Player Watch: Ryan Mason

[sparx100]

It bugs me when people point out Jenas as an example of a scapegoat. He was crap, we moved him on, and we improved the squad.

yeah I am one of those people just above your post.
Do you think one player contributed to us losing 5-1 to Newcastle?
Do you think Dier was let down by Mason in central midfield or do you think Dier has been piss awful for a month and should leave too?
Do you think that Mason has come into a a team brimming full of confidence and let them down?
Did Mason play a full season last season as a midfield two and have a good season?
Is he coming back from injury and a very bit part role on the team?

Jury is out for me but the vitriol against a player is ridiculous. Football is a squad game, so not every player is a match winner but everyone wants to see someone come off the bench and change the game or to have a big influence - the simple fact is no team has that and you have players who are squad players, who come in and do a job.

 

[Colonel Dax]

Mason played his part in a midfield that achieved a 5th place league finish the season before last. So well done for that.

But the point is we've progressed since then. Our ambition is now hopefully regular CL qualification and title challenges. Is Mason good enough to slot into a title challenging team? I don't think so.

We've moved on, and so should Ryan. Nothing personal - he's still a good player but we can do better.

 

[tooey]

I was critical of the Mason and Bentaleb pairing last year, the whole "but they were in a side that finished 5th last year" argument doesn't wash with me, in my opinion whilst they both had a handful of exceptional games our finishing position was more in spite than because of the two.

 

[Nigel Spinal]

I was critical of the Mason and Bentaleb pairing last year, the whole "but they were in a side that finished 5th last year" argument doesn't wash with me, in my opinion whilst they both had a handful of exceptional games our finishing position was more in spite than because of the two.

No way. They Kane and Rose were the catalysts of everything we did well last season.

That they dragged a team of Fazios and Chirches' to 5th was a major achievement.

 

[Everlasting Seconds]

No way. They Kane and Rose were the catalysts of everything we did well last season.

That they dragged a team of Fazios and Chirches' to 5th was a major achievement.

OK.
Let's for academic reasons assume that this is 100% correct: "we finished 5th because of Mason & Bentaleb". It is something you have kept on repeating in many threads. Let's agree that it is correct for sake of argument.
In which case, classical logic dictates that it is also correct that we finished 3rd this season because we didn't play them as the CM pairing. The first cannot be correct if not also the second is correct. If they were vital in the team achieving one result, then leaving them out must have been vital in improving on that result.

 

[eddiebailey]

OK.
Let's for academic reasons assume that this is 100% correct: "we finished 5th because of Mason & Bentaleb". It is something you have kept on repeating in many threads. Let's agree that it is correct for sake of argument.
In which case, classical logic dictates that it is also correct that we finished 3rd this season because we didn't play them as the CM pairing. The first cannot be correct if not also the second is correct. If they were vital in the team achieving one result, then leaving them out must have been vital in improving on that result.

That is like saying it is Jimmy Greaves fault that we didn't win the league in 62.

 

[Nigel Spinal]

OK.
Let's for academic reasons assume that this is 100% correct: "we finished 5th because of Mason & Bentaleb". It is something you have kept on repeating in many threads. Let's agree that it is correct for sake of argument.
In which case, classical logic dictates that it is also correct that we finished 3rd this season because we didn't play them as the CM pairing. The first cannot be correct if not also the second is correct. If they were vital in the team achieving one result, then leaving them out must have been vital in improving on that result.

No. It's because Alder and Alli (and Walker's return) improved other areas, while Lamela and Eriksen also learned how to synchronise press (which they weren't doing last season).

Major injuries were all that stopped Mason and Bentaleb contributing much more this season

 

[Eric_s]

No. It's because Alder and Alli (and Walker's return) improved other areas, while Lamela and Eriksen also learned how to synchronise press (which they weren't doing last season).

Major injuries were all that stopped Mason and Bentaleb contributing much more this season

You really post nonsense. Eriksen and Lamela since last season have always been better in pressing than mason and bentaleb. Both of them are attackers yet they track back and their interception stats are not inferior to bentaleb or mason. Your agenda is so obvious and it irks me that you pretend to know the extend of mason's "injury" to make excuses for him.

 

[dudu]

You really post nonsense. Eriksen and Lamela since last season have always been better in pressing than mason and bentaleb. Both of them are attackers yet they track back and their interception stats are not inferior to bentaleb or mason. Your agenda is so obvious and it irks me that you pretend to know the extend of mason's "injury" to make excuses for him.

Truth is Mason didnt get a fair run in the side this year.

great player or not - playing less than 9 games worth of prem league football for us is not enough for him to dictate anything about our overall team performance.

And last season Bentaleb's interceptions stats were definitely superior tp Eriksens and Lamelas.

If you Ignore Fazio, Kaboul, Capoue and Vlad Bentaleb had the most per game at 2.5 - 1.2 more than Eriksen and Lamela just under 50% more per game which is, by all accounts, inferior.

