U17 World Cup

IGSpur

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#41
Oakley Boothe already has to some degree.
2 mins and what does it really mean. Omomah at the same age had featured and been interested more at 17 and look what's happened to him, eventually on loan.

These players need to be better than anyone the club could buy and catch the eye of the manager. It's a low-risk league for the clubs most of these guys play at.
How does a player prove he's better than a player they're about to buy, when they aren't even getting the chances to prove it. Additionally how unrealistic is it for a quality academy player to instantly be better than a seasoned pro. They will be more talented but will still need adjustment time
 

Danners9

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#44
2 mins and what does it really mean. Omomah at the same age had featured and been interested more at 17 and look what's happened to him, eventually on loan.

How does a player prove he's better than a player they're about to buy, when they aren't even getting the chances to prove it. Additionally how unrealistic is it for a quality academy player to instantly be better than a seasoned pro. They will be more talented but will still need adjustment time
Being called into the squad is the main marker, I'd say. Going on loan is a good thing for Onomah as he needs the game time. He's at a decent Championship side doing well. You would hope it means he comes back better equipped for the Premier League.

During training, perhaps. They have the opportunity to show potential, the right attitude and a willingness to learn. That's how players catch the eye of their manager.See the excerpt from Poch's book about Edwards for the other side of that where he mentions behavioural issues. The FA need to put in the right type of coaches at the next level, too. U18, U19, U20 all seem fine.. then - as above - U21...
 

Danners9

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#45
I don’t really agree, if the talent and desire’s there then make allowances for ups and downs in their here and performances if it’s for a greater good, IMO of course
Being cynical, I'd agree if the players were at different clubs. Man Utd under Ferguson, yes. Chelsea or Man City now, not so sure..
 

nailsy

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#46
The biggest barrier to the success of English football is not the quality of players but the quality of the coaches. Too many Tim Sherwood's who don't have a bloody clue how to organise a team.
I thought that we'd been working on that in this country over the last ten years? Maybe the success of the youth teams is evidence that we've improved that side of things?
 

spursfan77

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#47
I thought that we'd been working on that in this country over the last ten years? Maybe the success of the youth teams is evidence that we've improved that side of things?
I've heard youth coaches say we've always had as talented players as those at other European nations. It's just what happens to them between 15/16/17 and becoming a pro that's the problem. This group will be evidence if it's changed or not in 5/6/7 years time
 

Spurs 1961

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#48
The only hope for England is that these youngsters turn down sitting around on the books of big Premier League clubs and go to Germany where they know how to use and develop young talent
 

Fowl!

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#49
You do wonder if there is not a case for some sort of central contract for some selected kids.

Say the FA pay subsidise clubs 5 grand per appearance for up to 3 players in each premier league club until they have say 100 premier league, fa cup or European games under their belts.

And those kids get to stay on that list for 5 consecutive seasons.
 

IGSpur

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#50
Being called into the squad is the main marker, I'd say. Going on loan is a good thing for Onomah as he needs the game time. He's at a decent Championship side doing well. You would hope it means he comes back better equipped for the Premier League.

During training, perhaps. They have the opportunity to show potential, the right attitude and a willingness to learn. That's how players catch the eye of their manager.See the excerpt from Poch's book about Edwards for the other side of that where he mentions behavioural issues. The FA need to put in the right type of coaches at the next level, too. U18, U19, U20 all seem fine.. then - as above - U21...
Not sure about that, so many players get called into squads it is ultimately meaningless unless they are actually used. Onomah at TOB's age had won the Euros and has since won the u20 World Cup and is still not intergrated into our squad and is now out on loan. Do you think his development has been handles well, what do you think this suggests for TOB who isn't imo as dynamic as Onomah at the same age, though TOB's style of play will allow him to swap in more seamlessly. Where would Onomah be if he was in Germany. Our other u20 World Cup winner has played 2 competitive matches at the age of 20. The stifling of players here is mad.

And your 2nd paragraph is nice in theory and we all hear they have to show the right attitude. But what really is that? A manager can always hide behind that excuse as a reason not to risk a player in the PL and apparently we are unable to question it. Training also doesn't replicate the intensity or the importance of actual matches. If Edwards and Onomah didn't have teh right attitudes in the first place Poch wouldn't have them here and be offering them contracts so surely that's not the reason. And are you telling me they haven't shown more ability in training than Sissoko or N'Koudou, I like your optimism but sadly I don't share it.

As I've said in the youth threads if you look at the number of academy playesr that have come through between those born in 89/90 to 94/95 it's around 10 PL or Top 5 EL league players. Poch has had full control over those born between 99/00 to 95/96 and has so far brought through 1 player. The 1st half of the decade won one international trophy between those age. The 93 age group won the Euros, we contributed no players in that tournament (Kane was injured). The 2nd half have won all the tournaments over the summer plus the u17s Euros in 2014, and we have contributed loads of players. It stands to reason these players are better so we should have no trouble replicating our success from the first part of the decade. Do you reckon 10 of our players will come through and be PL players under Poch? If not surely we've gone backwards with better players
 

IGSpur

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#51
You do wonder if there is not a case for some sort of central contract for some selected kids.

Say the FA pay subsidise clubs 5 grand per appearance for up to 3 players in each premier league club until they have say 100 premier league, fa cup or European games under their belts.

And those kids get to stay on that list for 5 consecutive seasons.
I've always thought of doing some sort of central contract, didn't they have something at Lilleshall. That way the FA could manage them better and maybe provide them with their own agents until they join proper clubs. Not sure how it'd work though
 

Fowl!

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#52
I think Lilleshall was a residential sort of thing and did actually develop some talent, but not really much in the way of a club culture.
 

IGSpur

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#54
I think England are reaping the rewards of some excellent club academy work, very little to do with FA or England coaching.
Put a post in General youth thread. Generally agree that the clubs are doing excellently but the EPPP is facilitating it somewhat
 
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