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Pochettino post Liverpool press conference

JCRD

Well-Known Member
Aug 10, 2018
19,153
30,013
Whilst Poch is to blame for the performances coupled with stuff out of his control eg world cup, players being tired etc, I think Levy has let him down BIG time. Look at Liverscum, the owners backed Klopp year on year. Yeah I know they sold Coutinho but they backed him to the hilt.
 

shelfboy68

Well-Known Member
Jun 14, 2008
14,566
19,651
Whilst Poch is to blame for the performances coupled with stuff out of his control eg world cup, players being tired etc, I think Levy has let him down BIG time. Look at Liverscum, the owners backed Klopp year on year. Yeah I know they sold Coutinho but they backed him to the hilt.
Nailed on the head he has been let down in such a big way seeing his ambitions go down the shitter, you have to hand it to levy he gets poch to sign a new deal then pulls the rug from under his feet cunning and sneaky.
 
D

Deleted member 27995

I don't believe for one moment that he is relaxed about the last couple of results and how shit the team has been plus I would imagine he had a good look at Liverpool and thought "if only that could be us", but he has to keep his boss happy with that official bollocks which you well know and for that only do I think he did well with.
Why does he have to keep his boss happy? Isn't it the line that his boss put him in this current situation with the squad as it stands?
 

sebo_sek

Well-Known Member
Jun 2, 2005
6,023
5,168
Poch goes along with what levy bags him with if you think he is calm and happy about not being able to strengthen his squad then you are very naive mate, poch was brought in for that reason because he follows instruction and doesn't complain like Harry would of or most of the top managers around him would have done.
Wow. Must be one lucky bastard to have got 3 top3 finishes in a row as well.
 

dickieven

Well-Known Member
Mar 31, 2006
2,041
2,930
I thought Poch's answers were spot on and similar to what he has been saying all season so far. He was critical of our performances against Newcastle, Fulham and Utd about giving up possession and chances. As he says here, Liverpool are a far better team than the others and took advantage of our sloppiness.

If the penalty had been given and scored we'd be saying great comeback, didn't play well but didn't give up blah blah. As he says very fine lines between good and bad.

I am not getting the concerns from others that Poch is not happy and players are not interested. I am seeing the same I have seen for the past few seasons in that we take a while to get going as a team. We do not have individual brilliant players to call on to drag us through games when we are not playing well e.g. Bale. When we have an off day as a team it is a hard watch and I think we have just had two of them on a trot. Let's hope a trip to the San Siro gets the spirits up and we can see a proper Poch spurs performance.
 

rupsmith

Well-Known Member
Jul 29, 2006
1,714
2,328
Posted this on the match thread in response to a suggestion that we spend big and if we dont its a bs excuse. Took me some 20 mins so will post it here too:

- your point is spend a 100 million (or two considering the cost of players today) to improve the squad with world class players to freshen us up and starting challenging for things;

- my point is that is a bullshit naive unrealistic suggestion suitable for Football Manager. Our primary focus is on completing that stadium which reports suggest is about a billion pounds. We have one of the best training centres in the world. These are models that will ensure financial sustainability - not some cash input from some super rich billionaire who wants some toys to play with to build his brand. We don't have some Middle Eastern royal family (City) or Russian tycoon (Chelsea, Arsenal) supporting us. Man United were winning things before not because of some "Busby Babes" philosophy. They could buy Berba, Carrick, Veron, Ferdinand, van Nistelrooy etc etc at record breaking amounts because of the money from their stadium - an 80k seater - and a top manager.

