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The Kyle Walker-Peters Thread

Japhet

Well-Known Member
Aug 30, 2010
19,232
57,388
Honest question here - really curious about this. Just your opinion of course! ?

Why do reckon poch hasn’t given kwp more chances? It seems to be more or less the same discussion we’re having ref edwards and onomah in many ways. Very highly rated by most people who follow the youth, other big clubs and a couple of the first teamers ahead of them (like sissoko and trippier) don’t seem to be far ahead of them in terms of ability and it’s difficult to see why they are not been given more time considering their potential. Is the whole «poch gives youth a chance» a myth? Is his eye for talent not as good as many believe?

I have always felt a bit of what kwp, edwards and onomah are missing is going through that physical transformation that kane and winks did. Added a bit of muscle over a preseason. All the former three seem a bit slight still? Just speculating of course!


My opinion is that the margins for error are extremely thin now. Top 4 this season is a (hopefully) a fantastic achievement all things considered but any slip ups would have beenvery costly. Trippier and Aurier have both had poor games but I think there's just a bit of trust lacking from Poch where KWP is concerned. There may be concerns about his physicality, but Trippier is no bigger/stronger and doesn't have the pace either. Trippier also seems to have gone backwards as an attacking force which was his saving grace. Overall, I think KWP is long overdue his chance but I wouldn't be surprised if Trippier was let go this summer.
 

WiganSpur

Well-Known Member
Aug 31, 2012
15,974
32,682
If we get a good fee for him, I think Trippier will be gone this summer.

We'll give Aurier a full pre-season and see how he performs next season. If there is no improvement, then I think he's gone next summer.
This is the way I probably see it at the moment. Though i'll be sad to lose Trippier as I think he's decent.
 

Japhet

Well-Known Member
Aug 30, 2010
19,232
57,388
For me tripps isn’t the problem, he’s just an average player, the issue is aurier who should have by now made rb his own

RB and LB are positions where Poch likes to rotate, so making the position 'your own' isn't really an option.
 

JR1994

Well-Known Member
Jan 11, 2018
1,155
4,716
Trippiers reached his level. Hasn’t got the pace to beat a fullback and it makes us so narrow. At least Aurier has the ability to get in behind team.. don’t think the constant rotation has done him any favours as he can’t get a run to generate some form! If he had Toby playing RCB would he have made as many mistakes? :whistle: Would love KWP a to have a few games now though. Think he could be class and save us a lot of money
 

Japhet

Well-Known Member
Aug 30, 2010
19,232
57,388
Trippiers reached his level. Hasn’t got the pace to beat a fullback and it makes us so narrow. At least Aurier has the ability to get in behind team.. don’t think the constant rotation has done him any favours as he can’t get a run to generate some form! If he had Toby playing RCB would he have made as many mistakes? :whistle: Would love KWP a to have a few games now though. Think he could be class and save us a lot of money


If Trippier could still deliver a decent ball into the box (sometimes even early!) he'd still be a decent option but, as I've said before, he seems to have morphed into Walker offensively where the usual outcome is a complete loss of momentum followed by a sideways or backwards pass. Maybe it's a case of opponents closing him down, but for whatever reason, without his attacking threaat, there's not much to put in the + column.
 

Hercules

Well-Known Member
Jul 23, 2014
5,694
156,565
As I’ve said previously I like trippier, the gripe I have is buying aurier

Before Aurier came here he had a high stack appraisal. You cannot blame us going for him. Let’s see what he is like next season, and everyone inside is confident you will see s much different player. Trippier, I am not a fan of, and I know at least three opposition coaches who earmark him as our weakness when they played us. It so BLATANTLY OBVIOUS. If we are a T4, he has no place in our team to be perfectly honest.

Compare him to Citeh, Yanited, and Scoucers RB-No compare. He wouldn’t get near, and that is what we are aspiring to. Get on SA’s back after a full season, that involves a pre-season.
 
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DCSPUR

Well-Known Member
Apr 15, 2005
3,918
5,415
Before Aurier came here he had a high stack appraisal. You cannot blame us going for him. Let’s see what he is like next season, and everyone inside is confident you will see s much different player. Trippier, I am not a fan of, and I know at least three opposition coaches who earmark him as our weakness when they played us. It so BLATANTLY OBVIOUS. If we are a T4, he has no place in our team to be perfectly honest.

