W Indies v England Test Series

[Coyboy]

Anyone watching this? I am just following online, not a great start and it looks like we will be relying on KP. I saw Gayle today saying he knew some tricks to get him out, we'll see. What do people think of the team? I would like to have seen Shah and Anderson for Bell and Harmison.

I don't think the W Indies should be underestimated especially if they bowl consistently quickly and Gayle, Sarwan and Chanderpaul bat as they can.

I don't like cricket...

 

[riversmonkey]

By the sound of things it was a mistake not to pick two spinners

 

[Tickers]

By the sound of things it was a mistake not to pick two spinners

Or it was a mistake to pick one and select the most ludicrously overhyped one-dimensional England player ever, ever, ever.

Monty Panesar is mediocre, and no amount of comical fielding mishaps or piss-poor high-fiving will change that. He lacks the brains and balls to be a top-class Test-match spinner. He has been well and truly worked out, I fear.

Warney, as he usually does, nailed it with that line about Panesar not playing 30 Tests but playing one Test 30 times.

The fact that he's not only been outbowled by a four-Test novice like Big Benn but also outthought should be worrying the England hierarchy immensely.

It's decision time: do they trust Monty to play a significant role in the Ashes? Right now, I'd say no. And that means he needs shipping out so that his replacement (safe option Swann, giant but hugely exciting gamble Rashid) has five matches to bed in.

 

[Coyboy]

Or it was a mistake to pick one and select the most ludicrously overhyped one-dimensional England player ever, ever, ever.

Monty Panesar is mediocre, and no amount of comical fielding mishaps or piss-poor high-fiving will change that. He lacks the brains and balls to be a top-class Test-match spinner. He has been well and truly worked out, I fear.

Warney, as he usually does, nailed it with that line about Panesar not playing 30 Tests but playing one Test 30 times.

The fact that he's not only been outbowled by a four-Test novice like Big Benn but also outthought should be worrying the England hierarchy immensely.

It's decision time: do they trust Monty to play a significant role in the Ashes? Right now, I'd say no. And that means he needs shipping out so that his replacement (safe option Swann, giant but hugely exciting gamble Rashid) has five matches to bed in.

I agree unfortunately, he seems to bowl the same ball over and over and on this pitch you would thought there would be other ways to get players out. I said on another thread I can rarely see England picking up twenty wickets and Monty is part of the problem. But more worrying is Freddie's fitness, Harmison's head and the youth of Broad. Do we need or can we afford two all rounders? Wouldn't Anderson have been a better bet. That tail batted ok yesterday but that was mainly due to Prior.

To be fair to Panesnar is still young though and needs more adept coaching. Warne? The problem we have is the dearth of spinners or spinners' pitches in England and so the cycle is difficult to break. I haven't seen Rashid, what makes him exciting?

 

[Tickers]

I agree unfortunately, he seems to bowl the same ball over and over and on this pitch you would thought there would be other ways to get players out. I said on another thread I can rarely see England picking up twenty wickets and Monty is part of the problem. But more worrying is Freddie's fitness, Harmison's head and the youth of Broad. Do we need or can we afford two all rounders? Wouldn't Anderson have been a better bet. That tail batted ok yesterday but that was mainly due to Prior.

To be fair to Panesnar is still young though and needs more adept coaching. Warne? The problem we have is the dearth of spinners or spinners' pitches in England and so the cycle is difficult to break. I haven't seen Rashid, what makes him exciting?

I think England's attack in general is hugely over-rated. Flintoff is magnificent but for whatever reason doesn't seem to pick up the big hauls his talent deserves. Broad is raw, Harmison is Harmison, Anderson's inconsistent - but unlucky to be left out here, I'd suggest - a nagging doubt remains about Sidebottom's ability against the very best, and Monty we've covered.

Living up in Leeds, I pop along to Headingley when the fancy takes me so I've seen a fair bit of Rashid, and the short answer to your question is 'everything'. He's a leggie, which is always a source of excitement, looks like he's got all the toys, bats very handily indeed and already looks more capable of thinking for himself than dear old Monty.

I've been lucky enough to interview him, and he's an impressive, intelligent young man who can go right to the top.

He's a gamble because he's young, inexperienced and, like all legspinners not called Warne, tends to go for a few runs.

 

[Coyboy]

I pretty much agree with your analysis of the attack. I said on another thread that this year's Ashes will see few victories because I don't like the look of either attack, at the moment. If Australia can get Clarke and Lee fit then it could be different but right now they are inexperienced.

I just got into to see a few overs before tea. Random thoughts;

1. It's good to see Broad get wickets. I just got to see his delivery to get rid of Chanderpaul which was excellent but he is still pretty expensive generally and prone to bowl the odd gimme.