I have seen this club grow under Levy and Enic. They have made mistakes sure - and sometimes some pretty big ones. But generally the club has grown. The world knows who we are now. Top players have started thinking about coming to us. Our new stadium will welcome us this season. But till date we have always been punching well above our weight due to a brilliant manager and some astute financial leadership. Daniel Levy is a person who generally knows his stuff - he has squeezed top clubs for every single pound when they come sniffing - Berba, Bale, Modric, Keane etc. But our most expensive player is 40 million. The average cost of the players we have bought in is around the 30 million range. We are not going to be splurging 100 million on a player. That was not our model - particularly after we got burnt wasting the Bale money pretty much to satisfy the fan base. Look at most of our squad:
1) Kane - home grown. England captain because of Poch
2) Moura - highly talented winger. Looking the part after a few months at the club. 26 million
3) Eriksen - Denmark international. Brilliant consistent playmaker. 12 million
4) Sonny - South Korean captain. pacy winger with a knack for scoring. 27 million.
5) Lamela - winger/playmaker - 27 million
6) Alli - England international playmaker. 6 million
7) Winks - home grown
8) Dembele, Wanayama - midfield powerhouses - Belgium and Kenyan internationals. 17 and 13 million respectively
9) Eric Dier - England International. 4.5 million
10) Trippier - England International. Highly praised performances. The Bury Beckham. 4.5 million
11) Rose - home grown. England International.
12) Sanchez - Colombia International. Record buy. 40 million
13, 14) Vertoghen, Alderweireld - Belgium international - top class centre backs, 11 million and 14 million respectively.
15) Lloris - France world cup winning captain. 11 million.

Look at what those players have become from when we recruited them (brilliant football management) and the their costs (top financial management - and doesn't look like we ever have been Real frikkin Madrid have we?)

Even Liverpool only had that money after Countinho - and they fix their two main problems centre back and goalkeeper. Well done. We wasted all the Bale money and we will not do the big spending again. That is simply not our model. Poch knows that, but he wants to stay because he has the degree of control that he wants. He is not some ego massaging type coach. He runs a tight ship with players that grow as people and players. They players love that and its a good vibe at the club. Sure there are going to be a few more ups and downs but its up to us as fans to stay supportive - not overreact because of a couple of losses. The premier league is a tough league - but the fact that we are playing Inter Milan in mid week in the Champions League shows how far we have come. We are not going to be challenging City anytime soon so don't hold your breath - we should try our best to stay top 4, a tough challenge. Still think this is all bs? Then listen to people who know the business (watch from 3:50 onwards):

 

cliff jones

Well-Known Member
Aug 31, 2012
4,059
6,516
putting the extreme reactions to one side, Poch clearly fked up yesterday- but it's whether he learns or not that matters.

We've seen Dier do a decent job in DM many times but he just gets overwhelmed by City and Liverpool's style- he should not be in there against these sides. Winks has ability but after good bursts he then passes backwards losing all momentum. Dembele made a bad mistake in possession in both halves but otherwise did some good things. In combo, however, these three had no idea what their individual roles were and how their positioning related to each other's. Poch is responsible for this.

Poch is also being badly let down by Eriksen and Kane, although both appear confused by how Lucas has changed the dynamic. Time for Poch to prove that selections are at least partly based on merit and form. Time to bench both v Inter and send the message.

Poch and the squad need to bounce back well in the next few games. Otherwise the wheels will have properly come off.
 

Japhet

Well-Known Member
Aug 30, 2010
19,232
57,392
putting the extreme reactions to one side, Poch clearly fked up yesterday- but it's whether he learns or not that matters.

We've seen Dier do a decent job in DM many times but he just gets overwhelmed by City and Liverpool's style- he should not be in there against these sides. Winks has ability but after good bursts he then passes backwards losing all momentum. Dembele made a bad mistake in possession in both halves but otherwise did some good things. In combo, however, these three had no idea what their individual roles were and how their positioning related to each other's. Poch is responsible for this.

Poch is also being badly let down by Eriksen and Kane, although both appear confused by how Lucas has changed the dynamic. Time for Poch to prove that selections are at least partly based on merit and form. Time to bench both v Inter and send the message.

Poch and the squad need to bounce back well in the next few games. Otherwise the wheels will have properly come off.


IMO the biggest tactical gaff was continually pushing Rose and Trippier forward which left masses of space down the flanks. One at a time would have been OK with the other FB staying put and the CBs shuffling across or Dier dropping back.
 

cliff jones

Well-Known Member
Aug 31, 2012
4,059
6,516
IMO the biggest tactical gaff was continually pushing Rose and Trippier forward which left masses of space down the flanks. One at a time would have been OK with the other FB staying put and the CBs shuffling across or Dier dropping back.

agreed. Dier usually drops back in but seemed to be deployed to the right of the three in mids. He was pedestrian in his cover work for Trips. Of course, 95% of our attacks broke down due to poor passing, leaving the FBs exposed up the pitch.
 

parj

NDombelly ate all the pies
Jul 27, 2003
3,586
5,861
Poch is also being badly let down by Eriksen and Kane, although both appear confused by how Lucas has changed the dynamic. Time for Poch to prove that selections are at least partly based on merit and form. Time to bench both v Inter and send the message.

