Match Ratings Ratings vs Liverpool

[kaz Hirai]

Odds that motd will make it look like Liverpool were superior and robbed?

 

[theShiznit]

Odds that motd will make it look like Liverpool were superior and robbed?

Probably go against everything that's been said and say neither were penalties.

We were far more on top of them second half than they were on top first half.

The players and fans were beaten until Kane's miss lifted them.

 

[kaz Hirai]

Probably go against everything that's been said and say neither were penalties.

We were far more on top of them second half than they were on top first half.

The players and fans were beaten until Kane's miss lifted them.

Lamela kicked Full whack in the nut sack and it's a contentious call

 

[theShiznit]

Lamela kicked Full whack in the nut sack and it's a contentious call

Well it does what it says on the tin, if you sign virgil van Dick kicker you're asking for trouble...

 

[Mr Pink]

Dear me, analysis on MOTD is appalling.

 

[Mr Pink]

Jenas saying draw a fair result. Fuckin hell JJ, just saying that because that twat lawerenson is on.

That said Merson predicted 2-2 lol

 

[theShiznit]

I think we're in the wrong thread boys...

 

[King of Otters]

Totally disagree on the Salah goal, when the guy is jinking in and out with that much pace and power it's almost impossible to anticipate what he's going to do next, Vertonghen guessed wrong but it was a 50-50 chance whether Salah was going to cut in or push further into the area. Sometimes you have to appreciate the brilliance of the goal, not pick apart the defensive decisions.

Verts main concern should have been keeping that jinking little fucker away from our goal, not preventing him from laying it off, which was how he positioned his body.

Jan let him clear through on goal without even laying so much as an arm on him. It was a clear defensive mistake.

 

[The Apprentice]

I’m really not sure what Lloris was doing with either goal.

 

[danielneeds]

Agree with this. I haven't been this pissed off since Hazard's goal in the 2-2 title fucker.

That was worse, because he was outside the area and should have been taken out! Lol.

 

[Cravenspurs]

To be fair he probably won't hit a ball like that again for the rest of his career. Dier had a good game and was one of the only players looking to try and take some sort of control of the game when we were shaky in the first half.

My thoughts have zero to do with the goal. All based on complete ability. I kindly disagree with you on the last bit too. How putting your team under pressure with silly passes and the inability to dribble out of danger is putting the pressure on the other team is beyond me.

 

[Bulletspur]

To be fair he probably won't hit a ball like that again for the rest of his career. Dier had a good game and was one of the only players looking to try and take some sort of control of the game when we were shaky in the first half.

You are joking right?

Yep. I'm glad you said before I did, but FFS he's got to show more ambition on the ball. I know he's still young and I know he's new to the EPL, but there must be some other reason we bought him for that much money other than the fact he passes sideways and back to the goalie well.

Rubbish. I agree Sanchez had a mare and was rightly subbed, but to suggest in previous games he is a backward and sideway merchant is just plainly not true. One of his greater attributes (before this game) was how quickly he turned defending a position into an attacking one. Your assessment of him is so not true.

 

[Luka Van der Bale]

I'm scared to grade today's performance, I think if I do, I'll have the whole message board after me...!

Basically, we stunk.

You’re joking.

I’ve never seen a team do to them at Anfield what we did second half. They couldn’t get a touch. We started messily but once we got a foothold that was a really, really impressive display.

 

[coys200]

Amazing if you compare the stats to last season from the game. Sounds odd to say because we are 5 th. But honestly believe we are a much better team this season than last. 2nd half we had 70% of the ball. I very much doubt anyone has done that to Liverpool in a half at Anfield. And overall 67% City only had 64%.

 

[Hazardousman]

Well that took us through the full smorgasbord of emotions didn't it. Anger, hope, elation, despair, relief and then finally, for me, sadness. Sadness that but for a little bit of tactical savvy, we should have won that game.


