What's new

Raheem Sterling: Manchester City winger is targeted by racism, says Ian Wright

heelspurs

Le filet mignon est un bastion de rosbif
Jul 25, 2012
4,270
5,105
@DJS is truly one of the nicest guys on this forum,
That may indeed be true and I'm sure he is happy for your support. However, no one made a statement to the contrary.

no need to be attacking his character.
As for this, if your reply was indeed for me, could you please show me where in my posts I attacked his character?
 

Paolo10

Well-Known Member
Apr 6, 2004
6,179
7,621
Is it not because he's a bit of a dickhead rather than a black dickhead?

Know someone that knew him at QPR, thought he was phenomenally talented but also an arsehole.
 

Maxtremist

Well-Known Member
Jun 11, 2014
1,530
3,300
Is it not because he's a bit of a dickhead rather than a black dickhead?

Know someone that knew him at QPR, thought he was phenomenally talented but also an arsehole.

If people in the media were calling him a dickhead then sure, but that doesn't seem to be the case. They're talking about other parts of his character ad nauseam.

In the same way that, if he were a dickhead, how many other dickheads are there in the league? Why are they not getting the same attention? You'd think that of the England squad that Sterling was the only dickhead and that he's constantly acting like one though there's nothing that currently suggests this.
 

Paolo10

Well-Known Member
Apr 6, 2004
6,179
7,621
He's in the public eye.

I'm only giving the little insight I have into what his character was like as a kid from someone who was at QPR with him for a short time.

You can be talented without acting like a dickhead. I'm not sure he gets any more or less grief about his actions because of his race tbh.
 

Maxtremist

Well-Known Member
Jun 11, 2014
1,530
3,300
He's in the public eye.

I'm only giving the little insight I have into what his character was like as a kid from someone who was at QPR with him for a short time.

You can be talented without acting like a dickhead. I'm not sure he gets any more or less grief about his actions because of his race tbh.

This is literally the point we're debating/talking about though. I'm of the opinion that he does get a lot more grief and media attention due to his race. The articles and think pieces etc... they write about him seem excessive. As previously mentioned, it's not even like he's doing Balotelli style antics or anything like that and yet he still gets how much written about him. It doesn't match up with how he seems to be living life and how other footballers live their life and whilst I'm not saying race is the ONLY factor, I certainly believe it's part of the factor.

It's worth seeing this as it contains a links to a few of the weird write ups he's had made about him over his career:
https://www.theguardian.com/footbal...9/raheem-sterling-tabloid-snobbery-gun-tattoo

Also worth seeing what Kick It Out have been saying too:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/45196259
 

mancman

Well-Known Member
Aug 24, 2006
363
688
Here's the thing, if it was JUST people criticising Sterling for his football then that would be fair. He has underperformed for England, no-one is really denying that. There's a potential argument to be made that he does help the team as he stretches defences and all that but he has underperformed for England and deserves criticism there.

What Ian Wright and others are alluding to though is the constant criticism for Sterling. From him getting the tattoo to him and being a father to him buying clothes from primark to him buying his mother a house etc... so much of his life and character away from the football pitch is brought up and that's where we see the levels of racism. No other footballers seem to be criticised that much or talked about and targeted that much for their lives without doing anything wrong like Sterling does.

Sterling is too tight because he buys clothes from Primark sometimes, cause he's eating something from Greggs, cause he's taking a cheap EasyJet flight, but then he's a scoundrel for buying his mother a nice house and sink and has bought a nice car. He gets an insane amount of unfair treatment by the media which is not respresentive of how he acts off the pitch and that is what Ian Wright and others (myself very much included) are calling racist.

TLDR: Criticising his football, fine. Fully deserved. The constant character assassination side of things? Racist undertones at the very least.
I understand your argument but disagree. I remember the media going after Bobby Robson and Graham Taylor in the most awful and personal manner. These so called journalists/people were scumbags as are the people who go after Raheem. They are not racists just very unpleasant people. Again I will repeat that if Raheem scores 30 goals in his next 30 internationals and we win the European Championship then he will be treated as the second coming!
 

Paolo10

Well-Known Member
Apr 6, 2004
6,179
7,621
How many other players do you see getting a gun tattoo (regardless of the 'reasoning' behind it), snapchatting their wealth (leaked by someone), shopping in Primark, flying Easyjet etc.

Either he's particularly thrifty with his multiple millions or it's almost like he wants the attention to a degree.

If a young, high-profile, white English player did half of the same things, I do think they'd be all over the papers too.

Maybe he sells more papers because Liverpool fans hate him?
 