Compare him to Citeh, Yanited, and Scoucers RB-No compare. He wouldn’t get near, and that is what we are aspiring to. Get on SA’s back after a full season, that involves a pre-season.

your info on the inside feeling on SA is important. if Poch chooses SA and KWP, and Trippier leaves, I could live with that.
I'd also really hope that KT would get a big ovation upon his return, he has always seemed to work hard and to the best of his ability
 

spursfan77

Well-Known Member
Aug 13, 2005
46,680
104,956
Before Aurier came here he had a high stack appraisal. You cannot blame us going for him. Let’s see what he is like next season, and everyone inside is confident you will see s much different player. Trippier, I am not a fan of, and I know at least three opposition coaches who earmark him as our weakness when they played us. It so BLATANTLY OBVIOUS. If we are a T4, he has no place in our team to be perfectly honest.

Compare him to Citeh, Yanited, and Scoucers RB-No compare. He wouldn’t get near, and that is what we are aspiring to. Get on SA’s back after a full season, that involves a pre-season.

But Poch likes him because he does what he’s told and is good tactically apparently according to the coaching team. It’s why we haven’t sold sissoko too isn’t it annoyingly.
 

Artemis

New Member
Apr 12, 2013
13
18
Before Aurier came here he had a high stack appraisal. You cannot blame us going for him. Let’s see what he is like next season, and everyone inside is confident you will see s much different player. Trippier, I am not a fan of, and I know at least three opposition coaches who earmark him as our weakness when they played us. It so BLATANTLY OBVIOUS. If we are a T4, he has no place in our team to be perfectly honest.

Compare him to Citeh, Yanited, and Scoucers RB-No compare. He wouldn’t get near, and that is what we are aspiring to. Get on SA’s back after a full season, that involves a pre-season.

I remember last year during a program of 'l'Equipe 21' French daily TV sport show, talking about Aurier they said : 'he has 2 Walker in each leg'.
That way of speaking is just telling you that he was higly regarded.
 

Shadydan

Well-Known Member
Jul 7, 2012
38,247
104,143
I remember last year during a program of 'l'Equipe 21' French daily TV sport show, talking about Aurier they said : 'he has 2 Walker in each leg'.
That way of speaking is just telling you that he was higly regarded.

That's the kind of thing @Bus-Conductor would say but in a derogatory slant to Kyle.
 

Hercules

Well-Known Member
Jul 23, 2014
5,694
156,565
I know SA is not going, and neither should he! I know KWP wants to play RB! So Trips is the obvious, as 3 into 2 don’t go!
 

dondo

Well-Known Member
Jan 4, 2006
8,603
14,091
I know SA is not going, and neither should he! I know KWP wants to play RB! So Trips is the obvious, as 3 into 2 don’t go!


I would argue it kwp that goes if anyone, as if Pochettino does rate him he is doing a goof job of hiding it
 

IGSpur

Well-Known Member
Jan 11, 2013
7,939
13,758
That's the over the top bit, in 6 games people will see him be better than a full England international who is second to only Kyle Walker in goals created from right back. Tripps if far from perfect but he is much better than people give him credit for, when he is aggressive he is a seriously good player, just think back to the Real Madrid game.


Similarly teams may try and expose Tripps and Davies lack of pace but they rarely actually get exposed because of it, Much less so that Aurier and Rose this season thats for sure.


See the bit you highlighted, isn't my opinion, it's my observation of the general fanbase once a young player breaks through. I'm just saying while everyone is worried and sceptical now, give it a few games and everyone will likely change their tune, to what I commented.


I know how fans works and after 5/6 good games people will go from doubting him to overrating him and instantly declare him better than Trippier. We have seen the same with Winks. After around 6 starts some fans thought he was better than Dembele, but I still don't think he is even better than Onomah, and I don't think Onomah is better than Dembele. Yet I had spent 2 years before that arguing that Winks was good enough to play for the first team, and being accused of overrating him. Now he has shown his ability against adults, if I was to say Onomah is better or has more ability than Winks, the same fans they may have believed me beforehand would now call me deluded as Onomah hasn't had the platform to show.

