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Match Threads Tottenham Hotspur vs Liverpool FC

SirHarryHotspur

Well-Known Member
Aug 9, 2017
5,005
7,422
I have great confidence that for our next PL against Brighton , Harry will be back to his former self with plenty of shots on target I have transferred him out of my fantasy football team, that should do the trick.
 

Sweetsman

Well-Known Member
Jan 30, 2011
6,673
6,588
In Jan? No, I don't believe we will. I believe we could (not financially as I have no way of knowing). There are a few players on questionable contractual circumstances that could help but in the long term I am not sure that is the best route. First off we need to make some real hard choices and get rid of some players. And Poch has to show the balls that he expects from the players and get rid of some of his favorites because they are causing roster issues ie home grown.

If there was truly money and a desire to recruit during the TW then we needed to bite the bullet on some of the players' contracts and take what was offered in order to open up team places. We heard the PR bullshit at the end of the window but I was mentioning it during the Kyle Walker transfer. It was an impending issue that needed attention. And if we intended to bring anyone in then that shit should have been done immediately following the last season. We hedge on that so I don't believe there was ever any intention on bringing anyone in this window.

So long story short I feel the best time to rejig the team is in the summer and we need a full rejig since we haven't taken the incremental steps necessary in the past few windows.
So, who would you get rid of and who do you think are realistic targets?
 

Sweetsman

Well-Known Member
Jan 30, 2011
6,673
6,588
I think dier rose Janseen sissoko llorente Aurier need to go.. dier I just don't think is gonna improve any more as a footballer.
I'd agree with you on all the above, except Aurier. I think I'd like to see more of him to see whether Poch can iron out the wrinkles.
 

dtxspurs

Welcome to the Good Life
Dec 28, 2017
11,234
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I'd agree with you on all the above, except Aurier. I think I'd like to see more of him to see whether Poch can iron out the wrinkles.
If we can get good fees for both he and Trippier I would be all for shipping both out, bringing in a top notch RB and just letting KWP be the backup.
 

Sweetsman

Well-Known Member
Jan 30, 2011
6,673
6,588
If we can get good fees for both he and Trippier I would be all for shipping both out, bringing in a top notch RB and just letting KWP be the backup.
Aurier was supposed to be that, probably because he was at PSG. Who is in charge of our French scouting, because the hit rate has been woeful? I have to say that KWP has shown all the attributes of a very good wingback, so why hasn't he been promoted?
 

Trees

Well-Known Member
Aug 31, 2012
1,534
4,203
Ruffle a few feathers. Drop / rest some undroppables. Stick to a system for a few weeks. This management larkie is simple.
 

dtxspurs

Welcome to the Good Life
Dec 28, 2017
11,234
46,574
Aurier was supposed to be that, probably because he was at PSG. Who is in charge of our French scouting, because the hit rate has been woeful? I have to say that KWP has shown all the attributes of a very good wingback, so why hasn't he been promoted?
Yeah, idk what has happened to him. Although I can't imagine its helpful that he doesn't speak English.
 

heelspurs

Le filet mignon est un bastion de rosbif
Jul 25, 2012
4,270
5,105
So, who would you get rid of and who do you think are realistic targets?
That's a loaded question for me to answer. I have significantly different ideas than most on here and I have no sacred cows except Harry...to a point. And that point is whether or not his transfer can truly lead to a better team, squad, and club. He is special for reasons beyond footballing so it would have to serve him as well. But like Liverpool did with Coutinho and we didn't do with Bale you can lose a top player and come out better. You just have to have direction in your efforts and not the vague 'profit' as your guide. People laughed at pool for coutinho but I dreaded him leaving. He held them back and they are much better off without him. He was never a Klopp player but he is better off as well and so is Barca. Almost a perfect transfer.

To define the targets I would have to know who is leaving. I will start with who I would not consider leaving: Hugo, Jan, Harry, Eriksen, Sanchez, Lucas, Sonny (and probably Lamela because he hasn't bitched about coming from the bench)...no, no, no, don't take a second look. That's my list. I would keep Toby if things could be worked out but if not and I could replace him with a decent youngster then that would be good. We missed Diallo (and WHam picked up a good player in Issa Diop from Toulouse for cheap but I don't think he was ready for us) and that's a shame because he is gonna be a player. BVB did very well in getting him and jettisoning their garbage off to Arsenal.

