The Daily ITK Discussion Thread - 22nd January 2019

[King of the Lane]

When a large portion of us in the summer were complaining and worried about a lack of transfers we were slated by other posters who told us we were 'pathetic' and 'impatient' and signings would come...that fell on its arse.

Now a large portion of us are worried that there are 0 signings again with loads of the team injured, crap Llorente upfront and hardly any CMs fit, Dembele gone, the threat of Eriksen and Toby being sold in the summer too. Once again we are slated for being worried by people refusing to take off their spurs tinted glasses.

I cant blindly follow Poch or Levy as I think they are making mistakes here and I just hope it doesnt cost us.

 

[Paolo10]

Don't be such a casual fan mate.

 

[Phomesy]

So what's the excuse for the failure to spend 0 last summer when most prem clubs splashed the cash? Fulham 100m+?And we clearly needed reinforcements?

Fulham are going down.

It's not what you spend - it's how you spend it.

 

[jay2040]

When a large portion of us in the summer were complaining and worried about a lack of transfers we were slated by other posters who told us we were 'pathetic' and 'impatient' and signings would come...that fell on its arse.

Now a large portion of us are worried that there are 0 signings again with loads of the team injured, crap Llorente upfront and hardly any CMs fit, Dembele gone, the threat of Eriksen and Toby being sold in the summer too. Once again we are slated for being worried by people refusing to take off their spurs tinted glasses.

I cant blindly follow Poch or Levy as I think they are making mistakes here and I just hope it doesnt cost us.

Well you should blindly follow them as they are in charge!

 

[Roynie]

I wonder just how much the players' agents are having an effect. The feeling I get is that they try to steer their clients towards the club(s) where the agents will get the biggest payout, not the club(s) best suited to the player.

 

[am_yisrael_chai]

It's really not. Liverpool have more money for both fee and wages. If we bring in a £70m plus player, he want's £70m wages. His agent wants a £70m signing on fee. If he gets those wages, how many players agents will be knocking DL's door down asking for parity. What feeling will that breed throughout the club that billy wonderbollocks has come in on £150k plus a week yet we've put in the graft and got us here. When all the time Poch has demanded and expected loyalty from his players.

And we really aren't doing the same thing over and over again, we are pushing on, we are improving, we just don't have the budget to do it at the rate some fans want at the moment. I'm not absolving DL of blame, he most likely has cocked up transfers trying to be clever, but we dont have the fanbase, the sponsor income, the global appeal etc. We are big in our eyes, not so much outside.

If Poch doesn't want 2nd rate options then it's understandable. If we genuinely can't afford / aren't attractive enough to top tier players then 'we must find another way to compete'. If Poch decides to leave of the back of it then he really doesn't understand the project and he's been spouting rubbish the last 5 years.

We have the highest gate receipts in world football, play in the league with the highest media revenues in world football and regularly are in the top 4 of the split of those revenues, claims of poverty are falling on deaf ears.

 

[Hakkz]

I wonder just how much the players' agents are having an effect. The feeling I get is that they try to steer their clients towards the club(s) where the agents will get the biggest payout, not the club(s) best suited to the player.

*apply Nicholas Cage "You don't say" meme*

 

[chinaman]

I wonder just how much the players' agents are having an effect. The feeling I get is that they try to steer their clients towards the club(s) where the agents will get the biggest payout, not the club(s) best suited to the player.

Hope one of these days, those parasites are done away with.

 

[kaz Hirai]

I'm not really fussed tbh whether we sign or not. I think the squad is very strong, just unlucky with Injuries at this moment.

What I do find curious is all the talk of poch would rather sign no one if he can't sign high quality that improves the team.

So in that case what was the deal with grealish?
That 23 year old championship player was the chosen one?

 

[Roynie]

*apply Nicholas Cage "You don't say" meme*

And the point is that people in here are moaning at the club not signing players, but the fact is we can't compete with the likes of Man C, Cheski, Manu and Liverpool when it comes to finances. We can't increase the costs of a player by exorbitant amounts due to the Agent's fees.

 

[Westmorlandspur]

Fantastic facility with fantastic staff.

Who have they produced in last ten years after the Messi Pique etc generation.
These things tend to go in phases. Man Utd struck gold in 1992 ....then what.
Wes Brown ok O’Shea average Darren Fletcher not bad
Won youth cup 2012 Pogba Lingaard and Ravel Morrison(disappeared without trace)
NowRashford.
Ajax have been poor for years and suddenly De Jong and De Light appear

You never get a constant assembly line in these things.

 

[Ghost Hardware]

I'm not really fussed tbh whether we sign or not. I think the squad is very strong, just unlucky with Injuries at this moment.

What I do find curious is all the talk of poch would rather sign no one if he can't sign high quality that improves the team.

So in that case what was the deal with grealish?
That 23 year old championship player was the chosen one?

