Jose Mourinho

sausage · Oct 2, 2020

Ausp said:
Highest win rate there and 3 trophies to show for it...

I'll agree with anyone that José's go-to philosophy was of a defensive mindset while he was there. However, I got the feeling that much of that came from an underdevelopment of what he was trying to do. He tried to rebuild the squad and their tactics from the ground up starting with their defense but he didn't receive the freedom and backing to see it through.

If I recall correctly, his best squads throughout his career all had very clinical attacks and the offense was usually developed later or was the last piece of his puzzle.

Didn't he say about Fred, not long after the beginning of that final season, that he couldn't play him because the defence was so cack he needed a different tactic or something?
He spent ages trying to get EW to buy Toby but they wouldn't.

wrd · Oct 2, 2020

matthew.absurdum said:
1-2 league cups win for 2.5 years peak Poch maybe fine, but the "10 trophies" talks are just too naive (unless 10 Audi cups)

Moreover, I don't think Jose ball is really that boring if we have a full fit squad. Really enjoy the quick counter-attack. Poch ball in his final days is really similar to AVB's 2nd year tactics

It's genuinely incredible that people are bringing up debates about style of football over the last few weeks when we've genuinely been playing good football. Feels like people just blindly sticking to a rhetoric regardless of what is in front of their eyes.

matthew.absurdum · Oct 2, 2020

wrd said:
It's genuinely incredible that people are bringing up debates about style of football over the last few weeks when we've genuinely been playing good football. Feels like people just blindly sticking to a rhetoric regardless of what is in front of their eyes.

They will just find their own anti-Jose excuses. The opponents are just European farmers, the 1-1 against Newcastle, Fat Frank is bad, Only rely on Son and Kane.....

You cannot convince a person if they already have bias or fixed agenda. Especially we had such a popular ex-manager in Poch

cjbyid · Oct 2, 2020

Probably a bit to soon but the 2nd half performances against Southampton & Chelsea and the full 90 against Newcastle is the first time I've enjoyed watching us in a very long time.

He's obviously doing something right!

DJS · Oct 2, 2020

Yes and I’m sure Kane would love to stay just to play lovely football under Poch and win nothing...

Give me a trophy winning team under Jose with Kane staying and doing his magic any day of the week.

And looking at a front three or Son, Kane and Bale I can’t see us being boring even if we tried!

rossdapep · Oct 2, 2020

I enjoy the fact that we look like scoring more often when we attack than previously where we struggled for ideas on how to break down a half resilient defence and had to rely on a moment of brilliance or mistake to win yet at the same time be very capable of making a defensive mistake ourselves.

Peak Poch was easily the most pleasurable time to be a Spurs fan in terms of how strong we were and how we would bully teams - although I'd say Redknapp's era just edges it for 'beautiful' football.

The truth is you could easily say latter period Poch was some of the most boring, lethargic play we've seen since AVBs last months.

I'd much rather be going into games knowing that we make the most of our chances and our defence aren't going to throw up easy chances or let the opposition run through them.

rossdapep · Oct 2, 2020

cjbyid said:
Probably a bit to soon but the 2nd half performances against Southampton & Chelsea and the full 90 against Newcastle is the first time I've enjoyed watching us in a very long time.

He's obviously doing something right!

I actually enjoyed the Leicester win.

We had very little possession but it felt like we could score whenever we felt like it whereas Leicester couldn't get within 20 yards of our goal.

There's something really comforting knowing that the opposition can't hurt you.

Ausp · Oct 2, 2020

sausage said:
Didn't he say about Fred, not long after the beginning of that final season, that he couldn't play him because the defence was so cack he needed a different tactic or something?
He spent ages trying to get EW to buy Toby but they wouldn't.

That's another thing. Was Fred even a player that he wanted?

fishhhandaricecake · Oct 2, 2020

Ausp said:
Highest win rate there and 3 trophies to show for it...