I know the last hour of that game we played well, can take positives, but the problem is, we all knew how the first 30 minutes of that game were going to go, it's a well rehearsed script that has found us floundering before. And I believe Poch sent us out ill prepared for the inevitable.

I'm not buying into the total criticism of Poch's away at top4 form. Away results of most of the top teams is not great against other top teams. That's hardly surprising, you are away at top teams, they are the hardest games you will play. And generally speaking our performances have been fair to good at the Chelsea's, ManU's, Arsenal's under Poch. But Liverpool (and Guardiola's City) are very different propositions now, and Poch must adjust IMO.

I'm beginning to concur with a theory proposed by @heelspurs in the match thread, that the home game tactical pragmatism that dismantled Liverpool so ruthlessly was maybe accidental, because Poch hasn't used it since, specifically against the two away opponents for whom it would be best used, ManC and Liverpool. Even worse for me was that Pochettino not only didn't adjust to this very tactically specific opponent, he actually made things worse by playing the daft ManC 442 semi diamond which just seemed to confuse our players more than theirs. To add to this he played the high line with Dier and Dembele in midfield, two players that really hate to be pressed, two players that do not dynamically, metronomically keep ticking, keep offering options for defenders under intense press. Where Liverpool were already suffocating the middle, and Kane was struggling for oygen,he added another body in there to suck up more in Son, a player who is a gold medal bumbler when he's put under this kind of pressure.

You know Liverpool will play a 433. You know they will fly out the traps. You know early on they will sucker you into playing the first ball out of defensive then swarm. They do this week after week after week and worse, they have done it to us before. As a result of this, and Poch's initial set up, we spent the first 20 minutes unable to string three passes together. The ball would go to the first defender, then the swarm, Dier put on his invisibility cloak, Dembele tried but was constantly getting caught taking too many touches, not helped by the fact that because of Poch's shape shift, nobody was in their usual place, and on the handful of times the ball managed to actually find it's way all the way to Kane or Son, they just choked on it and coughed it up.

I just don't understand why this seems to catch Poch out every time. Start the game ten yards deeper, maybe even play the 3CB to start (Dier can step out later if we want to switch to a more possession based game when Liverpool tire), make us wider, harder to get behind, play Eriksen in a CM3 to start with (like Dier, he can be pushed further up as the game changes if necessary) with Wanyama and Dembele or Winks. Start more pragmatically, don't try to play tippy tappy out of defence for the first 20 minutes, play on the counter, or even bypass the press and hit Kane, break their press gradually, then adjust as the game develops. If we get a goal on the counter we keep it up and keep suckering them on (like we did in the home game or against RM), if nobody scores and they start to tire of the press, we can begin to adjust to our normal game, eventually even pressing them higher and pushing up ourselves.

The worse thing that can happen did. We fell into the trap they set, as we have before, got flustered into fucking it over on the press and they go a goal up. You now know that whatever happens, no matter how well we play, we will have to come out and make ourselves more vulnerable, and even if we play really well, we will have to eposes ourselves somewhat. Just as we did to United last week, or to Liverpool in the home game.

The last 20 minutes of the first half we started to settle, Davis's tenacity and Vertonghen,Trippier, Eriksen and Dembele's composure started to help us get on top, a superiority we extended considerably in the second half.

Just as the first half was a combination of our ineptitude as much as it was Liverpool's efficiency, the second reversed. We were so much more assertive second half, but part fo that was that Liveprool's plan was to sit back, be more pragmatic, suck us in and hit us with their speedy break merchants, the way they love to do. The good news is that we are a better team than most they play, and they are not good enough defensively to do that every week and get away with it.

As much as we were good in the second half, I still don't really know why Poch persevered with the 2 up front centrally, it didn't help us at all, there was no Son inverting to create space for Davies to overlap into, he's so much better cutting in off that left side, running at the RB.

