don't - and the evidence on and off the pitch backed it up clearly enough for me, Bentley's interviews in the first weeks of the season when he found himself benched, where he spouted off about the team not understanding the manager/stopping short of saying the manager did not really know what he was doing and how he (Bentley) should be in the first team - that was a prime example. The reports of players complaining to Levy behind Ramos' back were another.

Hey, I already said many times that Ramos himself made several big mistakes at Spurs and carried fault for his failure here too. That is not the point. I was commenting on the post that referred to that period and just pointed out an alternative, albeit largely unpopular view on that.
But just because some views are unpopular, it does not have to mean they are "absolute crap" and the one who has them should just "fucking move on" and join the masses. I'm not sure you will understand that.
 

Coyboy

The Double of 1961 is still The Double
Dec 3, 2004
15,506
5,032
I know it is useless to have a debate with you coyboy, but what the hell - for the benefit of the forum discussion, let me try.

You go off on a rant as usual, as soon as I give my detailed take on the situation at the start of season 2008-09 - so instead of actually trying to think about it reasonably, your main argument is "it's all absolute crap because I don't believe it". Nothing new there.

For instance, you still believe that Ramos wanted Bentley and that Bentley did not stir things up behind the scenes once he found himself behind Lennon in Ramos' plans. I don't - and the evidence on and off the pitch backed it up clearly enough for me, Bentley's interviews in the first weeks of the season when he found himself benched, where he spouted off about the team not understanding the manager/stopping short of saying the manager did not really know what he was doing and how he (Bentley) should be in the first team - that was a prime example. The reports of players complaining to Levy behind Ramos' back were another.

Hey, I already said many times that Ramos himself made several big mistakes at Spurs and carried fault for his failure here too. That is not the point. I was commenting on the post that referred to that period and just pointed out an alternative, albeit largely unpopular view on that.
But just because some views are unpopular, it does not have to mean they are "absolute crap" and the one who has them should just "fucking move on" and join the masses. I'm not sure you will understand that.

So we are focusing on only Bentley then? We had this argument two years ago or just under when just because I started praising Redknapp, I was no longer a sound poster in your eyes. Bentley was signed under Ramos, he praised him highly when he was signed. Bentley was in and out of the team precisely because he wasn't playing very well. He is a bit of an idiot but a good manager should manage these players as Redknapp has done with Bentley to at least make him useful last season when Lennon was out. He was pretty much correct that Ramos couldn't communicate well- 'reports' you refer to are just reports.

I am not sure what your definition of evidence is but no evidence points to Ramos not in the summer wanting Bentley. It just shows Bentley wasn't playing very well and didn't like being benched.

You cannot give Ramos such credit for being there when Modric and Gomes were signed and not acknowledge dropping the ball with Bentley and just make up stories about them both.

I know it is still recent history but can you not just stop characterising 2008 sympathetically in Ramos' failure. It is no longer relevant. It's not relevant to this thread. It's boring and it just seems you want to pass it off as fact every time until people begin to accept your biased views. You can slap yourself on the back all you want with your 'detailed post' and claim I go off on a rant; neither is true, I answered your points and you decided to hone in on Bentley exclusively.

But as I said, please just leave it. Ramos has gone, we did well since he left and are in a bit of bad form right now. Ramos has nothing to do with that, so can you please stop saying 'Oh well if Ramos was here' or 'if Redknapp was in charge in 2008 etc'. Are you not able to look at things with an open mind and debate accordingly?
 

dontcallme

SC Supporter
Mar 18, 2005
33,986
81,918
It's quite a good article detailing certain questions some fans have over Harry. While Hary has been a fantastic manager for us he is in new water with the CL and a large squad to manage. The OP is right in saying he has never called for Harry's head or asking for Ramos though how anyone came to the conclusion that he wants Ramos back is completely beyond me.

To the OP, using a headline "It's offical, I'm fed up with Harry" and some of the other comments have made your otherwise reasonable or at least debatable opinion lose its meaning a little.
 

JoeT

Well-Known Member
Jun 7, 2005
3,813
935
Hi '2bear'... I think our problems started way back in the transfer window and I'm not so sure that Harry is entirely to blame there. As has been discussed many times on here, we really needed another centre-back...what did we end up with? An unfit Gallas - on a free....who at present is still unable to play consecutive games. Also another striker seemed to be a priority....we ended up with nothing here. Finally our last-minute "present" from Levy to Harry saved our so-called transfer window 'strategy' (Sandro apart) from being a farce. Levy surely must shoulder some of the blame for our so-so start?
Then the unthinkable happened - Dawson and Defoe both went down, so Harry has had to juggle pairings at the back (along with Gomez also going down injured), and try to somehow get our toothless 'strike-force' scoring goals at the other end. I think his latest strategy of building the midfield around VdV actually has merit because he is on fire goal-scoring wise at present. Maybe when Defoe returns things will change.
Some of the points you make are relevant though '2bear'; for example Harry's post-game interviews. Frankly they embarrass me, plus they seem to be ALL off the cuff and as a cosequence have no real consistancy. For example: last week we were having problems coping with both the Prem. and the C.L. Now..apparently we can manage O.K....no problem.
Also his apparent inability to proioritize whether we should really concentrate on Prem. games or the C.L. is a source of frustration....I know after last week's game (v:W.Ham), I was really angry. But again, (as other 'top' teams are finding...Man.U.anyone?) it is becoming apparent that there are just no easy games in the Prem.
So what are we left with...H.R. has his faults, but I don't think he is doing such a bad job....for a "barrow-boy".
p.s. I am writing this after the win over 'Villa, so there is till a somewhat 'rose-tinted' affect influencing my viewpoint today!
 

Lucky22

Active Member
Dec 11, 2006
710
160
I wonder after watching the team this week whether or not you think it is wrong to arrange the team to accommodate Van Der Vaart? He is a player of awesome class, so why wouldn't we want to get the best out of him.
Once again 2Bearis2Do and the rest of you deliver a knee-jerk reaction and use a poor result to air your problems with Harry. Some of you guys have a very, very short memory!! Keep up the good work Harry!!
 
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