What's new

The Rugby Thread

talkshowhost86

Mod-Moose
Staff
Oct 2, 2004
48,100
47,055
Fucking Ospreys breaking Billy V.

Still we got our own back with Haskell's assault on Jamie Roberts.

Hmmmm....not really a fair trade.
 

talkshowhost86

Mod-Moose
Staff
Oct 2, 2004
48,100
47,055
He’s starting to rival Sam Warburton in the brittle bone department.

Not quite that bad but it is frustrating for England particularly with Hughes out as well.

Fortunately Simmonds looks like some player so we'll be okay. Eddie may need to get over his aversion to picking Don Armand though.
 

talkshowhost86

Mod-Moose
Staff
Oct 2, 2004
48,100
47,055
Not looking great for English clubs generally in Europe this year and I do worry about the knock-on effect for the national team.

Only Exeter have it in their own hands to qualify, as even if (when) Sarries beat Northampton, they'd need to do it with a bonus point, hope Ospreys don't beat Clermont (or get any bonus points) and then hope results go their way in the race for best second place.

Northampton, Quins and Leicester have been a shambles, and Bath were torn apart by Scarlets the other day.

I was listening to a rugby podcast on the way in this morning and they think it's partly because the pro 12 teams are now stronger because they are being forced to qualify properly (and are therefore getting bigger squads) and partly because the English clubs are all going through a bad patch at the moment other than Exeter.

Personally I still think the pro 12 teams are helped a bit by not caring that much about their league until after the 6Ns (Ospreys being a prime example of that this year) but it's clear that for whatever reason the gap between those teams and the English/French teams is closing.

Will be interesting to see if it translates through to the 6 nations. I think Wales will be scuppered by injury and Gatland's refusal to adopt the style that is bringing Scarlets such success, but with Munster, Leinster and Ulster all topping their groups, you have to favour Ireland for the tournament at the moment.
 

E17yid

Well-Known Member
Jan 21, 2013
16,984
30,494
Not looking great for English clubs generally in Europe this year and I do worry about the knock-on effect for the national team.

Only Exeter have it in their own hands to qualify, as even if (when) Sarries beat Northampton, they'd need to do it with a bonus point, hope Ospreys don't beat Clermont (or get any bonus points) and then hope results go their way in the race for best second place.

Northampton, Quins and Leicester have been a shambles, and Bath were torn apart by Scarlets the other day.

I was listening to a rugby podcast on the way in this morning and they think it's partly because the pro 12 teams are now stronger because they are being forced to qualify properly (and are therefore getting bigger squads) and partly because the English clubs are all going through a bad patch at the moment other than Exeter.

Personally I still think the pro 12 teams are helped a bit by not caring that much about their league until after the 6Ns (Ospreys being a prime example of that this year) but it's clear that for whatever reason the gap between those teams and the English/French teams is closing.

Will be interesting to see if it translates through to the 6 nations. I think Wales will be scuppered by injury and Gatland's refusal to adopt the style that is bringing Scarlets such success, but with Munster, Leinster and Ulster all topping their groups, you have to favour Ireland for the tournament at the moment.

Yeah, we’re only in this weird situation this season due to being so bad in the league. I mean, we’re not in contention to get any European rugby next year so it’s natural we’d focus on the champions cup. In any normal season we’d be near the top and I think we’d be giving our all in the league but you’re right we’ve definitely sacked off the league to some extent this year and rightly so.

I think, as you alluded to, we’ve just got better, squads look better and it helps that the English clubs probably aren’t at their best at the moment. I wouldn’t read to much into this spilling over into 6N form but it can’t hurt. Like you say the Irish are looking in great nik bit we all knew they’d be strong.

There’s signs Gats is adopting a more Scarlets based style but it’s personel dependent and a lot will depend on who we can actually put into a 23 match day squad on the day. I’m still massively worried about our front 5 but we’ve got some good options in other areas.

Big Billy V is a big loss for you. Him missing that 2nd half in The Ospreys game was huge as he was playing well, he didn’t even really look like he’s been out. I didn’t know Hughes was out until you said the other day so it’ll be interesting to see what you do at 8. Let’s not kid ourselves, though, you’ve still got a lot of very good players and it’s a coin toss between you and Ireland imo.
 

