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Levy is the reason for Spurs' troubles

UbeAstard

Well-Known Member
May 31, 2005
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2,413
The latest piece (Tuesday 28th October) by Matt Law in The DT is worrying, because there appears to be more leaks from within the club. The leaks are also worrying as the report states that there may be untouchables: Townsend's name comes up in a negative light, Eriksen and Lamela being regarded as untouchable. Oddly enough, Adebayor's name doesn't feature, but Kane's lack of a start is cited as causing bafflement to players. The Spanish-speaking players are also not speaking English on the training ground.
I do wonder about all the above as they can be countered quite easily. Kaboul does come across well, surprisingly. My main regret is that we let Siggy go.

Well if I read anything like that I would be taking it with spoonfulls of salt.
 

UbeAstard

Well-Known Member
May 31, 2005
3,354
2,413
We've bought to many doves tbf Sherwood was 100% right all a long. Levy has been responsible for going with the cheapest options tooo many times.

players I would let go imo. No.1 Vertonghen. Kaboul. Soldado. Dembele. Adebayor Key positional players all have great technical abilities but f mentally weak

Show me the quotes where Sherwood said that, and all them players you have mentioned arent the cheapest options, they apart from Soldado and argueably Dembele have sometimes been as good here as they have been anywhere else and have also been linked with better clubs than us. How can you say ''the cheapest options'' then quote those players to support your arguement?
 

fedupyid

Well-Known Member
Dec 2, 2004
789
906
I do not understand how any Spurs fans can defend Levy. Spurs have managed to net spend than 90% of the league. Then our spending policy makes no sense we seem to just go out and buy central midfielders.
 

HotspurFC1950

Well-Known Member
Feb 6, 2011
4,223
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Who has been bought on the cheap ?

Soldado? Lamela? Paulinho ? Lloris? Ericksen ? Vertonghan? Dembele ? Adebayor ?
 

Jonesey

Well-Known Member
Apr 20, 2004
695
391
I cant agree with you. Look at some of the teams above us and doing well now and can you really say those squads/players are better than ours? I don't think so. They are organised and know what they are doing and their weaknesses are protected. Example, look how West Ham played Man City and compare with how we played them. Maybe after the game some of our players like some fans on here said 'it was Aguero, he is world class and will give most teams the run around..'. Not all true, he will come up with one or two decisive moments per game but lets see how many times he scores 4 or gets 5 or 6 good chances in one game like he did with us. I think some of our guys think they are better than they actually are and they have nothing to prove, they cant get out of that mind set.

Agree with a lot of this. Vertonghen is a prime example.

The problem with the players we have are three-fold from what I can make out.

1. Firstly there are just too many average players. I mean look at our squad and divide them into:
  • 'Definite Champions League Quality' (DCLQ) players. By this i mean they would feature in Chelsea, Arsenal, Man City or Liverpool's Champs League squad.
  • 'Potential Champions League Quality' players' (PCLQ) players. IE: Players who might well be good enough in the right team, with the right management, surrounded by the right players.
  • 'Not Champions League Quality' (NCLQ) players. IE: At this stage of their careers they are very, very unlikely to feature in a Champions League squad for any team, from any country.
Here we go - my opinion, mind:

DCLQ
Lloris, Lamela, Vertonghen, Eriksen. Maybe Walker when 100% fit and surrounded by the right supporting defenders.

That's 5 at best.

[NOTE: There are only two defensive players and no strikers in this group].

PCLQ
Vorm, Fazio, Stambouli, Chadli, Soldado, Dier, Davies (when he played for Swansea), Chiriches, Paulinho, Kane, Adebayor could all potentially do well in the Champions League as players in my opinion.

That's 11. Not bad, huh? But remember - in the right team, with the right management, surrounded by the right players, where their form can be the best it can be.

Unfortunately in the current Spurs squad they are surrounded by each other. Or they don't get enough game time.

NCLQ
Capoue, Ceballos, Dembele, Kaboul, Lennon (confidence shot), Mason (not experienced enough yet), Naughton, Rose (neither technically gifted enough), Townsend, Ceballos.

That's 10. And 7 are first team regulars - albeit rotated by a manager who simply doesn't seem to know his best starting XI.

