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Ratings vs Palace

MOM

  • Lloris

  • Dier

  • Fazio

  • Verts

  • Davies

  • Lamela

  • Bentaleb

  • Mason

  • Eriksen

  • Kane

  • Soldado

  • Chadli

  • Paulinho

  • Lennon

  • Undecided


Results are only viewable after voting.

davidmatzdorf

Front Page Gadfly
Jun 7, 2004
18,106
45,030
Lloris - 7.5 - the usual dodgy distribution, but a very good display and saved us a point.

Dier - 5.5 - struggled with Bolasie throughout - I've given him an extra half point just because he's playing out of position

Fazio - 8 - MotM - a real Dawson-esque display, in the best sense, but without the slowness - uncountable clearing headers, good positioning, a growing partnership with Vertonghen and, for a change, no brain-farts

Vertonghen - 7 - solid and aware - starting to look comfortable with Fazio

Davies - 7 - in the past few matches, we are seeing why people rate him - he's not lightning quick, but he does get up into position to cross and he's a very reliable defender, except for a tendency to drift inside at inopportune moments

Lamela - 4.5 - the main culprit for our first half problems - constantly overelaborating, repeatedly losing the ball, causing virtually every move he was involved in to break down - made one really good tackle, but otherwise entirely ineffective

Bentaleb - 5.5 - not a good show from our central midfield, who failed to control the game except for about 15 minutes in the second half - Bentaleb was reasonably creative, but poor at ball retention - and he wants shooting himself for shooting wildly from near the centre circle when half of the Spurs team were approaching the penalty box

Mason - 5 - a vague and unconvincing display also from Mason - we just couldn't keep the ball when in possession

Eriksen - 6.5 - our best player in the first half, faded after half time

Kane - 5.5 - did not impose himself on the game

Soldado - 5.5 - some decent team play, but yet again did not get any of his three good chances on target


Chadli - 6 - the right substitution, but did not make the expected impact

Paulinho - 6 - he has played much more convincingly in his past 3-4 appearances, but this time did not drastically affect the match

Lennon - 6 - OK, did what he was there to do

It was a crap football match and we were the worse team. Palace had many more chances, but we arguably created better chances.

It's yet another example of how we can only play convincing football when the other team permits us to do so by playing an open game themselves (Everton, Chelsea) and cannot cope when the opposition packs he defence, closes down vigorously in midfield and shows a bit of pace.

Fortunately, Palace's problems with finishing persist. I thought Bolasie was the best player on the pitch by some distance.
 
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Lufti

Well-Known Member
Jan 3, 2013
7,994
16,635
add Vertonghen, Eriksen, and Chadli to the good list IMHO.

Fazio had his best game to date as a Spurs player. Lloris saved their arses yet again and was MotM.

2 positives:

1- clean sheet
2- only 5 points from 3rd place in the premier league (somehow...)

Steady on. I mean we were playing Palace at home let's not forget, and Eriksen and Chadli created very few chances and struggled to have any significant impact on the game. I don't think you can say they had 'good games', Chadli in particular was anonymous
 

Flashspur

Well-Known Member
Jul 28, 2012
6,882
9,068
it was dire and the games come thick and fast now - no excuses of tiredness from here on in - everyone else is tired too.

I thought the whole team was dire. Some individuals shone better than others but no one played for the team and it seemed like 11 players out there looking for a white shirt because that is what you do. As for cohesion, playing as a team etc they feel like foreign concepts right now. Fazio is my MOM because he stuck his neck out and looked as if he cared. Lloris as usual back to making those great saves when needed after the clusterf*ck that was Chelsea. The rest were kind of meh! Christ, with all these lads feeling tired isn't it time we tried a few youngsters? They couldn't be much worse could they?
 

sim0n

King of Prussia
Jan 29, 2005
7,947
2,151
Steady on. I mean we were playing Palace at home let's not forget, and Eriksen and Chadli created very few chances and struggled to have any significant impact on the game. I don't think you can say they had 'good games', Chadli in particular was anonymous

Well, given the flip of the coin options of "good" or "bad" in your first post, then they lean closer to good IMHO. So, I think it unfair that you claim they had a "bad game." No big deal really. And I do not think there is any advantage for Spurs when playing at home this season, sad to say...

I think we agree on the other more obvious bad performances yesterday ;)(y)
 

Mr Pink

SC Supporter
Aug 25, 2010
54,770
99,331
What would your side have been Pinky? Is Poch coming up short?



