Morgan Schneiderlin

Barry Mead

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#81
So he made the French squad ahead of Capoue.........quelle surprise!
If it wasn't for injuries and Sherwood not having a clue about him I would imagine Capoue would have been there, he was just establishing himself in the French team before we signed him. It's not really a surprise Schneiderlin got the nod given Capoue was simply lacking enough playing time
 

DaSpurs

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#82
He's definitely a good player, but I'd much rather see Capoue develop and see what he can do. That first month he was here, I thought he looked as good as Sandro defensively, with a bit more mobility and better passing range. If he can bring that back, and hopefully push on, he'll be a mainstay for us.

Besides, we have Bentaleb as a backup CM, who can certainly fill in if one of our other 3 internationals in that position are out for one reason or another.

Paunlinho is the one I'm not a big fan of. I thought he had a terrible season. He can certainly provide goals, but little else. If rumours are true and we could get anything in the region of £30m for him, I'd sell and look at Pjanic or someone similar. Cabaye alternatively would have been fantastic - not sure how he's getting on at PSG.
I too would prefer to see Capoue as first choice, but as we saw from this last year, having only one senior CDM (were we to sell Sandro) for a four front season would be suicidal. Bentaleb can certainly deputize there, but it wouldn't be enough.

Agree on Paulinho though btw.
 

Mr Pink

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#83
I'm really up for this signing.

As BC says, he's tenacious and technically very good. Passing is good and he reads the game very well. Could easily instill a bit more tempo to our play to.
 

Greenspur

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#84
I agree we could use with another winger who could improve our goal-scoring potential, but it's very important to note that with midfielders and especially the CDM and DLP/BTB type players whose positioning is originally in front of the back line, it's the potential for scoring goals through the circumstances they create (space, defenders backpedaling, incisive passing) that are more important when evaluating such players' impacts at any given team.
I keep seeing these types of acronyms in various posts. I am assuming that they are from football manager (or some such). For those of us who don't play these computer games the acronyms make no sense. It seems to me that dozens of new 'positions' have been invented. These only serve to confuse matter, in my opinion.
 

DaSpurs

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#85
I keep seeing these types of acronyms in various posts. I am assuming that they are from football manager (or some such). For those of us who don't play these computer games the acronyms make no sense. It seems to me that dozens of new 'positions' have been invented. These only serve to confuse matter, in my opinion.
I've never played football manager in my life, and don't even own a video game console to play FIFA.

But I apologize if they're unclear to you, don't blame you frankly. But I can assure you they're from descriptions made well before anyone designing a video game got ahold of them. It's simply a coincidence that the modern game has shifted towards a staggered, three-man central midfield in almost the same time period as the rise of FIFA. But they are:

CDM = central defensive midfielder
DLP = deep-lying playmaker
BTB = box to box
 

felmani26

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#86
A very underated player but one who will only be brought in as a replacement for Sandro and/or Capoue and that's definitely not a priority position to start tinkering with unless ridiculous offers flood in.
 

Mr Pink

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#87
A very underated player but one who will only be brought in as a replacement for Sandro and/or Capoue and that's definitely not a priority position to start tinkering with unless ridiculous offers flood in.
I think it depends on how Poch views it personally.
 

DaSpurs

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#88
I think it depends on how Poch views it personally.
Agreed. His views of the strengths and weaknesses of the squad in the context of his plans could be entirely different from the fanbase's views from last year's performances. And if I'm honest, looking at our current squad and considering the players he likes to use from his previous stints, I believe they are.
 

Dazza86

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#89
I too would prefer to see Capoue as first choice, but as we saw from this last year, having only one senior CDM (were we to sell Sandro) for a four front season would be suicidal. Bentaleb can certainly deputize there, but it wouldn't be enough.

Agree on Paulinho though btw.
Bentaleb should certainly only be distant backup, in the hope that any necessary game time he has should only be to fill in for a short period, i.e. one of the other injured 3 (assuming we play a 2 in the CM position and one is fit) *should* be on the road to recovery.

BTW, in that other 3 I'm including Paulinho, Sandro and Dembele until any are sold, and presuming that if Paulie or Dembele are, that they will be replaced for an international (or equivalent) DLP. If it be Sandro, then I certainly agree we'll need them to be a DM. In this scenario, would Schneiderlin want to compete with Capoue?

I believe I've 'agreed' with a number of your Paulinho posts in the past. If he can turn his overall game around and start controlling the tempo, I'll be all up for him staying, but at the moment I think we're suffering having him in the team.
 
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DaSpurs

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#90
Bentaleb should certainly only be distant backup, in the hope that any necessary game time he has should only be to fill in for a short period, i.e. one of the other injured 3 (assuming we play a 2 in the CM position and one is fit) *should* be on the road to recovery.