2. I like Harmison's line and length at least in the last over I saw. I think there has little wrong with the length and was only possibly off with the line for Ramdin's four. I think when you say Harmison is Harmison you may think the same as me that it is all in his head, attitude and application whereas I am not convinced that others are necessarily good enough.

3. West Indies have a good batting lineup. Ramdin looks like one of the best batting keepers out there. His technique at least on the off side looks text book and I think in the flair of Gayle, the obstinance of Chanderpaul and Sarwan and the seemingly guile of Ramdin they are going to be hard to get all out quickly.

4. If the weather and the pitch hold out, this good be an excellent test match. 50 odd behind, I don't see the WIndies getting much more if Ramdin goes soon. I confess I know little of their tail but historically, Walsh and Ambrose, they aren't the strongest batters.

5. There is some talent in the crowd.

6. There are very few cricket lovers on SC.

 

[Tickers]

In response to those points.

1. Yeah, he's vital to England's development. There's not a better young all-rounder in world cricket. I've no doubt he'll go on to match or exceed Flintoff's stats. At the moment he still has good days and bad, but that will improve. Yesterday he was poor, today he's been excellent. That's young bowlers for you.

2. Yep. He again bowled far better today.

3. Ramdin should score a lot more runs than he does. Lovely technique. Gayle, Sarwan and Shiv are all top-class, while Nash looks an obstinate bugger as well.

4. Taylor's a hitter - smashed a hugely entertaining hundred against New Zealand late last year - but the rest are Montyesque.

5. True.

6. Truer.

 

[riversmonkey]

Three days in and already the signs are that this is going to be a fiercely competitive series.

The West Indies appeared to miss a trick yesterday, after Gayle's century the opportunity to accelerate was there. Yes, England bowled tightly but the mental fragility of Panesar and Harmison meant that there were opportunities to target bowlers. That being said, a lead of 75-100 with Benn and Gayle's spin could worry England.

The stagnation of the English setup is depressing. Take away Flintoff and Pietersen and you have a very mediocre team. We don't really have any dependable performers anymore (in the mould of Tresco, Hoggard and Giles) which is a big worry.

As you guys have touched upon Monty is a one dimensional performer who lacks the guile and intelligence to take wickets, not to mention the fear factor that most spinners who take over 100 test wickets develop.

I think the right approach is to constuct a nucleus of a team and let it grow like we did under Fletcher. Identify a talent pool of five players - two bowlers, one allrounder and two batsmen and get them into the current setup ASAP. We already have Cook, Broad and Rashid and KP for the next few years, Prior is showing signs that since being mentored by Alec Stewart he can take the gloves, and with Davies being called up to the ODI team that area looks to be covered. We need a team that can win series after series in a four year cycle.

Cook
?
?
KP
?
Prior (Reserve - Davies)
Broad
Rashid
?
?
?

 

[MattyP]

26-7 England are in their second innings, in danger of posting our lowest ever total. Oh dear.

 

[Archibald&Crooks]

27-7

Pathetic. And that's being kind.

 

[TheChosenOne]

51 all out.

Disgraceful.

 

[Tickers]

That went well. Fuck me. The footwork - or, more accurately, the lack of it - was astonishing.

Taylor and Big Benn were superb, though.

 

[SlickMongoose]

Beach tour interrupted by cricket: http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/sport/sport-headlines/england-beach-tour-interrupted-by-cricket-200902061563/

 

[montylynch]

1st Day's play abandoned, dodgy pitch !!

 

[Coyboy]

I am happy with the team changes, with the weather and the wierd looking outfield this perhaps has draw written all over it.

 

[Bill_Oddie]

So far, so good. That line across the wicket is mental, though. Only watching a (very) dodgy stream of the first session then some highlights but the obvious question for the next three days is how and if England can take 19 wickets.

In itself this is a brilliant test for the Ashes. Hopefully we'll see some creative and disciplined bowling and some good ideas from Captain Strauss.

 

[alfie103]

Good response from England to amass a large score like that, from the little i heard on TMS, we bowled ok and hopefully with the uneven bounce we can take some wickets, good to see panesar not playing, the bloke can't even bowl an arm ball.

 

[Coyboy]

We did bowl well in patches from what I saw up to about 9pm. Flintoff and Anderson beat the outside edge quite a few times, and that was Gayle who is now out. I think Anderson should have played from the start really.

 

[Marty]

1709 - England 181-4
Paul 'The Nurdle' Collingwood takes a step towards Ryan Hinds and kerplunks him for an almighty six over the long-on boundary. KP tries another switch-hit and it comes right off the middle, but again he only gets a single from it. He and Colly trying to smear every delivery, now, and the Windies fielders look about as happy to be out on the field as a dad escorting his 8-year-old daughter to a Teletubbies concert.

Don't you just love cricket text commentary? :lol:

 

[TheChosenOne]

206/7 ain't great !