JJ was one of our better players on Saturday, that's not saying much I know!

Title's a bit confusing, I was wondering if this was related to a waxing course Jenas had been on.

Nice of him to praise Huddlestone who is a rival for a place at Spurs and at International level. Shows good team spirit. Comment about backgrounds shows more solidarity too.
Thought that Jenas was one of the more focused players but given the job he was asked to do not surprising that he didn't get the time to do anything else.
Impressed by Lescott and Wright Phillips.

I agree with you enitrely about JJ's performance on Saturday. I think he worked his socks off to keep tabs on Kaka. Though I was also impressed by Lescott, it was Milner that caught my eye. He was full of energy, ready to run at the full backs, try and get a cross in and almost scored a wonderful volley at the end. Those 3 players were the stand-out performances for me.

its a shame Huddlestone didn't come earilier cause I thought he had that creative intutition that England's performance was lacking.

It was nice to see the four Spurs boys link up and attack, shame they only had a few minutes to do it.

It's always amazing how different people can watch the same game and yet see completely different things. For example I watched this game and saw that Brazil controlled it from the start and always looked the most likely to score. Luckily for England they were content to cruise along in first gear and once they got ahead simply did enough to stay ahead. It said a lot to me that even Lucio was confident enough that England offered nothing up front to stroll forward and almost score with his shot that hit the post.

Even allowing for the fact that most of the England players were not regular starters I was looking for stronger performances than any of them showed to give me some encouragement that we have a realistic chance of doing well next year. Inevitably, I came away disappointed in our players lack of technique, creativity and nous. Milner was up against Maicon (probably the best RB in World football) and it showed, it was man against boy stuff. On the other side Wright-Phillips didn't get much joy out of his fullback either which meant that Bent and later Defoe didn't get one decent ball to attack.

Believe me I want to be optimistic about England doing well in the WC but if we have to rely too much on any of the players who played against Brazil, I think we'll struggle to get out of the group qualifying stage. :shrug:

I think maybe the reason we saw different things is down to our expectations of the player's performances.

As you say, James Milner was up against one of the best right backs in the world and I thought he did well. He played a full 90 and looked like he had a lot of energy. It's important to remember he was playing on the left whereas for Villa he plays on the right. He still got in behind Maicon a couple of times and won some corners, and, as I said in my original post, almost scored a lovely goal.

For me, Lescott looked the more comfortable centre back, despite playing alongside the older and more experience Upson. I think he showed signs of reliability. He is maybe used to playing alongside Terry for England but did well against Brazil. Playing as chief CB for City this season will improve him no end.

JJ hasn't started for England in a year and hasn't really featured internationally for some time. He was up against Kaka from the off and I think, along with Lescott and Upson, he kept him reasonably quiet - all probing runs were eventually snuffed out.

Of course Brazil controlled the game, I dont think that's in dispute - certainly not from me anyway. Despite Bent and Defoe getting no service, I think the likes of JJ, Milner and Lescott played well given the circumstances in which they started the game.

I understand your concerns about England's lack of strength in depth but I think a couple of players showed signs of promise and that's worth noting.

Wright Phillips did nothing to impress me, but admittedly he was trying.

Did JJ actually play well? I didn't think that he looked that good myself.

Tough job to mark Kaka who is better than any England midfielder. I thought JJ had a so-so game, did not play paticularly well and worse better than some in the England side.
Having said that we are a long way short of a squad that can reach a World Cup final.

Oops should read NO worse and better above

W-P signally failed to provide support and cover for Brown at RB, who had a torrid afternoon. Milner put in his fair share of defensive work on the left, as well as looking committed and threatening when he did have the chance to go forward.

:clap:

The most obvious change for me would have been taking SWP off, moving Milner to the right and giving Young time on the left to show what he could do.

Nothing in my original post to say that Brazil did not entirely dominate the match and they could have had several more, missed penalty for a start. But I always look for positives especially if Spurs players get on the pitch, or even ex-Spurs players.