Don't think there was any confusion. The team simply wasn't moving yesterday bar Lucas. Poch needs to learn that his full back tactics only work when the full back is willing to take his man on... That's the only way Mane is forced to track back.
 

Noddy Gorman.

The Truth Is Bitter.
Sep 14, 2018
25
19
Posted this on the match thread in response to a suggestion that we spend big and if we dont its a bs excuse. Took me some 20 mins so will post it here too:

- your point is spend a 100 million (or two considering the cost of players today) to improve the squad with world class players to freshen us up and starting challenging for things;

- my point is that is a bullshit naive unrealistic suggestion suitable for Football Manager. Our primary focus is on completing that stadium which reports suggest is about a billion pounds. We have one of the best training centres in the world. These are models that will ensure financial sustainability - not some cash input from some super rich billionaire who wants some toys to play with to build his brand. We don't have some Middle Eastern royal family (City) or Russian tycoon (Chelsea, Arsenal) supporting us. Man United were winning things before not because of some "Busby Babes" philosophy. They could buy Berba, Carrick, Veron, Ferdinand, van Nistelrooy etc etc at record breaking amounts because of the money from their stadium - an 80k seater - and a top manager.

I have seen this club grow under Levy and Enic. They have made mistakes sure - and sometimes some pretty big ones. But generally the club has grown. The world knows who we are now. Top players have started thinking about coming to us. Our new stadium will welcome us this season. But till date we have always been punching well above our weight due to a brilliant manager and some astute financial leadership. Daniel Levy is a person who generally knows his stuff - he has squeezed top clubs for every single pound when they come sniffing - Berba, Bale, Modric, Keane etc. But our most expensive player is 40 million. The average cost of the players we have bought in is around the 30 million range. We are not going to be splurging 100 million on a player. That was not our model - particularly after we got burnt wasting the Bale money pretty much to satisfy the fan base. Look at most of our squad:
1) Kane - home grown. England captain because of Poch
2) Moura - highly talented winger. Looking the part after a few months at the club. 26 million
3) Eriksen - Denmark international. Brilliant consistent playmaker. 12 million
4) Sonny - South Korean captain. pacy winger with a knack for scoring. 27 million.
5) Lamela - winger/playmaker - 27 million
6) Alli - England international playmaker. 6 million
7) Winks - home grown
8) Dembele, Wanayama - midfield powerhouses - Belgium and Kenyan internationals. 17 and 13 million respectively
9) Eric Dier - England International. 4.5 million
10) Trippier - England International. Highly praised performances. The Bury Beckham. 4.5 million
11) Rose - home grown. England International.
12) Sanchez - Colombia International. Record buy. 40 million
13, 14) Vertoghen, Alderweireld - Belgium international - top class centre backs, 11 million and 14 million respectively.
15) Lloris - France world cup winning captain. 11 million.

Look at what those players have become from when we recruited them (brilliant football management) and the their costs (top financial management - and doesn't look like we ever have been Real frikkin Madrid have we?)

Even Liverpool only had that money after Countinho - and they fix their two main problems centre back and goalkeeper. Well done. We wasted all the Bale money and we will not do the big spending again. That is simply not our model. Poch knows that, but he wants to stay because he has the degree of control that he wants. He is not some ego massaging type coach. He runs a tight ship with players that grow as people and players. They players love that and its a good vibe at the club. Sure there are going to be a few more ups and downs but its up to us as fans to stay supportive - not overreact because of a couple of losses. The premier league is a tough league - but the fact that we are playing Inter Milan in mid week in the Champions League shows how far we have come. We are not going to be challenging City anytime soon so don't hold your breath - we should try our best to stay top 4, a tough challenge. Still think this is all bs? Then listen to people who know the business (watch from 3:50 onwards):


Get back to me when he WINS something. As for Levy and Enic. One League Cup in their tenure sums these Vampires up.
 