JH what's your assessment of the game?

I think he handled this week badly in terms of changes. I wouldn't of played Kane, Eriksen and Bentaleb against Chelsea..perhaps leaving out Mason to. In addition to Lennon, those lot put in a big effort against Everton.

I would of mixed it up with most of the aforementioned on the bench against Chelsea and had we still been in the game after an hour I would of looked to maybe introduce a few of them then.

I would of kept the defense largely the same, but I definitely would of brought in Dembele, Paulinho, Chadli etc mid week against Chelsea. And Stambouli would of been a cert for me to.

I really liked what we saw against Everton so I'm putting yesterday down to fatigue but Pochettino didn't help himself one bit with the way he managed the week IMO.

We now know some of these players are capable, collectively, of applying what he wants. Lets see how we do against Swansea and Burnley. I want to see more of what we saw against Everton in the next two league games. and I sincerely hope he leaves at least half dozen of them at home this week.
 
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alamo

Don't worry be happy
Jun 10, 2004
5,047
7,226
Hugo 9
Fazio 9 (really liking him now)
Crossbar 10
Lamela disappointing

Jaded effort in all. Still had the occasional good attempt but palace will rightly feel hard done by with just a point.
 

Bus-Conductor

SC Supporter
Oct 19, 2004
39,837
50,713
I'm away this weekend so didn't go. From what I saw we were lucky to get a point. More in depth than that it was the usual lack of width and guile/intelligence once we got in their defensive third.

Every time we have a decent result and performance we get the ' Poch is great, we're starting to see the signs, that's why I wanted him ' proclamations. Until we start beating the likes of Palace, Stoke, West Brom etc at home then I think this talk needs to stop. And over egging it because people hung their hat on the manager is wearing a little thin.

I don't accept the tiredness argument, we've a massive squad and it needs to be utilized effectively. Palace also played 3 times this week.

The manager needs time but the jury is out. Welding yourself to a system without picking the right players for it doesn't strike me as the characteristics of a successful manager. I hope I'm wrong and I hope the manager gets time.


That's the thing, it's not like Palace have had it any easier this week.

@Mr Pink

I think he could have managed the squad a little better, he could for example have played a 433 in the week, rested Lennon & Mason and played Bentaleb and Paulinho either side of Capoue or Stambouli with Lamela and Chadli either side of Kane.

Then yesterday he could have reverted to the 4231, Played Dembele and Mason maybe, brought Lennon back in, rested Eriksen and played Lamela in the central role with Kane rested and Chadli left.

PLaying Bentaleb three times in a week (two very intense games) after so long out is not too clever is it ?

He really need to stop with the Dier RB thing now. It's utterly counter intuitive and makes us very predictable. And I don't think it's doing the lad's confidence much good. I think he should be 3rd choice CB now ahead of Kaboul and Chriches, but we have two very promising RB's and if there's anything we've learnt this season and last it's that home made is sometimes better than the shop bought, especially if you have to shop at Tesco quite a lot.
 

Mr Pink

SC Supporter
Aug 25, 2010
54,770
99,331
That's the thing, it's not like Palace have had it any easier this week.

@Mr Pink

I think he could have managed the squad a little better, he could for example have played a 433 in the week, rested Lennon & Mason and played Bentaleb and Paulinho either side of Capoue or Stambouli with Lamela and Chadli either side of Kane.

Then yesterday he could have reverted to the 4231, Played Dembele and Mason maybe, brought Lennon back in, rested Eriksen and played Lamela in the central role with Kane rested and Chadli left.

PLaying Bentaleb three times in a week (two very intense games) after so long out is not too clever is it ?

He really need to stop with the Dier RB thing now. It's utterly counter intuitive and makes us very predictable. And I don't think it's doing the lad's confidence much good. I think he should be 3rd choice CB now ahead of Kaboul and Chriches, but we have two very promising RB's and if there's anything we've learnt this season and last it's that home made is sometimes better than the shop bought, especially if you have to shop at Tesco quite a lot.

Quite. He could of mixed it up with a whole host of different permutations. I was very disappointed that he didn't because I feared a tired performance against Palace and they had that crucial extra day's recovery.

The points were far more winnable so I would of prioritised the Palace game but better use of the squad gives you a better chance in both games IMO. If you're still in it against Chelsea with 20 minutes to go, use some of them the ones you took out.

