Race for the Top 4 - 2017/18

Discussion in 'Spurs Chat' started by am_yisrael_chai, Aug 8, 2017.

  1. shelfboy68

    shelfboy68 Well-Known Member

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    Even with an injury or two city's depth is so great that they can cope quite easily, all we can do is keep doing our stuff and see what happens.
    The reality is that all of us are playing for second spot and downwards as first looks to be done.
     
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  2. Locotoro

    Locotoro King of Zamunda

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    It did make sense when I wrote it (half drugged up h flu medicine).

    My point was that it's not about individual players it's about how they work together as a team. Their first XI is no different to last year with exception of Walker and Jesus. They went on an early unbeaten run last year where everyone was saying the exact something about them and then came up against us.

    In actual fact aside from Arsenal yesterday, they've not beaten anyone I wouldn't expect them to beat comfortably. I look at Man City and see they have a great side but I see a lot of vulnerabilities too, that so far no one has exploited (apart from WBA despite losing). Their backline is still shaky if put under pressure and better teams will do that. Clearly we can see that Arsenal and Liverpool are not going to be on the pace this year so i'd like to see them up against us or Chelsea and then the fallout from that. They are a young team and they will get better but I think a few of their stars will go missing when the things get tough, same as last year
     
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  3. thelak

    thelak Active Member

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    Lets be consistent

    1. New GK also a big addition. Walker and Jesus - 3 first team additions
    2. If we keep looking at our stable first team but give Poch credit for YOY improvement of the players then we should do the same - Guardiola has had a year now - those same players are performing at a much higher level - Stones, Sterling the biggest examples. Sane and De Bryne are getting better and better

    I hope they slip up of course but I saw clear weaknesses last year that now seem largely addressed
     
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  4. Locotoro

    Locotoro King of Zamunda

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    That's a fair and valid point.

    I just don't see much difference in quality between them and us - we have had to cope with quite a few injuries. Someone on here made a very good point; if we had spent 300million buying Kane, Alli and Eriksen in the summer we'd be being talked up as title challengers far more than we are, but since we are doing it organically we never seem to be first choice in people's minds.

    On the question of YOY progress, as it goes I don't think Guardiola is the coach the media and many fans give him credit for.
     
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  5. DCSPUR

    DCSPUR Well-Known Member

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    the thing that worries is that win against Chelski....yeah they got them on a good day but that was a big blow as it was away
    they did get their share of luck in the two home games against Pool and the Goons but Chelski away was a big win
     
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  6. thelak

    thelak Active Member

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    That’s fair but Utd have spent a lot of money and I’ve said we are better than them still

    I look at city and see 5-6 match winners and a now very respectable defence vs us with 3 match winners most games and a world class defence and think the former when adding squad depth is hard to overturn

    And guardiola certainly shown himself to be a chequebook and stylistically narrow manager but some has got Stones looking like an actual defender and Sterling not doing a headless chicken act in front of goal
     
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  7. spursfan77

    spursfan77 Well-Known Member

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    I think we've just got to hope this happens.

    Liverpool last season did the same thing. I haven't checked the league table from 12 months ago but the media were saying they were going to win the league about now but they burnt out and had a few injuries. I know its slightly different, but the point I'm making is that is can happen.
     
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  8. SpursDave88

    SpursDave88 Well-Known Member

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    They are still playing Fabian Delph as their starting left back. We just have to win our games and hope they slip up.
     
  9. Mr Pink

    Mr Pink SC Supporter

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    City look really good, but its ridiculously early to be talking about it being decided already.

    We havnt even entered the manic festive period yet.

    Long way to go and lots can happen.
     
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  10. kitchen

    kitchen Well-Known Member

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    Guardiola isn't the coach the media and fans give him credit for. He plays the tiki taka style and it works, but he doesn't develop players like poch, and has had to spend fortunes to get the right players to play the system and the way he wants.

    However, he has spent that fortune and that's where we're at.

    There is a difference in quality between them and us and it's mainly in the midfield. They have 3 top draw technical players that just don't lose the ball and can all make an accurate incisive pass. Plus they have a front 3 with great movement and incredible pace that makes them a threat on the counter and against parked buses. Even Sterling looks good for them because despite his lack of end product and flawed technical ability, his movement and pace is top draw and there are a lot of players that will pick him out when he runs in behind.

    They complete about 100 more passes than even us per match and that's telling... Their goal difference is more than double ours and that's even more telling.

