Some thoughts on the Wigan match

[ShayLaB]

Burnley first half maybe, but in the league, I don't recall.

What amazes me is that the same group of players can score four past Arsenal, draw with chelsea away from home, beat Liverpool (twice), come back from 2 goals down against the second team in Russia, but we fail to beat Stoke, Hull, Newcastle, Wigan (1 point from those by the way, and we played wigan twice in the league).

Any ideas why?

Jonah sailed to Tarshish instead of preaching against the evils of Nineveh as the Lord bade him. But the Lord sent a mighty storm to punish him for fleecing, so “that the ship was like to be broken,” the frightened sailors aboard deciding that he was an evil influence, a loser, real bad luck. “And they said . . . Come, and let us cast lots, that we may know for whose cause this evil is upon us. So they cast lots, and the lot fell upon Jonah” (Jonah 1:7). After they jettisoned Jonah, calm returned to the seas, but Jonah, of course, was swallowed by a whale and after three days and nights “vomited out upon dry land,” whereupon he did what he was supposed to do in the first place. A Jonah still means a bringer of bad luck that spoils the plans of others, the phrase so popular that it has even become a verb, as in “Don’t jonah me!”.

I watched Master and Commander again the other night and the 'Jonah' in that movie jumped over board with a cannonball.

We know what needs to be done.

We know who is he.

...and it's not BAE. :razz:

 

[sebo_sek]

Gomes told the physio he was OK, that information was passed to the bench and the third sub was made.

His expression was that of desperation, I am sure he even rolled his hands to show he needed to come off.

Not saying that that was the reason for the defeat, but we need him healthy, and now it looks as though he isn't. Good thing about Przyrowski then, will go straight into the team.

They start negotiations next week, but 1 million quid should secure it. Polonia has a budget of around 30 million PLN (Ł9 million) 4.2 million PLN will be huge to them.

Just watched the Redknapp interview and he is right, the players need to show more for the money invested in them. It is not always the manager's fault 'Arry, just today.

 

[tiddola]

gutless

Totally dispiriting today...
The poor management of the club that started with Marin Jol's sacking is starting to seriously threaten our Premier status-

• Bale is devoid of confidence- need to take him out of firing line
• Bent- not good enough
• Dawson- i have been a critic in the past but he was superb today
• King- i hate to say it but i think the club should be looking to let him go at the end of the season- poor bloke should have had 70 odd england caps
• Jenas- replace him with someone who can lead the team
• Zokora- better at right back- i would love to see Corluka in defensive mid

We desperately need a centre forward who can hold the ball up to get best out of defoe- Redknapp mentioned this in the post match interview so hopefully he has something lined up.

Also need CM and LM- don't think anyone has mentioned that before have they?

 

[elvis7754]

Im starting to think top4 is unlikely but I would settle for top6 at this stage.
x

 

[chico]

Thought second half was as bad as WBA away. What is most worrying is the games are fast running out. If we are in,or near , the bottom 3 come April we're f**ked...... last 3 away games Man Utd, Everton, Liverpool ......and this side just dont have what's needed to get 6+ points at those places. For the first time you feel real doubt as to our ability to stay up.I reckon we need 6 wins from the last 9 home games ,which is a big ask of this team. Portsmouth next week ,and Stoke ,are massive, we need a few wins soon. I know not everyone likes BAE , but I agree with the earlier post that Bale needs resting.

 

[sprest]

Today was one of the first times we have played without any sort of width for quite some time. When I saw that we were playing a 442 (diamond) I despaired. Zokora on the right side of midfield? He is a very good DEFENSIVE midfielder, but when it comes to passing, shooting and general creativity he others nothing at all. If Redknapp thought that was the right formation (which I don't), why not play Jenas there. If he was fit enough to be on the bench, he was fit enough to start. He has attacking instict, but works hard enough to tuck in or track back when needed.

For what it's worth I thought King played very well as def mid. If he carries on playing every other game, it makes sense to keep Woodgate & Dawson (who has got back to his best of 3 years ago) in the team consistantly.

There is no denying that the players were not good enough (bar King, Woodgate & Dawson) but I feel the blame for the result lies squarely with Redknapp. The formation and tactics were 100% wrong. Why he took Modric off I'll never know. We had 3 attacking players on the pitch (Bent, Defoe & Lennon), none of whom regularly creates something out of nothing. We needed a Modric/Huddlestone to unlock a very tight, hard workinig Wigan team.