My heart sank when I saw Dier at RB. Why we can't use one of young ones to fill in I'm not sure. Dier should only be used in his natural position. I find Poch's continued use of him at RB very perplexing, like you say it makes us horrendously predictable.
 

southlondonyiddo

My eyes have seen some of the glory..
Nov 8, 2004
12,599
15,012
It was a shame to see Verts strolling through yet another game, giving all the responsibility a ball to his partner yet again. Like Zoko Pops before him I'm sure he could easily have done a few 100 yard sprints in the last 10mins

Came off as fresh as a daisy, doubt he even needed a shower

As a footballer he's so much better than that and with Palace playing 9 behind the ball when we had it surely he could have ventured out at least once or twice to try and do/create something!?!?

Maybe it's just me and yes I'm definitely not his biggest fan but we could certainly do with his experience and ability in games like that. Real shame.

Still, he breezed through the game, didn't make any shocking errors and will pick up his however many thousands again this week
 

striebs

Well-Known Member
Mar 18, 2004
4,504
667
Pretty good performance by most Spurs players out there .

Did well to grind out a draw against a superior Palace side .
 

Darrkespur

Resident scientist
Jun 8, 2003
2,510
1,998
I think Fazio was excellent and aside from Dier our whole defence does look pretty assured. The problem yesterday was Palace really exploited that weakness and pretty much all their play came from Bolasie and Zaha making the most of that mismatch. Even so, the combination of Fazio, Vertonghen and Davies in front of Lloris looks promising and when Walker and/or Yedlin are added to the right we should have a pretty good base to work from.

Having said that, attacking wise we were poor again. Mason and Kane have been great this season but they looked very tired out there, and I thought Bentaleb made some poor decisions. I was impressed by Stambouli in Europe and with 3 games in 6 days I really think he deserved to be rotated in. I like the fact that Poch is sticking with players as we've had some managers that never stuck with a lineup long enough to get some consistency but with the fixture list the way it is Poch really needs to change it up in midfield.

I like all of our attacking midfielders (Kane, Eriksen, Lamela, Chadli and Lennon) in theory and in parts, but they either seem to click or not as a whole, and throwing a different one on doesn't seem to lift the rest like it should. I feel like we need one more sparky player there that can really make the difference, all of them at the moment are good but not great. That said, adding a better striker to the mix will really help, as much as I want Soldado to succeed he really should have scored yesterday, and he didn't put enough effort in on 50:50 balls to make up for it.

I've seen some progress in our play recently but if Poch sticks to the same 11 players in every game there's no way his style of play will work consistently. I get that some players just aren't doing their job but he has to rotate enough to get us through to January. We could really do with another striker/AM and possibly swapping out our ineffective CMs (Paulinho was a mess again) for someone who gets what we're trying to do. If only Arsenal hadn't bought Chambers, this team with Schneiderlin in it would be doing so much better I suspect...
 

jonathanhotspur

Loose Cannon
Jun 28, 2009
10,292
8,250
JH what's your assessment of the game?

Hi steve.

I didn't blow a top when I saw the starting line-up but I feared another afternoon of congested tripe was in store for us. I had no sympathy for Pochettino's post-match whingeing about fixture congestion; his excuses were of the rehearsed variety and did nothing to dispel the notion that he'd made a rod for his own back with unimaginative use of the squad over the past week.

When playing out from the back, we weren't doing what you'd expect us to do and getting the centre backs to split and pushing the full-backs high up the pitch. Our back four were almost in a straight line, our back six were close enough together to hold hands.

Lloris- 8 Made some outstanding saves to keep us in the game, must have been a serial transgressor in his previous incarnation.

Dier-5 Every fucker seems to know that the place to draw blood from us is down the flanks. By hook or by crook, we invite the opposition to bombard our full backs/attack the space in behind them. So Dier was yesterday's victim. He didn't know whether he was coming or going and, as Tony Gayle pointed out, he frequently got his distances wrong when defending 1v1 situations. He was often left exposed by our midfield and, for my money, he is low in confidence and was utterly appalling going forward.

Fazio- 8 Really warming to him, he looks like a really good defender of the old fashioned variety and he can play a bit, too. Snuffed out a lot of danger.

Verts-7.5 He was good but he seems to be playing within himself-we need him to surge forward with the ball at his feet to create some overloads and catch the opposition off guard.

Davies- 7.5 Warming to this guy, aggressive in the tackle and very good 1v1. Shy going forward but pleasantly surprised me by finding a white shirt in the final third on a few occasions.