    I'd argue that our defence is better than theirs but it doesn't matter because they don't really have a lot of defending to do. They boss possession and their defenders aren't that bad anyway.

    It's not over but 8 points clear is already huge, and can we really see them dropping 8 points on top of the amount that we/ other title contenders might drop? City will continue to roll over most outside the top 6 and then will drop no more points against the top 6 than anyone else. They've already beaten Liverpool and Arsenal at home and Chelsea away... Plus injuries do less damage to them than most because their squad is so strong. The only players they might really miss are De Bruyne and Fernandinho.
     
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  11. kitchen

    kitchen Well-Known Member

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    He's been very good to be fair...
     
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  12. olliec

    olliec Well-Known Member

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    I think we can beat City if we play the same way we did against Pool and Madrid. Let them have the ball and break. Their defence isn't all that and we all know walker is capable of a brain fart or 2.
     
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  13. Locotoro

    Locotoro King of Zamunda

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    I don't deny they have very good players and yes they've started the season very well but the moment one side gets a good result against them every other premier league team will set up the same way and their wins will turn to draws, their confidence will start to evaporate and the likes of Chelsea and us will start feeling them in.

    You say they have 3 great midfielders and a great front 3 but that's 6 players already meaning they'd have to play with no holding player and a back 3 to fit them all in at once and if they don't it doesn't really matter if they have 50 great ball players if they can only play 2 at any one time. My point is that when its 11 v 11 on the pitch they can and will be beaten
     
  14. Dharmabum

    Dharmabum Well-Known Member

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    3rd season in a row Spurs have to deal with a team on a freak-streak. 2 seasons ago it was Leicester, last season it was Chelski and now it's ManC. Sigh. Feel a bit like a jinx :cool:
     
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2017
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  15. StartingPrice

    StartingPrice Chief Sardonicus Hyperlip

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    We have been in the midst of an injury crisis. Harry Kane, for some strange reason, couldn't score in August but did manage to hit the woodwork in three consecutive games in that month, and Mike Dean seemed to be on a one man mission to not give us a penalty against Swansea. Otherwise, I sincerely believe we would be a couple of points off City. We have had an injury crisis ergo it is entirely possible that they can have one. Their form dropped noticeably when he was injured last season. I'm not wishing him injury, but it could happen and it could happen any time. They looked invincible until we steamrolled them last season - and they weren't conceding goals (but the signs were there that the defence could be got at). Afaiac it is way too early to say they will walk the title. They are the early front-runners and clear favourites. That is enough.

    TBH, and I mean no offence, but I don't think you have quite understood what is being said about their defence. No-one, so far as I know, has said they have a bad defence - I certainly haven't. What I said was that either their defence isn't as well balanced as ours or Guardiola sets his team up in such a way as to leave flaws at the back - and personally I think it a bit of both. Neither of which means their defence is bad. I personally believe we have the best defence and best balanced squad in the league - so less well balanced or defensively good doesn't mean having a bad defence. And I think Guardiola sets his team up to rely on attack as the best form of defence, hence the refences to Ossie Ardiles and the Famous Five. That is fine, and not a weakness at all as long as they keep on outscoring their oppos. Where I see a weakness is when they tika-taka out of defence, they do get caught. Never mind anyone else, just watch the second half against West Brom - who have been dire as an attacking force this season. Then consider if the goals dry up for any reason - such as, for instance, an injury crisis. I'm not saying it will happen, I'm saying it could. Then, all of a sudden, their defence not being water-tight could become a problem.

    It is interesting that you reference them conceding the second least amount of goals in the league. It is all about context. They hardly conceded anything in the opening run of games - but, there again, they did have the second easiest start, after United. They played Liverpool and the Mickeys got around their defence constantly until Mane was (correctly) sent off. I doubt they would have kept a clean sheet if he hadn't TBH. They played Chelsea and Morata went off early doors - I doubt they would have come through that game having such little pressure put on them if he hadn't. So, there you have it - easy start, massive stroke of good fortune in two hardest games. More recently and separating from those games, they conceded two against Stoke, two penalties against Napoli at the Etihad, two against West Brom, Two against Napoli in Naples. Serious question, ignoring their early record, when was they last time we conceded goals so frequently?

    Making them favourites is fine. Personally, I think we are the second best team in the league. But we will improve as the season progresses, just as last season - and teams were pretty scared of facing us too (yea they might improve still more, too). And they have yet to face a heavy injury crisis, fatigue from fixture pile-up or recovering from a dispiriting defeat.It's all about opinions and yours is as valid as mine - but I still believe if we can position ourselves to be the team take advantage of any slip ups, there is plenty of time for those slip ups to occur.
     