Maxtremist

Well-Known Member
Jun 11, 2014
1,530
3,300
I understand your argument but disagree. I remember the media going after Bobby Robson and Graham Taylor in the most awful and personal manner. These so called journalists/people were scumbags as are the people who go after Raheem. They are not racists just very unpleasant people. Again I will repeat that if Raheem scores 30 goals in his next 30 internationals and we win the European Championship then he will be treated as the second coming!

I disagree but this is where we start to go into a whole debate about how far you wanna go with racism which is not needed and all that. What I will say is I'm not saying the media or these people are racist. I am saying there are racial tones to their constant critiquing of him as opposed to others.

As for the whole Raheem scoring 30 goals thing, whilst true to a point it's that annoyance that myself and a lot of black men feel in that we have to prove that we're good enough to stop the criticism and get the acceptance.

End of the day from how I see it presented it feels like there's at least undercurrents of racism in how he's handled in the media which he only is able to push away if he performs well which I think is an unfair standard to be holding him too.
 

southlondonyiddo

My eyes have seen some of the glory..
Nov 8, 2004
12,599
15,012
For me there are 2 factors

Institutionalised racism and the fact that he had the audacity to kick up a fuss and want to leave one of are big 2 clubs in England

He did as well if not better than most in the WC yet got absolutely slaughtered
 

Maxtremist

Well-Known Member
Jun 11, 2014
1,530
3,300
How many other players do you see getting a gun tattoo (regardless of the 'reasoning' behind it), snapchatting their wealth (leaked by someone), shopping in Primark, flying Easyjet etc.

Either he's particularly thrifty with his multiple millions or it's almost like he wants the attention to a degree.

If a young, high-profile, white English player did half of the same things, I do think they'd be all over the papers too.

Maybe he sells more papers because Liverpool fans hate him?

What's the big deal with him shopping in Primark and flying Easyjet etc... like literally why does it matter how he spends his money? He earned the money, he can spend it how he wants to. Why does him going to Primark need an article written about it? So he might like to save a few quid... so what? The gun tattoo is a whole other debate but he explained his reasons (which I personally am fine with).

Part of this as well is that the other young-high profile english players are out there living their life and the media aren't writing about them at all. They're choosing to focus on Sterling and I think at least PART of that is due to race. I'm not saying how big a part of that it's solely because of that but I personally believe PART of it is.

There are other factors, sure. His poor England performances, the Liverpool media bias etc... but in accepting that they are part of the factors built into this, I think his race plays another factor into this as well and the stereotypes some members of the media place on young black stars and the black community in general.
 

heelspurs

Le filet mignon est un bastion de rosbif
Jul 25, 2012
4,270
5,105
Know someone that knew him at QPR, thought he was phenomenally talented but also an arsehole.
My question would be do you often take people's second hand opinion as fact? Additionally, he left QPR as a 15 or 16 year old and seeing as that is very young do you find it wise to tarnish a person's entire life with the impressions of someone else when you cannot, for the life of you, determine their motivations? Could your presumably QPR-loving friend have been upset due to Sterling's impending decision to leave his beloved club?

You can be talented without acting like a dickhead.
This is absolutely true and I am sure we would all prefer players to comport themselves like our Harry ('s' in our case). But your friend's assessment of a teenage Sterling notwithstanding can you point to an incident, witnessed or reported, wherein Sterling has acted like a 'dickhead'?
 

Paolo10

Well-Known Member
Apr 6, 2004
6,179
7,621
Do I hold someone I've know for a long time's opinion in high regard? Yes.

He was a player at QPR, not a fan. He also thought Taraabt was similarly talented and also a dickhead and he's not black.

Personally I don't give a fuck about Raheem, but there you go.
 

Paolo10

Well-Known Member
Apr 6, 2004
6,179
7,621
Also, if you're a famous multi-millionaire and you shop in Primark or fly Easyjet, then there's a very high possibility it will be recorded by someone and potentially be a news story.
 

mancman

Well-Known Member
Aug 24, 2006
363
688
I disagree but this is where we start to go into a whole debate about how far you wanna go with racism which is not needed and all that. What I will say is I'm not saying the media or these people are racist. I am saying there are racial tones to their constant critiquing of him as opposed to others.

As for the whole Raheem scoring 30 goals thing, whilst true to a point it's that annoyance that myself and a lot of black men feel in that we have to prove that we're good enough to stop the criticism and get the acceptance.

End of the day from how I see it presented it feels like there's at least undercurrents of racism in how he's handled in the media which he only is able to push away if he performs well which I think is an unfair standard to be holding him too.
Again I sympathise with your argument but (given that footballers are paid tonnes of dosh) if I think that Sissoko is crap I am a racist? Just don't like the easy use of labels , like racism, that stops or blocks all discussion. I don't see colour I just see ability or lack of it.
 