Eventually we got what we deserved, and I don't think I've screamed a goal home like Wanyama's thunder bastard since Stalteri's winner at Upton Park. It was that combination of immense frustration build up in the gut, we were comprehensively outplaying our closest rival in a three pointer at their place, but nothing was rolling our way, we still couldn't seem to create a good chance, then booooooomm. The mother load of footballing tension released.

Their now seemed like only one team would win this game, and when we got that penalty it looked like we were going to get what we deserved. Kane had had a poor game and this penalty capped off what had gone before. It was poorly hit, down the middle but too hard and low to give the keeper time to dive out of the way.

And just when you think things can't get worse than being cruelly denied such a valuable and rare win away at a big rival, they do. Fat middle eastern Messi goes and dances through our whole defence and still has the composure to dink the Limp Lloris biscuit. By this point I'd hit defcon 10 on the footballing despair-ometre, kicked the poof across the room (and this is not a bean bag poof, but one of those faux leather clad wooden things) launched the remote venomously into the sofa, from which it bounced across the room, sending the dog scuttling to hide behind Mrs BC in the kitchen, leaving me to incoherently try to assemble words like wankers, jammy, Scouse, ****s, fucking, bollocks, unbelievable into some kind of sentence.

Then the unbelievable happened. The best linesman in the world ever. Overruling the ref to give a justified penalty with 50,000 screeching Scouse baboons at his back was correct, but exceedingly brave. I don't even know what his name is, but I salute you Mr. Linesman.

Relief was palpable but swiftly followed by sadness. Because overall, despite his initial tactical faux pas, this was a game that we deserved to win, not handsomely, but definitely. We were bad for 20 minutes, tolerable for 25, largely excellent for 45.

I love what Poichettino has brought to this club. There is no questioning our bollocks and bottle any more, we play he best brand of football we have for half a century or more, and everything good about us is at his instigation, but I just wish he could show a tiny bit more savvy on occasions like this. He's very honourable, I just wonder if he's a cunning enough bastard at times.

Individual

Lloris - Piss poor. What the fuck he is doing on that first goal is anyone's guess. He actually steps backwards as Salah advances, giving him the whole goal to aim at, it's utterly baffling. Second goal I'm ambivalent about.

Trippier - This wasn't his best game I forward areas, Liverpool worked incredibly hard at preventing balls coming in, but only Dembele saw more ball and completed more passes today. His composure under the press helped us gradually get a foothold.

Sanchez - Let's not dress this up, the boy had a bit of a mare. This was the ManC game all over again, wrong set, voracious early pressing exposed him badly, and he didn't cope brilliantly. Made several poor clearances/passes.

Vertonghen - Luckily for Sanchez, Vertonghen stayed composed. Outstanding game.

Davies - Loved his tenacity first half, it was his commitment that helped galvanise us that first half.

Dier - Really poor first 45. When the going got hectic, he went awol, but not before handing them a lead with a timid tippy toe. Games like this just don't suit him. To fast, to furious.

Dembele - First 20 minutes was tough, but at least he didn't hide. He did keep taking a touch too many though. After the first 20 he was pretty composed and had a decent last hour.

Eriksen - Like other, found that first 20 tough, but gradually got to grips with things and was good for an hour.

Alli - I actually thought he worked hard again today and contributed. Yes, he's not as sure footed as some, but he's not hiding anymore, he's more involved generally, he's improving as player, even if his productivity is down.

Son - Another pretty erratic and ineffective knock today. I don't think this role suits him, operating centrally in the congestion of a game like this just doesn't give him the time and space he needs to get the fucking thing under control. Once he has control he can be devastating, but if he can't make that first leap - to control - he's next to useless and often more of a hindrance.

Kane - This was about as insipid a game as I've seen from Kane. Barely touched the ball, made about 5 passes all game, first penalty was poor - to fast to give the keeper time to get out of the way if he was deliberately going down the middle, but what happened next just epitomises Kane's whole "Kane-ness". Undaunted, dusts himself off and coolly slots home the equaliser under the most immense of pressure.

