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What our opponents' fans are saying about us 18/19

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Hakkz

Svensk hetsporre
Jul 6, 2012
8,196
17,270
When there is a potential handball review with VAR, they look for the answers to these questions:

1. Did the ball hit the players arm / hand?
2. If yes, was it deliberate, OR was the players arm / hand in an unnatural position that made their body area larger?

Now, whilst 2. is still subjective (see the penalty awarded against Rose in the first leg), last nights was clear...

Llorente did not deliberately handle the ball, and his body was not in an unnatural position where his arm made his body area larger. The ball brushed his arm and then hit his hip which created the force to direct the ball into the goal. As such it was the correct decision, as backed up by every single referee commenting in the media today.

The offside goal was simply offside. Fact.

I think it will be a different story next season. IIRC all goals scored via hands will be disallowed, regardless of intent.
 

olliec

Well-Known Member
Jun 20, 2012
3,574
11,763
I actually hate this about VAR. the fact that the decisions are so marginal, like the penalty in the first leg. Nobody appeals, the ref gives nothing but some donut with 65 tv screens has spotted something so pulls it back.

I love that it worked for us last night but the game is dead if that’s the future.

To clarify, I don’t mean the game is dead because of the drama it creates, just because the decisions are so marginal, I think the onus should still be on the ref to ask for help.

Are you mad about football being dead? How many times have we been screwed over because there has been no VAR? Remember the semi final with chelsea where the ball didn't even cross the line? I believe if we had var earlier we wouldn't of gone this long without a trophy. So many times we've been the butt of the joke when it comes to controversial decisions, and last night it would of happened again and we would of been out of the CL being labelled Spursy for conceding right at the very end..

I think Var is a massive game changer when it comes to major incidents, and I am a believer in the technology.

 
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TheBlueRooster

Well-Known Member
May 10, 2005
3,817
4,701
Personally, I've always been fairly neutral about the pros and cons of the away goals rule, but, funnily enough, West Ham fans on KUMB have always had really strong ideas about it and not just thought up in the last two hours. Oh no.

"Is it just me or is the away goals rule highly unsatisfactory and, somewhat out of date?"

"Needs scrapping like the golden goal was! A stupid rule to settle a tie!"

"It's one of the daftest rules in football. Tonight's game and many others before that deserved to go to extra time. Goals are goals and none should ever count double."

"Away goals rule should definitely be scrapped. Made sense back in the 50s when travelling away was tough and everyone played for a 0-0 but serves no purpose in the modern game. A goal is a goal and extra time would have been a fitting end to that tie."

"Completely outdated. Not just saying it because it’s Spurs, I’ve thought it for years. The tie was a draw. The home team tonight had to go attacking as they were one down, so it’ll inevitably be a more open game meaning the away side have a better chance of scoring."


Away goals do not count double if they did the score would be 4-6
 

double0

Well-Known Member
Aug 29, 2006
14,423
12,258
At the end of it as long as VAR is awarding the correct decision nobody can complain... the biggest issue is interpretation.
 

SpartanSpur

Well-Known Member
Jan 27, 2011
12,552
43,063
Personally, I've always been fairly neutral about the pros and cons of the away goals rule, but, funnily enough, West Ham fans on KUMB have always had really strong ideas about it and not just thought up in the last two hours. Oh no.

"Is it just me or is the away goals rule highly unsatisfactory and, somewhat out of date?"

"Needs scrapping like the golden goal was! A stupid rule to settle a tie!"

"It's one of the daftest rules in football. Tonight's game and many others before that deserved to go to extra time. Goals are goals and none should ever count double."

"Away goals rule should definitely be scrapped. Made sense back in the 50s when travelling away was tough and everyone played for a 0-0 but serves no purpose in the modern game. A goal is a goal and extra time would have been a fitting end to that tie."

"Completely outdated. Not just saying it because it’s Spurs, I’ve thought it for years. The tie was a draw. The home team tonight had to go attacking as they were one down, so it’ll inevitably be a more open game meaning the away side have a better chance of scoring."


1. Why do West Ham fans even have an opinion on away goals? They must have rarely even got to that stage in any competition let alone lose cruelly by it.

2. The reason we had the advantage of away goals is because Man City couldn't score in the first leg. They were too tentative and paid for it.

3. As others have said the home team has a distinct advantage in ET if there are no away goals. Arguably on pens too.

4. Look at the Carabao Cup semi this year, any alternative to penalties is best IMO. City knew their job and the implications on the night and whilst unlucky, fell just short. Losing on away goals is no more painful than losing on pens IMO.
 
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Sanj

Well-Known Member
Jun 22, 2003
1,680
1,130
I think it will be a different story next season. IIRC all goals scored via hands will be disallowed, regardless of intent.
Although, the goal wasn't scored with his hand. The ball was scored by his hip.
I'm not sure the rules are clear for next season on the LLorente goal.
He didn't score with his hand, and the handball didnt lead to him controlling the ball. The rule does not say any contact with the arm will be disallowed - and therefore there could be some confusion next year as well.
 

Hakkz

Svensk hetsporre
Jul 6, 2012
8,196
17,270
Although, the goal wasn't scored with his hand. The ball was scored by his hip.
I'm not sure the rules are clear for next season on the LLorente goal.
He didn't score with his hand, and the handball didnt lead to him controlling the ball. The rule does not say any contact with the arm will be disallowed - and therefore there could be some confusion next year as well.

