Pochettino: Why there’s a key difference between a head coach and manager

[dagraham]

Is there anything that would change your mind?

Your opinion is based on an outsider looking in perspective, whereas the people inside have said what it is and this is minuted. If not accurate then all it takes is for the manager (or ex-managers) come out and say something different.

When I say "changed my mind" I mean from the viewpoint that in practice it will never work imo at Spurs and to whether it's the best way for the football side of the club to be run.

I'm sure that all the main protagonists are being accurate and honest in the theory of how its going to work.

As for Pochettino, he's not going to say anything negative about it. Meanwhile all of our ex managers working under this system have come out and said how it has hampered them.

 

[avonspurs]

When I say "changed my mind" I mean from the viewpoint that in practice it will never work imo at Spurs and to whether it's the best way for the football side of the club to be run.

I'm sure that all the main protagonists are being accurate and honest in the theory of how its going to work.

As for Pochettino, he's not going to say anything negative about it. Meanwhile all of our ex managers working under this system have come out and said how it has hampered them.

I remember seeing quotes from Redknapp (never worked under DoF at Spurs) and even from Jeff Stelling (never done anything!! ) but don't remember any explicit quotes from all of our ex-managers. Indeed, AVB wanted one.

What I do agree with you on, though, is this bit about "in the theory" - if Levy has got a DoF in and is not letting it work in the best way that it should (and can), then he needs to take responsibility for that.

 

[Hoddle&Waddle]

I don't wish to argue the point as to whether it works or not, but I am interested in why people think it doesn't work. And something other than 'different culture' stuff, seeing as though there has, other the last couple of decades, been an increasing influx into the PL of different cultures (both at player and owner level).

If you do your research you will find that foreign clubs began using DoF's because they kept sacking managers every week, as a way of keeping continuity. There is not a scrap of evidence that says this system works well in England, in fact to the contrary, so I base my opinion on this.

 

[Hoddle&Waddle]

I remember seeing quotes from Redknapp (never worked under DoF at Spurs) and even from Jeff Stelling (never done anything!! ) but don't remember any explicit quotes from all of our ex-managers. Indeed, AVB wanted one.

What I do agree with you on, though, is this bit about "in the theory" - if Levy has got a DoF in and is not letting it work in the best way that it should (and can), then he needs to take responsibility for that.

Yep, out of nowhere AVB suddenly wanted Baldini......hmmmmm. I call bullshit, purely PR devised by the Club.

 

[avonspurs]

If you do your research you will find that foreign clubs began using DoF's because they kept sacking managers every week, as a way of keeping continuity. There is not a scrap of evidence that says this system works well in England, in fact to the contrary, so I base my opinion on this.

As I put in my other post, in theory it should work fine - if done correctly. Whether or not we, as a club (because of DL's role), are working it properly is another thing altogether.

As for your assertion that there is evidence that it doesn't work, here's an article that suggests a counterview http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/footb...chester-city-proved-director-football-4169115

 

[Hoddle&Waddle]

As I put in my other post, in theory it should work fine - if done correctly. Whether or not we, as a club (because of DL's role), are working it properly is another thing altogether.

As for your assertion that there is evidence that it doesn't work, here's an article that suggests a counterview http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/footb...chester-city-proved-director-football-4169115

Hehe I've just listened to a City fan calling in talksport saying how the DoF hasnt worked (Bergestein or whatever his name is). City fans are far from happy with the signings since the Barcalona guys came in.

 

[avonspurs]

Hehe I've just listened to a City fan calling in talksport saying how the DoF hasnt worked (Bergestein or whatever his name is). City fans are far from happy with the signings since the Barcalona guys came in.

. The fact is any system will produce failed and successful signings. Like I said, in principle and in theory, I think the DoF can work well and clubs have shown it can work well. Whether or not DL is setting it up to work well is another thing.....

 

[Hoddle&Waddle]

. The fact is any system will produce failed and successful signings. Like I said, in principle and in theory, I think the DoF can work well and clubs have shown it can work well. Whether or not DL is setting it up to work well is another thing.....

