Stewards at WHL

[tylaw]

As for calling the Fuzz in to help tonight, its beyond belief. If a Green Team member makes me miss a goal live, because of their incessant ranting, then you really will see an angry man in need of police assistance.

grrrrr.....:roll:

 

[arthurgrimsdell]

Firstly I would like to say that, having been in Seville I will always be grateful for the actions of the Tottenham stewards that night. Being in the upper tier that night I was away from the melee, but had a good view of their actions that night, and I unreservedly applaud them, and fully endorse the award they received from the Met Police for their actions.

And now onto the point of the thread.

Mr Levy, you recently sacked a man who we loved for, in your opinion, not being up to the job he was expected to do. I salute you for having the courange to back your convictions.

So, if you are prepared to sack a loved associate of the club for not being up to the job, then please get rid of disrepected associates, those that go by the name of "Green Team".

I understand the issue of standing in conjunction with the Football Licensing Authority.

My issue is, sitting in row 8, why am I continually told by Green Team to sit down, when there are seven rows in front of me who are standing up.

In the words of Coolio, I'm an educated fool yet I still cannot work out quite why Green Team can think how I spend £700 on a season ticket, plus more for cup games, and expect me to be happy to watch the back of someone's head, rather than the match.

Another thing. You quite rightly bring up the million plus number of supporters our club has, and the fantastic atmosphere at the Lane. Well, if your Green Team cronies, lead by Tottenham employee Mr Moustache in the South East Corner, continuously throw people out for starting the chant "Stand Up if you hate A*rsenal", and generally kill the atmosphere, expect our numbers to fall and our "twelfth man" to be negated.

As for calling the Fuzz in to help tonight, its beyond belief. If a Green Team member makes me miss a goal live, because of their incessant ranting, then you really will see an angry man in need of police assistance.

I shall not dwell on the chant "Four pounds an hour, you only get four pounds an hour". Sort them out, or ship them out.

On the one hand you say you accept that standing is not allowed under the terms of the Club's licence (Big of you). On the other hand you don't accept that the stewards should tell you to sit down while there are other people standing in front of you. Shouldn't you be helping the stewards to get those in front of you to sit rather than criticising the stewards for doing the job they are paid to do? And when the majority are, like you, using the excuse that the others in front are the cause of the problem rather than you yourself, how on earth can you criticise the use of police action when the stewards are completely ignored?
Do you really think that the mindless chant "Stand Up If You hate Arsenal" is in any way supporting Tottenham? Or indeed is adding to a supportive atmosphere for the team? It is self-indulgent nonsense, goading the authorities by inciting people to stand: Nothing more, nothing less.

I've got a new chant for you, if chanting is your idea of support, rather than roaring the team on, which in my view shows support much much more than competitive singing against the opposition's fans with only half a mind on the game: Altogether now:

"Sit down if you've got a brain, Sit down if you've got a brain."

 

[Zuben]

In the words of Coolio, I'm an educated fool yet I still cannot work out quite why Green Team can think how I spend £700 on a season ticket, plus more for cup games, and expect me to be happy to watch the back of someone's head, rather than the match.

Did Coolio really say that? :think:

 

[yidal]

I remember some chants from1 game last year coming from the Shelf aimed towards Green Team...

“You’re just a fat Eddy Murphy”

“Who’s got a big fat wife, who’s got a big fat wife, Lenny Henry, Lenny Henry, he’s got a big fat wife”

“Green Team, Green Team what’s the score?”

I'm pretty sure that was the last UEFA group game last season, it was the one where their keeper threw it straight to berba, vs bucharest i think, we were 3 up at halftime, they were terrible, we had to do something to stay entertained! Like you say, the guy was playing along and then when he stopped he got chants of who's got a big fat wife, seemed a bit harsh! Still, a very funny night.

 

[nikosramone]

Block 34 tickets just doubled in price on ebay

yes...Mrs. Ramone was none too pleased when my eyes were off the pitch!

 

[justfookinhitit]

The only way we're gonna resolve this is for the Prem League to look at implementing safely controlled standing areas in the same manner as they have at one of the Bundesliga clubs. Until that happens this sort of angst will continue.

I'm in with those that want to stand through a game. It drives me nuts that home fans are constantly told throughout a game to sit down, while the away fans can do what the hell they like for the 90 minutes.