Japhet

Well-Known Member
Aug 30, 2010
19,232
57,387
Not quite that bad but it is frustrating for England particularly with Hughes out as well.

Fortunately Simmonds looks like some player so we'll be okay. Eddie may need to get over his aversion to picking Don Armand though.


Dave Ewers is looking good again at Exeter. Offers an option at 8 as well.
 

talkshowhost86

Mod-Moose
Staff
Oct 2, 2004
48,100
47,055
Dave Ewers is looking good again at Exeter. Offers an option at 8 as well.

It'll be interesting to see what England do. Eddie's tactics seem to rely quite heavily on a ball-carrying 8, so without Billy or Hughes he'll have to either find an alternative or get his ball-carrying elsewhere.

My concern is that he'll try and Play Maro or Lawes at 7 which I thought unbalanced us horribly when we tried it previously.

With Ewers, Simmonds and Armand all playing well for the Chiefs, we do have options, but none do quite the same thing as Billy and Hughes so we'll need to adapt.
 

Japhet

Well-Known Member
Aug 30, 2010
19,232
57,387
It'll be interesting to see what England do. Eddie's tactics seem to rely quite heavily on a ball-carrying 8, so without Billy or Hughes he'll have to either find an alternative or get his ball-carrying elsewhere.

My concern is that he'll try and Play Maro or Lawes at 7 which I thought unbalanced us horribly when we tried it previously.

With Ewers, Simmonds and Armand all playing well for the Chiefs, we do have options, but none do quite the same thing as Billy and Hughes so we'll need to adapt.


I think he'll most likely go with Maro and Underhill at 6 & 7 and Simmonds at 8. We'll certainly miss Billy and hughes though but we should be better at the breakdown.
 

E17yid

Well-Known Member
Jan 21, 2013
16,984
30,494
I think he'll most likely go with Maro and Underhill at 6 & 7 and Simmonds at 8. We'll certainly miss Billy and hughes though but we should be better at the breakdown.

Launchbury and Lawes in the 2nd row?

Lawes hasn’t been that great recently but I guess he’s been better than Kruis, just.
 

talkshowhost86

Mod-Moose
Staff
Oct 2, 2004
48,100
47,055
I think he'll most likely go with Maro and Underhill at 6 & 7 and Simmonds at 8. We'll certainly miss Billy and hughes though but we should be better at the breakdown.

I'd be pretty surprised if Robshaw was dropped to be honest.

He's been an ever present under Eddie, and rarely has a bad game for England, and is even playing well in quite a poor Quins side.

We'll see though. He might decide that if we don't have a rampaging 8, then we instead need to sacrifice Robshaw's work-rate for the ball carrying of Itoje at 7.

I would like to see Simmonds at 7 actually as he was great over the ball for Exeter at the weekend, and I'm not sold on Underhill just yet.
 

E17yid

Well-Known Member
Jan 21, 2013
16,984
30,494
I'd be pretty surprised if Robshaw was dropped to be honest.

He's been an ever present under Eddie, and rarely has a bad game for England, and is even playing well in quite a poor Quins side.

We'll see though. He might decide that if we don't have a rampaging 8, then we instead need to sacrifice Robshaw's work-rate for the ball carrying of Itoje at 7.

I would like to see Simmonds at 7 actually as he was great over the ball for Exeter at the weekend, and I'm not sold on Underhill just yet.

Underhill has only just come back from injury as well. He looked off the pace against Scarlets the other night. Still only 21, though.
 

mpickard2087

Patient Zero
Jun 13, 2008
21,886
32,512
Depends how long Haskell gets banned for. I wouldn't do it, but wouldn't be shocked if he was put at 8 and just told to run hard at the opposition.

6. Itoje
7. Robshaw
8. Haskell

20. Simmonds

Italy first up, Haskell probably banned, where Simmonds might get the shirt with Underhill benching.
 

talkshowhost86

Mod-Moose
Staff
Oct 2, 2004
48,100
47,055
Underhill has only just come back from injury as well. He looked off the pace against Scarlets the other night. Still only 21, though.