Thats different though, Southampton have a DoF yet Poch is quoted as saying he had a different role, with final say on transfers. I am talking purely about the structure at Spurs currently, and where that same structure is implemented elsewhere. You know, the one where the guy that has to get results every week doesnt pick the players.

 

[jolsnogross]

. The fact is any system will produce failed and successful signings.

While this is undeniably true, so is this: if the guy who picks the team also picks the signings, he can't end up with a player he doesn't want in his squad. A managerial system ensures this, a DoF one doesn't.

I'm no defender of AVB, but even he suggested this was the case for him - that he had players signed that he didn't want. I'm not entirely sure how that happened when he seemed so instrumental in getting a DoF, but he seemed to suggest it in one of his closing press conferences.

 

[cliff jones]

if coach identifies weaknesses and DoF gets who the coach wants, the structure obviously works. But when the coach doesn't get who he wants, ie AVB got Dembele not Moutinho, to replace Modric, then the fans have a right to question others not the coach. I'm questioning others for us ending up with Fazio not MM, not Poch. I think Levy likes a DoF so he has someone else he can fire, reducing his own accountability, whilst his own salary package increases of course.

 

[Henry Percy]

Sounds like Poch has an issue, sounds dirty about something. That could become a problem.

That said he knew what he was in for. So shouldn't have been surprised.

As for not getting what you want invariably the majority of players are already at the club so it's not like any new manager or head coach gets every player he wants.

What annoys me is the way managers/head coaches are fixed on their "system". They need to develop structures that suit their players and stop trying to fit round pegs in square holes. One of the reasons SAF was so successful IMO was adapting the style of football Utd played based on the players at his disposal. Play to their strengths.

 

[sebo_sek]

bringing in your people is important and knowing that he wanted a midfield shield in MS and a defender in MM and got neither is a key part of this seasons narrative. As for the need for these two, saw this in a guardian.co.uk/football story about Pool and Woolwich:

"And yet, the biggest problems for both teams are at the back. Both sides seem to bring their troubles on themselves. Since the start of last season, only the ever self-destructive Tottenham (23) have committed more errors leading to an opposition goal than Liverpool (18) and Arsenal (13)."

While not a fan of 'Arry, but definately not his opponent, one thing is certain - he had control over transfers and we flourished, with two 4th place finishes. Jol fell when he didn't get Distin and Petrov, AVB fell because he didn't get Moutinho and then got a barrowful of new names, now Pochettino is falling cos he didn't get MS, who probably won't come anyway, judging by their start of the season.

BUT, and I always say this, a manager can't ASSUME that he's gonna get this or that player. It's simply wishful thinking at best, and childishly naive at worst. A manager, or head-coach, needs to figure out where the problem is and fix it. When you have a back four comprised of players who know each other, know how to hold a line and communicate, then shedding such a shitload of goals really shouldn't be an issue.
And going forward you need to analyse your options and set up the tem in such a way, as to best compliment the ability of the players you HAVE, not who you WISH YOU HAD.

Excuses aside, Poch needs to do his homework. Vlad on the right was the right move. He needs to do more of the same. Change players' positions if need be. But get it right.

 

[yido_number1]

if coach identifies weaknesses and DoF gets who the coach wants, the structure obviously works. But when the coach doesn't get who he wants, ie AVB got Dembele not Moutinho, to replace Modric, then the fans have a right to question others not the coach. I'm questioning others for us ending up with Fazio not MM, not Poch. I think Levy likes a DoF so he has someone else he can fire, reducing his own accountability, whilst his own salary package increases of course.

Weren't we still trying to sign Moutinho after signing Dembele? I think there is a mid point between what people think and what gets said but the amount of fiction that gets put out there claiming to be what Levy thinks and why things are like they are is ridiculous.

 

[yido_number1]

While not a fan of 'Arry, but definately not his opponent, one thing is certain - he had control over transfers and we flourished, with two 4th place finishes. Jol fell when he didn't get Distin and Petrov, AVB fell because he didn't get Moutinho and then got a barrowful of new names, now Pochettino is falling cos he didn't get MS, who probably won't come anyway, judging by their start of the season.