I'll agree with anyone that José's go-to philosophy was of a defensive mindset while he was there. However, I got the feeling that much of that came from an underdevelopment of what he was trying to do. He tried to rebuild the squad and their tactics from the ground up starting with their defense but he didn't receive the freedom and backing to see it through.

If I recall correctly, his best squads throughout his career all had very clinical attacks and the offense was usually developed later or was the last piece of his puzzle.

This is so spot on. Jose didn’t have the same control of backing at man.u as he has done here with Levy, sure he spent a decent amount of money but their squad was very very poor relative to their ambitions when he took over and yet still he finished 2nd and won 2.5 trophies!

Jose is like marmite and it is frustrating when general football fans who only know the surface of what is going on criticise him without the full picture.

It’s similar to when he took our squad over, it was stale and need of a refresh but still better than the man.u one he had, but he tried to firstly sort our organisation and defence out before more recently and with new signings now improving our attacking play, but if we’d not given Jose any new players this summer I’m certain he’d still have us playing pretty defensive ‘boring football because that is the way he sees getting the most effective results out of such a squad, but now we’ve signed Doherty, PEH, Regulion, Bale, Vinicus and have our key players fit and not injured it’s no surprise that our play is more balanced and adventurous as he now has the weapons at his disposal to play that way, the guy isn’t stupid, he’s won everything there is across multiple decades and in different countries and leagues, you don’t just suddenly ‘lose it’ when you’ve achieved all that.

Also you have to say the way he’s managed our squad this week is absolutely world class management.

Onwards and upwards.

mattdefoe · Oct 2, 2020

fishhhandaricecake said:
This is so spot on. Jose didn’t have the same control of backing at man.u as he has done here with Levy, sure he spent a decent amount of money but their squad was very very poor relative to their ambitions when he took over and yet still he finished 2nd and won 2.5 trophies!

Jose is like marmite and it is frustrating when general football fans who only know the surface of what is going on criticise him without the full picture.

It’s similar to when he took our squad over, it was stale and need of a refresh but still better than the man.u one he had, but he tried to firstly sort our organisation and defence out before more recently and with new signings now improving our attacking play, but if we’d not given Jose any new players this summer I’m certain he’d still have us playing pretty defensive ‘boring football because that is the way he sees getting the most effective results out of such a squad, but now we’ve signed Doherty, PEH, Regulion, Bale, Vinicus and have our key players fit and not injured it’s no surprise that our play is more balanced and adventurous as he now has the weapons at his disposal to play that way, the guy isn’t stupid, he’s won everything there is across multiple decades and in different countries and leagues, you don’t just suddenly ‘lose it’ when you’ve achieved all that.

Also you have to say the way he’s managed our squad this week is absolutely world class management.

Onwards and upwards.

I agree with a lot of this BUT in terms of backing he’s been backed here to an extent however with the exception of bale none of our other transfers have mega fees they are all quite shrewd and low value

At United he was able to spend big especially on lukaku . He’s not getting that type of money with us right now

muppetman · Oct 2, 2020

Blimey - someone says something hyperbolic about football and it leads to all this?

thekneaf · Oct 2, 2020

mattdefoe said:
I agree with a lot of this BUT in terms of backing he’s been backed here to an extent however with the exception of bale none of our other transfers have mega fees they are all quite shrewd and low value

At United he was able to spend big especially on lukaku . He’s not getting that type of money with us right now

He's got connections (Mendes) and a reputation that greases the wheels. Put a good deal in front of Levy and he'll pull the trigger. Always has.

freeeki · Oct 2, 2020

Archibald&Crooks said:
Someone with a beard on Twitter said he'd had the best 2 years of his Spurs supporting life watching Spurs under Pochettino. Someone else posted it in here and it all kicked off. Like who cares what the fuck he thinks.