To give names is somewhat difficult as many of the players I liked moved this summer and now we have no chance of getting them. Now it's on to the next crop. As you can tell from my previous list I prefer players with less recognizable names. Once they hit the level of being recognized by the FIFA bandits then we have no financial chance so why dream. Also, I don't need to have proxy-penis measuring contests and I don't measure a player's ability or likelihood of helping the team by his name recognition.
I though Vorm was leaving this summer but they gave him a contract further exacerbating our HG issue. FFS get us an English GK in there somehow. If Gazza is good enough for number 2 then great but we won't know unless we give him the cups.


Figure out Toby's issues but Jan finishes his career here. Move Dier back to CB or get rid. If he can play on the left side the awesome because otherwise we would have 4 right-sided CBs in Toby, Sanchez, Dier and Foyth and on Jan on the left.

People won't want to hear it but Trips and Davies would go. We should have dumped Trips in Jan when Leicester were thinking of shelling out 30M for him. He has improved but his defense is still shit and I hate our over-reliance on crossing. He does have some decent passing combos over there though.

Davies is limited athletically, struggles to get any service into the box without hitting the defender, and takes a run of games to get up to speed...not ideal for a backup player. They seem really decent blokes and you would love to have them in your team but then your aspirations would be limited because they are.

Aurier is complicating this. I fully expected him to unseat Trips and for whatever reason it hasn't occurred. Don't know why he is not up to speed. From a roster perspective I hoped for Serge to start and KWP to back him up. But Trips is still #1 and KWP looks a little light in the ass though. He spends half his performances on the ground so who knows.

If Danny's form picks up then we could keep him and recruit on top of him. He seems to be getting more fit so let's hope his ball work tightens up.

This need to be BLOW'D UP. The number needed is difficult to say right now but most importantly they must be fundamentally/technically sound, athletic, and intelligent. No 1 footers, slow coaches, weaklings, etc. And it depends on what formation Poch was to ultimately play. He mentioned before that his perfect system has 1 holding/base MF. It was in the context of the 4141 discussion. If this is true then we need a new body in here. All around midfielders are rare these days but for me it is the pinnacle of a footballer.

I wouldn't want to see Dele or Eriksen anywhere near my midfield as neither wants the ball with a guy on their back and Dele lacks the touch/control and the technical ability beat a man there while also making sure to not lose the ball. And this is not the place for his flopping in the hope for a foul. Although Eriksen has great touch he is not a great close control guy and is terrified of people on his back. And neither are great passers off the dribble...from the MF not throughballs releasing a player.

If Vic is a sicknote then move him on. Retaining Mousa for a proper older player role is fine but not what we are doing already this season. Winks must stay healthy this year or he would get recruited on top of.

3-4 players are need here: 1DM unless Vic goes and would prefer it to be a 6/8 hybrid and not a pure 6; 2 CMs and a player to keep Eriksen on his toes.

The outs are obvious but not sure anyone will take those with contracts. Janssen was a fool for not taking the Brighton opportunity. Bet he regrets that now.

I've said previously that once we got a players here that were more technically sound that certain players would find their previous value to the team in question. Moura has become very valuable to us in a short period of time. With Sonny able (and hopefully willing) to play from the right it gives us a great attacking 3 with Kane (not current Kane but actually good Kane). But that gives us a selection headache with Dele as he would have no natural position in a 433 and would not be favored in a 4231. This diamond shit Poch has thrown together is a way to get all his ol'reliables on the field and Lucas. But thus far this season you would have to pick Lucas over Dele.

Dele and Eriksen have done their best work in free-ish roles. Sure they drop when needed and press from the front but we have lots of possession and their job is to find space and create. Our MF is no longer dominant and we can't afford 1 free role let alone 2. And when Eriksen and Dele are given defensive/midfield responsibilities they 'disappear' to quote many a poster. Well actually they haven't disappeared they are just 20 yards deeper into our end doing donkey work.

