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Rafa van der Vaart

jonnyp

Well-Known Member
Jun 11, 2006
7,149
9,628
Thanks AVB...

EDIT: why the dislike rating? Someone's sarcasm meter broken?
 
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we_all_loved_freund

Well-Known Member
Apr 6, 2006
1,692
987
Rafa's side of this was covered in more detail a year or so back in another article....

When Sigurdsson was signed, Rafa was brought into AVB's office and told that Sig was number 1 for that position and Rafa should either leave or accept being back up ( direct quotes from Rafa ). To me, this highlighted the worst aspect of AVB's weaknesses, and one of Harry's mains strengths. AVB was young and inexperienced in understanding how to treat differing personalities to get the best out of them. Fair enough if Sig was number 1 in his own head but that didn't mean that this was the way to go about it with a veteran player of the squad who has some amount of pride through his previous experiences/clubs.. Rafa was our most experienced top level player, a beacon to the younger guys and represented many things that the fans loved. Anyone with an ability to read characters and understand roles should've known to treat Rafa with some respect and phrase things very differently imo. I'll take Rafa at his word because he has no reason to lie, so to me, AVB was extremely heavy fisted and obtuse in how he handled it.

If he'd said to Rafa '' We've brought in Sigurdsson, we really like him and think he will push you for your place, but we respect your role in this squad and what you've achieved and hope you can cement your place through performances'' I'm pretty damn sure Rafa's view on staying/going may have been very different. Furthermore, we know that Sig really didn't do much to cement his place, Dempsey was an ill fit, we struggled creatively and that if AVB had displayed some more nous that VDV could have been a very useful player for us in patches even with his flagging fitness.

AVB's belligerence, rigidity and lack of understanding the human aspects to a squad of players meant that players like this would be instantly ostricized if they weren't a shoe in in the starting lineup.

AVB wasn't stupid, he knew what the likely effect would be of his words. In my opinion, he didn't want big characters around the squad who had the respect of the dressing room as this would dilute his own influence. He seemed t be able to influence and motivate the younger less experienced guys but really struggled to persuade the older, more experienced, players that his footballing 'philosophy' was correct (probably because they could see it was a load of shit!?!).
 

TottenhamMattSpur

Well-Known Member
Aug 31, 2012
10,925
16,007
Tbf Rafa did also say "It was private things..." so the reason for him leaving wasn't soley down AVB.

As much as I loved Rafa he was pretty primadonna-ish to want to leave because AVB wouldn't guarantee him to be the main man. AVB had just taken over and was trying to run a meritocracy and considering Rafa's fitness and injury record I don't blame him for not wanting to rely on him. It wouldn't have sent out the right signals to the rest of the squad if he had made him automatic first choice.
Fair response.
I don't disagree that his fitness was always an issue. However there's ways of doing things.

On harry "I'd do anything for that man"
On AVB "What's his name? "

I think he'd have accepted a situation where he wouldn't play 90 minutes every game but had regular involvement.
But AVB is too one dimensional to incorporate anyone that way.
 

TwanYid

Well-Known Member
Aug 1, 2013
1,223
3,484
I didn't think it was possible for me to hate AVB any more than I do- but it is.

I hate him so fucking much it makes me shake.

Rafael Van der Vaart was my favorite Tottenham player of all time.

I hated AVB's appointment from the minute it happened- I was incensed that we'd gotten rid of Harry and was enraged that this slimy, know-it-all, non-playing little nerd was going to be our manager. The more I find out about his tenure with us the more my disgust grows.

God, how I despise that fucking weasel...

VdV would've stayed had our little piss-ant gaffer given him the respect he deserved.
 

dagraham

Well-Known Member
Sep 20, 2005
19,115
46,080
Fair response.
I don't disagree that his fitness was always an issue. However there's ways of doing things.

On harry "I'd do anything for that man"
On AVB "What's his name? "

I think he'd have accepted a situation where he wouldn't play 90 minutes every game but had regular involvement.
But AVB is too one dimensional to incorporate anyone that way.

Indeed. Could have had a meeting with the whole squad and shaken things up a bit by saying that everyone has to prove themselves and everyone has a chance if they impress in training. Having a private chat with one of your star players and telling him you're no longer number one seems an incredibly ham fisted way of shooting yourself in the foot.

Man management at its very worst.
 

jurgen

Busy ****
Jul 5, 2008
6,711
17,170
I didn't think it was possible for me to hate AVB any more than I do- but it is.

I hate him so fucking much it makes me shake.

Rafael Van der Vaart was my favorite Tottenham player of all time.

I hated AVB's appointment from the minute it happened- I was incensed that we'd gotten rid of Harry and was enraged that this slimy, know-it-all, non-playing little nerd was going to be our manager. The more I find out about his tenure with us the more my disgust grows.

God, how I despise that fucking weasel...

VdV would've stayed had our little piss-ant gaffer given him the respect he deserved.

Crikey!
 

TwanYid

Well-Known Member
Aug 1, 2013
1,223
3,484
Rafa's side of this was covered in more detail a year or so back in another article....

When Sigurdsson was signed, Rafa was brought into AVB's office and told that Sig was number 1 for that position and Rafa should either leave or accept being back up ( direct quotes from Rafa ). To me, this highlighted the worst aspect of AVB's weaknesses, and one of Harry's mains strengths. AVB was young and inexperienced in understanding how to treat differing personalities to get the best out of them. Fair enough if Sig was number 1 in his own head but that didn't mean that this was the way to go about it with a veteran player of the squad who has some amount of pride through his previous experiences/clubs.. Rafa was our most experienced top level player, a beacon to the younger guys and represented many things that the fans loved. Anyone with an ability to read characters and understand roles should've known to treat Rafa with some respect and phrase things very differently imo. I'll take Rafa at his word because he has no reason to lie, so to me, AVB was extremely heavy fisted and obtuse in how he handled it.

