Tottenham Vs Chelsea: Match Thread

[dagraham]

Chelsea's league position doesn't change the fact that they are shit.
Their fans are shit.
Their players are shit.
They're run by shit.
They play on a shit ground.
They act like shit.
They talk like shit.
They walk like shit.
They're shit.

Personally I think the chant was succinct and to the point for that lot.

Surely, "you're ***** is more appropriate? However, I get your point .

 

[Gb160]

For me, the "you're shit" chant was very annoying. Because they aren't. They're a top side.

For us to be chanting "you're shit" when we're beating the Premiership leaders 2-0 just seems perverse. Why would we want to label the top side that we are dismantling as "shit" when we're in the process of beating them soundly?

The only time that song pisses me off is when it starts getting sung at 1 nil up in the first half, you're asking for trouble then.
I think also that no one actually believes a team who went on a 12 game winning streak is shit, but this is more directed at their "shit" fans rather than the players on the pitch, we've had to listen to their gloating for the last few months of how they stopped up winning the title, but at 2 nil up, with a couple of minutes left, i found it quite beautiful personally.

 

[Shadydan]

Just some banter in the form of a shit chant literally nothing more.

 

[Gb160]

48 hours on, on reflection that was a faultless performance. Other than Lloris's kicking I can't think of any errors during the game.

On a side note (and I love Lloris BTW) he needs to put his foot through it more often. Often leads to us losing possession or giving a throws away in our own half. Can't think of too many times it leads to anything positive.

Not saying do it all the time as obviously helps us keep the ball but when we are under pressure get it up to Kane and co and trust them to fight for it.

Not sure I agree with this, i think we've moved on from the old 'when in doubt, give it a clout' mantra.
Its all about control, and it gives the signal to the opposition 'we are in control'.
This is clearly an instruction from Poch, you lump the ball long, its 50/50 whether you'll keep possession, with Jan and Toby, you calmly play it around their pressing forwards and feed it to midfield, or wide where two best fullbacks in the league currently reside...it makes perfect sense.

Admittedly i find myself clenching my arse sometimes but it rarely backfires.
How many times has this approach cost us goals this season?...i have no idea but suspect its not many, if any.

 

[widmerpool]

How many times has this approach cost us goals this season?...i have no idea but suspect its not many, if any.

Certainly far fewer than set pieces!

 

[Charly***]

48 hours on, on reflection that was a faultless performance. Other than Lloris's kicking I can't think of any errors during the game.

On a side note (and I love Lloris BTW) he needs to put his foot through it more often. Often leads to us losing possession or giving a throws away in our own half. Can't think of too many times it leads to anything positive.

Not saying do it all the time as obviously helps us keep the ball but when we are under pressure get it up to Kane and co and trust them to fight for it.

It draws the opposition up the pitch, making spaces in behind them, so if we can play through it we outnumber the opposition up the pitch. Poch's way of playing in the build up is all about luring the opponents into certain areas of the pitch, creating space elsewhere and switching the ball to the space.

& on another subject the you're shit chant was brilliant.

 

[Roynie]

48 hours on, on reflection that was a faultless performance. Other than Lloris's kicking I can't think of any errors during the game.

On a side note (and I love Lloris BTW) he needs to put his foot through it more often. Often leads to us losing possession or giving a throws away in our own half. Can't think of too many times it leads to anything positive.

Not saying do it all the time as obviously helps us keep the ball but when we are under pressure get it up to Kane and co and trust them to fight for it.

It was a great performance for sure. What did please me was that after going 2 up we didn't start the tippy-tappy shit amongst the back 4 or 5 players but kept going forwards. Trying to just see the game out towards the end of the game always makes me so nervous. It seems to me that most of the time we do that we end up conceeding a goal and invite more pressure on ourselves. I really hope that Poch is tryng to eliminate that from our game.

 

[Shadydan]

This was our game plan that Alli was talking about before the match, I don't want to hear anything about Poch being a poor tactician he pulled Conte's pants down.

http://theworldgame.sbs.com.au/blog/2017/01/06/how-poch-outsmarted-conte-and-chelsea

 

[CheltYid]

Admittedly i find myself clenching my arse sometimes but it rarely backfires.