But considering how shaky we look I hope Poch goes back to the base 4231 with a 532 in the away CL and tougher league games. I think this gives Poch some selection headaches.
 

Styopa

Well-Known Member
Jan 19, 2014
5,136
14,177
We're starting to look really stale which is at least partly a result of our decision not to bring in anyone new during the transfer window. I don't think it's a knee jerk reaction to say we're lacking any spark right now. The really disappointing thing about Saturday's match is that Liverpool weren't so good that they blew us away it's just we never got going - which has been been the theme of the last 4 matches barring the second half against Utd.
 

Jonboy

Well-Known Member
Jul 15, 2005
1,151
990
100% agree with the above post.
I'm so disappointed with Spurs at the moment. Liverpool bossed us on Saturday and I agree a lack of signings have not helped at all
Fuck me how can I team that finished 3rd and have won fuck all for so long not find anyone that could improve on our squad is absolutely beyond me. It showed a complete lack of ambition, incompetence even and I fear dropping out of the top 4 will only confirm this.
 

wrd

Well-Known Member
Aug 22, 2014
13,603
58,005
We're starting to look really stale which is at least partly a result of our decision not to bring in anyone new during the transfer window. I don't think it's a knee jerk reaction to say we're lacking any spark right now. The really disappointing thing about Saturday's match is that Liverpool weren't so good that they blew us away it's just we never got going - which has been been the theme of the last 4 matches barring the second half against Utd.

What was frustrating was that at 2-0 there was 25 mins or so of nothingness and we could have got back into the game as evidenced by the final 5 minutes.

We do look stale I agree and over last 2 seasons we have gone on poor little runs early into the season and I hope Poch makes big changes, we shouldnt have to settle for top players putting in poor performances week after week not being dropped with Lamela, Son and Winks back.
 

Sweetsman

Well-Known Member
Jan 30, 2011
6,673
6,588
That's a loaded question for me to answer. I have significantly different ideas than most on here and I have no sacred cows except Harry...to a point. And that point is whether or not his transfer can truly lead to a better team, squad, and club. He is special for reasons beyond footballing so it would have to serve him as well. But like Liverpool did with Coutinho and we didn't do with Bale you can lose a top player and come out better. You just have to have direction in your efforts and not the vague 'profit' as your guide. People laughed at pool for coutinho but I dreaded him leaving. He held them back and they are much better off without him. He was never a Klopp player but he is better off as well and so is Barca. Almost a perfect transfer.

To define the targets I would have to know who is leaving. I will start with who I would not consider leaving: Hugo, Jan, Harry, Eriksen, Sanchez, Lucas, Sonny (and probably Lamela because he hasn't bitched about coming from the bench)...no, no, no, don't take a second look. That's my list. I would keep Toby if things could be worked out but if not and I could replace him with a decent youngster then that would be good. We missed Diallo (and WHam picked up a good player in Issa Diop from Toulouse for cheap but I don't think he was ready for us) and that's a shame because he is gonna be a player. BVB did very well in getting him and jettisoning their garbage off to Arsenal.

To give names is somewhat difficult as many of the players I liked moved this summer and now we have no chance of getting them. Now it's on to the next crop. As you can tell from my previous list I prefer players with less recognizable names. Once they hit the level of being recognized by the FIFA bandits then we have no financial chance so why dream. Also, I don't need to have proxy-penis measuring contests and I don't measure a player's ability or likelihood of helping the team by his name recognition.
I though Vorm was leaving this summer but they gave him a contract further exacerbating our HG issue. FFS get us an English GK in there somehow. If Gazza is good enough for number 2 then great but we won't know unless we give him the cups.


Figure out Toby's issues but Jan finishes his career here. Move Dier back to CB or get rid. If he can play on the left side the awesome because otherwise we would have 4 right-sided CBs in Toby, Sanchez, Dier and Foyth and on Jan on the left.

