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Player watch: Toby Alderweireld

thelak

Well-Known Member
Aug 31, 2012
2,166
6,950
seems a mess. Surely needs to sign a new contract if he is going to stay

All sorts of rumours on this one from finance based to his Missus telling Levy he is a bald headed penny pinching moron - hard to know what’s happened but buyers when faced with his wage demands (even serial mercenary aquirers like Utd) probably realise he has probably peaked as a player
 

TheHoddleWaddle

Well-Known Member
Dec 13, 2013
11,289
20,289
I am surprised to read that Alderweireld is said to have been disrespectful to Poch'. With some.players you can see something in it, but Toby always seems to have been professional in his conduct etc. I get the issues around salary etc, but not the implication there's more to it.

Bit of a conundrum with what to do with him now. Such a quality player, I'm actually surprised there hasn't been more overseas interest. He was brilliant at the wc too.
 

nicdic

Official SC Padre
Admin
May 8, 2005
41,857
25,919
I am surprised to read that Alderweireld is said to have been disrespectful to Poch'. With some.players you can see something in it, but Toby always seems to have been professional in his conduct etc. I get the issues around salary etc, but not the implication there's more to it.

Bit of a conundrum with what to do with him now. Such a quality player, I'm actually surprised there hasn't been more overseas interest. He was brilliant at the wc too.

The story all along, was that it was Poch who persuaded Levy to give Toby what he wanted. When Levy then did that, he and his people turned round and asked for more. Poch took that as a personal affront. He had vouched for Toby, and made it happen, and took Toby and his people moving the goalposts as disrespectful.
 

yanno

Well-Known Member
Aug 1, 2003
5,857
2,877
The story all along, was that it was Poch who persuaded Levy to give Toby what he wanted. When Levy then did that, he and his people turned round and asked for more. Poch took that as a personal affront. He had vouched for Toby, and made it happen, and took Toby and his people moving the goalposts as disrespectful.

The story has moved on. Check the part of ali z's ITK that I've highlighted:

------------------------------------------

ali z on toby: Only wants to stay as nobody wants to pay him what he thinks his worth, in addition he needs a change of attitude if he does stay as he acted very disrespectful to Poch, not over finances but can't/won't reveal unless he goes. He did not act professionally and if it was me there would be no way back but I am not Poch.
 

TheHoddleWaddle

Well-Known Member
Dec 13, 2013
11,289
20,289
The story all along, was that it was Poch who persuaded Levy to give Toby what he wanted. When Levy then did that, he and his people turned round and asked for more. Poch took that as a personal affront. He had vouched for Toby, and made it happen, and took Toby and his people moving the goalposts as disrespectful.

I can see why that would go down like a lead balloon. Well, perhaps, if Toby eats a little humble pie there would be a way to sort this out? Blame.the agent! Although trust issues are hard to overcome. That said, if Toby hasn't been disruptive with the players and it's purely contractual / cheek then maybe the hatchet can be buried.

But the story seems to be evolving, how much is Chinese whispers who knows.
 

St José Dominguez

Well-Known Member
Jul 15, 2014
3,592
11,648
Be great if he stays in terms of the quality of the team but I've gone off him. He's only staying because no other club offered him more than we did. It's not even like we didn't want to give him a healthy pay rise, he just wanted to try and rinse us.

Then he comes out saying he should've been starting even though he looked horrendous when he returned from injury plus totally disregarding young Sanchez performances.

Hope we go to a 3 as I feel very uncomfortable with the idea of Sanchez suddenly being a sub when Toby would have happily kicked off if we blocked him his Utd money move. If he stays he needs to be motivated I guess as Poch wouldn't stand for it after this nonsense and he'd be dropped.

Seems like it's one rule for him one rule for others from fans though.
 

wrd

Well-Known Member
Aug 22, 2014
13,603
58,005
My honest opinion on this is that if we can strike a deal with united to get Martial and sacrifice Alder then it is worth it and we don't need a big cb replacement. if we can finally sort that attacking position then the other issue we have is that Dembele is irreplaceable with a player for player replacement. That to me suggests a shift in formation with Dier dropping back as CB cover and the likes of Eriksen dropping deeper even Dele similarly to how he has now for England. It would also give Foyth the opportunity to start to be apart of the first team. It's risky but I think we can sacrifice Alder.
 

TheHoddleWaddle

Well-Known Member
Dec 13, 2013
11,289
20,289
Be great if he stays in terms of the quality of the team but I've gone off him. He's only staying because no other club offered him more than we did. It's not even like we didn't want to give him a healthy pay rise, he just wanted to try and rinse us.

Then he comes out saying he should've been starting even though he looked horrendous when he returned from injury plus totally disregarding young Sanchez performances.

Hope we go to a 3 as I feel very uncomfortable with the idea of Sanchez suddenly being a sub when Toby would have happily kicked off if we blocked him his Utd money move. If he stays he needs to be motivated I guess as Poch wouldn't stand for it after this nonsense and he'd be dropped.

Seems like it's one rule for him one rule for others from fans though.

Did he say he 'should' be starting, or that he was 'fit' enough to start. I thought it was the latter.
 

RuskyM

Well-Known Member
Jul 9, 2011
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22,732
Be great if he stays in terms of the quality of the team but I've gone off him. He's only staying because no other club offered him more than we did. It's not even like we didn't want to give him a healthy pay rise, he just wanted to try and rinse us.

That's true, but from his point of view he's 29 years old and probably getting to his peak: understandable that he'd want to squeeze us for as much as we can.

