The Daily ITK Discussion Thread 9th June 2016

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Archibald&Crooks

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Well if that's true then you're right, I don't get it and didn't get it and I assumed you did hate Levy. My bad.
I honestly don't, I pretty much agree with your first post. The thought of Levy being a milgnant dwarf with an ego the size of a buffalos left testicle amuses me, that's all. I'm sorry if it mounts your breasts, it isn't the intention.
 

spurs9

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This is just as ridiculous as the other side. Dier and Alli were the exceptions, not the rule.
Not really, you also have Wimmer, Eriksen, Alderweireld and Lloris. In fact out of the 3 players we have spent 20m+ on we have 1 good but not great player (Lamela), 1 flop (Soldado) and 1 jury is still out on (Son). I would say spending alot of money and it being a success would be the exception.
 

nedley

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On JJ's latest:

Our search for a striker continues to look a little messy from the outside. If we decided that Bats wasn't for us months ago, why are we dragging heals over what looks like our main target for what in the grand schemes of things isn't mega money (I appreciate that deals are difficult).

Strikers are difficult to come by. This kid wants us, we obviously like him and he'll deputise Kane nicely.

I hope we get it done before somebody else does.
 

yankspurs

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Not really, you also have Wimmer, Eriksen, Alderweireld and Lloris. In fact out of the 3 players we have spent 20m+ on we have 1 good but not great player (Lamela), 1 flop (Soldado) and 1 jury is still out on (Son). I would say spending alot of money and it being a success would be the exception.
Are you kidding? They each cost 7-10m more than Alli and Dier. They didnt cost a ton but certainly werent "bargains" like Alli and Dier. Also, our scouting is decent in identifying great talent for low cost. But they have failed quite a bit as well.

Oh and one more thing. Lamela is a fantastic player and is only getting better. Do not say other wise. Countless times he was the only on the pitch last season actually fucking giving a shit and trying. One of our 2 most important players. Poch taking him off so early cost us 3 points multiple times last season, including both games against woolwich.
 

jambreck

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Then we can compare to other PL clubs. We are probably the 6th biggest club in PL, so naturally it's fair that we can/may expect the 6th biggest transfer investment in PL. Looking at our transfer expenditure (net amount), that's not what's happening. So where goes the profit? (besides the privately-owned stadium which is supposed to have a separate budget anyway)
You've mentioned this a few times. I'm not sure where you got this idea.

The current stadium and the new stadium site and structure (thus far) belongs to Spurs. And ENIC owns some 85-90% of Spurs.
 
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Are you kidding? They each cost 7-10m more than Alli and Dier. They didnt cost a ton but certainly werent "bargains" like Alli and Dier. Also, our scouting is decent in identifying great talent for low cost. But they have failed quite a bit as well.

Oh and one more thing. Lamela is a fantastic player and is only getting better. Do not say other wise. Countless times he was the only on the pitch last season actually fucking giving a shit and trying. One of our 2 most important players. Poch taking him off so early cost us 3 points multiple times last season, including both games against woolwich.
Absolutely nailed on about lamela, haven't seen enough people say this.
 

ryantegan

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I think the fact that we have made 3 real bids to AZ for Janssen says everything we need to know about Bats. The deal was dead long ago, long before Chelsea were smoked out by Palace.

Janssen would be a great addition to a very good young squad. We don't have the resources to compete with most teams today because we are building a stadium and the money others are spunking will go towards that. But if we can build a strong competitive team over 3 years till the stadium is done then its mission accomplished. The next stage from there would be to utilise our assets financially and add to what should be by then, a mature team ready to win titles
 

Jospur

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I think the fact that we have made 3 real bids to AZ for Janssen says everything we need to know about Bats. The deal was dead long ago, long before Chelsea were smoked out by Palace.

Janssen would be a great addition to a very good young squad. We don't have the resources to compete with most teams today because we are building a stadium and the money others are spunking will go towards that. But if we can build a strong competitive team over 3 years till the stadium is done then its mission accomplished. The next stage from there would be to utilise our assets financially and add to what should be by then, a mature team ready to win titles
That would seem to make sense in a perfect world. But players are human and they want to win trophies (and make money) - and if we can't deliver a competitive squad to the players currently on hand then some will want to move. And we'll find that what is now a squad with great potential will turn into a squad with unrealized potential when key players demand a move.

The squad does not require lots of player investment at this point. Just the right player investment - in quality players. To me that means stumping up the going rate on number 1 targets and not settling for second or third choices.
 

whitechina

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I think the fact that we have made 3 real bids to AZ for Janssen says everything we need to know about Bats. The deal was dead long ago, long before Chelsea were smoked out by Palace.