KILLA_SIN

Well-Known Member
May 24, 2008
7,813
14,455
Again I sympathise with your argument but (given that footballers are paid tonnes of dosh) if I think that Sissoko is crap I am a racist? Just don't like the easy use of labels , like racism, that stops or blocks all discussion. I don't see colour I just see ability or lack of it.

Not everyone is like you though are they? Some people are racist, yes it does exist in England in 2018, but you can't go out and call someone a black expletive because their young and rich and you don't like it, so you do it more insidiously. People that are racist in the 70/80/90's didn't go away they just do it differently now.
 

Maxtremist

Well-Known Member
Jun 11, 2014
1,530
3,300
Again I sympathise with your argument but (given that footballers are paid tonnes of dosh) if I think that Sissoko is crap I am a racist? Just don't like the easy use of labels , like racism, that stops or blocks all discussion. I don't see colour I just see ability or lack of it.

This is what I'm saying though. Criticising him as a player is completely fine. I do that. He doesn't always perform and on the international stage leaves a lot to be desired. That is completely fine.

What I'm arguing/talking about is why we need to know about him going to Primark and Greggs and Easyjet and all of the uproar about the Tattoo and the stuff he does away from the football pitch. That is what doesn't seem to add up. He's just living his life and not doing anything that bad or terrible but seems to have a new piece about him on a regular basis and it doesn't add up/reflect to what he's doing, especially when you compare it to other players.
 

Maxtremist

Well-Known Member
Jun 11, 2014
1,530
3,300
Also, if you're a famous multi-millionaire and you shop in Primark or fly Easyjet, then there's a very high possibility it will be recorded by someone and potentially be a news story.

But why though? You've not answered that? Why does it matter where or how he shops with the money he's earned from being good at football?

Why are we hearing about both him going to Primark and also him fixing his mum's sink? Why do we not hear that about Jordan Henderson or Gary Cahill or Jordan Pickford?

If Sterling was sleeping with a different hooker every night whilst setting off fireworks whilst smoking etc... I'd understand the attention but from the sound of things he's living a relatively normal life and yet it gets talked about more than most and in a disparaging way
 

Paolo10

Well-Known Member
Apr 6, 2004
6,179
7,621
Why? Because rich people don't need to shop at Poundland or fly Easyjet.

Regardless of him being black, if anyone rich and famous is spotted in fucking Poundland, it's making a tabloid and also bring recorded by ordinary people who have to shop there/fly Easyjet to be able to afford what they want.

If I was in his position and didn't want to be in these type of stories, I'd avoid doing the same things.
 

heelspurs

Le filet mignon est un bastion de rosbif
Jul 25, 2012
4,270
5,105
Do I hold someone I've know for a long time's opinion in high regard? Yes.
Fair enough I guess. If you feel that your friend's opinion has the forecasting ability to know how Sterling is 10 years after he last 'knew' him then that's your decision. I would really love to have seen you and your friend's behavior at that age. Would it be safe to assume that you are the same now? What would people have said about your then and would you like to be limited to that now?

He was a player at QPR, not a fan.
I'm sorry but are you saying your friend was an academy player there as well? If so, you are saying that a fellow competitor that Raheem Sterling, the jewel of QPR's academy, probably shit on everyday of the week thought that Sterling was in fact a dickhead. Can you not conceive of any less than reasonable motivation behind your friend's assessment? Is your friend flipping burgers or is he starring for a top 6 team raking in loads of dosh right now? And this is the 'highly regarded' opinion that you are indeed offering up as defence of the journalistic shellacking that Sterling takes?

He also thought Taraabt was similarly talented and also a dickhead and he's not black.
But he is African and not 'white English' so I would safely say that'll do. The most important thing is the 'other' here, anything other than 'white English'. So, two players significantly better than your friend are dickheads as per said friend and you cannot see how his assessment could be fraught with confounding factors?

Personally I don't give a fuck about Raheem, but there you go.
While that may be you did give enough fucks to come in and blithely dismiss the possibility that racism plays a part in his treatment. So there you go.
 

Paolo10

Well-Known Member
Apr 6, 2004
6,179
7,621
How talented they are as footballers has nothing to do with their characters and there's no jealously whatsoever, if you're so upset about Sterling's treatment complain to the fucking PCC.

You asked why he gets a hard time, maybe it's because he's a dick? Maybe its because he wasn't born in England, maybe it's because it sells papers.
 
Top