Bentaleb- 5.5 Lethargic, uncharacteristically caught in possession a few times and too conservative, particularly when we had a few opportunities to hit Palace on the counter. The lack of movement in front of him was a mitigating factor, as was fatigue.

Mason- 5.5 Sees opportunities to raise the tempo but disappoints with poor execution. Needs to be more composed. Not good at helping his full-back when we're under attack on the edges of our box. Even in the first minute against Chelsea, Matic (Matic, FFS) was able to dance past three white shirts (Mason, Chiriches, Lennon) into our box.

Lamela- 4 Wretched game. Is he beyond redemption? Shades of Ronaldo about him against QPR but hasn't shown himself to be the sharpest tool in the shed since. His stuttering dribbling style blunts our attack. One moment summed him up yesterday-he got back to pinch the ball from Bolasie (possibly with the aid of a foul), strolled forward as if he had all the time in the world and found himself dispossessed-by Bolasie...What is it that you don't get about the pace of English football, Erik?

Eriksen-6 Our most likely source of inspiration, at the heart of most of our good play, playing on the right side of midfield in the second half was a poor move, he was jaded and offered little in defence. Some of his passing in the second half was so bad that I couldn't tell what his intentions were.

Kane-5 Utterly drained from his exertions against Chelsea and Everton. He shouldn't have been playing at all, whatever half-chances came his way, poor touch and indecision saw to it that they came to nothing. It was sad to see him picking the ball up from the centre backs in the closing stages of the game. That's how fucking shambolic the tactics were.

Soldado-4 At times like these, this guy has got to step up to the plate and stick some of those chances away because despite our shit tactics and tired legs yesterday, we still created enough to find a breakthrough. And most of those chances (four, I think) fell to this fanny. One lousy stinking goal, Bob, and the whole complexion of the game changes. It's not as if he offers anything else, with his "one-second-rule", whereby he offloads the ball as quickly as possible so as to avoid taking any responsibility, his shit pressing, his spinelessness in 50/50 challenges and his pendant for allowing centre backs to have free headers. Why doesn't he attack the fucking ball in the six yard box and why doesn't he ever run at defenders? Got a great chance to do it yesterday and immediately played a square ball that did nothing to advance our cause.

Chadli- 5 Bringing him on made no difference, he doesn't create. Putting him up top instead of Soldado might have worked better.

Paulinho-4 A disgrace and a dope. Plodded around, passed the ball to our centre backs, disappeared into traffic. Turned his back on the ball in midfield duels. No urgency and no World Cup Winner's medal either.

Lennon-5 If he's the answer, we're fucked. Or so we're told. Well maybe we are fucked because we've spunked the Bale money on a shower of shit. He's a midtable player but, hey, we're a midtable club and we could have done with him yesterday.

Pochettino-2 Wake up, FFS.
 
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Mr Pink

SC Supporter
Aug 25, 2010
54,770
99,331
Hi steve.

I didn't blow a top when I saw the starting line-up but I feared another afternoon of congested tripe was in store for us. I had no sympathy for Pochettino's post-match whingeing about fixture congestion; his excuses were of the rehearsed variety and did nothing to dispel the notion that he'd made a rod for his own back with unimaginative use of the squad over the past week.

When playing out from the back, we weren't doing what you'd expect us to do and getting the centre backs to split and pushing the full-backs high up the pitch. Our back four were almost in a straight line, our back six were close enough together to hold hands.

Lloris- 8 Made some outstanding saves to keep us in the game, must have been a serial transgressor in his previous incarnation.

Dier-5 Every fucker seems to know that the place to draw blood from us is down the flanks. By hook or by crook, we invite the opposition to bombard our full backs/attack the space in behind them. So Dier was yesterday's victim. He didn't know whether he was coming or going and, as Tony Gayle pointed out, he frequently got his distances wrong when defending 1v1 situations. He was often left exposed by our midfield and, for my money, he is low in confidence and was utterly appalling going forward.

Fazio- 8 Really warming to him, he looks like a really good defender of the old fashioned variety and he play a bit, too. Snuffed out a lot of danger.

Verts-7.5 He was good but he seems to be playing within himself-we need him to surge forward with the ball at his feet to create some overloads and catch the opposition off guard.

Davies- 7.5 Warming to this guy, aggressive in the tackle and very good 1v1. Shy going forward but pleasantly surprised me by finding a white shirt in the final third on a few occasions.

Bentaleb- 5.5 Lethargic, uncharacteristically caught in possession a few times and too conservative, particularly when we had a few opportunities to hit Palace on the counter. The lack of movement in front of him was a mitigating factor, as was fatigue.

