New Stadium Details And Discussions

Discussion in 'The New Stadium' started by fozzi44, Nov 4, 2008.

  1. TaoistMonkey

    TaoistMonkey What would Phil Dunphy do? Staff

    Messages:
    32,365
    Media:
    9
    Albums:
    2
    Ratings Received:
    +33,245 / 500 / -186
    Can all the "Experts" chill out and let us plebs speculate about if we think it will be done on time?

    Unless you are on the project or giving Levy a handjob nobody knows fuck all.

    [​IMG]
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
    • Funny Funny x 3
    • Like Like x 1
    • Winner Winner x 1
  2. SlotBadger

    SlotBadger Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,460
    Ratings Received:
    +3,523 / 48 / -23


    I'm not actually disagreeing. I have no opinion - nor facts - to present on the subject of artichokes.
     
    • Funny Funny x 2
  3. davidmatzdorf

    davidmatzdorf Front Page Gadfly

    Messages:
    10,331
    Ratings Received:
    +13,920 / 445 / -371
    I'm hoping you're right. It's arguably one of the advantages of the "construction management" form of procurement they are using: the programme gets set by Mace, who are paid a fee for their services, as opposed to design-and-build or traditional procurement, where the building contractor gets paid for the work completed, plus a profit margin.

    The problem that arises then is that contractors have to compete to win the tender with the lowest price. Time is money: the more quickly you can build, the less it will cost. Thus there is an incentive for contractors to make hopelessly optimistic assumptions for how quickly they can build, to make their tenders as competitive as possible.

    A common part of this tendency is taking a "fingers crossed" approach to bad weather ... and then bunging in a claim for extended time due to "exceptionally inclement weather", based on snowstorms and rain in winter. I can't tell you how many times I have had to remind a contractor that snowstorms and rain in the British winter are not "exceptional", while telling them where they can insert their spurious claim ;).
     
    • Like Like x 2
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Informative Informative x 1
  4. dovahkiin

    dovahkiin Top notch swords!

    Messages:
    1,601
    Ratings Received:
    +39,720 / 75 / -26
    edmonton on stadium ready for next season (probably more educated guess than itk though, i guess you cant be fully itk on this):
    Have faith. If late won't be by much.
     
    • Informative Informative x 10
    • Like Like x 5
  5. Ionman34

    Ionman34 SC Supporter

    Messages:
    4,543
    Ratings Received:
    +7,949 / 88 / -71
    The Contractor would account for time risk analysis (TRA) and float in the programme. However, it is unlikely that inclement weather would have been allowed into the programme as it is generally accepted over here that weather is the Contractor's risk.

    You also have to appreciate that the Client (THFC) dictates the completion date most of the time, the Contractor generally provides a resource loaded programme that meets the timeframe but has costs reflecting this.

    Mostly though, it is about how much risk either party is prepared to take. If the Client insists that the Contractor shoulder most of the risk, the Contractor then prices accordingly (I'm currently putting a risk register together now) and submits the tender with cost and time associated with the risk included.

    Having said this, much will depend on the nature of any delay. If the delay is Client caused (design error, the Client deciding to change an aspect of the design etc) then the Contractor is entitled to an Extension of Time (EOT) complete with associated costs arising from the delay, including overheads, and this will protect them from LD's. If inclement weather is not the Contractors risk then they get EOT but without costs.

    The whole thing depends on the contract. For example, an NEC contract gives you 5 options ranging from option A (lump sum where the Contractor assumes virtually all the risk) to option E, which is a cost plus if the Contractor feels the risks outweigh the opportunities.

    As far as the programme is concerned, if they are behind then they can go into "acceleration." This is effectively where the Contractor saturates the job with the maximum amount of plant, labour etc that it can get into the job to get it done as fast as possible. It is extremely expensive. But, if the Client orders it due to causing the delay, it's because the lost revenue would outweigh the extra over cost. If the Contractor has caused the delay then he is likely to accelerate because the extra cost will be significantly less than the LD's.

    Spurs could likely levy (scuse the pun) LD's in the region of millions per week, as the revenue loss would be 7 figures, so it's in everyone's best interest to get the job finished on time really.
     
    • Informative Informative x 5
    • Agree Agree x 2
  6. Bulletspur

    Bulletspur The Reasonable Advocate

    Messages:
    6,098
    Ratings Received:
    +7,420 / 527 / -162
    Do you know if there is a sliding scale of penalties against the constructor, based on time limits if project runs behind schedule?
     