As for Bale..... He is a fantastic talent, but he is so devoid of confidence it hurts. seems to be second guessing every decision he makes rather than doing what comes naturally. If Redknapp is so at bringing the best out of players, we are yet to see it yet. I really hope that Bale regains his form as soon as possible.

 

[spud]

I've just watched Mr. Redknapp's post-match Sky interview. Astonishing, yet predictable.

First, nothing (as always) is his fault. Two points from the first eight games was mentioned. Why? What possible relevance has it to today's abject performance apart from the deflection of blame?

Secondly, his inference is that he is working with inferior players. He has 'to work with what he has got'. What he has got is a squad full of internationals who, individually, he is signally failing to make play to anything like their talent level and, collectively, he is failing to inject with any cohesion.

He also bemoans the fact that - 'as with West Brom and Newcastle' - we have conceded last minute goals in matches that we have 'never looked like losing'. So that's all that's wrong then; lapses of concentration at the end of games.

Give me strength.

 

[fatspur]

It is all well and good having 45m woth of strikers, but if there is no service then they might as wel be kids from the youth set up.

they may have cost 45m, but are they really worth that?

 

[fatspur]

I've just watched Mr. Redknapp's post-match Sky interview. Astonishing, yet predictable.

First, nothing (as always) is his fault. Two points from the first eight games was mentioned. Why? What possible relevance has it to today's abject performance apart from the deflection of blame?

2 points from the last 5. Wake up and smell the coffee, Harry

 

[JuanRebelde]

I've just watched Mr. Redknapp's post-match Sky interview. Astonishing, yet predictable.

First, nothing (as always) is his fault. Two points from the first eight games was mentioned. Why? What possible relevance has it to today's abject performance apart from the deflection of blame?

Secondly, his inference is that he is working with inferior players. He has 'to work with what he has got'. What he has got is a squad full of internationals who, individually, he is signally failing to make play to anything like their talent level and, collectively, he is failing to inject with any cohesion.

He also bemoans the fact that - 'as with West Brom and Newcastle' - we have conceded last minute goals in matches that we have 'never looked like losing'. So that's all that's wrong then; lapses of concentration at the end of games.

Give me strength.

I have said on many occasions that I knew Redknapp fairly well and I was underwhelmed by his appointment and never caught up in the good old 'arry stuff peddled by the press etc.

I believe he is a limited manager in the kevin Keegan mould of motivation as his prime weapon and he is the least tactically adept of the previous three we have had. I hope he proves me wrong but in over twenty years of knowing him through football I have never seen anything in him that makes me think we will become a team that will challenge in the league for CL places with him as Manager.

This result, just like the previous two or three in the league seem to be setting a pattern which is really worrying. That is we seem to be becoming increasingly devoid of ideas in attack and prone to very sloppy goals against opposition that any Spurs team worthy of the name should expect to beat.

The Redknapp recovery seems to have stalled and it seems I like a few others on this site are genuinely concerned that the stomach for the fight is not there. The tactics and selection etc made by the manager may also be damaging us.

The same players who let down Ramos are now reverting to type under Redknapp I just hope we can sign enough new players this month to get us the 20 or so points that should save us this season my expectations are no more than that especially if Manure decide they want to win the Carling Cup after all.

 

[Sanj]

KingKay - you hit the nail on the head.
I think most can accept losing if we go out to try and win the game.
What i can't accept is losing with such a negative performance. The only person to blame for this is Harry. I'm not asking for Harry to go or anything like that, but he MUST learn that at Spurs we need to play attacking football, and we should not be going to places like Wigan looking for just a draw. UNACCEPTABLE.

However Daws was great!!!

 

[Wiener]

I totally agree Spud.

The blame lies squarely with redknapp for today's truly appalling performance. he got pretty much everything wrong today.

He is starting to bug the hell out me with incessant media broadcasts. He talks far too much and it's nearly always complete crap.

 

[speccy_spur]

Well said Mr.Spud.
All blame to Harry. He seemed to have turned a blind eye to all that was going wrong today and just made it worse with almost every decision made.
Bale is atrocious now. Maybe a welsh international, maybe a championship level player, but certainly not a premiership level one. Must be dropped. Who does Gunter have to blow to get a game?
Why is Sanchez sat on the bench? Is he there to hold Jordan's false teeth when Joe wants to rant at an official? They appear to have no interest in playing him unless Gomes loses a limb. And then only maybe.
I have asked before. What are all these extra coaches we now employ actually doing? With the exception of Parks, little it seems.

