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Harry Winks - Leicester City

wrd

Well-Known Member
Aug 22, 2014
13,603
58,005
People need to stop comparing Winks to Xavi and Busquets. Winks isn't fit to lace their boots.
Barcelona was Tikki Takka and it's a million miles away from Winks passing sideways to CBs all match and rarely playing a forward pass which when he does pretty much always goes to an opposition player.

He is improving, Winks that is, he has played very well in recent weeks, but please stop comparing Winks to the likes of Xavi, it's embarrassing. He's nowhere near. It may be the way we want to play, and it may be the role Winks is assigned to, but he doesn't play it close to that level.

The thing is, I get criticism for not OTT fawning over him but I just call it as I see it. There are many fans on here guilty of going too far the other way.

If Winks can develop his play so that he can see and execute decisive forward passes from deep, he will then be THAT player. If he doesn't, I think there is a ceiling to his potential.

You've completely missed the point. I didn't say Winks was the next Xavi, I said that Barca revolutionised how teams have set up their midfield. So all your posting is an irrelevancy.
 

smallsnc

Well-Known Member
Mar 30, 2017
699
1,237
I don’t want to be THAT GUY, who slates armchair fans...but hey. You have to watch him live to appreciate him. He is constantly moving and being that one available player.

People in the match day thread are TV fans. They are welcome to their opinion but they cannot make a fair or proper judgement.

I am an "arm chair" fan regarding Spurs as I live in the U.S. and can't attend matches. With that said, I have been saying for quite some time that Wink's key attribute is the fact that he knows how to make himself available allowing us to always have an option to control possession. It is not just arm chair fans that complain about what Winks doesn't do, but it is people that really don't understand what they are watching, whether live or on TV.

My frustration is that people are more worried about his shooting when he is playing as our deepest midfielder. Right now, I had rather he be practicing long range passes and through balls, the shooting can come later.
 

Primativ

Well-Known Member
Aug 9, 2017
3,229
12,486
You've completely missed the point. I didn't say Winks was the next Xavi, I said that Barca revolutionised how teams have set up their midfield. So all your posting is an irrelevancy.


Well, no it's not. It's still completely relevant. People on here go OTT with Winks. At the moment he is a promising young player but with quite clear limitations to his play at the moment. Can he overcome these limitations? He's still young so it's very possible.

Last night, he attempted to be more progressive with his passing at times, and he failed every time. On one hand I was please pleased to see him attempting these passes, on the other hand it was a shame he failed, but I'd rather he tried and failed rather than not try at all.

On the basis of the last month I feel quite excited about watching his continued development, if he continues on this trajectory.
 

Shadydan

Well-Known Member
Jul 7, 2012
38,247
104,143
People need to stop comparing Winks to Xavi and Busquets. Winks isn't fit to lace their boots.
Barcelona was Tikki Takka and it's a million miles away from Winks passing sideways to CBs all match and rarely playing a forward pass which when he does pretty much always goes to an opposition player.

He is improving, Winks that is, he has played very well in recent weeks, but please stop comparing Winks to the likes of Xavi, it's embarrassing. He's nowhere near. It may be the way we want to play, and it may be the role Winks is assigned to, but he doesn't play it close to that level.

The thing is, I get criticism for not OTT fawning over him but I just call it as I see it. There are many fans on here guilty of going too far the other way.

If Winks can develop his play so that he can see and execute decisive forward passes from deep, he will then be THAT player. If he doesn't, I think there is a ceiling to his potential.

Sigh...Can't hep yourself can you, where did he compare Winks to Xavi and Busquets?
 

wrd

Well-Known Member
Aug 22, 2014
13,603
58,005
Well, no it's not. It's still completely relevant. People on here go OTT with Winks. At the moment he is a promising young player but with quite clear limitations to his play at the moment. Can he overcome these limitations? He's still young so it's very possible.

Last night, he attempted to be more progressive with his passing at times, and he failed every time. On one hand I was please pleased to see him attempting these passes, on the other hand it was a shame he failed, but I'd rather he tried and failed rather than not try at all.

On the basis of the last month I feel quite excited about watching his continued development, if he continues on this trajectory.

I can't debate you if you argue a point I didn't make.

My original point is that the midfield game has moved on from Sounness days and you have very specialised players doing specific roles and I believe Barca are the best example of that.