I want you to know, I only come into this thread for your ratings BC, I just love reading your thoughts on the game, which are, imo, more often than not completely accurate.

The part in bold however had me laughing out loud like some sort of deranged hyena, I even shed a tear of laughter because it was essentially my exact reaction, I smashed by face into a pillow and threw out a wide variety of insults, many starting with the word “scouse” and ending with the word “****”

Top post mate.

 

[dannythomas]

After a shocking first 20 minutes we actually played extremely well , especially in the second half. But how anyone could be anything else than “ over the moon “ after we snatched a point to shove Klopp’s victory celebrations up his Arse is beyond me. To respond after Kane’s miss and after Salah’s Messi style goal with only 2 minutes of injury time remaining is a cause for joy, not for fury. Yes, Kane missed . Was the first one a penalty ? No, it was offside. Was the second one a penalty ? Debatable. Kane showed real guts to calmly put it away after the first poor effort.

You can criticize a few of our players. Dier is a good back up central defender and a mediocre midfielder. Disastrous mistake.. Sanchez really looks shaky of late and thank God Toby is back and hopefully ready. Son was ineffective but he does occupy defenders even when not at his best. Lloris could maybe have done better with the first goal.

But on the positive side Davies is improving all the time and justifiably first choice. Dembele has really recovered his mojo in the past 2 fine performances, Eriksen continues to keep things ticking over and Vertonghen is a contender for player of the season.

But the biggest single player plus for me was THAT goal from Wanyama. That one moment is going to give him huge belief
And let’s have him back as a regular first choice . Not Dier . And of course we have Moura, Toby and Winks to give us that extra impetus to take us ahead of Liverpool and Chelsea.

Momentum is a great thing . Let’s keep it going in the NLD. They have replaced a want away Sanchez and one dimensional Giroud with real quality in Mkhitarian and Aubamayang and a newly committed Ozil. It’s going to be tough and we are going to have to stand up and be counted as we did today and during the week.

I’m giving MOTM to Wanyama for that one second of sheer brilliance.

 

[Flashspur]

Gutted. I thought we had this and should have won deservedly.

Even though we played poorly in the first half I think it was primarily because we were slightly overawed by the occasion and the early Salah goal was a sucker punch. The lads need a dose of self belief. They didn't trouble us after that when we grew into the game, until that cluster fuck that allowed the Egyptian to score a second time. Why did we hesitate because he put his hand up? Oldest con in the book. Play the ball not the foul.

I thought Dembele, Son, Dele and Davies were outstanding. On balance I think the Welshman deserves it. Everyone keeps talking about Verts but he had a shit game after some good performances lately, misjudging the header that Firmino got onto and getting turned by Salah on a number of occasions. Sanchez got owned a few times. Not a good performance at all but this the baptism of fire that lad needs to advance. Inconsistent performances all round by Lloris, Dier who looked better in defence and Kane who looks tired.

All in all though I have to say I am so proud of the lads. They pulled themselves back from the abyss in the cauldron that is the Kop and did us proud. Not many teams recover at Anfield to a 3 minute goal. We played the better football. Dele was so impressive in the center when he switched with Eriksen and Lamela and Vic put in some serious cameos. Its looking good. We seem to be getting our mojo back. COYS!!

Loved the gurner king's activities on the sidelines, it was all grimacing and gesticulating to no avail. It was comedy gold. Don't mess with the Spurs or you'll be sorry

 

[Phomesy]

I’m really not sure what Lloris was doing with either goal.

Not sure he did anything wrong with either tbh

 

[Dillspur]

Not sure he did anything wrong with either tbh

I feel like he went to ground early for the 2nd, had he stayed on his feel and made himself big he probably would have taken a shot in the face

 

[guiltyparty]

Jenas saying draw a fair result. Fuckin hell JJ, just saying that because that twat lawerenson is on.

That said Merson predicted 2-2 lol

It was a fair result.