I want to keep him because he's the best centre back in the league, but if he's a problem in the dressing room then that's another story.
 

St José Dominguez

Well-Known Member
Jul 15, 2014
3,592
11,648
That's true, but from his point of view he's 29 years old and probably getting to his peak: understandable that he'd want to squeeze us for as much as we can.

I want to keep him because he's the best centre back in the league, but if he's a problem in the dressing room then that's another story.

If he plays like he did before I want to keep him too but I don't feel he's shown much commitment to the cause. It's one thing negotiating best deal you can from club it's another moving goalposts either using interest elsewhere or genuinely wanting to go elsewhere if they pay him more. I'd be fuming if I was Sanchez after a great season finding myself on bench for a guy, albeit a great CB, who has let's be honest treated the club like mugs.
 

ShaunL84

Well-Known Member
Jan 3, 2013
3,725
10,853
Both parties should swallow their pride and look for a compromise.

Toby and Jan back together would be incredible.
 

Giovanni

Well-Known Member
Aug 31, 2012
2,587
3,614
Not sure id describe it as incredible. 3 at the back loses us a forward player who actually has pace (son, moura) and it also puts far too much emphasis on kane to get all the goals (alli cant be relied on to score enough imo). Alli and eriksen never get rested so we will suddenly have lamela and moura and son getting little minutes.
Only option would be to drop eriksen next to dier in cm to bring in pace up top. I think its extreemly unfair on davinson to suddenly sit out even if he is only 22.
 

Timberwolf

Well-Known Member
Jan 17, 2008
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50,217
Not sure id describe it as incredible. 3 at the back loses us a forward player who actually has pace (son, moura) and it also puts far too much emphasis on kane to get all the goals (alli cant be relied on to score enough imo). Alli and eriksen never get rested so we will suddenly have lamela and moura and son getting little minutes.
Only option would be to drop eriksen next to dier in cm to bring in pace up top. I think its extreemly unfair on davinson to suddenly sit out even if he is only 22.
I think this is the only way we could keep our players happy. Eriksen drops deeper and we play Kane, Alli + 1 depending on the opposition. If Poch really does want to go 3 at the back, though, why would be be so desperate to sign a wide forward who would be completely negated in that formation?
 

parj

NDombelly ate all the pies
Jul 27, 2003
3,586
5,861
IF Alderweireld stays, he and Vertonghen would surely be the first choice two. I think Sanchez has to be smart enough to recognise that makes sense - he's 22 or so and primarily played so much last season because of the injury.

I think we have to be smart. Sanchez had a fantastic first season, albeit a bit clumsy at times, but he showed he can handle the job. He also had a great world cup.

Toby lost the right to start with his issues and Sanchez earned the right to take his place. He has grown into the team and to then become second fiddle and start maybe 10-15games wouldn't sit well with anyone that has had his last 12 months
 

SpartanSpur

Well-Known Member
Jan 27, 2011
12,552
43,063
I think this is the only way we could keep our players happy. Eriksen drops deeper and we play Kane, Alli + 1 depending on the opposition. If Poch really does want to go 3 at the back, though, why would be be so desperate to sign a wide forward who would be completely negated in that formation?

Chelsea won the league with 3 at the back in 2016/17 with Hazard and Willian/Pedro ripping it up behind Costa in a 3-4-2-1. Put Eriksen deeper in that formation and we can accommodate another attacker, although our squad depth would be crazy.
 

Rosco1984

Well-Known Member
Aug 31, 2012
1,740
7,048
Chelsea won the league with 3 at the back in 2016/17 with Hazard and Willian/Pedro ripping it up behind Costa in a 3-4-2-1. Put Eriksen deeper in that formation and we can accommodate another attacker, although our squad depth would be crazy.

Chelsea had Kante doing the running and work of about 3 players in there 2 in midfield and he still had Matic another DM alongside him. If you played Eriksen in there we would have to put in a call to metropolis for our new CM. Eriksen can play deeper but not as part of a 2 unless you want our defence to be exposed on the break.
 

Klinsmannesque

Well-Known Member
Jul 26, 2013
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4,665
Big players have fallen out with their clubs in the past, looked to be leaving only for them to stay and perform. Just look at Rooney/Chelsea, Gerrard/Chelsea, Suarez/Arsenal (albeit the latter left a year later). If they can find a common ground and Toby signs an extension without a clause then he's a player well worth keeping. A top CM and a run at Martial/Zaha close to deadline day and we are set (with the FWD players not a priority if we can't shift)
 

SpartanSpur

Well-Known Member
Jan 27, 2011
12,552
43,063
Chelsea had Kante doing the running and work of about 3 players in there 2 in midfield and he still had Matic another DM alongside him. If you played Eriksen in there we would have to put in a call to metropolis for our new CM. Eriksen can play deeper but not as part of a 2 unless you want our defence to be exposed on the break.

For lesser teams, maybe not. A common sub last season was a CM for an attacker, dropping Eriksen deeper to try and break down defensive teams, and that was in front of a 4. Bigger games yes you'd have to probably move to a 3-5-2 or push Eriksen up. We'd still have a world class back 3 behind them with the exceptional recovery pace of Sanchez to help.

Also a 100% fit Wanyama would be no slouch in midfield either.

I do think WF is the one that if we got it right could be the big difference (our goals tally was far too short of City/Pool last year), but right now it is one that is the best covered in the squad, especially if Toby stays and a 3 is used more often. If we end up getting a top class CM I'm happy for us to just wait to see if Utd blink on Martial near deadline day.
 
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