BTW, in that other 3 I'm including Paulinho, Sandro and Dembele until any are sold, and presuming that if Paulie or Dembele are, that they will be replaced for an international (or equivalent) DLP. If it be Sandro, then I certainly agree we'll need to them to be a DM. In this scenario, would Schneiderlin want to compete with Capoue?

I believe I've 'agreed' with a number of your Paulinho posts in the past. If he can turn his overall game around and start controlling the tempo, I'll be all up for him staying, but at the moment I think we're suffering having him in the team.
Agree with all of this.

On Schneiderlin and Capoue, that question certainly has to be asked. However, I think given the very nature of the position within the demands of the modern game suggests that each would see plenty of time. Schneiderlin might find himself as second choice upon arrival, but at that time he should find himself given plenty of opportunities between the cup matches, and the high likelihood of any of Poch experimenting with the lineup, Capoue falling out of form, Capoue being hurt, or Schneiderlin sufficiently impressing in training or those cup matches. And then of course, vice versa in favor of Capoue as the season progresses and injuries take their toll.

Of course, this is entirely assuming were Sandro being sold, as I view that as the only possibility that would inspire the club to take the measures it would take to get Schneiderlin from Saints or another CDM capable of contributing quickly at a club of our level. I do think Dembele will be sold this summer, but if he and Livermore are the only sales from midfield this summer I don't think they'll induce us to buy anyone to replace them (unless Poch really does want Banega).
 

dondo

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#92
A very underated player but one who will only be brought in as a replacement for Sandro and/or Capoue and that's definitely not a priority position to start tinkering with unless ridiculous offers flood in.

We need a different type of midfielder sandro capoue dembele and paulinho are good players but are not good passers of the ball and are the reason we lack any sort of tempo and look slow and sluggish a lot of the time
 

spurs9

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#93
I remember when Arsenal fans were calling for an injury prone Van Persie to be sold after he had a slow recovery from an serious injury. He was struggling to get game time and when he did he only scored something like 2 goals in 13 games. Once he got his fitness and form back he scored something like 18 goals in 17 games.

If you compare Sandro's stats last season to Schneiderlin either this season or last season, Sandro made more interceptions, made more assists, made more key passes, created more chances than Schneiderlin did in either season. Sandro had a higher pass completion rate than Schneiderlin last season (but not this season) despite having a higher ave pass length and a higher % of passes going forward rather than backwards (to Schneiderlin in both seasons).

Sandro is also a big personality off the pitch. Modric recently wrote on either his or Gomes instagram post that he misses them both and hopes they can catch up in Brazil.

I will be gutted if we get rid of Sandro to replace him with Schneiderlin.
 

Dazza86

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#94
Agree with all of this.

On Schneiderlin and Capoue, that question certainly has to be asked. However, I think given the very nature of the position within the demands of the modern game suggests that each would see plenty of time. Schneiderlin might find himself as second choice upon arrival, but at that time he should find himself given plenty of opportunities between the cup matches, and the high likelihood of any of Poch experimenting with the lineup, Capoue falling out of form, Capoue being hurt, or Schneiderlin sufficiently impressing in training or those cup matches. And then of course, vice versa in favor of Capoue as the season progresses and injuries take their toll.

Of course, this is entirely assuming were Sandro being sold, as I view that as the only possibility that would inspire the club to take the measures it would take to get Schneiderlin from Saints or another CDM capable of contributing quickly at a club of our level. I do think Dembele will be sold this summer, but if he and Livermore are the only sales from midfield this summer I don't think they'll induce us to buy anyone to replace them (unless Poch really does want Banega).
If Schneiderlin were to come in and fancy competing with Capoue (assuming Sandro is sold), I think Bentaleb could be the one left asking questions, and possibly finding a way out the door. Possible loan in Jan? That combo is a great option to have, but could still cause a few headaches, similar to what we've had this year - too many players on about the same level in positions.

However, I'm possibly a bit against the grain when it comes to Dembele - I think he's a great player, although I agree with most that he doesn't rotate the ball fast enough or have any real vision to note. It's his ability to retain possession that I like and the way he glides past players. It grates on me when people suggest playing Holtby in a similar role because we then notice how easily we lose the ball in dangerous positions, something Dembele hardly, if ever, does. A lot of his work is underrated, and with all the talk about 'x' could improve under Pochettino, maybe so to can Dembele.

Out of him and Paulinho, although Paulinho does possibly...maybe need a bit more time to acclimatise - I'd still sell Paulinho this window. He's worth more and would be more difficult to keep quiet on the bench if a more expensive replacement keeps him there.
 