Metalhead

But that's a debate for another thread.....
Nov 24, 2013
25,351
38,294
Posted this on the match thread in response to a suggestion that we spend big and if we dont its a bs excuse. Took me some 20 mins so will post it here too:

- your point is spend a 100 million (or two considering the cost of players today) to improve the squad with world class players to freshen us up and starting challenging for things;

- my point is that is a bullshit naive unrealistic suggestion suitable for Football Manager. Our primary focus is on completing that stadium which reports suggest is about a billion pounds. We have one of the best training centres in the world. These are models that will ensure financial sustainability - not some cash input from some super rich billionaire who wants some toys to play with to build his brand. We don't have some Middle Eastern royal family (City) or Russian tycoon (Chelsea, Arsenal) supporting us. Man United were winning things before not because of some "Busby Babes" philosophy. They could buy Berba, Carrick, Veron, Ferdinand, van Nistelrooy etc etc at record breaking amounts because of the money from their stadium - an 80k seater - and a top manager.

I have seen this club grow under Levy and Enic. They have made mistakes sure - and sometimes some pretty big ones. But generally the club has grown. The world knows who we are now. Top players have started thinking about coming to us. Our new stadium will welcome us this season. But till date we have always been punching well above our weight due to a brilliant manager and some astute financial leadership. Daniel Levy is a person who generally knows his stuff - he has squeezed top clubs for every single pound when they come sniffing - Berba, Bale, Modric, Keane etc. But our most expensive player is 40 million. The average cost of the players we have bought in is around the 30 million range. We are not going to be splurging 100 million on a player. That was not our model - particularly after we got burnt wasting the Bale money pretty much to satisfy the fan base. Look at most of our squad:
1) Kane - home grown. England captain because of Poch
2) Moura - highly talented winger. Looking the part after a few months at the club. 26 million
3) Eriksen - Denmark international. Brilliant consistent playmaker. 12 million
4) Sonny - South Korean captain. pacy winger with a knack for scoring. 27 million.
5) Lamela - winger/playmaker - 27 million
6) Alli - England international playmaker. 6 million
7) Winks - home grown
8) Dembele, Wanayama - midfield powerhouses - Belgium and Kenyan internationals. 17 and 13 million respectively
9) Eric Dier - England International. 4.5 million
10) Trippier - England International. Highly praised performances. The Bury Beckham. 4.5 million
11) Rose - home grown. England International.
12) Sanchez - Colombia International. Record buy. 40 million
13, 14) Vertoghen, Alderweireld - Belgium international - top class centre backs, 11 million and 14 million respectively.
15) Lloris - France world cup winning captain. 11 million.

Look at what those players have become from when we recruited them (brilliant football management) and the their costs (top financial management - and doesn't look like we ever have been Real frikkin Madrid have we?)

Even Liverpool only had that money after Countinho - and they fix their two main problems centre back and goalkeeper. Well done. We wasted all the Bale money and we will not do the big spending again. That is simply not our model. Poch knows that, but he wants to stay because he has the degree of control that he wants. He is not some ego massaging type coach. He runs a tight ship with players that grow as people and players. They players love that and its a good vibe at the club. Sure there are going to be a few more ups and downs but its up to us as fans to stay supportive - not overreact because of a couple of losses. The premier league is a tough league - but the fact that we are playing Inter Milan in mid week in the Champions League shows how far we have come. We are not going to be challenging City anytime soon so don't hold your breath - we should try our best to stay top 4, a tough challenge. Still think this is all bs? Then listen to people who know the business (watch from 3:50 onwards):


I agree that we have to accept our limitations to an extent because we can't compete with clubs that are essentially backed by countries and Levy is to be applauded for what he has done to date.

Obviously the stadium delays are not his finest hour and whilst I accept that big projects do run over, the PR hasn't been the best, which is most unlike Levy. In terms of the business model that Levy has pursued in relation to transfers, it has been astute albeit not foolproof and I feel a sense that it has come to the end of the road with premier league clubs now being a lot richer (even if artificially so due to the TV money) and many now seem ready to rebuff Levy's tactics so that may need a rethink.