This is indeed good news, a backfiring arse can be lethal.

 

[Charly***]

This was our game plan that Alli was talking about before the match, I don't want to hear anything about Poch being a poor tactician he pulled Conte's pants down.

http://theworldgame.sbs.com.au/blog/2017/01/06/how-poch-outsmarted-conte-and-chelsea

Good article, thanks for posting that. Yeah it was a tactical masterclass. It's a different approach this season. Last season we largely set up the same way and only really changed to cater for the opposition in the Watford game.

This season, against the top teams we're changing approach to nullify opponents strengths and exploit their weaknesses.

Against City, who play out from the back it was all about a furious press to force their shaky back line into mistakes. Of course a way through this is to launch a long ball over our press, but a Pep team wouldn't do that so it was the correct approach.

The chavs I think expected the same and did look to launch over our press a couple of times, but we had one less attacking player than normal so were well covered even if the full backs were high up the pitch with our back three and Dembele & Wanyama. Our plan contained their front three, Our DMs bossed theirs and our wingbacks bossed theirs. Kane occupied their back three.

Which meant we negated their threats but had two of our own players, Dele & Eriksen freed up to find space and win us the game.

I think possibly most of us thought our starting lineup would contain them for 60mins then the pace of Sissoko & Son would have a chance to win it once the game opened up later on, but Poch had other ideas and we won the game with the starting 11, which on paper looked like we might have trouble breaking them down.

Catering for the opposition is a new approach and not something we've generally done as a club, but it's something coaches that win things often apply.

 

[Gb160]

This was our game plan that Alli was talking about before the match, I don't want to hear anything about Poch being a poor tactician he pulled Conte's pants down.

http://theworldgame.sbs.com.au/blog/2017/01/06/how-poch-outsmarted-conte-and-chelsea

Well so far this season he's out-Pep'd Pep, and he's out-Conte'd Conte...no doubt if we dare draw a game or two the usual suspects will be knee jerking like normal.

 

[davidmatzdorf]

Good article, thanks for posting that. Yeah it was a tactical masterclass. It's a different approach this season. Last season we largely set up the same way and only really changed to cater for the opposition in the Watford game.

This season, against the top teams we're changing approach to nullify opponents strengths and exploit their weaknesses.

...

Catering for the opposition is a new approach and not something we've generally done as a club, but it's something coaches that win things often apply.

I agree and would add that it takes time to get to know one's players. Changing tactics becomes much easier after a manager has had a season or two to work out, by experimenting on the training pitch, which combinations of players are best suited to implement the different kind of tactics. Until he got to that point, it made sense for Pochettino to stick to the basic format.

Also, I think that retaining the same formation for the first season or two made it easier for the players to learn each others' games. If you're constantly changing the shape of the team while the players are still getting to know what their teammates are likely to do, it adds an avoidable layer of complication and confusion.

Its always worth bearing in mind that the best managers look at team development over the course of a number of years, even if they are rarely given that amount of time to play with.

 

[TottenhamLegend]

48 hours on, on reflection that was a faultless performance. Other than Lloris's kicking I can't think of any errors during the game.

On a side note (and I love Lloris BTW) he needs to put his foot through it more often. Often leads to us losing possession or giving a throws away in our own half. Can't think of too many times it leads to anything positive.

Not saying do it all the time as obviously helps us keep the ball but when we are under pressure get it up to Kane and co and trust them to fight for it.

Don't get me wrong it does make me nervous, but looking back, how many times has Lloris kicking it short directly led to a goal conceded? I can't think of any. The last goal from a Lloris poor kick I can think of was at Stamford Bridge 2 seasons ago, and even that was an attempted long kick he scuffed I believe (I'm sure I may have missed one somewhere).

Overall, the effect it has - drawing their players out, creating space in behind etc - seems to outweigh the risk.

 

[Wellspurs]

I actually like Conte. He seems like a genuine guy.

Considering he went through the sixties in The Small Faces he survived it well.