People won't want to hear it but Trips and Davies would go. We should have dumped Trips in Jan when Leicester were thinking of shelling out 30M for him. He has improved but his defense is still shit and I hate our over-reliance on crossing. He does have some decent passing combos over there though.

Davies is limited athletically, struggles to get any service into the box without hitting the defender, and takes a run of games to get up to speed...not ideal for a backup player. They seem really decent blokes and you would love to have them in your team but then your aspirations would be limited because they are.

Aurier is complicating this. I fully expected him to unseat Trips and for whatever reason it hasn't occurred. Don't know why he is not up to speed. From a roster perspective I hoped for Serge to start and KWP to back him up. But Trips is still #1 and KWP looks a little light in the ass though. He spends half his performances on the ground so who knows.

If Danny's form picks up then we could keep him and recruit on top of him. He seems to be getting more fit so let's hope his ball work tightens up.

This need to be BLOW'D UP. The number needed is difficult to say right now but most importantly they must be fundamentally/technically sound, athletic, and intelligent. No 1 footers, slow coaches, weaklings, etc. And it depends on what formation Poch was to ultimately play. He mentioned before that his perfect system has 1 holding/base MF. It was in the context of the 4141 discussion. If this is true then we need a new body in here. All around midfielders are rare these days but for me it is the pinnacle of a footballer.

I wouldn't want to see Dele or Eriksen anywhere near my midfield as neither wants the ball with a guy on their back and Dele lacks the touch/control and the technical ability beat a man there while also making sure to not lose the ball. And this is not the place for his flopping in the hope for a foul. Although Eriksen has great touch he is not a great close control guy and is terrified of people on his back. And neither are great passers off the dribble...from the MF not throughballs releasing a player.

If Vic is a sicknote then move him on. Retaining Mousa for a proper older player role is fine but not what we are doing already this season. Winks must stay healthy this year or he would get recruited on top of.

3-4 players are need here: 1DM unless Vic goes and would prefer it to be a 6/8 hybrid and not a pure 6; 2 CMs and a player to keep Eriksen on his toes.

The outs are obvious but not sure anyone will take those with contracts. Janssen was a fool for not taking the Brighton opportunity. Bet he regrets that now.

I've said previously that once we got a players here that were more technically sound that certain players would find their previous value to the team in question. Moura has become very valuable to us in a short period of time. With Sonny able (and hopefully willing) to play from the right it gives us a great attacking 3 with Kane (not current Kane but actually good Kane). But that gives us a selection headache with Dele as he would have no natural position in a 433 and would not be favored in a 4231. This diamond shit Poch has thrown together is a way to get all his ol'reliables on the field and Lucas. But thus far this season you would have to pick Lucas over Dele.

Dele and Eriksen have done their best work in free-ish roles. Sure they drop when needed and press from the front but we have lots of possession and their job is to find space and create. Our MF is no longer dominant and we can't afford 1 free role let alone 2. And when Eriksen and Dele are given defensive/midfield responsibilities they 'disappear' to quote many a poster. Well actually they haven't disappeared they are just 20 yards deeper into our end doing donkey work.

But considering how shaky we look I hope Poch goes back to the base 4231 with a 532 in the away CL and tougher league games. I think this gives Poch some selection headaches.
I was going to give you a LOL about Dier. I agree pretty much with everything you've said, including Kane. That said, he has the will to win and based on what Lamela once told Rose, Lamela also thinks we can win big things. In fact, I see Kane getting a lot more service from Lamela than Eriksen right now.
 

Sweetsman

Well-Known Member
Jan 30, 2011
6,673
6,588
I didn't go to the match and a friend bought the ticket off me. He's a Man U fan. His comment was that the midfield was weak; and he was glad they didn't buy Dier. I don't know what's happened with Dier, but his concentration levels are down there with peak-Walker.
 

shelfmonkey

Weird is different, different is interesting.
Mar 21, 2007
6,690
8,040
Correct

Watch this video and look at how many mistakes we make and Liverpool aren't even pressing that much, it's cringe worthy.

I know the vid is trying to make out like Liverpool rushed us but the truth is that we kept giving the ball away.



