The England Thread

[Flynn]

Messi needs to move to a bigger club if he wants to win things and be considered world class

 

[dontcallme]

Either Football Weekly or The Totally Football Show made a point that a good club manager doesn't make a good international manager, that most international managers have in fact been fairly mediocre at club level. In international management you need to find a man with a clear plan who can pick the right players for his plan and who can communicate said plan to his players in the short period of time they have. Admittedly that sounds easier than it really is but it shouldn't be as hard as the FA make it look.

I agree with this way of thinking.

I think good candidates for the England job are Allardyce, Redknapp and Hoddle. But for various reasons won't get it, or get it again.

 

[Flynn]

For a long time England suffered from "the undroppables" that the FA relied upon for marketing but they've all gone now.

Any manager now should be able to build something new and mould it in their image. It's an opportunity no England manager has had for a long time.

There are gaps in the team but very few teams in world football don't have 1 or 2 areas they could improve. We need a manager that can get he best of their decent players and do the best they can to fill whatever holes they have left.

 

[nedley]

I think he's just not used to be starved of the ball and felt the need to come looking for it. I don't mind Sterling, I think he gets way more shit than he deserves for England, but he'd be in my England starting 11 just about every time.

You were doing so well BC. I was winnering your every comment.

His appearances over the last 10 games have been nothing short of pathetic.

I lost count the amount of unforced errors from him yesterday. For a chap that is a lover of brains, I bemused to how you'd champion a player that has only air between the ears.

 

[kmk]

I guarantee that the following team managed by Glenn Hoddle would do a better job than any side put out by Southgate.

--------------------Forster---------------------

-------Walker----Stones------Keane------

Trippier---------------Dier-----------------KWP

-------------Winks------------Onomah---------

-------------------Dele----Kane-------------------

 

[tototoner]

I still cannot believe Allardyce who is exactly the type of manager England needed, was driven out and replaced by Southgate, who is frankly Conference League level at best.

It's as if they don't want success.

 

[Marty]

I still cannot believe Allardyce who is exactly the type of manager England needed, was driven out and replaced by Southgate, who is frankly Conference League level at best.

It's as if they don't want success.

The meeja don't want success. Failure is what really sells papers/clicks.

 

[dontcallme]

The meeja don't want success. Failure is what really sells papers/clicks.

England winning a tournament would sell a lot.

 

[tototoner]

The meeja don't want success. Failure is what really sells papers/clicks.

The Premier League don't seem to want to help the England team either, such a contrast to the other top European football nations.

 

[Marty]

England winning a tournament would sell a lot.

For a day. Failure sells for weeks or even months.

 

[Spurger King]

For a day. Failure sells for weeks or even months.

Oh I'm sure the media would love England to win a tournament. They could then spend the next few years knocking down all of the national heroes.

 

[dontcallme]

For a day. Failure sells for weeks or even months.

We still talk about 1966 and papers bring it up all the time.

England winning a major tournament would make newspapers a lot of money for a long time.

 

[Shadydan]

Yeah I don't get that either, stories either hood or bad will sell papers, it's just that England have been largely shit so the majority of stories have mostly been negative.

 

[Spurger King]

Worth pointing out that this is a meaningless discussion anyway, as that shower of shit won't be winning anything.

Said it before, but we're akin to Ukraine from a few years ago, or a worse version of Croatia. A couple of genuinely great players surrounded by plodders. The main thing that annoys me about England is that we really have had good teams in the past but generally ended up going out on penalties, losing to eventual winners/finalists, or both.

Now we've somehow ended up with one of the worst group of England players since possibly the beginning of internationals. The Ox, Henderson, Smalling, Hart, Lingard, Cahill...none of them would get anywhere near a team with serious ambitions of doing well in a tournament.

Frankly it's embarrassing to see. There are clearly huge problems with the FA and the entire set-up of grassroots football upwards.

As for the players, I think most of them couldn't care less about representing their country, and remind me of players featuring in a club game just before a big match who only want to avoid injury for fear of missing out on something more significant/profitable to them. The exceptions seem to be Hart (as crap as he is, he does genuinely seem to care about playing for England) and Kane (his celebration yesterday showed exactly what it meant to him).

Not that I blame the other players much. I'd probably feel the same way.

 

[taidgh]

From the outside, no idea how Hart keeps getting picked. The front 3 couldn't play together yesterday, Henderson is a disaster in midfield. England seemingly had no plan or method of play. Aside from that, everything is great. As I said, I have no vested interest in how England does, and makes me laugh to watch the inevitable disappointment every tournament. It would be great to actually be able to have Ireland qualify for major tournaments...but we're even more shite than you.