I still think that the 'being brave meant backing youth rather than signing players' was retrospective spin but equally it was a weird window and there weren't that many quality players available. I'm kind of surprised that we didn't seem to cast our net a bit wider but then none of us know where we were looking apart from the obvious targets like Grealish.
 

rupsmith

Well-Known Member
Jul 29, 2006
1,714
2,328
I agree that we have to accept our limitations to an extent because we can't compete with clubs that are essentially backed by countries and Levy is to be applauded for what he has done to date.

Obviously the stadium delays are not his finest hour and whilst I accept that big projects do run over, the PR hasn't been the best, which is most unlike Levy. In terms of the business model that Levy has pursued in relation to transfers, it has been astute albeit not foolproof and I feel a sense that it has come to the end of the road with premier league clubs now being a lot richer (even if artificially so due to the TV money) and many now seem ready to rebuff Levy's tactics so that may need a rethink.

I still think that the 'being brave meant backing youth rather than signing players' was retrospective spin but equally it was a weird window and there weren't that many quality players available. I'm kind of surprised that we didn't seem to cast our net a bit wider but then none of us know where we were looking apart from the obvious targets like Grealish.

Well I was speaking in context of the overall Levy reign and not just this window. But to be fair, even this window the ITK posts were hot with names - but clearly when the selling clubs were playing around trying to get us into a desperate spot and shell out millions more, both Poch and Levy told them to take a walk.

The stadium delay has clearly been a stumble but somehow I get the feeling that some construction parties are sweating their financial nuts off.

My personal criticism is a little bit more on the footballing side. I do believe that we need to demonstrate some degree of tactical flexibility in the premier league. There are teams of such significantly different tactical make up we do sometimes have to adapt. Llorente for example is a very good striker and Kane could do with a rest. A hold up target man with Moura and Sonny buzzing around will get certain teams nervous - it will also allow Aurier, Trips and Rose to keep swinging the ball in. Similarly Gazaniga has shown real promise but Vorm always seems shaky. We have the numbers in CM but injury has blighted us and Dembele is on his last legs. A little bit more flexibility from our brilliant press, pass and move at pace game plan may sometimes be helpful when the team is a bit leggy. Apart from that no complaints. Off to the San Siro. COYS!
 

Metalhead

But that's a debate for another thread.....
Nov 24, 2013
25,351
38,294
Well I was speaking in context of the overall Levy reign and not just this window. But to be fair, even this window the ITK posts were hot with names - but clearly when the selling clubs were playing around trying to get us into a desperate spot and shell out millions more, both Poch and Levy told them to take a walk.

The stadium delay has clearly been a stumble but somehow I get the feeling that some construction parties are sweating their financial nuts off.

My personal criticism is a little bit more on the footballing side. I do believe that we need to demonstrate some degree of tactical flexibility in the premier league. There are teams of such significantly different tactical make up we do sometimes have to adapt. Llorente for example is a very good striker and Kane could do with a rest. A hold up target man with Moura and Sonny buzzing around will get certain teams nervous - it will also allow Aurier, Trips and Rose to keep swinging the ball in. Similarly Gazaniga has shown real promise but Vorm always seems shaky. We have the numbers in CM but injury has blighted us and Dembele is on his last legs. A little bit more flexibility from our brilliant press, pass and move at pace game plan may sometimes be helpful when the team is a bit leggy. Apart from that no complaints. Off to the San Siro. COYS!
I agree about the tactical side of things. You are understandably taking the Spurs side of things on transfers but it's kind of a two way street. Levy also has employed a 'poker' element to our transfer strategy in the past to get the price down, which is understandable and has worked in the past but clubs won't necessarily be held over a barrel on transfer fees anymore and selling clubs are less likely to give in to the brinkmanship tactics.
 

rupsmith

Well-Known Member
Jul 29, 2006
1,714
2,328
I agree about the tactical side of things. You are understandably taking the Spurs side of things on transfers but it's kind of a two way street. Levy also has employed a 'poker' element to our transfer strategy in the past to get the price down, which is understandable and has worked in the past but clubs won't necessarily be held over a barrel on transfer fees anymore and selling clubs are less likely to give in to the brinkmanship tactics.

Agreed on the last point - it’s perhaps the range of fee in the negotiation that will widen in the current environment. Before it was the odd 5 million and Frazier Campbell. Now it seems like 55 to 75 million for Wilfred Zaha
 
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