  16. DCSPUR

    DCSPUR Well-Known Member

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    you need a bit of luck to win the title. Two years ago we had none with Leicester players having the season of their lives, no Europe and no pressure. A year ago Chelsea players because they downed tools the year before have the massive break of one game a week and no injuries of note.

    This year, with Citeh having the deeper squad and KDB having an incredible season so far, the breaks in matches have been going for them and against us AND the injuries more against us than them.....

    let's keep going and see if finally, we get the rub of the green when we need it in a title chase....it would be wonderful to win.
     
  17. Lighty64

    Lighty64 Glory Glory

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    Not having a go SP, and yes we have had an injury crisis and still up there, but at the moment we are 8pts adrift.

    yes Mike Dean could of given us a penalty v Swansea, but he never, just like Kane doesn't ever seem to score in August. last season we got a penalty v Swansea and went on to put 5 past them, but if your really honest, Alli dived to get that one.

    when we beat City last year, and deservedly so, it was the 7th match, in a week they had also drawn to Celtic in the CL, by the time we play them in December away from home, we both would of played 17 or 18 games, so we really need someone to spoil their momentum, because whether they have had a bit of luck so far, and we haven't, we are still 8pts a drift, and no guarantees our luck will change.

    we have also had a slice of luck just this weekend gone, our keeper and defence were MotM against C Palace, who had better chances and missed an open goal.


    I agree with attack being the best form of defence, and also agree our defence is stronger than theirs, but theirs is stronger this season, their keeper isn't Bravo.

    the 2nd goal that WBA came from a bad bit of defending, unfortunately they aren't having to defend too often.


    when they played Liverpool it was just like when we played them, a pretty open game, they could of conceded but they never and were 1-0 up when Mane got sent off, and made the extra man count. Not being funny but Conte made the error of playing defensive once Morata went off, but they where on top most of the game, just like we were v Chelsea, the only trouble is we haven't won at Stamford Bridge for 28yrs, we might have to this season.

    no point mentioning them conceding or giving penalties at home to Napoli, it won't make the slightest difference in the PL, and if they keep scoring 3-4-5-7 goals then conceding 2 won't hurt them. it will only hurt them if they fail to score at least 2 themselves.


    no they are at the moment the best team in the league, they are breaking teams down that park the bus, they are scoring for fun. 1 week they play Aguero up front, the next they play Jesus, the week after they play both. the only position they don't have enough cover is in defence, but other than that, they have a lot of strength and depth in their front 5.

    whatever luck they have had so far they have had it, but it doesn't mean it's not going to continue.

    our only real hope at the moment is to do the biz ourselves, and hope that they run out of steam, though it's only a few that are not being rotated or taken off after 70 mins, and the only other hope is picking up injuries, but with their squad, it needs to hit them with their back 5 and hope teams nick something when they do actually get forwards.

    however good they are though, at least we know we haven't had to rob an oilfield to do it.


    PS. had to answer this is the 2nd or 3rd time you have posted the same stuff, and no one is replying.
     
  18. shelfboy68

    shelfboy68 Well-Known Member

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    The main reason why we didn't win the league the two seasons you just mentioned was because we drew far too many games, double that of our rivals so our inability to win those games cost us.
    So far this season draws against Burnley and Swansea have not be good along with the two defeats have left us 8 pts behind which is quite a gap even at this early stage.
    I can't see us pulling that back along with city being so good and our injuries this year are ridiculous just can't keep clear for a few weeks.
     
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2017
  19. nasescoba1985

    nasescoba1985 Active Member

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    That Leicester city season still pisses me off to this day. Last season was annoying but I could hack it as Chelsea were clearly the best side and never looked like losing the league. How the fuck did those long ball merchants win that league that year ? I'm still convinced they were on drugs. Just seems funny how Leicester are now battling relegation in the seasons after. Kante surely is not the reason why they fell downhill? He's good but he's not the messiah. Only Spurs can have a league challenge ruined by a once in a life time Leicester fucking city!!!! Infuriates me that those ****s won it.
     
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  20. nasescoba1985

    nasescoba1985 Active Member

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    And that Leicester game at the lane where we battered them all game, only for them to get a winner with that sucker punch Huth header made me realise Leicester had the gods with them that season.... and the drugs
     
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