Everything about us in that vid was half hearted!! Something is wrong at the club, what that is I have no idea, but based on our performances so far this season, I'm very worried!!
 

The Doc

Well-Known Member
Dec 18, 2012
881
2,456
Everything about us in that vid was half hearted!! Something is wrong at the club, what that is I have no idea, but based on our performances so far this season, I'm very worried!!

It's not halfhearted. Just really poor. From everyone. Dier's no look throughball for Salah was so bad I almost choked on my beer with laughter. Even if you did that on a Sunday morning in div 8 you would expect to get slaughtered. Can try to pin it on tiredness, formation, confidence, whatever, but, sometimes it's just that. Everyone has a shocker. I can't see us playing that badly again all season. Obviously, will revisit that claim tomorrow.
 

spursfan77

Well-Known Member
Aug 13, 2005
46,680
104,957
I have great confidence that for our next PL against Brighton , Harry will be back to his former self with plenty of shots on target I have transferred him out of my fantasy football team, that should do the trick.

I think I'm going to do the same. It usually works!
 

UbeAstard

Well-Known Member
May 31, 2005
3,354
2,413
Whilst I agree that the long term view should be noted and taken into account, I also feel that we have been completely negligent in regards to the playing staff.

Let's say we continue to struggle this season and end up 5th or 6th, is it the end of the world? No.

But what are the consequences? Poch decides that he has taken us as far as he can and believes he won't ever be able to compete with the big guns so in order to do so needs to join one? Eriksen decides that he wants to win something as another year of his life has gone by without competing and packs off to Real? Kane, having seen his manager and the club's other talisman leave, ponders for the first time can he really win stuff at the club? Toby, knowing he has the upper hand, leaves?

Now that may sound a little too far but I do believe that one of these things happening can act as the catalyst for this club to take more steps backwards. Considering we were probably in the best situation we have ever been in (in my lifetime), to fall from here without winning anything will be extremely demoralising.

Yes, the club will still be here, we will have this fantastic stadium and we'll have many other times to look forward to but you can't help but feel saddened when other clubs (that you've been ahead of for the last few years) start to surpass you, knowing that if you had been more proactive it wouldn't have come to this.

I've seen my favourites and top players leave, Hoddle, Archibald, Gascoigne, Carrick, Berbatov, Bale, Modric etc because we cant afford to match the ambition of the big clubs. I've seen the board give managers money which has been wasted on dross players to suit the crave for signings. Now Levy has seen that splashing cash doesn't equate to success or getting near to being on a level with the top clubs, though you may with a bit of luck and good management win the odd trophy (our squads were better than the WIgan who won the FA cup and Leicester who won the league).
A couple of years back Van Gaal who was interested in Kane said something like 'Manchester United will always be a bigger club than Spurs'. This will never change while we take short term views, so if we have players who are as fickle as some of our fans with the short term view and cant understand how things have changed financially over the last year, of course they may leave. Add to Pochettinho too who is one of the best managers we have seen for some time (but by no means perfect). I understand why we need to change what we have done in the past and take this longer term view, the stadium is the most important thing to try to get us to that level.
 

alfie103

Well-Known Member
Jun 4, 2005
3,967
4,441
Anyone would have thought we lost 5-0. We weren't great but Liverpool are a very good side who got the champions league final last year and have improved on that side.
 

Gassin's finest

C'est diabolique
May 12, 2010
37,355
87,828
I personally think that it's been nothing more, so far this season, than Poch playing around trying to find a formation/system that might help him crack the missing piece of the puzzle in the search for a trophy. And it's not really working out, because the midfield has been looking weird thus far, leaving the defence exposed, and the attack isolated.

Our midfield really is where our team succeeds or fails. The right balance of destroyer, pivot, hook and attackers has been lost. I'll bet a chicken tikka pukka pie, that a return to:

Wanyama - Dembele
Lamela -- Eriksen -- Alli​

will result in us being brutal again. Yes Moura, Son etc are great for goals and disruption, and I'll concede that Moose may be almost over the hill and hopefully Winks can take that deep lying pivot role up. But Alli is the missing link between midfield and Kane, and Lamela is a force of nature.
 
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