2. Secondly, as mentioned by someone before, the squad is not being played/utilised to its best ability.

And many of the players who have been with us for 2 or 3 seasons haven't been played in their best position, in the best formation for the squad at hand at the time, for a LONG time.

This has meant that confidence is incredibly low for some key players - eg: Soldado, Lennon, Paulinho - and that players less experienced at dealing with being played out of position in a squad where the manager doesn't know his best starting XI after eleven games (ie: they haven't been at Spurs very long) don't really know what their role is and aren't playing to their best either.

So, in short, we only really have 4 or 5 NOCLQ players. In a squad of 27.

So how the hell is Pochettino to be expected to get us into the Champions League??

And worse still - how can he make the others play to their best?

The obvious answer from some will be to give him time. But if we're in the bottom 3 by Christmas - which could well be the case - will Levy give him that time?

I sound like a broken record but if Levy had done a better job in the transfer window following our pretty good Champions League season, not sacked our third best manager of all time and spent the Bale money more on proven players rather than the majority of players who he thought might make us some cash in the future, we might not be in this position of mid-table mediocrity.

Long post, I know - and I'm sure some of you won't agree - but had to get that off my chest.

Aaand relax ...
 

Sweetsman

Well-Known Member
Jan 30, 2011
6,673
6,588
Well if I read anything like that I would be taking it with spoonfulls of salt.
Agreed: seems early to have cliques; what language should Spanish speaking players speak amongst themselves? My worry is that there is an effort to blindside MP by disparate parts of the media.
 

longtimespur

Well-Known Member
Sep 10, 2014
5,830
9,949
Agreed: seems early to have cliques; what language should Spanish speaking players speak amongst themselves? My worry is that there is an effort to blindside MP by disparate parts of the media.


Nothing new in the media having a go at THFC.
They've been doing it for years. IMHO
 

JoeT

Well-Known Member
Jun 7, 2005
3,813
935
Show me the quotes where Sherwood said that, and all them players you have mentioned arent the cheapest options, they apart from Soldado and argueably Dembele have sometimes been as good here as they have been anywhere else and have also been linked with better clubs than us. How can you say ''the cheapest options'' then quote those players to support your arguement?
Pochetto wanted Schniederlin; we got Stambouli. He also wanted a good C.B.; we signed Fazio; also a better R.B.; we resigned Rose and bought in Davies.We were supposed to be strengthening our strikers; we didn't get anyone.
Agree with a lot of this. Vertonghen is a prime example.

The problem with the players we have are three-fold from what I can make out.

1. Firstly there are just too many average players. I mean look at our squad and divide them into:
  • 'Definite Champions League Quality' (DCLQ) players. By this i mean they would feature in Chelsea, Arsenal, Man City or Liverpool's Champs League squad.
  • 'Potential Champions League Quality' players' (PCLQ) players. IE: Players who might well be good enough in the right team, with the right management, surrounded by the right players.
  • 'Not Champions League Quality' (NCLQ) players. IE: At this stage of their careers they are very, very unlikely to feature in a Champions League squad for any team, from any country.
Here we go - my opinion, mind:

DCLQ
Lloris, Lamela, Vertonghen, Eriksen. Maybe Walker when 100% fit and surrounded by the right supporting defenders.

That's 5 at best.

[NOTE: There are only two defensive players and no strikers in this group].

PCLQ
Vorm, Fazio, Stambouli, Chadli, Soldado, Dier, Davies (when he played for Swansea), Chiriches, Paulinho, Kane, Adebayor could all potentially do well in the Champions League as players in my opinion.

That's 11. Not bad, huh? But remember - in the right team, with the right management, surrounded by the right players, where their form can be the best it can be.

Unfortunately in the current Spurs squad they are surrounded by each other. Or they don't get enough game time.

NCLQ
Capoue, Ceballos, Dembele, Kaboul, Lennon (confidence shot), Mason (not experienced enough yet), Naughton, Rose (neither technically gifted enough), Townsend, Ceballos.

That's 10. And 7 are first team regulars - albeit rotated by a manager who simply doesn't seem to know his best starting XI.