For those taking kids or indeed anyone else of a delicate nature, the place to go is Paxton Road, NOT the South Stand. I love the South Stand but wouldn't take a young kid or a granny there. If you take kids to the South Stand don't be surprised if your kids go home and call your neighbour a f***ing c*** or something equally pleasant.

Oh, and if you want to sit throughout the game with virtually no swearing save up your pennies and head for the West Stand.

 

[wearetheparklane]

arthurgrimsdell, paxton i presume?

 

[stephen509]

hey im a steward and personally hate telling ppl to sit down but have to do what the supervisors tell me!! the green team is only there because they are specially recruited to cover for stewards that are not there! i think in the south alone 3/4 of the stewards cant make night games!oh yea and the girl in 34 she aint all that, maybe from very far away

 

[nikosramone]

the girl in 34 she aint all that, maybe from very far away

she was really friendly actually! chatting to some of the regulars there.

 

[PeterboroughYids]

join standupsitdown.co.uk guys, we are looking for about ten fans from each club to hand out flyers or just generally support the cause and spread the word. there are about 4 spurs fans involved already but we have thousands standing home and away weel in week out.

This is a perfect example of why safe standing areas should be introduced, the stewards apend the whole game making people sit when they are really there for safety. we are allowed to stand at rugby, in lower league football and at concerts but not football... its time for a change

 

[arthurgrimsdell]

arthurgrimsdell, paxton i presume?

Not since 1979.

 

[Chris12345]

Do you really think that the mindless chant "Stand Up If You hate Arsenal" is in any way supporting Tottenham? Or indeed is adding to a supportive atmosphere for the team? It is self-indulgent nonsense, goading the authorities by inciting people to stand: Nothing more, nothing less.

I've got a new chant for you, if chanting is your idea of support, rather than roaring the team on, which in my view shows support much much more than competitive singing against the opposition's fans with only half a mind on the game: Altogether now:

"Sit down if you've got a brain, Sit down if you've got a brain."

I've seen several interviews with players that say they really enjoy the crowd banter...

Last season Dawson said he loved it when the crowd did the "We're the X side..." thing at each other...

Were you at/did you hear the MJs blue n white army all second half vs Seville?

Personally I think it created a very good atmosphere, and probably really spurred the players on... but since thats not "urging the team on", merely "self indulgent chanting", i guess it didn't, we might aswell have been quiet all game and yelled "come on" occasionally :roll:

 

[arthurgrimsdell]

The only way we're gonna resolve this is for the Prem League to look at implementing safely controlled standing areas in the same manner as they have at one of the Bundesliga clubs. Until that happens this sort of angst will continue.

I'm in with those that want to stand through a game. It drives me nuts that home fans are constantly told throughout a game to sit down, while the away fans can do what the hell they like for the 90 minutes.

For those taking kids or indeed anyone else of a delicate nature, the place to go is Paxton Road, NOT the South Stand. I love the South Stand but wouldn't take a young kid or a granny there. If you take kids to the South Stand don't be surprised if your kids go home and call your neighbour a f***ing c*** or something equally pleasant.

Oh, and if you want to sit throughout the game with virtually no swearing save up your pennies and head for the West Stand.

Fair enough.
There are a very large number of people who want to stand during a game. The way for them to go is surely to try to get the regulations changed, rather than to continually flout them and complain when they're pulled up for it.
In order to do this though, those who want to stand have to convince the authorities that there is such a thing as a "safe standing area" and what the mechanisms are that make such an area safe. Just going back to terracing pre-Hillsborough and Heysel will not be a starter.

Whenever there is a thread such as this, it starts because someone has been told to sit down and doesn't like it, even though it is made abundantly and regularly clear that standing is not acceptable to the Club, because it needs to keep its operating licence for the stadium and it jeopardises that licence when people are allowed to stand.