I think that is how it will be.
 

fatpiranha

dismember
Jun 9, 2003
8,337
21,678
I love this little gem of knife-twisting I found on Arsemania ...

"You should be proud. London tonight has become the first city in history to have three teams who have qualified for the Champions League semi-finals. "
 

Dov67

Well-Known Member
Jul 1, 2005
3,318
10,212
Are you mad about football being dead? How many times have we been screwed over because there has been no VAR? Remember the semi final with chelsea where the ball didn't even cross the line? I believe if we had var earlier we wouldn't of gone this long without a trophy. So many times we've been the butt of the joke when it comes to controversial decisions, and last night it would of happened again and we would of been out of the CL being labelled Spursy for conceding right at the very end..

I think Var is a massive game changer when it comes to major incidents, and I am a believer in the technology.



I’d forgotten how f*****g outrageous that decision was. Don’t forget the ghost goal at Stamford bridge when Gomes let it through his legs and the linesman guessed that it had gone over the line
 

spursfan77

Well-Known Member
Aug 13, 2005
46,680
104,956
VAR, and the way it is used is improving rapidly. The best thing about it is players no longer try to cheat the ref. If you watched a CL or World Cup game from pre-VAR you’d see players diving and basically making refereeing impossible. Now refs jobs are much easier. Once the last few things get ironed out (like handball) it will be great for the sport.

Wait till you see the PL refs making a complete pig’s tit of it next season!
 

spursfan77

Well-Known Member
Aug 13, 2005
46,680
104,956
At the end of it as long as VAR is awarding the correct decision nobody can complain... the biggest issue is interpretation.

No. The biggest issue is letting those in the stadium know what is going on. At the moment people watching at home on tv have more than an idea than we do in the stadium. That can’t be right.
 

teok

Well-Known Member
Aug 11, 2011
10,836
33,607
From the F365 letters page (a utd fan)

Spurs in context

To put Spurs’ result against City into context:


1. Spurs’ starting 11 tonight cost £157m. Man City’s starting 11 tonight cost £458m.


2. Spurs have yet to spend more than £40m on a single player. Man City have spent more then £40m on 10 players.


3. Spurs did not sign a single player in the last 2 transfer windows. Man City had the luxury of bringing Riyad Mahrez for £60m. He was an unused sub.


4. This was a Spurs team without their main striker and talisman. This was a fully fit, full strength City team.


5. This was a Spurs team who had the most number of players in the latter stages of the WC and therefore had very little pre-season/rest.


To say this result is incredible is an understatement. Mauricio Pochettino is mint and Spurs should fight to keep him. Penny for Ed Woodword’s thoughts right now.
Joon, MUFC (The true treble will never be emulated or eclipsed)
 

talkshowhost86

Mod-Moose
Staff
Oct 2, 2004
48,100
47,055
Var is only there to change a decision if there is a clear and obvious error. There was nothing clear and obvious about the alleged handball, while there clearly was regarding the offside.

I think there are two parts to this.

With regards to Llorente's one I agree with you. Having looked at it hundreds of times they couldn't see a clear and obvious error so the goal was given. I think that was very clear and within their description of how VAR works.

Personally I still think the problematic part is who is deciding whether there has been a clear and obvious error? How far back in a move does that error have to have happened? Does someone have to have appealed for there to be any consideration of it?

Again if it's used consistently in a game/tie (as it was with Rose's handball and Aguero's offside) then that's fine, but I'm not sure if it's being used consistently across the game generally at the moment.
 

robbiedee

Mama said knock you out
Jul 6, 2012
2,713
7,488
I was just lapping up the saltiness on Blue Moon and saw this...

Just to put a downer on things, we also lost to a Spurs team without a couple of their best players.

In good news maybe Pep will convince the board for the need for a few top class players in key areas in the summer as its clear we're just short.

Amazing! They are such a bunch of spoiled bastards...
 

buttons

Well-Known Member
Feb 24, 2005
2,945
3,861
Are you mad about football being dead? How many times have we been screwed over because there has been no VAR? Remember the semi final with chelsea where the ball didn't even cross the line? I believe if we had var earlier we wouldn't of gone this long without a trophy. So many times we've been the butt of the joke when it comes to controversial decisions, and last night it would of happened again and we would of been out of the CL being labelled Spursy for conceding right at the very end..

I think Var is a massive game changer when it comes to major incidents, and I am a believer in the technology.



I’m delighted it worked for us last night. And I think there is a place for VAR, I just think in its current form it’s a bit flawed.
 

TheBlueRooster

Well-Known Member
May 10, 2005
3,817
4,701
I think there are two parts to this.

With regards to Llorente's one I agree with you. Having looked at it hundreds of times they couldn't see a clear and obvious error so the goal was given. I think that was very clear and within their description of how VAR works.

Personally I still think the problematic part is who is deciding whether there has been a clear and obvious error? How far back in a move does that error have to have happened? Does someone have to have appealed for there to be any consideration of it?

Again if it's used consistently in a game/tie (as it was with Rose's handball and Aguero's offside) then that's fine, but I'm not sure if it's being used consistently across the game generally at the moment.

I think the problem with the hand ball was that it may have happened, as the ball seemed to deviate, but the City defenders hand obscured what made it happen. So that view was not shown to the referee as he would be guessing it was the hand/arm, from the other angle it only appears to be the thigh so he has to give a goal.
 
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