 

[Nigel Spinal]

You really post nonsense. Eriksen and Lamela since last season have always been better in pressing than mason and bentaleb. Both of them are attackers yet they track back and their interception stats are not inferior to bentaleb or mason. Your agenda is so obvious and it irks me that you pretend to know the extend of mason's "injury" to make excuses for him.

I meant Eriksen and Lamela improved their own pressing from last season. The defensive contribution from those two have grown significantly this season as a result of good coaching and organisation

 

[Eric_s]

Truth is Mason didnt get a fair run in the side this year.

great player or not - playing less than 9 games worth of prem league football for us is not enough for him to dictate anything about our overall team performance.

And last season Bentaleb's interceptions stats were definitely superior tp Eriksens and Lamelas.

If you Ignore Fazio, Kaboul, Capoue and Vlad Bentaleb had the most per game at 2.5 - 1.2 more than Eriksen and Lamela just under 50% more per game which is, by all accounts, inferior.

Based on their roles in the team I wouldn't say that bentaleb had a exceptionally better stat in terms of intetception as his position meant that he should be intercepting more. I am not discrediting any players contribution.

 

[yido_number1]

No way. They Kane and Rose were the catalysts of everything we did well last season.

That they dragged a team of Fazios and Chirches' to 5th was a major achievement.

Completely agree with this. The turning point last year was Mason's introduction in the Nottingham Forest game. At that point we were playing crab football with no passion. Mason was unlucky with his injury, that goal at Sunderland was epic.

A good squad player that bleeds the club.. Needs full fitness but well worth keeping.

 

[Everlasting Seconds]

We were a top 5 team with Mason and Bentaleb as the CM pair, and top 3 team without them.
I think that is a pretty accurate description of their abilities when paired together.

 

[eddiebailey]

We were a top 5 team with Mason and Bentaleb as the CM pair, and top 3 team without them.
I think that is a pretty accurate description of their abilities when paired together.

The other nine players being a complete irrelevance apparently.

 

[Japhet]

No way. They Kane and Rose were the catalysts of everything we did well last season.

That they dragged a team of Fazios and Chirches' to 5th was a major achievement.

Funny how nobody ever says Fazio and Chiriches were in a team that made top 5 but somehow Mason and Bentaleb deserve some sort of accolade for being part of it. IMO Fazio, Chiriches and everybody else at the back were continually exposed by a weak CM which led to our appalling goal difference.

 

[yankspurs]

We were a top 5 team with Mason and Bentaleb as the CM pair, and top 3 team without them.
I think that is a pretty accurate description of their abilities when paired together.

Mason and Bentaleb werent that good of a CM pairing. Way too weak defensively and lost possession too often. They needed Dembele in the CM with them as he shielded them and gave them protection. Without him, they were exposed all too often.

 

[yankspurs]

Funny how nobody ever says Fazio and Chiriches were in a team that made top 5 but somehow Mason and Bentaleb deserve some sort of accolade for being part of it. IMO Fazio, Chiriches and everybody else at the back were continually exposed by a weak CM which led to our appalling goal difference.

Exactly. It shouldnt come as a surprise to people that our best run of form that season came when Dembele was in the side. He covered up the weaknesses. When he was out of the squad, we shipped goals left and right.

 

[Indacupfortottenham]

Slightly off topic but I like Alli as CM and Eriksen in the 10 role - If we bring in a good striker Kane will get more game time in that role two I think.
We already have top class cover for Dembele in Alli, just need another DM to compete with/cover Dier.

I'd get rid of Mason, Bentaleb and Carroll if it meant we could bring in Kante from Leicester.

 

[Everlasting Seconds]

The other nine players being a complete irrelevance apparently.

Hey, don't shoot me, I'm just going off those who claim that Mason & Bentaleb were the reason why we finished 5th.

Funny how nobody ever says Fazio and Chiriches were in a team that made top 5 but somehow Mason and Bentaleb deserve some sort of accolade for being part of it. IMO Fazio, Chiriches and everybody else at the back were continually exposed by a weak CM which led to our appalling goal difference.

Heck yes. It's not Lamela and Eriksen who press better this season (they already understood the job last season), it's the CM pairing this season who are vastly better.

Mason and Bentaleb werent that good of a CM pairing. Way too weak defensively and lost possession too often. They needed Dembele in the CM with them as he shielded them and gave them protection. Without him, they were exposed all too often.

I don't disagree with you at all, but I suspect you know that

 

[DJS]

Mason needs to be given the opportunity to have his op and get fully fit.

At his best he can bring real drive and energy to the team, as shown at Stoke at start of season.

Also, it could be that he'd actually be better as cover for Ali in attacking three as does have passing / goal scoring potential that could be better served not being held back playing in one of the two engine room positions.

For me Eriksen is better on left of attacking three so when Ali is not available as kicked the shit out of someone and gotten suspended, rather then moving Eriksen centrally could be interesting to try Mason there. And also Kane as another option if we finally by another forward lol.

You can't write him off after this season with injuries and lack of game time he's had, he was impressing for England the season before so can't be that shit!

But I don't think he can be relied on as sole cover for engine room positions - you'd hope Bentaleb will buck up his ideas, maybe Winks will make step up and we'll also bring someone in.