Agree, and I’m also curious what happens next summer if nothing changes in the market. If the players we want are still unattainable and Eriksen still refuses to sign a new contract . Are we still going to abstaine from the market. At what point do things change what’s the tipping point. I guess we shall see. I’m still very concerned over the injuries we have considering the large number of games we have coming up in a very short space of time. But, although I was hopeful, I was never really expecting any signings this window.

 

[vegassd]

I'm not really fussed tbh whether we sign or not. I think the squad is very strong, just unlucky with Injuries at this moment.

What I do find curious is all the talk of poch would rather sign no one if he can't sign high quality that improves the team.

So in that case what was the deal with grealish?
That 23 year old championship player was the chosen one?

My guess (just a guess) would be that Grealish was seen as a good Plan B but not at the expense of losing out on Plan A... whoever that may have been. We would have determined his value to us in the grand scheme of things and then bid up to that value.

The Herc info is really interesting - we aren't willing to spend 70-80% of the available budget on a single player. I imagine there is a whole load of nuance to that as well, but it would suggest that when the club are looking at getting players in it's very much with the bigger picture in mind.

Maybe they had agreed that Grealish would be good but only worth 15-20% of the budget or something (just spitballing numbers) so when the price eventually went up it meant that he was not available for what we were willing to pay. It seems a bit of a strange approach to me and requires a hell of a lot of discipline and balls to not budge on that sort of valuation if it is indeed what happens.

Like I say, I'm just guessing at the above as a potential explanation for how the budgets are being allocated based on Herc's snippet. It would be interesting to know who is coming up with those percentages (if that happens) and if different squad positions would be subject to "breaking the budget" or if it's very strictly controlled.

 

[Klinsmannesque]

I thought it was regarding the latest ITK, tbf - but happy to remove if I’m wrong (often am).

My point about Pool was badly made, I was walking and tapping on my phone. I didn’t mean that we should emulate Liverpool, I was more responding to somebody saying “it’s not as easy to just go out and get the players you want”. I don’t think it’s easy, and I’ve never played FM, but it is possible if you pay the going rates. I don’t think we should go out and spend £200m, but there are glaring weaknesses in the squad that I’m hoping don’t cause a capitulation like Spurs of old.

We should draw a line here anyway, I don’t want anything different to any of you - I just mainly thought the tone was needlessly rude and condescending from some.

Wasn’t intended as either so apologies if taken that way, but I still stand by my overall point of we don’t have the resources or prestige of others yet we need the same players as them in order to improve. Any lesser player is pointless and actually sets us back.

 

[codspur]

Who have they produced in last ten years after the Messi Pique etc generation.
These things tend to go in phases. Man Utd struck gold in 1992 ....then what.
Wes Brown ok O’Shea average Darren Fletcher not bad
Won youth cup 2012 Pogba Lingaard and Ravel Morrison(disappeared without trace)
NowRashford.
Ajax have been poor for years and suddenly De Jong and De Light appear

You never get a constant assembly line in these things.

I meant ours mate...have been there a few times recently and it’s realky impressive as a facility and the staff are friendly and knowledgable.

 

[jay2040]

We have the highest gate receipts in world football, play in the league with the highest media revenues in world football and regularly are in the top 4 of the split of those revenues, claims of poverty are falling on deaf ears.

It's not all just what's coming in, what about the outgoings??

 

[Fidget]

Yes so also telling the powers that be sell those bloody players or get rid of those that I will not use. That is part of DL and his team's remit. You can not just say nobody wants our players so we are not buying anyone until someone does. It's the responsibility of the Club's to do that not Poch's.

i agree with you.
we are continuing to pay a huge amount of weekly wages to these players that aren’t useful, whilst their value decreases. it obviously makes sense to cut your losses, rather than hang on for a ttansfer that won’t happen. this is a process that should be managed by financial advice to the club and then for Levy to carry it out.
unless we don’t want our financial accounts for the year to look worse because of the action.

 

[am_yisrael_chai]

It's not all just what's coming in, what about the outgoings??

What outgoings ? We have the lowest wage bill in the top 6. If you are referring to the stadium I think that has been done to death in numerous threads. I’m not de-railing this one by starting a debate on it in here. I would suggest you look at the thread Rob started on how our cashflow has been used in the last 10 years.

 

[jay2040]

What outgoings ? We have the lowest wage bill in the top 6. If you are referring to the stadium I think that has been done to death in numerous threads. I’m not de-railing this one by starting a debate on it in here. I would suggest you look at the thread Rob started on how our cashflow has been used in the last 10 years.

Until you have seem the actual finances I think your comments are 'Billy bullshit'. Meant in the nicest way!!

I suggest you take Rob' s comments as a source of information rather than be led by it!

And don't reply to this as I don't want you to be banned !!

 

[Fidget]

Well surely we run the risk of him moving to a club with a bigger budget.

yes. eventually. but he probably has his own plan and hopefully it will include helping us get through this spell of standing still.