If he'd said to Rafa '' We've brought in Sigurdsson, we really like him and think he will push you for your place, but we respect your role in this squad and what you've achieved and hope you can cement your place through performances'' I'm pretty damn sure Rafa's view on staying/going may have been very different. Furthermore, we know that Sig really didn't do much to cement his place, Dempsey was an ill fit, we struggled creatively and that if AVB had displayed some more nous that VDV could have been a very useful player for us in patches even with his flagging fitness.

AVB's belligerence, rigidity and lack of understanding the human aspects to a squad of players meant that players like this would be instantly ostricized if they weren't a shoe in in the starting lineup.

I wish I could give two Winners for this.
 

TwanYid

Well-Known Member
Aug 1, 2013
1,223
3,484

Number one: I loved Rafael Van der Vaart like no other player I've seen play for us in my twenty years as a Tottenham supporter. my son's middle name is Rafael, FFS (done two weeks before the departure).

Number two: despite his obvious faults, I loved Harry as well. I was shaken to the core the minute he was fired and said- loudly and clearly- that this was the beginning of the end. (I TOTALLY acknowledge that Redknapp had a hand in the debacle- but I still blame Levy for not being above it all and doing what's best for the team and renewing his contract). Had Harry stayed I'm convinced we could've made the Champions League again- and no way on earth would we be "worse off" than we are today. I'd rather have Joey Barton than Roberto Soldado (if you get my drift).

To me, AVB represents what's wrong with Spurs: action when inaction is required, inaction when action is needed, being too smart by half, etc. I hated his appointment. I'm not saying I'm some kind of predictive genius, but believe me I was firmly, absolutely, definitely in the "no- please God- NO!"-camp when I heard we'd replaced Redknapp with him.

And hese new quotes from Van der Vaart just confirm my bias lol.
 
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Sp3akerboxxx

Adoption: Nabil Bentaleb
Apr 4, 2006
5,180
7,620
Hurry up and retire Rafa, so we can hire you in some capacity.

Quality player, but I mainly loved him for being a "big game" player.

The crunch. Rafa knew all about it.
 

sundanceyid10

Well-Known Member
Aug 22, 2013
3,379
8,319
AVB plays very dull football the home game against Hull just before he was sacked, was one of the worst I have sat through at WHL.
 

TottenhamMattSpur

Well-Known Member
Aug 31, 2012
10,925
16,007
AVB plays very dull football the home game against Hull just before he was sacked, was one of the worst I have sat through at WHL.
You and me both mate.
And the fact he slagged the fans off after.
The only interesting thing of note that night was that Harper was time wasting all match then a late penalty goes in and he wants to rush everything. Ball goes out for a hull goal kick and a cheeky spurs fan in the south stand wouldn't give him the ball back. He went mental.

Served the time wasting **** right.

Anyway, I digress.
Team Rafa all the way.
 

DaSpurs

Well-Known Member
Jan 20, 2013
11,816
13,655
AVB ripped apart the best team we'd had in decades, then lumbered us with a bunch of useless twats that we're still struggling to get rid of.

Quoted for fucking truth.

I can't even handle seeing vids of that team anymore. Just why in the fuck it and its style was so deliberately decimated is utterly beyond my reasoning capacity.
 

TottenhamMattSpur

Well-Known Member
Aug 31, 2012
10,925
16,007
I think it says a lot about Daniel levy that he ever got through a single interview.
He had less charisma than Tyson Fury's cacks.

I think Poch may go the same way. Although at least he likes using youth players. Levy will see the pound signs every time one of the Yoof lace their boots up.
 

Mr Pink

SC Supporter
Aug 25, 2010
54,773
99,336
Also interesting Rafa mentions Lennon as one of the instrumental players he remembers in that side.

I've always felt there was too much Lennon criticism. He played a massive part in terms of the good times in recent years.

Yeah he's not the same now, but he was good for sometime despite what many say.
 

eViL

Oliver Skipp's Dad
May 15, 2004
5,840
7,960
Legs had gone.

AVB told him he wouldn't be an automatic starter, not that he wanted him out - AVB's system is based around possession and impact players like Bale and VDV.

VDV made the choice by his own admission in this article but some of you only want to comment on what you want to read.
 

amathews3416

Well-Known Member
Mar 3, 2008
1,696
6,110
We got around a 9 million fee for a player who was clearly deteriorating and if we would have held onto probably would have gone for peanuts or on a free later on. I loved VDV, but for the price Hamburg was offering it was probably a smart business decision to get rid, especially when you consider the style of play of AVB and where VDV would have fit in.
 

HildoSpur

Likes Erik Lamela, deal with it.
Oct 1, 2005
8,958
28,085
I loved Rafa, was a fabulous player for us and a bit of a hero.
 

dorsetyid

Well-Known Member
Aug 12, 2007
189
457
Never felt more confident in a player than Rafa when we needed someone to step up, doubt we will have a player quite like him for a while.

I hate remembering that we had an outstanding team a few years back
 

fuzzylogic

Well-Known Member
Aug 2, 2004
4,741
9,098
Loved vdv, I had his name on the back of the home top at the time. Was devastated when I washed it in the washing machine and it got stuck on the door and ripped! Felt the same the day we sold him

Morale of the story, dont do the washing half jaked. Or get someone else to do if for you.
 
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