Janssen would be a great addition to a very good young squad. We don't have the resources to compete with most teams today because we are building a stadium and the money others are spunking will go towards that. But if we can build a strong competitive team over 3 years till the stadium is done then its mission accomplished. The next stage from there would be to utilise our assets financially and add to what should be by then, a mature team ready to win titles

I get your point, but we have to KEEP this group together and show ambition (behind closed doors if it keeps the spine of the squad happy- we don't need to know). If we tread water for the next few years I can see many of the players (manager and coaches) being tempted to try their luck else where.


I hope we keep a tight ship with regards to others finding out our targets (Willian etc), but that inside the club there is a togetherness including the players etc
 

Gbspurs

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Are you kidding? They each cost 7-10m more than Alli and Dier. They didnt cost a ton but certainly werent "bargains" like Alli and Dier. Also, our scouting is decent in identifying great talent for low cost. But they have failed quite a bit as well.

Oh and one more thing. Lamela is a fantastic player and is only getting better. Do not say other wise. Countless times he was the only on the pitch last season actually fucking giving a shit and trying. One of our 2 most important players. Poch taking him off so early cost us 3 points multiple times last season, including both games against woolwich.
£7-£10m more each? Dier was £4m and Alli was £5m

Wimmer was £4m. Toby was £11m. Eriksen was £11m. Hugo was £8m.

They were all bargains, paint it how you want.

Lamela is clearly good but I think people are falling into that trap of players getting better and better in the off season. He has come along way, he still has a way to go, this could be the best season for him yet but let's not pretend he is Messi.
 

Spursidol

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This is not any business but football, where you have to rely on fanbase support to generate profit. What they charge for tickets (especially Spurs) and TV rights is outrageous. It is almost verging on corporate donations. Naturally fans reserve right to demand more investments when the club has the ability to make higher expenditure instead of pocketing majority of it as investment return.
Off topic, but why not look at Spurs accounts (on their website) over the last say 10 years period.

Over that time period, except for the year we sold Bale, the cumulative profits are 'diddly squat' and no dividend paid. So no 'investment return being pocketed'

Fact of the matter is that so far all the revenues coming in from match tickets, TV and sponsorship are largely paid to players, and the negative transferee balance over the last few years has been invested in the training ground etc.
 

C0YS

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On JJ's latest:

Our search for a striker continues to look a little messy from the outside. If we decided that Bats wasn't for us months ago, why are we dragging heals over what looks like our main target for what in the grand schemes of things isn't mega money (I appreciate that deals are difficult).

Strikers are difficult to come by. This kid wants us, we obviously like him and he'll deputise Kane nicely.

I hope we get it done before somebody else does.
Look 100k a week plus 33million is a lot.

100k would be most probably be are most highly paid player, for a player mostly spent on the bench. Paying a bench player that amount may get other players demanding that wage, if that were to happen we could see our wage budget match richer teams, but also put us in a really bad financial position.

33 million for a player who may not start every game is a massive risk for spurs. Mostly because that value will almost certainly never be recouped. If Bats were to stay mostly on the bench next season he may ask to leave, other clubs could then sign him for about half the price, and we will probably have to continue paying him a portion of his wages.

The money we are talking about is considerable. In fact the cost of bats for say two seasons is more than 10% of the cost of the stadium, with little chance of recuperating it. Someone like Janssen would represent an investment who is likely to increase in value and who´s wages are likely to be at least half the price.

To put it simply Bats at his current price is worth the same amount as two other quality players, both in wages and fee, with little chance of recuperating that investment. The management has to make the decision whether this is worth it, or if it is better for the team to spend the money elsewhere.

I know Levy is tight, and rarely pays premium but it is this model which has got us where we are. We cannot simply abandon the model without having serious financial implication. Sure, Levy could treat Bats as an exception, like Soldado, and to a latter extent Lamela, were. But I dont think Bats is worth it, I dont think paying that much for a player to sit on the bench is reasonable, if we going to spend 33million lets spend it on a workd class box to box centre midfield that will take us up a level, or game changing attacking midfielder like Mkhitaryan (I know its not realistic but he would cost us less than Bats).
 

Ossie85

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£7-£10m more each? Dier was £4m and Alli was £5m

Wimmer was £4m. Toby was £11m. Eriksen was £11m. Hugo was £8m.

They were all bargains, paint it how you want.

Lamela is clearly good but I think people are falling into that trap of players getting better and better in the off season. He has come along way, he still has a way to go, this could be the best season for him yet but let's not pretend he is Messi.
If he plays like he did at the Copa America, he'll be a lot better this season
 
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