2. Secondly, as mentioned by someone before, the squad is not being played/utilised to its best ability.

And many of the players who have been with us for 2 or 3 seasons haven't been played in their best position, in the best formation for the squad at hand at the time, for a LONG time.

This has meant that confidence is incredibly low for some key players - eg: Soldado, Lennon, Paulinho - and that players less experienced at dealing with being played out of position in a squad where the manager doesn't know his best starting XI after eleven games (ie: they haven't been at Spurs very long) don't really know what their role is and aren't playing to their best either.

So, in short, we only really have 4 or 5 NOCLQ players. In a squad of 27.

So how the hell is Pochettino to be expected to get us into the Champions League??

And worse still - how can he make the others play to their best?

The obvious answer from some will be to give him time. But if we're in the bottom 3 by Christmas - which could well be the case - will Levy give him that time?

I sound like a broken record but if Levy had done a better job in the transfer window following our pretty good Champions League season, not sacked our third best manager of all time and spent the Bale money more on proven players rather than the majority of players who he thought might make us some cash in the future, we might not be in this position of mid-table mediocrity.

Long post, I know - and I'm sure some of you won't agree - but had to get that off my chest.

Aaand relax ...
 

shelfmonkey

Weird is different, different is interesting.
Mar 21, 2007
6,690
8,040
Agreed: seems early to have cliques; what language should Spanish speaking players speak amongst themselves? My worry is that there is an effort to blindside MP by disparate parts of the media.

Lawton isn't trying to blindside Poch at all, he's having a pop at our ever so wonderful, baldy leader!!
 

UbeAstard

Well-Known Member
May 31, 2005
3,354
2,413
Pochetto wanted Schniederlin; we got Stambouli. He also wanted a good C.B.; we signed Fazio; also a better R.B.; we resigned Rose and bought in Davies.We were supposed to be strengthening our strikers; we didn't get anyone.

And specifically how was it Levy's fault we didnt get those targets eg Schniederlin?
 

HotspurFC1950

Well-Known Member
Feb 6, 2011
4,223
2,623
Do people believe Spurs have the money to compete the way the fans would like us to ?

Do people think that Spam and Soton will be in the top four at the end of the season ?
 

shelfmonkey

Weird is different, different is interesting.
Mar 21, 2007
6,690
8,040
Do people believe Spurs have the money to compete the way the fans would like us to ?

Do people think that Spam and Soton will be in the top four at the end of the season ?

No and no, but they probably won't lose at home to the baggies and a shite barcodes team!!
 

Shirtfront

Well-Known Member
Jul 29, 2005
1,247
406
I think that Moyes was a point better off at this stage last season, anyway irrelevant to this conversation.

I would guess that we have spent close to the 150 million that Man Ure have over the past two seasons and as Matt has said in his article this team has actually regressed.

The pointy finger should be at the system. It's evidently not working and down to the players being incapable of playing it or the coach incapable of instilling it. It simply has to be one or the other and not both.

I would ask anyone this question who doubts the above (and do not advocate a change of manager!).

When Pulis went to Palace last January, did he use tactics and a system to suit the players to hand, or were the players just a misguided bunch under Holloway who could adapt easily to the system Pulis wanted to use?

I think that he used the players that he had and adopted a system to suit their strengths. I truly believe that after Sunday and twenty odd games in charge (pre-season / EL / PL and CC) that Poch is doing the opposite. Until he gets in the players that are suited to his system than we are doomed to failure.

Re spending: not net. We had to finance ours by selling our only world class player. They didn't. But that's beside the point - Poch didn't get to spend it so we can't really blame him. That was all I was saying.

I completely agree the system is a mess. And that derives from Levy who keeps jumping from one system to the next, one quick fix to another instead of having the courage of his convictions and building for long term success.

That, and running it like a business (to maximise shareholder value; resale value) rather than a football club (to win things, while being financially prudent).

Poch's mandate seems to be to get this lot to play his way (more entertaining, high tempo). Win and win well. That's all well and good, but all the tactics in the world cannot instil a sense of dedication and winning mentality in players who lack the stomach for a fight and have the discipline and strength of character to be winners. And we have a squad full of pea hearts.

That comes back to how and why we ended up here - and the dysfunctional management system(s) that Levy sets up (and tears down).
 
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