No one that I've seen ever comes up with a positive proposal for making standing areas safe. "Like they have in Germany" is not enough". What makes those areas acceptable for standing to the German authorities? What more, if anything would the UK authorities require? How can those wanting to stand convince the authorities to trust them not to behave in the way that certain elements of crowds in the UK got such a notorious reputation for, pre-Hillsborough? It has to be pointed out that to those making such claims that the drinking culture, pre-match, post-match and at half time, with the best will in the world won't help their case. Nor will the competitive and usually abusive chanting between fans of each side. It is not a coincidence that the most vocal chanters at Tottenham have migrated to the Park Lane end over the years, where the opposition's supporters are put. Were they elsewhere the safe standing idea would undoubtedly gain more support.
As an aside, if a convincing case could be put forward, I have a strong suspicion that clubs, including Tottenham, would be in favour, because they would be able to get more revenue for a substantially smaller capital outlay than for seating, purely by weight of numbers; though having said that, I can well imagine those now clamouring for the right to stand, would want it to be at a discount because "we have to stand". But then with some people you just can't win.

With regard to being circumspect as to where you go within WHL to watch the match, there is a lot in what you say, though if you ever had the misfortune to sit close to me during a match you would soon be dis-abused of your misapprehension that there is little shouting, raving, swearing and indeed gesticulating in the West Stand.

Or so I'm told.

 

[arthurgrimsdell]

I've seen several interviews with players that say they really enjoy the crowd banter...

Last season Dawson said he loved it when the crowd did the "We're the X side..." thing at each other...

Were you at/did you hear the MJs blue n white army all second half vs Seville?

Personally I think it created a very good atmosphere, and probably really spurred the players on... but since thats not "urging the team on", merely "self indulgent chanting", i guess it didn't, we might aswell have been quiet all game and yelled "come on" occasionally :roll:

Yes I was at that game. What was really inspiring was not the singing and chanting. That got increasingly irritating and off-putting. When we were pushing late on in the game that was all forgotten and there was a continuous roar of support, not consciously co-ordinated but nevertheless consistent throughout the ground. That was inspiring, and I for one could feel the team being lifted by it. That is what I think we should be aiming for.
My view is that we are there to support, and indeed I couldn't be quiet if I tried, and believe me I've tried, because it has often been suggested to me that if I don't watch out I'll have a heart attack. But I'm also there to watch the game, and if I'm chanting something in response to opponents, or declaring my synchronised hatred for Arsenal, Chelsea or West Ham, then I'm not giving my full attention to the game.
"We're the Park Lane, We're the Shelf side, We're the Paxton" might give the chanters some amusement, and even the players, but it is not support. In my mind it's equivalent to the Mexican Wave, tending to happen when there's a lull in the game. Having said that, if there were a song which was Tottenham's song alone, and the whole ground sang that, then that could be inspiring. But in my view, only Liverpool and Celtic in the UK have mastered that particular routine.

 

[bomberH]

Arthur, some of what you say is correct, but a lot of it is really wide of the mark.

The only way the crowd will 'roar' on the team is if they do something in particular that gets us excited, or if they're having attack after attack in a short space of time. Basically, we have to rely on them for that.

In the meantime, pro Spurs songs such as the Park Lane Shelf Side chants are more than welcome and do not come just because there's a lull in the game. They're sung because people are there enjoying themselves and in some cases, trying to up the atmosphere so the team can perform better.

I agree 100% with the poster who hates the Stand up if you hate Arsenal chant, which is why i always sing Stand up if you love Tottenham when they start it. No-one joins in with me, but i don't care. Sing the former if we're actually playing Arsenal. There's a trillion pro Spurs songs that are also sung during the 90 minutes and some fucking funny ones too, mainly aimed at the opposition, so it's all good.

Back to the point, the fact is, Footie used to be like that. We used to be able to stand and shout and sing and it did help the atmosphere. It isn't our fault (as such) that they made it all seater. It's a million times more difficult to get a bit of atmosphere going when you're all sat down. Not that it's the stewards fault, but bare in mind a massive percentage of those who go now, used to go when we could stand and sing.

Your main point was chanting is different to supporting. It's not really, depending on the chant. A roar from the crowd is when the team give us something to roar about. Your example against Seville last season was based on the fact that we were down and out, then we came back into it, hence the roar as time was running out. The only other commonplace roar is when the board is shown for injury time minutes if we're level or losing. Or when i get home and my fucking dinner ain't ready.

 

[arthurgrimsdell]

Arthur, some of what you say is correct, but a lot of it is really wide of the mark.

The only way the crowd will 'roar' on the team is if they do something in particular that gets us excited, or if they're having attack after attack in a short space of time. Basically, we have to rely on them for that.

