Southgate: Stay or Go

[Ribble]

He's done a great job with man management and inspires a lot of loyalty from the players, I don't think risking squad harmony is worth changing him out. A little bit of extra help to polish the rough spots and a spot of luck to not lose players just before the tournament starts would certainly help, though.

 

[JUSTINSIGNAL]

I don't think Southgate is "bad" - but I don't think he has the tactical nous to pick the right players, and put them in positions to consistently create goals. Its mostly done with a hope and a prayer.

Weird comment.

We were one of the highest scorers in qualifying for the WC and in the tournament itself, so he must have some idea how to set up the team to create goals.

Besides, international management is a totally different beast to club management due to the limited time you get with an ever changing squad. Southgate has managed to completely change the atmosphere of the camp so now that players actually look like they enjoy representing England. To the point some players perform better for England than they do their clubs (Stones and Maguire being examples of this). It was always a frustration that except for a few examples most players that were world class for their club sides were meek and tentative playing for england. Most of the time meaning we couldn't even keep the ball and pass to each other.

Now the players play a well structured brand of possession based football, with defenders that don't just lump the ball, midfielders who don't just run around like headless chickens, and attackers that actually threaten using their guile and technical ability.

If largely outplaying the then world champions in the quarter-finals isn't cause for optimism I don't know what is. We have no divine right to beating teams of that level. It is always going to be a 50/50 chance., But the main thing is we were competitive. We didn't sink into our shell, defend, and hope to get something from a counter attack of set piece like we have against every team of a similar or superior level in every tournament in my life time. We actually went toe-to-toe. If that isn't cause for optimism for how this team can develop I don't know what is.

 

[Trix]

I wanted him gone pre world cup. He ditched his over cautious approach So I'm now happy if he stays.

 

[Yid121]

I wanted him gone pre world cup. He ditched his over cautious approach So I'm now happy if he stays.

Exactly this for me, if he plays positive football, very hard to get anyone better who would come and likely to unstable the squad so keep him for 18 months to the Euros then review it.

 

[A Bit Much]

I wanted him gone pre world cup. He ditched his over cautious approach So I'm now happy if he stays.

This is for me the most sensible answer. I wasn't a fan of Southgate and probably posted on this forum saying I was sick of his cautious approach. But based on evidence of the world cup he did change his approach and that should be commended.

I don't know what he could reasonably have done differently against France, aside from these very abstract arguments about "oh bring on x player and we'd have won".

 

[FrankSpencer]

Strangely, I saw something in the France game that gave me enough positivity to keep him until the Euros.

 

[Gassin's finest]

Southgate has massively turned round England in terms of what we were when he took over. But it all feels very Spursy (yes i'm using that term, deal with it ) in as much as the football and team spirit is much better, we have a great squad of players to pick from with some really exciting talents, but defensively we're still a bit ropey and I can't see Southgate winning anything with England.

The question becomes is he enough to get us a tournament win - and the answer to that, in my mind is no. However, he deserves a shot at the Euros in 2024. If he can get a win with us there then he'll go down as the best manager we've had for generations. What he does need to do, as others have said, is get better tactically and be a bit less trusting in players that have served him well previously. There are some really exciting players coming through for England right now, but he needs to get them into the first team. If he can move on from players like Stones, Maguire and Shaw and build a back line of younger players that are of a better class then great, I think there's a chance of him getting a trophy with us.

This is England though, and we've always lacked that bit of tenacity, arrogance and ruthlessness that it takes to get over the line. It's a national trait, certainly at a footballing level.

 

[Japhet]

Stay. Not keen on International football these days anyway with all the stupid friendlies and Nations League bullshit, and the World Cup going to Qatar was the icing on the cake. Only watched a few highlights of the WC and didn't miss it one bit.

 

[Thenewcat]

I wanted him gone pre world cup. He ditched his over cautious approach So I'm now happy if he stays.

100% agreed. On paper his worst result but comfortably his best tournament management wise for me

 

[aliyid]

Wouldn’t say I’ve ever been overly pro or anti. My view is that he’s always played a pragmatic style that I’m not a fan of but I accept that it’s effective in international tournament football.

I can’t remember the last time we were outclassed during a tournament maybe 3/4 playoff at last WC (nations league doesn’t count).

Overall I’d say our style of play is better than under Sven, Capello, Hodgson, etc… and if we were to replace him it would prob be with somebody like Dyche or Gerrard so I’m happy that we’ve stuck with him.

 

[nailsy]

I would argue that the manager for WC26 should start now - and have the Euros to get the team playing in his style. Otherwise, you put the new manager in a tougher spot to come in after the Euros and have a shorter time to implement any changes.

I'd argue that we have more chance of winning the Euros than the world cup so stick with the guy who got us to the final last time.
The two years between the Euros and world cup is long enough for a new manager to put in his changes anyway.

 

[Tottenham_God]

Can someone explain to me why England fans and ex players seem to have such low expectations and happy with semi finals and finals appearances? I'm looking at you Gary Neville.

I'm Australian, we are shit at football, but if I was English I'd be expecting far more. The biggest and best league in the world, dozens of top class players to choose from etc.

 

[muppetman]

Can someone explain to me why England fans and ex players seem to have such low expectations and happy with semi finals and finals appearances? I'm looking at you Gary Neville.

I'm Australian, we are shit at football, but if I was English I'd be expecting far more. The biggest and best league in the world, dozens of top class players to choose from etc.

I wouldn't say many are happy but it's fairly realistic to expect to make the semis and a final, at which point it's a 50/50 chance of winning.

I think lots of people overestimate the prem and a huge number of the best players in the PL are not English anyway? I think we are now in with a shout of winning World Cups and Euros so we are about where we should be?

 

[Tottenham_God]

I wouldn't say many are happy but it's fairly realistic to expect to make the semis and a final, at which point it's a 50/50 chance of winning.

I think lots of people overestimate the prem and a huge number of the best players in the PL are not English anyway? I think we are now in with a shout of winning World Cups and Euros so we are about where we should be?

Demand excellence my friend

 

[muppetman]

Demand excellence my friend

You might just be on the wrong forum for that!