BUT, and I always say this, a manager can't ASSUME that he's gonna get this or that player. It's simply wishful thinking at best, and childishly naive at worst. A manager, or head-coach, needs to figure out where the problem is and fix it. When you have a back four comprised of players who know each other, know how to hold a line and communicate, then shedding such a shitload of goals really shouldn't be an issue.
And going forward you need to analyse your options and set up the tem in such a way, as to best compliment the ability of the players you HAVE, not who you WISH YOU HAD.

Excuses aside, Poch needs to do his homework. Vlad on the right was the right move. He needs to do more of the same. Change players' positions if need be. But get it right.

I think he will, he has generally made the right decisions sub wise and the things that have been costing us have been individual mistakes. I think given time we will start to see a well oiled machine. His is the kind of job that you learn from doing. The players can look good in training but on the pitch is where it counts. He is trying out different combo's and I'm sure we will soon see his best eleven or some changes will be made in the squad. I hope he is given the time to get it right.

 

[eddiebailey]

I think what Poch is trying to say is that the key difference between a head coach and a manager is that the buck stops with a manager.

 

[UbeAstard]

And our 3 attempts at the DOF + coach structure have worked brilliantly??!

And the other options always works just a brilliantly? Remember Francis/Grahams/Hoddle's wasted money?

 

[TottenhamMattSpur]

What successful teams use the set up we have?
Where a coach asks for a position to be filled and some one else goes and identifies that player and brings them in?

How does that someone provide the mythical continuity if the coach leaves and a new one has a different way of playing?

The whole theory is just that and rarely works and never does in England.

They don't do it at United, city, Chelsea (anymore) Arsenal.
Liverpool have gone from perennial top 4 to mid table joke since they adopted it.

It should never be done.

 

[UbeAstard]

While not a fan of 'Arry, but definately not his opponent, one thing is certain - he had control over transfers and we flourished, with two 4th place finishes. Jol fell when he didn't get Distin and Petrov, AVB fell because he didn't get Moutinho and then got a barrowful of new names, now Pochettino is falling cos he didn't get MS, who probably won't come anyway, judging by their start of the season.

If you inherit a squad with at least 3 special outfield players -Modric, Bale, Berbatov (later left) and sign Van De Vaart you have a great chance of achieving. When those players decide they want to go elsewhere or they dont suit a pressing system (VDV) any manager has a big, big challenge at a club like Spurs to replace so has to look at potential Eriksen, Chadli and Chiriches and see if we can acompany with a proven player (Moutinho, Soldado, Paulinho, Lloris etc) who we may not get or they may not suit our system or Premier football.
What I'm trying to say is Redknapp had a great squad that wanted to play for him. He would be in the same position as the managers who have followed when those players left, I dont think they are worse managers than HR.

 

[JoeT]

On paper DOF + coach looks great. Coach says I need a new [enter position] either first choice or cover - he's presented with a list of realistic targets & he chooses, DOF does deal.
In practice it's not worked thus far & we're on our 3rd DOF and 6th coach!! The ironic thing is Levy, by all accounts, didn't like the old fashioned manager type guy because when he leaves/is fired the next guy is stuck with his squad. I believe Hoddle discarding Graham's £11m Rebrov was the catalyst.
But this system has arguably made things even messier.
At the end of the day the coach needs to pick the players, both individually (eg get me, say, Eriksen) or the certain type he wants (eg we need a hard midfielder).
If he's given players & told to make them work, I worry.

Then I think you have cause to worry...

 

[g_harry]

Where have we seen this before.

My interpretation is that Mauricio took on the job as head coach knowing full well what that implied, however I'm sure he expected to be completely backed by Levy regarding transfer dealings and here, although I'm speculating, he has been let down with the cheaper version of the players he wanted brought in.
I sense that he's distancing himself from full responsibility of what happens on the field due to transfer decisions being taken out of his hands.