 

[Little Squatman]

Spud, completely agree with everything you are saying. How you can play someone in the centre of midfield in this league when he isn't even fit enough to train is beyone me. I don't even know where to start with the rest of it. We are in a serious scrap now

 

[WhippsX]

For the first time this season, after today's performance, I am really worried about relegation. This inept, gutless show by highly paid professionals, was inexcusable. Besides O'Hara & Dawson (& perhaps Gomes) no one showed either the quality or determination we need to stay up. Harry's substitutions didn't help any of the problems. Bale was so poor defensively - why did he stay on? Bent for Pav? Jenas to help out when Daws is injured? Modric replaced when he's the only player with any quality to start an attacking move? Thudd may be slow but at least he can pass the ball - more than can be said for Zokora.

Most of the team should be ashamed of themselves but Harry must also take some of the blame for this shambles.

 

[JimmyG2]

Posted this on the match thread butseeems appropriate her too.
Who will get the sack first Harry or Scolari? Late goal defeat takes us straight back to the bad old days of three seasons ago. We were waiting to get defeated, asking for it in fact with the selection,the formation and the performance.
Apart fom the inclusion of Defoe for Cambell the team that finished against Wigan last week should have started. Gomes should have been subbed when injured and its about two seasons too late to be playing Ledley in midfield.
To be honest I don't think that Harry has a clue, but have been too polite thus far to say so in so many words.
His new manager bounce was wonderful and was mainly due to the fact that he was as far away as possible from Juande Ramos,who isn't doing badly at Real Madrid. I was surprised and delighted by his impact but our form is relegation standard only. Does he have the qualities to get us out of this crises again?
Dawson and Ohara gave their best but Modric seemed as bemused as the supporters by our set up and Defoe though given little support was the little boy lost that he often was in the past.

 

[spurs_viola]

I've just watched Mr. Redknapp's post-match Sky interview. Astonishing, yet predictable.

First, nothing (as always) is his fault. Two points from the first eight games was mentioned. Why? What possible relevance has it to today's abject performance apart from the deflection of blame?

Secondly, his inference is that he is working with inferior players. He has 'to work with what he has got'. What he has got is a squad full of internationals who, individually, he is signally failing to make play to anything like their talent level and, collectively, he is failing to inject with any cohesion.

He also bemoans the fact that - 'as with West Brom and Newcastle' - we have conceded last minute goals in matches that we have 'never looked like losing'. So that's all that's wrong then; lapses of concentration at the end of games.

Give me strength.

My sentiments exactly, except that I think Harry has finally started finding out that he's got quite a few mediocre players with inflated egos and not enough commitment as well as not enough skills and footballing intelligence - exactly what Poyet and Ramos were infering to after they were pushed out mainly thanks to those players.
Funny how the squad went down from being "full of good, high quality players" (or something like that) when Harry just joined Spurs to being "badly put together", inferior squad now that the league form has nosedived again and it is January transfers window...

And I noticed how we hardly conceded last minute goals under Ramos and Alvares regime (yes, I remember Cisse goal for Sunderland where we were chasing victory instead of settling for a draw against "well-drilled, tough team") - and hardly had any bad injuries bar chronic case of King and recurrence of long-term problem for Hutton.
Is it coincidence that all the hard training and strict, meticulously worked out diet has now given way to more "happy", relaxed sessions and much more relaxed, "British style" diet with nice fatty sauces that players so craved - and we have started seeing the results?
We seem to have had more injuries since December than we had in the whole year under Ramos/Alvares!

 

[claw_diddy]

We just need to find the back of the net FFS!

 

[rc1]

There seems to be a lot of hyprocritical people on this forum who one moment are praising the signing of Defoe, for example, and then after one game are castigating him for his apparent shortcomings.

What we all need to realise is that we have a very overated bunch of players, who believe they are much better than they actually are.

The rest of the season will be up and down and I just hope that we survive it so that come the summer Harry can start rebuilding the squad. We so lack aggressive, strong and combative players but there's not much we can do about it now. For my part, I would sign Appiah on a short-term contract if he's up for it, because we need all the winners we can get from now until the end of the season.

 

[DiscoD1882]

I think the blame can be put on Redkanpp. but lets look at the brief history of Spurs. Players losing confidence in Jol. Sacked. Mr Ramos comes in a blaze of glory. Worst ever start to a premiership campaign. Sacked. Mr Redknapp arives as the messiah. We have given ouselves a chance of stying up but it seems it isnt lasting.

We are too quick to blame the managers at spurs. There seems to be a rotten core at spurs which needs to be surgically removed before we can move forward. The managers are niot the problem. The blame lies squarely with the players as far as i am concerned.