  7. Ionman34

    Ionman34 SC Supporter

    Messages:
    4,543
    Ratings Received:
    +7,949 / 88 / -71
    Penalties are actually illegal. The Client will set a Liquidated Damage that the Contractor will agree to within the contract. This is simplifying it somewhat though as there are damages and LD's. Even then, it is not a given that the Contractor will have to pay the LD as the Client still has to prove that the LD actually reflects a genuine loss of income. I've been involved in a project with an arse of a Client who set an arbitrary sum as an LD and tried to cash in on it. My company proved that they suffered zero loss of revenue so paid nothing as the arbiter decided it construed a penalty, regardless of what was agreed in the contract.

    In answer to your question, no, there isn't a sliding scale to LD's. They are imposed from the instant that the agreed completion or Practical completion date has been overrun and they are a fixed rate.

    Just to clarify, Practical Completion (PC) is the date when it is agreed that sufficient quantity of the works have been completed for it to be "fit for purpose." This is usually when the LD's are calculated against. So, whilst the Contractor may still be working on, he's protected from the LD's. so they could still be working on the project even while we're in there watching the game (not on match day obviously, DL ain't letting anyone see the game for free!)
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
    • Informative Informative x 1
  8. dondo

    dondo Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    4,144
    Ratings Received:
    +5,804 / 468 / -118
    Alan Brazil on talksport just said he's heard that they is no chance stadium will be ready for next season
     
    • Funny Funny x 9
  9. Hengy1

    Hengy1 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    821
    Ratings Received:
    +1,916 / 65 / -7
    Alan Brazil :ROFLMAO:
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  10. Rocksuperstar

    Rocksuperstar just a child getting older...

    Messages:
    40,422
    Ratings Received:
    +24,578 / 227 / -67
    And the rest of the program has been Ray Wilkins going on about how cold it is in the studio, without resorting to point out that Brazil isn't cold as he generates more heat than a blast furnace, simply from the density.
     
  11. L-man

    L-man Pele Alli

    Messages:
    7,392
    Ratings Received:
    +25,484 / 372 / -171
    15AF3411-8346-487D-83AA-9EFBF4248B88.jpeg
     
    • Funny Funny x 6
    • Winner Winner x 1
    • Informative Informative x 1
  12. alexn_spurs

    alexn_spurs Active Member

    Messages:
    179
    Ratings Received:
    +218 / 2 / -1
  13. Chris Flynn

    Chris Flynn Active Member

    Messages:
    901
    Ratings Received:
    +1,643 / 31 / -9
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Funny Funny x 1
  14. spursfan77

    spursfan77 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    10,679
    Ratings Received:
    +15,710 / 506 / -132
    Pretty sure Scotland isn't going to be happy to see they've been picture like that for 3 years in the 80s!
     
  15. mark_2017

    mark_2017 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    15,525
    Ratings Received:
    +25,047 / 289 / -84
  16. nicdic

    nicdic Official SC Padre Admin

    Messages:
    39,704
    Ratings Received:
    +13,911 / 353 / -66
    The pictures from the last couple of days on the twitter look awesome.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  17. Breezer

    Breezer Position??? Magician!!!!

    Messages:
    4,070
    Ratings Received:
    +15,126 / 168 / -88
    Taken yesterday:
    8835AAA2-1473-485D-849D-60AB118D3520.jpeg 94F76B19-F404-4312-B56C-254EF71CB2E5.jpeg
     
    • Like Like x 11
  18. dovahkiin

    dovahkiin Top notch swords!

    Messages:
    1,601
    Ratings Received:
    +39,720 / 75 / -26
    edmonton on alan brazil:
    He's wrong.
     
    • Like x 9
    • Funny x 2
    • Informative x 2
    • Agree x 1
    • Winner x 1
  19. dondo

    dondo Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    4,144
    Ratings Received:
    +5,804 / 468 / -118

    Just passing on what I heard on the radio mate
     
  20. davidmatzdorf

    davidmatzdorf Front Page Gadfly

    Messages:
    10,331
    Ratings Received:
    +13,920 / 445 / -371
    Apparently Alan Brazil is today's self-appointed expert on building programmes.

    Everyone has an "opinion", eh?


    [I used to watch him when he played for Ipswich, as my partner in those days came from a Ipswich supporting family and we often went to Portman Rd. I don't recall any of his performances in his brief stint with Spurs. Good winger, though.]
     
    • Like Like x 1

Share This Page