Another example is Pogba who was bought because he's meant to have every attribute you would want from a footballer go from being a success in the Juventus squad, to playing under a manager who used him incorrectly, was terrible and is now playing for a manager who utilises him correctly in a midfield trio and then look at the jobs Herrera and Matic are doing now. They're not threading through killer passes, they're doing their job with recycling the possesion and giving the attacking players the platform. Hell the Juventus president spelled it out when he used a FM term I've never heard of to describe the reason they've gone for Ramsey because he's a half winger/Midfield hybrid with little defensive responsibility. Gone are the days of Sounness style where you were expected to be all action.

You only have to look at the Goals/Assists column in the prem to see that CMs are no longer expected to be all action and are instead dictating play and very rarely playing those forward passes which cut a team open.

Specifically talking about winks, it's clear to me that Poch has a style he wishes to play and he values a player with immense ball retention and the ability to dictate a game, he will add the rest to his game in the coming years but right now he's doing the core of his job extremely well.
 

HildoSpur

Likes Erik Lamela, deal with it.
Oct 1, 2005
8,958
28,086
Hate this way of thinking. I live in Northern Ireland, and have only been to 3 matches this season. I think Winks is brilliant - watching on TV isn't an excuse for having a poor opinion, nor is it reason to insult someone or make out their opinion is less valid.

As a fellow Ulster man I feel your pain.
 

wrd

Well-Known Member
Aug 22, 2014
13,603
58,005
Hate this way of thinking. I live in Northern Ireland, and have only been to 3 matches this season. I think Winks is brilliant - watching on TV isn't an excuse for having a poor opinion, nor is it reason to insult someone or make out their opinion is less valid.

If you were a proper fan you'd give up your surroundings, family and any careers prospects you have so you can watch Spurs/Watford on a Wednesday night at Wembley.
 

CoopsieDeadpool

Well-Known Member
Jun 8, 2012
18,257
70,419
yeah, goals, assists or something else other than just the possession job he does right now. Its a bit like Dembele - previous managers have said he needed to add some goals to his game. Ands Id argue Dembele was more resolute in his defending due to superior strength. Ive been a Winks fan since he broke into the first team and after a season wasted last year due to injury he's progressed again this year. Id like to see him continue to develop.


Maybe he's doing exactly as his manager asks of him though?
 

synththfc

Well-Known Member
Aug 24, 2017
3,740
26,716
Genuine star in the making. I'm not one that says the academy is the answer to all of our problems, but Winksy is the future of our DM role without question. He's footballing brilliance.

Just have to improve the CMs around him in the transfer market
 

ilya

Well-Known Member
Aug 23, 2013
464
1,368
He's been good and surprisingly mature, I also like his energy and enthusiasm, seems to have a good self-confidence. One thing he could improve is his passing, he clearly has a good eye and quick feet but with better passing technique he could be a true star.
 

CoopsieDeadpool

Well-Known Member
Jun 8, 2012
18,257
70,419
maybe, but it seems unlikely his manager is asking him not to score or get assists.


Maybe he's wanting the lad to master the basics before setting him free?

Am I wrong in thinking that, in the past, he explained that he sees Dier as a CB for the future & playing DM will help him to learn better positioning and reading of the game etc?
 

swarvsta

Well-Known Member
Jul 25, 2008
773
4,061
Hate this way of thinking. I live in Northern Ireland, and have only been to 3 matches this season. I think Winks is brilliant - watching on TV isn't an excuse for having a poor opinion, nor is it reason to insult someone or make out their opinion is less valid.
I am an "arm chair" fan regarding Spurs as I live in the U.S. and can't attend matches. With that said, I have been saying for quite some time that Wink's key attribute is the fact that he knows how to make himself available allowing us to always have an option to control possession. It is not just arm chair fans that complain about what Winks doesn't do, but it is people that really don't understand what they are watching, whether live or on TV.

My frustration is that people are more worried about his shooting when he is playing as our deepest midfielder. Right now, I had rather he be practicing long range passes and through balls, the shooting can come later.

I think my views came across in the wrong way. I am not trying to dig out those fans that don’t go to games. I am just basing this argument on the fact that I go to nearly every game, but also then watch the highlights, or full match on TV afterwards.

I form various opinions watching live and then see things very differently depending on tv angle, slow motion etc.

Last night, I thought Lloris’s save on HT was a worldie. I didn’t know the shot had been blocked and the save was much easier than it looked live.

I know for sure you cannot appreciate a lot of Winks’ movement when watching on tv. It doesn’t pick it up at all. You will always lack the ability to see who the best off the ball players are when watching on TV, it’s just a fact really.
 