Mason- 5.5 Sees opportunities to raise the tempo but disappoints with poor execution. Needs to be more composed. Not good at helping his full-back when we're under attack on the edges of our box. Even in the first minute against Chelsea, Matic (Matic, FFS) was able to dance past three white shirts (Mason, Chiriches, Lennon) into our box.

Lamela- 4 Wretched game. Is he beyond redemption? Shades of Ronaldo about him against QPR but hasn't shown himself to be the sharpest tool in the shed since. His stuttering dribbling style blunts our attack. One moment summed him up yesterday-he got back to pinch the ball from Bolasie (possibly with the aid of a foul), strolled forward as if he had all the time in the world and found himself dispossessed-by Bolasie...What is it that you don't get about the pace of English football, Erik?

Eriksen-6 Our most likely source of inspiration, at the heart of most of our good play, playing on the right side of midfield in the second half was a poor move, he was jaded and offered little in defence. Some of his passing in the second half was so bad that I couldn't tell what his intentions were.

Kane-5 Utterly drained from his exertions against Chelsea and Everton. He shouldn't have been playing at all, whatever half-chances came his way, poor touch and indecision saw to it that they came to nothing. It was sad to see him picking the ball up from the centre backs in the closing stages of the game. That's how fucking shambolic the tactics were.

Soldado-4 At times like these, this guy has got to step up to the plate and stick some of those chances away because despite our shit tactics and tired legs yesterday, we still created enough to find a breakthrough. And most of those chances (four, I think) fell to this fanny. One lousy stinking goal, Bob, and the whole complexion of the game changes. It's not as if he offers anything else, with his "one-second-rule", whereby he offloads the ball as quickly as possible so as to avoid taking any responsibility, his shit pressing, his spinelessness in 50/50 challenges and his pendant for allowing centre backs to have free headers. Why doesn't he attack the fucking ball in the six yard box and why doesn't he ever run at defenders? Got a great chance to do it yesterday and immediately played a square ball that did nothing to advance our cause.

Chadli- 5 Bringing him on made no difference, he doesn't create. Putting him up top instead of Soldado might have worked better.

Paulinho-4 A disgrace and a dope. Plodded around, passed the ball to our centre backs, disappeared into traffic. Turned his back on the ball in midfield duels. No urgency and no World Cup Winner's medal either.

Lennon-5 If he's the answer, we're fucked. Or so we're told. Well maybe we are fucked because we've spunked the Bale money on a shower of shit. He's a midtable player but, hey, we're a midtable club and we could have done with him yesterday.

Pochettino-2 Wake up, FFS.

Don't agree with everything but a pretty good summation in all honesty.
 

iluvsteffenfreund

Well-Known Member
Nov 5, 2004
2,078
2,465
After watching west ham today I can't believe I've found myself thinking id rather have their two c midfielders in song and kayoute(spelling) their front two Carroll and sakho are better than what we have with Valencia as well and Reid and Tomkins look more solid than are two as well ! But it's the central midfield two for me that really is a huge eye opener. Imagine having to face song and that kayoute or bentaleb or mason. I know what every premiership manager will be saying. How on earth do west ham have a better side than us ???!!
 

iluvsteffenfreund

Well-Known Member
Nov 5, 2004
2,078
2,465
I asked first, would be genuinely interested in why you think Lennon would have been more useful yesterday ?
Anyone in our squad would have been more useful yesterday. He was useless. And wasn't a coincidence he got dragged at half time. Both zaha and bolasie showed him up
 

jonathanhotspur

Loose Cannon
Jun 28, 2009
10,292
8,250
I asked first, would be genuinely interested in why you think Lennon would have been more useful yesterday ?
Seeing as you ducked out of the debate on the Chelsea thread, you don't really deserve an answer, BC.

The trouble with Lamela yesterday was that he was bringing nothing to the party. In fact, he was a liability, as evidenced by the ridiculous free kick he conceded on our "D". When shit's not working, you shake it up a bit. At the moment, Lamela is delivering so little that I would consider Lennon to carry an equal (if not greater) threat.

Lennon has never kicked on but at least he puts that doubt into a defender's mind. He can cut inside or he can go round the outside. With Lamela, you know which way he's going to go.

Lennon would have offered Dier better protection (fuck knows he needed it badly) and perhaps made Palace more reluctant to bomb forward on our right side.
 
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