Fans will immediately move from one end of the spectrum to the other based purely on experience alone. I get it, proving yourself is a massive part of it, but it isn't half exaggerated as soon as a young player bursts onto the scene. Even outside of our club. Around 2 years ago, though he still appeared small, but right size for his age I said Sessegnon was ready to play in the Championship and would do well for Fulham because I know he'd get a chance there. At that time he was as an attacker he was not on Foden, CHO or Sancho's level. If I told people those 3 were better back then, people would accept it. Now Sessegnon as predicted gets his shot and performs well, but the other 3 are struggling for time(Sancho excl. now) being at bigger clubs, but anyone dare suggest they're better than Sessegnon they're laughed at. So much value is placed on experience, that no one is willing to listen to what anyone says about ability even when comparing on an even platform. Yet if these same guys were given the experience look at Sancho now in the Bundesliga then people start listening.


I hope we do have young players who show themselves to be really worth a place in the team but no one, absolutely no one can say with any degree of certainty how good KWP is or if he would make it as a PL player because he is entirely unproved at this level, and there have been more talented players than him who have failed to make a grade.

I would like to see youth players be given a little bit more of a chance, particularly in games that don't really matter, but ultimately everyone needs a bit of patience as well, and accept the vast majority of times even the most hyped youth players will fail to make it in a top 6 club in the PL.

There is a difference between actual ability and ability to execute it. Before Kane, proved himself, there were fans who thought he would do better or be better than our current strikers. They had no 'evidence' as some would put it, but he went on that season to prove that he was better. At what point do you start declaring someone is a better player. At what point did Kane's ability improve beyond that of Soldado and Adebayor? Truth is some people could see at the start of that season he was most likely already better than them but he hadn't proved it. Was that a case of fling enough mud or were people just using their eyes having watched Kane loads and watched the other two loads. He had the ability at the start of that season but not the opportunity to display it. Truth is he may never have got the opportunity to prove it, or even in his EL games he may have missed one of his chances, as can happen and it may have affected his form, and we may have never have seen it. It doesn't mean that same ability was never there, it was just never shown or tapped into. Due to fortunate circumstances, we got to see Kane show it.

I personally believe you don't need to see players perform at the exact same level to make a judgement on who has more ability. I don't need Edwards to have played in whatever league to know he's a better dribbler than Livermore. I've seen World Class players and first teamers play u23 football and get bullied by 17 year olds but you then say the 17 year old can play 1st team and it's only against kids. It is possible to watch academy players over 20/30games assess their ability extrapolate it, make a mental adjustment and conclude that in your opinion they could perform better than a first teamer you've seen play 38 games if given the same chances. It is what managers and the like have to do in order to be able to give an academy player a chance. It is also what I do, granted your not going to believe some random fan on SC but similarly it is what scouts and other fans do with random signings. Take what they see from a different league and working out if they will be able to replicate it in another.

I believe KWP has more ability than Trippier, but I know that he will need at least a season and patience shown, to prove it. This isn’t to undermine Trippier’s ability but I am praising KWP. I came to that conclusion from watching their ability. It's not foolproof, nothing is, but it's fair.


FWIW I agree Trippier is a good RB, but I don't think he is top class, and I think from what I have seen of KWP that if he were given chances, he would soon look better than Trippier, and over the course of a season would outperform him. Equally, he could struggle for whatever reason and not look the part. After all Trippier was never good enough to make it out of the City academy. But I don't get why you wouldn't just try out the top quality players you have, if you (the manager) rate them, before deciding to splash 25m, on a player that will have to go through the whole acclimatisation process anyway. No one could absolutely say Aurier was going to be a success or any signing for that matter, like with anything there's a degree of guesswork, and I don't think believing the best RB at a top academy, having more ability, than a slightly above average RB is completely out of this world.

I know I rambled, but and probably went off topic, but some parts applied to your post. I think I'm improving
 

lukespurs7

Well-Known Member
Feb 21, 2006
4,833
4,259
Before Aurier came here he had a high stack appraisal. You cannot blame us going for him. Let’s see what he is like next season, and everyone inside is confident you will see s much different player. Trippier, I am not a fan of, and I know at least three opposition coaches who earmark him as our weakness when they played us. It so BLATANTLY OBVIOUS. If we are a T4, he has no place in our team to be perfectly honest.