 

[Shadydan]

Don't get me wrong it does make me nervous, but looking back, how many times has Lloris kicking it short directly led to a goal conceded? I can't think of any. The last goal from a Lloris poor kick I can think of was at Stamford Bridge 2 seasons ago, and even that was an attempted long kick he scuffed I believe (I'm sure I may have missed one somewhere).

Overall, the effect it has - drawing their players out, creating space in behind etc - seems to outweigh the risk.

You won't find many because not many goals are scored when keepers pass it out from the back but that's not the way to look at it, the strategy is designed to coax the opposition out and lead them into a false sense of security which in turn leaves gaps in their setup for our players to exploit, the question you need to be asking is how many goals have we conceded from playing out from the back, can't think of many if there is it's minimal but this high risk, high reward strategy clearly benefits us and we should continue playing this way.

 

[Charly***]

I agree and would add that it takes time to get to know one's players. Changing tactics becomes much easier after a manager has had a season or two to work out, by experimenting on the training pitch, which combinations of players are best suited to implement the different kind of tactics. Until he got to that point, it made sense for Pochettino to stick to the basic format.

Also, I think that retaining the same formation for the first season or two made it easier for the players to learn each others' games. If you're constantly changing the shape of the team while the players are still getting to know what their teammates are likely to do, it adds an avoidable layer of complication and confusion.

Its always worth bearing in mind that the best managers look at team development over the course of a number of years, even if they are rarely given that amount of time to play with.

I agree entirely. Also having players who can play in several positions is of huge benefit in this respect. Poch has always expressed a preference for players able to play more than one position. So it's clear this has always been his plan. You make the point that this tactical diversity takes time and that is fundamental. Grumblings about lack of plan b in the past were clearly premature. It was and still is a work in progress but we're already one of the best drilled teams out there & we'll continue in this vein.

 

[dynamoSpurs]

Not sure I agree with this, i think we've moved on from the old 'when in doubt, give it a clout' mantra.
Its all about control, and it gives the signal to the opposition 'we are in control'.
This is clearly an instruction from Poch, you lump the ball long, its 50/50 whether you'll keep possession, with Jan and Toby, you calmly play it around their pressing forwards and feed it to midfield, or wide where two best fullbacks in the league currently reside...it makes perfect sense.

Admittedly i find myself clenching my arse sometimes but it rarely backfires.
How many times has this approach cost us goals this season?...i have no idea but suspect its not many, if any.

Agree its tactical and certainly a good tactic, but he's just not the best with under pressure short range passing. Probably his ONLY shortfall as a keeper.

But who cares? It hasn't cost us much, if any this season, as u said .

But he could save a few of our nerves in sure

 

[Gb160]

Agree its tactical and certainly a good tactic, but he's just not the best with under pressure short range passing. Probably his ONLY shortfall as a keeper.

But who cares? It hasn't cost us much, if any this season, as u said .

But he could save a few of our nerves in sure

Yeah I keep reading that his distribution is shit...but looking into it further he's one of the best in the league.

http://www.squawka.com/football-pla...01/2017#season#1#all-matches#total#desc#total

That's for this season so far, but last season is a similar story as well.
It's a myth that his distribution is poor, I think it stems from the fact that we all watch pretty much every minute of every spurs game, and not so much of the other teams...

 

[Air Jordan 3]

Agree its tactical and certainly a good tactic, but he's just not the best with under pressure short range passing. Probably his ONLY shortfall as a keeper.

But who cares? It hasn't cost us much, if any this season, as u said .

But he could save a few of our nerves in sure

I think it has cost us goals but maybe not directly from Lloris's kick.

Think it was against West Ham he gave it to Vertonghen under pressure who kicked it into the stand and they scored from the resulting throw/corner.

Agreed it does draw the other team out though.

 

[Gb160]

I think it has cost us goals but maybe not directly from Lloris's kick.

Think it was against West Ham he gave it to Vertonghen under pressure who kicked it into the stand and they scored from the resulting throw in.

Agreed it does draw the other team out though.

One goal from failing to defend a throw in can hardly be blamed on Lloris mate.