Absolutely Underhill has ages to develop, but the international arena is not always the place to do it. He also needs to learn to tackle with his arms and not his face.

Depends how long Haskell gets banned for. I wouldn't do it, but wouldn't be shocked if he was put at 8 and just told to run hard at the opposition.

6. Itoje
7. Robshaw
8. Haskell

20. Simmonds

Italy first up, Haskell probably banned, where Simmonds might get the shirt with Underhill benching.

Haskell has been awful when he's played for Wasps this year. Personally I think it would make a mockery of the selection process if he gets in ahead of people like Ewers and Armand.

I think before Billy's injury we might have seen Simmonds at 7 against Italy, but not sure what we'll do now.

The other established player who has to be looking over his shoulder is Josephs, as Slade has really started to look the business at 13.
 

teok

Well-Known Member
Aug 11, 2011
10,836
33,607
England look in absolutely terrible shape for the 6N. Ireland were favourites anyway but they should now walk it. A bit of a shame really as a few months ago I was thinking this year would be a classic.
 

E17yid

Well-Known Member
Jan 21, 2013
16,984
30,494
No Roberts, though hardly surprising.

James Davies’ call up is much deserved. Got some great options at 7 even with Warburton out.

Tipuric, Davies and Navidi.
 

E17yid

Well-Known Member
Jan 21, 2013
16,984
30,494
England look in absolutely terrible shape for the 6N. Ireland were favourites anyway but they should now walk it. A bit of a shame really as a few months ago I was thinking this year would be a classic.

If Ireland were favourites there wasn’t much more than a **** hair between you and them. To say they’ll walk it now is ridiculous. Are you just basing this on the Champions Cup?
 
Last edited:

talkshowhost86

Mod-Moose
Staff
Oct 2, 2004
48,100
47,055
England look in absolutely terrible shape for the 6N. Ireland were favourites anyway but they should now walk it. A bit of a shame really as a few months ago I was thinking this year would be a classic.

Terrible shape?

We've only lost one player from our first XV. Granted he's our best player, and granted his backup is also injured, but it's hardly the case that we're in terrible shape.

With the pool of players available to England we should always be able to cover a selection of injuries, let alone one, so don't think we can make any sort of excuse before the tournament on that front.

My team for the first game would be:

1. Mako
2. George (but it will be Hartley)
3. Cole
4. Lawes
5. Itoje
6. Robshaw
7. Simmonds
8. Ewers
9. Care (but it will be Youngs)
10. Ford
11. May
12. Farrell
13. Slade (but it will be Josephs)
14. Daly (Woodburn to come in if he's injured)
15. Watson (but it will be Brown)

That's still a very strong team with a very deep bench available (the players who don't get picked from above plus the likes of Launchbury, Williams/Sinckler, maybe even Tuilagi available?) so I don't think it's right to say we're in terrible shape.

I make Ireland favourites just because of the form of their international team recently, and the fact they have all carried that through into the top level club matches, but with us playing them at Twickenham I don't think anyone can say they are going to walk it.
 

E17yid

Well-Known Member
Jan 21, 2013
16,984
30,494
Terrible shape?

We've only lost one player from our first XV. Granted he's our best player, and granted his backup is also injured, but it's hardly the case that we're in terrible shape.

With the pool of players available to England we should always be able to cover a selection of injuries, let alone one, so don't think we can make any sort of excuse before the tournament on that front.

My team for the first game would be:

1. Mako
2. George (but it will be Hartley)
3. Cole
4. Lawes
5. Itoje
6. Robshaw
7. Simmonds
8. Ewers
9. Care (but it will be Youngs)
10. Ford
11. May
12. Farrell
13. Slade (but it will be Josephs)
14. Daly (Woodburn to come in if he's injured)
15. Watson (but it will be Brown)

That's still a very strong team with a very deep bench available (the players who don't get picked from above plus the likes of Launchbury, Williams/Sinckler, maybe even Tuilagi available?) so I don't think it's right to say we're in terrible shape.

I make Ireland favourites just because of the form of their international team recently, and the fact they have all carried that through into the top level club matches, but with us playing them at Twickenham I don't think anyone can say they are going to walk it.

I read the other day that Daly is out. Could be wrong.
 
Top