DaSpurs

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#96
I remember when Arsenal fans were calling for an injury prone Van Persie to be sold after he had a slow recovery from an serious injury. He was struggling to get game time and when he did he only scored something like 2 goals in 13 games. Once he got his fitness and form back he scored something like 18 goals in 17 games.

If you compare Sandro's stats last season to Schneiderlin either this season or last season, Sandro made more interceptions, made more assists, made more key passes, created more chances than Schneiderlin did in either season. Sandro had a higher pass completion rate than Schneiderlin last season (but not this season) despite having a higher ave pass length and a higher % of passes going forward rather than backwards (to Schneiderlin in both seasons).

Sandro is also a big personality off the pitch. Modric recently wrote on either his or Gomes instagram post that he misses them both and hopes they can catch up in Brazil.

I will be gutted if we get rid of Sandro to replace him with Schneiderlin.
Interesting stuff. Just for clarification though, by "last season" pertaining to Sandro's stats, are you referring to 12/13 or 13/14?
 

Bus-Conductor

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#97
I remember when Arsenal fans were calling for an injury prone Van Persie to be sold after he had a slow recovery from an serious injury. He was struggling to get game time and when he did he only scored something like 2 goals in 13 games. Once he got his fitness and form back he scored something like 18 goals in 17 games.

If you compare Sandro's stats last season to Schneiderlin either this season or last season, Sandro made more interceptions, made more assists, made more key passes, created more chances than Schneiderlin did in either season. Sandro had a higher pass completion rate than Schneiderlin last season (but not this season) despite having a higher ave pass length and a higher % of passes going forward rather than backwards (to Schneiderlin in both seasons).

Sandro is also a big personality off the pitch. Modric recently wrote on either his or Gomes instagram post that he misses them both and hopes they can catch up in Brazil.

I will be gutted if we get rid of Sandro to replace him with Schneiderlin.
Where are you getting your stats from S9 ?

According to whoscored.com this season Sandro averages 1.4 tackles a game, Scneiderlin 3.2. Sandro averages 1.8 interceptions, Scneiderlin 2.1. Sandro averages 0.4 key passes, Schneiderlin 0.9. This season Schneiderlin is their most productive passer (averaging 58 a game) and also has their highest completion rate of 89%. Sandro averages 27 and 84%.

Pretty big superiority in pure numbers.
 

DaSpurs

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#98
If Schneiderlin were to come in and fancy competing with Capoue (assuming Sandro is sold), I think Bentaleb could be the one left asking questions, and possibly finding a way out the door. Possible loan in Jan? That combo is a great option to have, but could still cause a few headaches, similar to what we've had this year - too many players on about the same level in positions.

However, I'm possibly a bit against the grain when it comes to Dembele - I think he's a great player, although I agree with most that he doesn't rotate the ball fast enough or have any real vision to note. It's his ability to retain possession that I like and the way he glides past players. It grates on me when people suggest playing Holtby in a similar role because we then notice how easily we lose the ball in dangerous positions, something Dembele hardly, if ever, does. A lot of his work is underrated, and with all the talk about 'x' could improve under Pochettino, maybe so to can Dembele.

Out of him and Paulinho, although Paulinho does possibly...maybe need a bit more time to acclimatise - I'd still sell Paulinho this window. He's worth more and would be more difficult to keep quiet on the bench if a more expensive replacement keeps him there.
I don't blame you for feeling as if Bentaleb might question, but I very much hope he'd be kept both if Sandro stays or if we get a replacement. As we saw from last season, even with Sherwood's non-usage of a distinctive CDM and early exits from both domestic cups, we still came very much up against the line in terms of fitness at the position. I think with having two senior CDM's, and a youth player available who's been blooded that's also capable of performing in another position that he's actually better at in the No 8 slot, we leave ourselves very well protected against the long four-front season while also keeping everyone happy. Bentaleb will see time if Dembele is sold, as he's better alongside the CDM IMO rather than being the CDM, and Holtby would also share time with Eriksen. So I think it would all work out with the sales I speculate are likely to happen from midfield.
 

DaSpurs

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#99
Where are you getting your stats from S9 ?

According to whoscored.com this season Sandro averages 1.4 tackles a game, Scneiderlin 3.2. Sandro averages 1.8 interceptions, Scneiderlin 2.1. Sandro averages 0.4 key passes, Schneiderlin 0.9. This season Schneiderlin is their most productive passer (averaging 58 a game) and also has their highest completion rate of 89%. Sandro averages 27 and 84%.

Pretty big superiority in pure numbers.
From that, I can only assume he's referring to Sandro in 2012/13 before his injury, which also makes since given he had prefaced with discussing RvP returning to his best.
 
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