In the meantime, pro Spurs songs such as the Park Lane Shelf Side chants are more than welcome and do not come just because there's a lull in the game. They're sung because people are there enjoying themselves and in some cases, trying to up the atmosphere so the team can perform better.

I agree 100% with the poster who hates the Stand up if you hate Arsenal chant, which is why i always sing Stand up if you love Tottenham when they start it. No-one joins in with me, but i don't care. Sing the former if we're actually playing Arsenal. There's a trillion pro Spurs songs that are also sung during the 90 minutes and some fucking funny ones too, mainly aimed at the opposition, so it's all good.

Back to the point, the fact is, Footie used to be like that. We used to be able to stand and shout and sing and it did help the atmosphere. It isn't our fault (as such) that they made it all seater. It's a million times more difficult to get a bit of atmosphere going when you're all sat down. Not that it's the stewards fault, but bare in mind a massive percentage of those who go now, used to go when we could stand and sing.

Your main point was chanting is different to supporting. It's not really, depending on the chant. A roar from the crowd is when the team give us something to roar about. Your example against Seville last season was based on the fact that we were down and out, then we came back into it, hence the roar as time was running out. The only other commonplace roar is when the board is shown for injury time minutes if we're level or losing. Or when i get home and my fucking dinner ain't ready.

We fundamentally disagree.

Your first point is that it's up to the team to get the fans excited. My point is that it's up to the supporters to support.

I have no argument against fans enjoying themselves, but without supporting the team that is self-indulgence, which is fair enough, but means they are fans rather than supporters.

Whether it's "Stand up if you hate Tottenham", "Stand up if you hate Arsenal", or "Stand up if you need a wee" it's still inciting the crowd to stand up, and the team or the state of the game becomes an irrelevance.

You can't argue that this sort of chanting is supporting the team, and at the same time argue that because of all-seater stadia, you can't get a supportive roar going. That's utter nonsense isn't it?

If someone can only support the team when they are doing well, doesn't that, by definition, make them a "fair-weather supporter", something that Tottenham supporters take a great deal of pride in accusing Arsenal, Manchester United and particularly, Chelsea supporters of being: "Where were you when you were Sh*t" comes to mind.
You are arguing both that chanting is supporting, and at the same time that a supportive roar won't come about unless the team is providing something that incites a roar. You are contradicting yourself.

Your comments about when roars occur are generally accurate. That is just what I'm arguing about: that instead of chanting at the opposition, and singing to enjoy themselves the fans would be better off roaring the team on in support, if they want the team to win. If they don't care about the team winning, but are only concerned with their status vis-a-vis the opposition's chants and singing then by all means carry on. They have every right to do what they like. My priority is the team playing well, with confidence, and winning, and I'm firmly of the view that roaring support and encouragement, rather than concentrating on singing your favourite songs, and out-insulting the opposition's fans, is the best way to help the team achieve that.

You disagree.

So be it.

 

[PeterboroughYids]

I fundamentally disagree.

Read up on safe standing mate, please

http://www.standupsitdown.co.uk

 

[Rupstoh]

We fundamentally disagree.

Your first point is that it's up to the team to get the fans excited. My point is that it's up to the supporters to support.

I have no argument against fans enjoying themselves, but without supporting the team that is self-indulgence, which is fair enough, but means they are fans rather than supporters.

Whether it's "Stand up if you hate Tottenham", "Stand up if you hate Arsenal", or "Stand up if you need a wee" it's still inciting the crowd to stand up, and the team or the state of the game becomes an irrelevance.

You can't argue that this sort of chanting is supporting the team, and at the same time argue that because of all-seater stadia, you can't get a supportive roar going. That's utter nonsense isn't it?

If someone can only support the team when they are doing well, doesn't that, by definition, make them a "fair-weather supporter", something that Tottenham supporters take a great deal of pride in accusing Arsenal, Manchester United and particularly, Chelsea supporters of being: "Where were you when you were Sh*t" comes to mind.
You are arguing both that chanting is supporting, and at the same time that a supportive roar won't come about unless the team is providing something that incites a roar. You are contradicting yourself.

Your comments about when roars occur are generally accurate. That is just what I'm arguing about: that instead of chanting at the opposition, and singing to enjoy themselves the fans would be better off roaring the team on in support, if they want the team to win. If they don't care about the team winning, but are only concerned with their status vis-a-vis the opposition's chants and singing then by all means carry on. They have every right to do what they like. My priority is the team playing well, with confidence, and winning, and I'm firmly of the view that roaring support and encouragement, rather than concentrating on singing your favourite songs, and out-insulting the opposition's fans, is the best way to help the team achieve that.