Lescott was excellent in the air and made several timely tackles and covered well. He also brings the ball out of defence well which I like to see in a centre half.

Nothing to say about Bent of Defoe who had no service because we were too busy firefighting to really set up meaningful attacks.

JJ had one of the most difficult tasks in football today and stuck to it, retained possession well, which managers like even if it means going sideways or even backwards, and which some fans hate.
But I think you will find that Brazil made as many such passes, as all good teams do, but it is the quality of the forward ball that counts and the movement up front. As in their goal for example.

Rooney again tried too hard to produce the killer ball, inside the full back for example, which the Brazilian defence accepted with gratitude but I have to say he was our one truly top class player, but forced to play too deep to be effective.

Remember this was a second eleven in the main. As for the World Cup, who knows at this stage. Can't see us getting too far in truth.

I watched the Spain/Argentina game immediately after the England game on Spanish TV and the kind of skill levels (and passion) evident show what a formidable task we have. Spain were exhilerating and must be favourites to win it.

I fancy Spain to win it too, they certainly play the most consistently brilliant football. JJ was a little quiet on Saturday, but then I would expect that against Brazil - its the sort of game Gerrard and Lampard have both disappeared in before for their countries - any English midfielder struggles against Brazil. Wright Phillips isn't good enough, Milner is better but hardly sets the world alight either, as was demonstrated by neither of our forwards having a whiff of service. Just a couple of unreachable crosses.

Doesn't bode well.

what game were you guys watching, did no one see Capello's face when he (JJ) passed to a yellow shirt for the 10th time and his shocking free kick that went nearer the corner flag than a player, his passing and decision making is unbelievably bad 90% of the time and the rest of the time its sideways or backwards and that impedes the flow.. imo that's not good enough for Spurs or England and you can bet he wont be going to the world cup.

Would love Milner at the club, works for 90mins at full throttle, passes well and can cross a ball.

I wouldn't bet too much on Jenas not going to the World Cup, although I concede it depends on injuries.
You undermine your case by exaggeration, 10 misplaced passes and 90% bad decision making doesn't sound like a player that completed 90 minutes against Brazil

I think you have to remember that in every instance keeping the ball with a backwards or sideways pass is favourable to making a forward pass and having even a 50% chance of it being intercepted.

Spain are current favorites and consistently good not because or their technique or even the passing. Its due to their "keep the ball under all circumstances" attitude. Backwards pass or sideways, who cares as long as you can bring it forward again and probe for another opening.

Ultimately if jj is having to make a pass like that I would blame a lack of options and movement from his team mates more than highlighting his lack of creativity.

Spain always play the simple 3-4 metre pass and they find the options by moving the oppositions around and tiring them out. England don't lack the ability to do that, they lack the tactical discipline.

The other thing that Spain and Brazil do that seems to go unnoticed, perhaps because people are always focusing on the man with the ball, is that they ensure that there is always a man in space able to receive that "simple 3-4m pass". That was what really struck me in the second half of the game last weekend. Whenever Brazil had the ball in midfield, there was always someone in 5m of space, ready for the easy pass.

In the first half, I thought England were decent, although you could see some legs starting to tire after only 35 minutes. We closed down those 5m spaces and the defence, even Wes Brown, was playing well. The only player I thought was seriously ineffective in the first half was Wright-Phillips, who was just having one fo those games where every decision turns out to be the wrong one, whatever he does.

From the whistle, the second half was a different story and that was just exacerbated by Brazil's early goal, which enabled them to change their tactics to slow the game down even further, caused very tired England players' energy levels to drop another notch and opened up all of those 5m spaces.

As for Jenas, I thought he was OK, especially given that his main role was to be a limpet attached to Kaka. He didn't misplace many passes at all, that's false, but he did make his usual collection of bad final decisions whenever he took the ball forward.

I agree with the general sentiment, here and elsewhere, that the only England player really to enhance his reputation was James Milner, who has looked unfazed, energetic and threatening every time I have seen him in an England shirt. He looks like he's turning into a really good winger who can play on either side. Lescott was pretty good, too.