Yes, someone not actually on SC (as far as I know) is responsible for this

Honestly it's always someone with a beard. It's why I don't trust socialists or lesbians.

Metalhead · Oct 2, 2020

sausage said:
For some reason I enjoyed the Redknapp era more. I know we didn't win every game, but I found his management more 'agreeable'. Maybe it's my bad memory, as I didn't use or read forums at all until well after AVB had gone. I feel that what Harry did for us (including being the catalyst for Kane and so many others) is always completely ignored (or wholly under-appreciated) in the context of what Poch did for us.

I think that Redknapp was exactly what was needed at the time.

whatislifewithoutspurs · Oct 2, 2020

May be thinking too much but didnt Jose praise Eric Dier for playing 2 full games (Newcastle and Chelsea) in 48 hrs but I dont see him praising Alderweireld when he did the same as well (Chelsea and ytd's game) ? Some kind of bias there or something

SandroClegane · Oct 2, 2020

whatislifewithoutspurs said:
May be thinking too much but didnt Jose praise Eric Dier for playing 2 full games (Newcastle and Chelsea) in 48 hrs but I dont see him praising Alderweireld when he did the same as well (Chelsea and ytd's game) ? Some kind of bias there or something

"What Eric Dier, [Steven] Bergwijn and Toby [Alderweireld] did is not human [in starting twice in 48 hours). It’s proven, scientifically proven, every sport scientist person knows that what they did shouldn't be done," he said.

"To play 180 minutes in three days shouldn't be allowed. These three guys did it, I know that some others played also until their limit, but we managed because we have a good squad and we have a squad with different options.

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carmeldevil · Oct 2, 2020

whatislifewithoutspurs said:
May be thinking too much but didnt Jose praise Eric Dier for playing 2 full games (Newcastle and Chelsea) in 48 hrs but I dont see him praising Alderweireld when he did the same as well (Chelsea and ytd's game) ? Some kind of bias there or something

You called the schedule inhuman?

What Eric Dier, Bergwijn and Toby did is not human. It’s proven, scientifically proven, every sport scientist person knows that what they did shouldn't be done. To play 180 minutes in three days shouldn't be allowed. These three guys did it, I know that some others played also until their limit, but we managed because we have a good squad and we have a squad with different options.

We managed to share players in these matches and we managed to go through two knockout competitions in the Carabao and Europa League but we could have gone out. Job done. I am really happy for the job done.

sausage · Oct 2, 2020

Metalhead said:
I think that Redknapp was exactly what was needed at the time.

I don't think anyone saw it coming tbf. A 'Westamm' legend (well, I assume so, ex-player, ex-manager style, and their bar is low) with a mediocre reputation.
I think we were exactly what he needed too. I found it harder to get over him leaving because he left on a bit of a high (albeit some bad luck from a one-off ECL rule), whereas with other managers, Poch included, it was an extended process of seeing it unfold first.

Metalhead · Oct 2, 2020

sausage said:
I don't think anyone saw it coming tbf. A 'Westamm' legend (well, I assume so, ex-player, ex-manager style, and their bar is low) with a mediocre reputation.
I think we were exactly what he needed to. I found it harder to get over him leaving because he left on a bit of a high (albeit some bad luck from a one-off ECL rule), whereas with other managers, Poch included, it was an extended process of seeing it unfold first.

It was a shame that’s for sure although you have to think that DL always hankered after a younger, project style manager.

sidford · Oct 2, 2020

Shadydan said:
Windy saying that he'd rather 2.5 years of peak Poch ball and win no trophies as opposed to winning 10 trophies with Jose ball

Windy and his side kick on Extra inch podcast have had a mare of a few weeks after the bale gag backfired and then this. Would imagine the listening figures to their podcast have taken a big dip.
It's hard to listen to "fans" being so negative when we win and not recognising any positives so havnt listened to the podcast in a good while.

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A hoonter must hoont

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Arsehole.

But that's a debate for another thread.....

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