 

[Bus-Conductor]

You were doing so well BC. I was winnering your every comment.

His appearances over the last 10 games have been nothing short of pathetic.

I lost count the amount of unforced errors from him yesterday. For a chap that is a lover of brains, I bemused to how you'd champion a player that has only air between the ears.

Yeah, he's far from perfect, I'm not exactly "championing" him, but this is England, and where the other options are Oxlade, Linguard et al, I'd still have him in there most weeks.

Compare the shit he gets to the praise Alli gets though. People seem much less tolerant of Sterling, for example, than they are of Alli, yet Sterling will generally lose the ball trying to dribble at a player or something, Alli can lose the ball trying to control the fucking thing, and it's "what a talent".

I think he's trying to do too much for England. He's actually got a better Goals per minute ratio than Kane this season, and if used correctly is a nippy, direct wide forward who can run at defenders and actually get his head up, and who'll also work hard for the team off the ball, he's better at that than most of the other options, the problem is when you try to turn him into an Eriksen or DeBruyne.

 

[riggi]

The Premier League don't seem to want to help the England team either, such a contrast to the other top European football nations.

http://www.skysports.com/football/n...verstepped-mark-with-england-on-two-occasions

Anyone else watch that debate when it was on?

 

[JAYSTAR]

When is this for? Not sure why you've got Jones and Delph who are injured, but ignored Lallana, Welbeck, Rose, etc.?

The future! Rose vs Bertrand sure, providing Rose finds the same form as before. Delph is a CM and Henderson is not good enough. I prefer Delph to Henderson. Lallana is similar to Alli, so I would play Alli and Wellbeck is similar to Rashford, but I see more potential in Rashford. Does that answer your questions?

 

[fridgemagnet]

Another left field idea would be say to use the League cup as teams must field English or potentially eligible to play for England players, their age doesn't mater (to a point) bench is free but the first XI must be as above or you forfeit your place in the later rounds (or start 3 goals down or something)
You must also start with a preset formation (set by the current acting England manager) and the formation can't be switched until the 65th minute or something.

That way all the England players coming through know how the senior team plays, they're all coherent and the England manager can pick from outside the PL and know that the players are au fait with how an England team plays.

At the minute i don't think anybody can agree on how an England team should play, i don't think we play fast enough or pass well enough or quick enough and for pro footballers a lot have the first touch of a rapist. But that's just my own onions.

 

[JAYSTAR]

Why not simply try playing like Spurs?

Build the team around the Spurs contingent, including Walker, set them up in the same way that Spurs do, and fill the gaps with players closest to the Spurs player in that position.

Hard to find English Eriksen, Toby and Jan and so on, but do your best. Look for the closest you can get, rather than picking different types of players for jobs they don't understand, switching them around all the time, and even changing the formation to fit your today's favourite player.

At least it gives the team a clear shape and a style they can learn to understand.

We know it can work, we have half the players for it already, and it makes life simpler for everyone. At the very least everyone would know what they need to learn in training, and what they need to try to do during matches. Each non-Spurs player can even learn their job just by studying Spurs throughout the season, rather than waiting for the few days of England training each year. .

Keep doing it, no chopping and changing, no experimenting except for injury cover, just go for it 100% for a couple of years and see if England, with our limited player resources, can compete as effectively with the mega-nations as Spurs can with the mega-rich clubs.

No, of course it won't happen. But we could do a lot worse. And will.

I made the same suggestion a few pages back. We should play a 3421 system I'm, as Spurs do. Replacing the Dembele role is the hardest bit and although Winks is good, he's not pacey or strong. Honestly, the closest we currently have I'm is Delph and he is not close in terms of overall quality. The midfield is our biggest problem. Lallana and Alli play in a similar way, Wellbeck and Rashford and Lingard all play in a similar way and Sterling is just too wasteful in possession. Forster and Hart are similar in level. Rose may have a serious problem I'm, so ATM it has to be Bertrand and Stones and Keane have different strengths. Jones is in form and playing well, so it's who contributes most out of Stones or Keane.

Hart
Jones Stones Cahill
Walker Dier Delph Bertrand
Rashford Alli
Kane
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Lingard is a like for like sub for Rashford, Lallana is likewise for Alli and Sterling could play either side. Wellbeck can play all three front positions and back up Kane.

​