Compare him to Citeh, Yanited, and Scoucers RB-No compare. He wouldn’t get near, and that is what we are aspiring to. Get on SA’s back after a full season, that involves a pre-season.
Serge will be good next season. He’s miles better than Trippier but I get the feeling Poch trusts trippier because he has a good attitude and works hard but for me Aurier is better in many ways, I think he and Lucas will be very good next season.
 

mpickard2087

Patient Zero
Jun 13, 2008
21,886
32,513
Alexander-Arnold is a good comparison, especially as they play the same position. Now I have seen him make mistakes this year and have poor games, but ultimately he's come through it and had a positive season.

KWP, as with any youngster, I can not say if he will ultimately make it - but if the club think a player has ability, the right attitude, and believe in using the academy then they need to be pitched in and see what happens. They might sink, they might swim, but that is the same with signings too.

You have to accept though that you will get some errors and poor games along the way, like TAA has had, even if they do end up proving themselves and 'making it'. All players, no matter what age/experience have crap games over a season... Liverpool have managed to blood a player and still made the Top Four plus almost certainly have a CL final to look forward to, the 'risk' factor is overblown.
 

Bus-Conductor

SC Supporter
Oct 19, 2004
39,837
50,713
Before Aurier came here he had a high stack appraisal. You cannot blame us going for him. Let’s see what he is like next season, and everyone inside is confident you will see s much different player. Trippier, I am not a fan of, and I know at least three opposition coaches who earmark him as our weakness when they played us. It so BLATANTLY OBVIOUS. If we are a T4, he has no place in our team to be perfectly honest.

Compare him to Citeh, Yanited, and Scoucers RB-No compare. He wouldn’t get near, and that is what we are aspiring to. Get on SA’s back after a full season, that involves a pre-season.

Who exactly held high stack appraisal for Aurier? PSG couldn’t wait to get shot of him, he couldn’t hold a regular place down and never had and caused trouble in the dressing room, including making a video calling his manager a faggot who sucked Ibra’s dick.

On the pitch Aurier’s as daft as Walker was/is and both of them have cost their team’s more goals through errors than Trippier has this season, and neither get close to Triipier’s quality in forward areas. Which is why he pisses their assist and chance created stats.

If your mates say they target Trippier, it just suggests they aren’t very good coaches, they’d be much better off targeting rb’s like Walker or Aurier as they are far more likely to do something stupid under pressure than Trippier is.

Just go and read what ManC fans think of Walker.

Poch certainly seems to trust Trippier more than Aurier, judging by the games he plays. And let’s not forget this is Trippiers first full season of regular starts for us too.

Personally I think KWP has the potential to be better than both Trippier and Aurier and the mistake we made was spending 24m plus wages for a player who’s going to take even more time than KWP would have to settle in and prove his worth and who wont be as good even then.
 

Hercules

Well-Known Member
Jul 23, 2014
5,694
156,565
Who exactly held high stack appraisal for Aurier? PSG couldn’t wait to get shot of him, he couldn’t hold a regular place down and never had and caused trouble in the dressing room, including making a video calling his manager a faggot who sucked Ibra’s dick.

On the pitch Aurier’s as daft as Walker was/is and both of them have cost their team’s more goals through errors than Trippier has this season, and neither get close to Triipier’s quality in forward areas. Which is why he pisses their assist and chance created stats.

If your mates say they target Trippier, it just suggests they aren’t very good coaches, they’d be much better off targeting rb’s like Walker or Aurier as they are far more likely to do something stupid under pressure than Trippier is.

Just go and read what ManC fans think of Walker.

Poch certainly seems to trust Trippier more than Aurier, judging by the games he plays. And let’s not forget this is Trippiers first full season of regular starts for us too.

Personally I think KWP has the potential to be better than both Trippier and Aurier and the mistake we made was spending 24m plus wages for a player who’s going to take even more time than KWP would have to settle in and prove his worth and who wont be as good even then.
Mate, I respect your views. But coming from the background that I have etc, and with my own eyes and ears knowing why it went tits up at PSG. There is 90% you are not aware of. Before he went to PSG, check out his Lens & Toulouse career.

Only time I will name drop is Henry was pushing goons to sign him, and raged about him. He has all the tools, and just needs to be coached and loved. The reason he got frozen out at PSG, was NOTHING to do with footballing reasons at all. There is more too it than that. He would of ended up at Yanited, If it wasn’t for a certain new scout we have, with his intel, and Daniel commandeering the best legal brains to do the deal.

Sometimes the fabs don’t know everything ?
 
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