You disagree.

So be it.

Oi, Killjoy. What are we supposed to do when we score?

Lay down? :grin:

 

[PeterboroughYids]

this whole thread shows exactly why we should have safe standing areas brought back. if they returned then the old men and kids who want to sit can do and those who stand can do the same, instead of whats happening at the moment which is mixing all fans together so people can't see and problems are caused...

nobody is asking for a return to the shitty old terraces, the call is for safe areas that are controlled just as seating areas are but allow fans to stand. 93% of football fans want this so I really don't understand why the authorities pretend its not an issue...

 

[bomberH]

We fundamentally disagree.

Your first point is that it's up to the team to get the fans excited. My point is that it's up to the supporters to support.

I have no argument against fans enjoying themselves, but without supporting the team that is self-indulgence, which is fair enough, but means they are fans rather than supporters.

Whether it's "Stand up if you hate Tottenham", "Stand up if you hate Arsenal", or "Stand up if you need a wee" it's still inciting the crowd to stand up, and the team or the state of the game becomes an irrelevance.

You can't argue that this sort of chanting is supporting the team, and at the same time argue that because of all-seater stadia, you can't get a supportive roar going. That's utter nonsense isn't it?

If someone can only support the team when they are doing well, doesn't that, by definition, make them a "fair-weather supporter", something that Tottenham supporters take a great deal of pride in accusing Arsenal, Manchester United and particularly, Chelsea supporters of being: "Where were you when you were Sh*t" comes to mind.
You are arguing both that chanting is supporting, and at the same time that a supportive roar won't come about unless the team is providing something that incites a roar. You are contradicting yourself.

Your comments about when roars occur are generally accurate. That is just what I'm arguing about: that instead of chanting at the opposition, and singing to enjoy themselves the fans would be better off roaring the team on in support, if they want the team to win. If they don't care about the team winning, but are only concerned with their status vis-a-vis the opposition's chants and singing then by all means carry on. They have every right to do what they like. My priority is the team playing well, with confidence, and winning, and I'm firmly of the view that roaring support and encouragement, rather than concentrating on singing your favourite songs, and out-insulting the opposition's fans, is the best way to help the team achieve that.

You disagree.

So be it.

In the nicest possible way, that's bollocks.

My point about the roaring is that supporters do not (and never have) roar for the sake of it, just to urge the team on. A roar is the one thing players need to earn. I will sing supportive chants til i'm blue in the face but a roar is generated from excitement. If you can just stand there and roar them on, you're a fucking lion.

And if you think 30 odd thousand people singing 'Stand up if you love Tottenham' doesn't help the team, you're not as bright as i thought you were. When we were playing shite around the Hoddle/Graham era and losing games left right and centre, when some were singing 'we want our tottenham back', others who were more supportive sang the 'Love Tottenham' chant to let everyone know that no matter how shit we are, we'll always love Spurs. The team always got a massive lift from it and several of them would mention the singing in the post match interviews and interviews with the papers the following week. So the fact is, chants do help.

If you're naive enough to not realise that singing funny chants at our players and theirs is a sign that we're happy, then so be it. Us fans/supporters being happy is a sign that the team are playing well enough, otherwise we wouldn't be chanting those sort of chants in the first place. When we're winning, losing or drawing, there's always a cry of COYS at corners and free kicks. That's not a roar, yet it's urging the team on. Weird that.

And if you genuinely think you get the same kind of 'roar' sitting down as you do standing up..... :duh:

I support the team and i'm a fan. I sing pro Spurs songs the whole game and support them through thick and thin. Who the fuck are you to say people that chant more than they roar are fair weather fans?

Lastly, if you genuinely go to games JUST to roar on the team and don't get involved in any banter or songs at all, then not only are you are in a vast minority, but you're probably not much fun to be around either.

Saturday's about everything. Meeting your mates, going to the pub, going to the ground, watching your team, singing, chanting, the banter with the away support if you're near them, moaning afterwards, going home, beating the wife if you're a northerner etc etc. That doesn't make me any less of a supporter. In fact, it defines me as one.