LexingtonSpurs

Well-Known Member
Aug 27, 2013
13,456
39,042
I think my views came across in the wrong way. I am not trying to dig out those fans that don’t go to games. I am just basing this argument on the fact that I go to nearly every game, but also then watch the highlights, or full match on TV afterwards.

I form various opinions watching live and then see things very differently depending on tv angle, slow motion etc.

Last night, I thought Lloris’s save on HT was a worldie. I didn’t know the shot had been blocked and the save was much easier than it looked live.

I know for sure you cannot appreciate a lot of Winks’ movement when watching on tv. It doesn’t pick it up at all. You will always lack the ability to see who the best off the ball players are when watching on TV, it’s just a fact really.
To be fair - the tv often gives better angles than you get in a stadium - depending on your seat. There is no "perfect" viewing angle of any play (though you are more likely to find it on TV with the multitude of cameras and replays) than you are watching a match live.

In this regard - I watch Winks move a lot - and I see him show for the ball a lot. But, I also see how the angles he takes, and the movements he makes, don't always put him in the best position to receive the ball, or to beat an opponent (I frequently see his movement where he leaves an opponent between himself and the ball - instead of moving to a position to eliminate that opponent.

I love Winks - and think he is a great confidence player - meaning that as he gains confidence the better he plays - and the more he plays the more confidence he gets. I am very happy with his development, and I think with more experience he will make even better movement off the ball, and spot better areas to receive a pass.

I don't need to be in a stadium to realize he is a key contributor to Spurs success, and we are fortunate that he continues to develop.
 

fortworthspur

Well-Known Member
Nov 12, 2007
11,244
17,536
Maybe he's wanting the lad to master the basics before setting him free?

Am I wrong in thinking that, in the past, he explained that he sees Dier as a CB for the future & playing DM will help him to learn better positioning and reading of the game etc?

I dont know what he said about Dier. I dont know what hes telling Winks. I know Winks is already very good at showing for every pass and knitting things together, and he's only 23. My point was he has the time and ability to add something else and be a really special player.
 

Mr Pink

SC Supporter
Aug 25, 2010
54,776
99,338
I think my views came across in the wrong way. I am not trying to dig out those fans that don’t go to games. I am just basing this argument on the fact that I go to nearly every game, but also then watch the highlights, or full match on TV afterwards.

I form various opinions watching live and then see things very differently depending on tv angle, slow motion etc.

Last night, I thought Lloris’s save on HT was a worldie. I didn’t know the shot had been blocked and the save was much easier than it looked live.

I know for sure you cannot appreciate a lot of Winks’ movement when watching on tv. It doesn’t pick it up at all. You will always lack the ability to see who the best off the ball players are when watching on TV, it’s just a fact really.

Not sure I agree with your last sentence, not completely anyway.

You won't 'always' lack the ability to see who the best off the ball runners are, as some angles on TV will still pick these up, but obviously watching the game live you certainly won't miss them if you're watching attentively.

But a good view live, is the more pertinent issue, as it enables you to appreciate these more. Like a more elevated position as opposed to pitch side.

I love to see the whole game unfold with a great view to appreciate the patterns of play, combinations and movement off the ball.
 

knilly

SC Supporter
Apr 12, 2005
1,819
1,033
Winks is definitely following orders when it comes to his passing.

I’ve noticed recently until we get in the opposition half we play zero risk passes. Spread out wide, pass side to side until our defenders are on the half way. Winks is one of the central parts of gaining territory, almost in a rugby way going through the phases.
 

CoopsieDeadpool

Well-Known Member
Jun 8, 2012
18,257
70,419
I dont know what he said about Dier. I dont know what hes telling Winks. I know Winks is already very good at showing for every pass and knitting things together, and he's only 23. My point was he has the time and ability to add something else and be a really special player.


It's become a bit of a cliche on here over the course of this season BUT....

Look at what Poch has done to Sissoko. This is a fully grown, fully pledged French International player, entering his peak years.

Just imagine whats possible with the comparatively blank canvas that is Harry Winks.
 

fortworthspur

Well-Known Member
Nov 12, 2007
11,244
17,536
It's become a bit of a cliche on here over the course of this season BUT....

Look at what Poch has done to Sissoko. This is a fully grown, fully pledged French International player, entering his peak years.

Just imagine whats possible with the comparatively blank canvas that is Harry Winks.


I think we are saying the same thing. Im delighted with winks. I also think he has the potential to better.
 

Tit&Ham

Well-Known Member
Aug 19, 2012
809
1,699
I am not sure how many has noticed, but he is our main man, heart and Soul.

everyone fit, he is probably the first name on the teamsheet.

Love him.
 
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