Tottenham Takeover Talk

[McFlash]

Levy apologists

Oh fuck off with the name calling, this isn't the school playground FFS.

 

[Misfit]

Lets wait and see how stringent these measures are.

Yes, I have large reservations that the cash cows of UEFA will be reigned in by UEFA, and that's before we get into UEFA's observable track record down the years.

In which case the window for clubs hasn't closed and I'd happily take it.

 

[HodisGawd]

Levy apologists always forget this bit.

No-one forgets this at all, but some of us can recognise it for what it is: a reductive point that ignores all the complexities.

 

[Snarfalicious]

We rich yet?

 

[carmeldevil]

We rich yet?

Not you. Sorry.

 

[jay2040]

Well he could put more focus on trying to win some of the competitions we are in.

He is doing exactly that, though maybe his chosen year is different to yours!

 

[fecka]

Good point, but I guess with the Kane sale (pure profit) it would make a difference too. I think I read somewhere an academy sale allows you to spend 3x what you sell them.

Due to recent numbers and analysis from the latest numbers from Swiss Ramble, the FFP number is likely less than half of 400m as we've run at a loss for the last 4 or 5 seasons. The 400m is from the season after we hadn't signed a single player and gone to the CL final if I recall correctly.

 

[brasil_spur]

Due to recent numbers and analysis from the latest numbers from Swiss Ramble, the FFP number is likely less than half of 400m as we've run at a loss for the last 4 or 5 seasons. The 400m is from the season after we hadn't signed a single player and gone to the CL final if I recall correctly.

The losses come from the Stadium and other infra projects connected to it and the club, which don't come into FFP calculations.

The latest I've seen on this since the 22/23 accounts were released is below, basically if we get CL this season we have nearly £650m of FFP headroom this summer, before player sales are taken into account.

 

[tubbygold]

The losses come from the Stadium and other infra projects connected to it and the club, which don't come into FFP calculations.

The latest I've seen on this since the 22/23 accounts were released is below, basically if we get CL this season we have nearly £650m of FFP headroom this summer, before player sales are taken into account.

View attachment 139679

Woo! We win!

 

[Stuart Leathercock]

The losses come from the Stadium and other infra projects connected to it and the club, which don't come into FFP calculations.

The latest I've seen on this since the 22/23 accounts were released is below, basically if we get CL this season we have nearly £650m of FFP headroom this summer, before player sales are taken into account.

View attachment 139679

We have nothing like that for PL rules. Not even close unfortunately.
We are allowed to spend 70% of our turnover on player wages and transfer fees, amortised over the length of the signed players’ contracts with a cap of (I think) 5 or 6 years. Plus profit (fee minus remaining book value) of players sold.

With our current wage bill and amortisation numbers we will likely have around £70m - £110m of net transfer spend available to us if we are to stay within PL fair play limits.

 

[brasil_spur]

We have nothing like that for PL rules. Not even close unfortunately.
We are allowed to spend 70% of our turnover on player wages and transfer fees, amortised over the length of the signed players’ contracts with a cap of (I think) 5 or 6 years. Plus profit (fee minus remaining book value) of players sold.

With our current wage bill and amortisation numbers we will likely have around £70m - £110m of net transfer spend available to us if we are to stay within PL fair play limits.

100% wrong as of right now.

The only rules currently in effect are the ones that have been for several years now.

There was however a meeting last week where clubs agreed to progress talks on supplementing these rules with new ones that align with the UEFA squad % rule which you've mentioned above. That meeting means that there will be further discussions and another vote in June before these rules come into effect.

These rules are likely to see the continued rule continue for now as they phase in the 70% UEFA rule (85% for non CL European competitions).

Right now UEFA 70% rule is still being phased, this season it was 90% and next it will be 80%.

There are no firm details on what next season's PL version of this will be, but the rumours are it will start at 85% of revenue. If we get CL we'll obviously have to adjust this down to be compliant there, to the 80% number that is in place for next season in the CL.

Now the point to note here is that it is from the previous seasons revenue numbers, so we don't currently know what that number looks like as we've only just seen a release of 22/23 season accounts. Also there are sponsorship deals still being worked on right now. Likewise the transfer window opens in June and allows a small amount of time for further player sales.

But if we assume a modest 10% increase in revenue for this year versus last (modest because of the lack of European football and domestic cup progression but it does include the sale of Kane), then that puts of 23/24 revenue number at about £600m revenue (rounded number for ease).

I don't know our exact wage bill, but we've lost some of the higher earners this season, so let's assume it's about £235m*. I would imagine amortisation has increased as well so let's call that £125m.

So some real "bag of a napkin" maths put us at £600m revenue, meaning £510m available to spend, less £360m of wages and amortisation.

So I reckon the realistic number is about £150m in order to stay within the new PRS guidelines, if they come in.

This whole thing is a bit pointless anyway, as frankly the amount of headroom we have above about £100-120m is unlikely to be used.

So there's definitely some variance depending on what our revenue number is, because we had a £70m uplift in revenue from player sales (thanks to Kane) but a loss of CL revenue which is about £50m. But then there's the overall increase in revenue from the stadium and associated revenue streams that brings in growing year on year, as well increases in TV rights money.

*I'm not 100& sure if we need to count all wages or just footballing wages in the total wages - if it's just footballing then the wages number comes down a fair bit.

What is interesting to note in all of this though, is that if this is the position we are in, despite generating massive amounts of revenue, the available player signing budgets for the likes of Chelsea, Villa and Newcastle this summer are going to be interesting to watch.

Villa, for example, are likely to have revenue of about £250m = £210 @ 85%, less wages at £150m and amortisation at £100m. So currently it looks like Villa will probably fall foul of these regulations and in a best case scenario will have £0 transfer budget this summer.

Also worth noting is that it doesn't matter who they sell after 1st July as this will only help their PRS compliance for the following (25/26) season.

Newcastle look a bit healthier at revenue of £275m = £235m @ 85%, less wages at £100m and amortisation at £100m. So they could likely have up to maybe £50m this summer to spend.

Chelsea are proper fucked though. They have revenues of £510m = £465m, wages of £405m and amortisation of £205 for this season 22/23. Next season isn't likely to be any better for them as there's no European football and they spent a further £400m+ on players last summer that will be hitting their amortisation accounts for this summers PSR calculations. So right now Chelsea are likely £150m ish over PSR for this summer, hence the need for them to generate lots of revenue before then end of June.

 

[SirHarryHotspur]

*I'm not 100& sure if we need to count all wages or just footballing wages in the total wages - if it's just footballing then the wages number comes down a fair bit.

Don't think it's ever been explained what part of the wage bill counts , in the recent Tottenham Hotspur Ltd accounts there are 320 players & football admin staff out of a total of 793 employees at the club with a total wage bill of circa £251 million.

 

[brasil_spur]

Don't think it's ever been explained what part of the wage bill counts , in the recent Tottenham Hotspur Ltd accounts there are 320 players & football admin staff out of a total of 793 employees at the club with a total wage bill of circa £251 million.

Yep this is definitely the grey area. Most online sources have our player wage bill at around £120m for 22/23 season, yet as you say that's less than half the reported amount of wages in our accounts.

Obviously the little bald fella gets a fair wedge, as does Ange and his team, but I would expect non playing staff wages not to count, along with the women's team and youth teams.

So you would think that wages are more likely to be around £150m for PRS than £250m, in which case we have a further £100m of head room.

 

[mil1lion]

This is the stuff I trust Levy with so if he can manage that and we get investment to allow to spend enough to compete without breaching that would be perfect