Jose Mourinho

Shanks · Feb 5, 2021

talkshowhost86 said:
Mourinho isn't getting anything out of them whichever way you look at it.

I am perfectly happy for Mourinho to play his negative style if it gets results. I know some don't agree with that but being a pragmatist, if that's the style that he thinks best suits our available players then fair enough.

But it isn't working, and hasn't been working since he arrived.

So I still see absolutely no justification for keeping him at the club.

this is it for me, but f it brings in titles, then great, but it’s not enjoyable to watch.

we have a cup final to contend with, I already k ow it will be 90 mins of us sat in our 18 yard box hoping to catch them on the break, this invites mistakes - as soon as that first goal goes in, heads drop.

mots absolutely no good what so ever

waresy · Feb 5, 2021

I can't work it out. Jose says all the same things that we see, highlights things that are a problem but the team is playing with less and less confidence each week.

I'm confused on his selection of players coming in and out of the side, the contradiction of play compared to his apparent instructions, the suggestion that there is a glimmer of hope that the team can play based on the 2nd half. I just dont see the same thing. The press conferences are pointless.

We have an FA Cup match next week that on current form I can't see us winning. I'm sure we will beat West Brom Sunday, but then I thought we would beat Brighton too.

We know we have some good players, some average ones too but that will always be the case in terms of a squad. Is it the manager, is it a lack of energy after a lot of games. I really dont know. Many critised Poch for sticking with players that were out of form and not performing and yet JM leaves them out and then he has 'lost the dressing room'. What options does a manager have?

Sorry, a lot of waffle there and not a lot of sense, sums it all up really

Styopa · Feb 5, 2021

The main expectation we should have of a coach/manager is that he gets the best out of the players he has at his disposal. We can keep saying the players aren't good enough but we also need to ask whether Mourinho is getting the most from them. In other words, does the current level of form, 2 wins in 10 league matches or whatever, reflect the ceiling of this current squad? Has Mourinho got this bunch performing to their best of their ability? I would say absolutely not, and that falls on him. Maybe par for this team is as low as 7th or 8th in the league but at the moment we're playing like relegation candidates both in terms of performance and number of points we're collecting.

SUIYHA · Feb 5, 2021

-Afri-Coy- said:
Another example of using an extreme scenario to fit a narrative.

Everyone and their new born knows West Ham are punching above their weight, using them to try prove a point is meaningless. When I say top 5/6, I am talking about the teams that CONSISTENTLY perform to that level. With COVID and the world's circumstances it's not surprising that a dark horse like West Ham are performing better than others.

That being said, there are STILL West Ham players I would rather have in our squad, which goes to show how shocking some of our players are.

I don't think anyone outside of East London expects West Ham to be where they are now come the end of the season, but the point remains - they only have a couple of players that should be able to get into our team yet they look like an organised, functional unit under a manager that has been widely mocked for the past eight years.

It's easy to say players aren't good enough when playing in a disfunctional team. Lennon, Defoe and Dawson were just overhyped crap English youngsters under Jol and Ramos. Danny Rose and Kyle Walker were absolute liabilities under Sherwood. There are plenty of players in our squad that I don't think are good enough, but there are also plenty that we've seen player far better than they are doing now and you have to ask why that is.

Jaddas · Feb 5, 2021

League table on 15th December 2020 before we played Pool

League table today

Were we overachieving in December? Probably.......but we are definitely underachieving now.

To think some of us were dreaming of a league title only 7 weeks ago, with regular "Mourinho masterclasses," tonking United 6 - 1 etc but now surrendering meekly to Pool, Brighton & Chelsea. What a car crash we are with only 8 points from 9 games.

Don't think sacking him is the answer, but think it might be the only option left.

talkshowhost86 · Feb 5, 2021

Vinny_Sammways_left_peg said:
Hmm, really?

Yes really.

We are at 51% win percentage in his 70 games (I believe).

At no stage have we had any sustained success under Mourinho, and no trend of improvement.

fishhhandaricecake · Feb 5, 2021

Its pretty simple really, we have some of our most important key players either injured or not being played however that is no excuse for the football and results that are being served up, he has to go, its unwatchable and he's not a good fit for Spurs style at all, shame its not worked out how we liked but this cannot go on.

But we do still need to seriously improve in summer:

Davies
Aurier
Dier/CB
CM creativity
RW
ST

6 clear weaknesses that still need addressing.

Injuries making a huge diff:

Regullion : completely transforms our defence and attack compared to Davies
Lo Celso : key creative CM
Dele : big attacking threat when played in best position and on form
Kane : he is our entire attack in this Jose plan

However even with these 4 players back it would just paper over the cracks in Jose's set-up and style, when all fit the squad is still pretty decent and we should be getting a lot more out of it and Jose needs to go but to be fair 3/4 of the above are arguably our 3 most important players.

talkshowhost86 · Feb 5, 2021

Vinny_Sammways_left_peg said:
You said it hadn't worked at all since he arrived ... Which is why the poster you're responding to made the point he made.

Being top for a week doesn't mean something has worked.

That's a preposterous way of looking at things.

If you win your first three games and then lose the rest is that success? Absolutely not.

Deleted member 27995 · Feb 5, 2021

talkshowhost86 said:
Yes really.

We are at 51% win percentage in his 70 games (I believe).

At no stage have we had any sustained success under Mourinho, and no trend of improvement.

My apologies, I just read the part where you said "But it isn't working, and hasn't been working since he arrived."

I thought you meant when we won some matches and topped the league, rightly or wrongly, for a few days.

SpartanSpur · Feb 5, 2021

talkshowhost86 said:
Being top for a week doesn't mean something has worked.

That's a preposterous way of looking at things.

If you win your first three games and then lose the rest is that success? Absolutely not.

Agreed. Had we started the season with our form in the last 10 games and were sitting 15th I genuinely think Jose would be sacked now.

That early performance propped up by Kane and Son and making the most of some very favourable cup draws is masking the current situation IMO.

Deleted member 27995 · Feb 5, 2021

talkshowhost86 said:
Being top for a week doesn't mean something has worked.

That's a preposterous way of looking at things.

If you win your first three games and then lose the rest is that success? Absolutely not.

That isn't what you posted though.

handsomecake · Feb 5, 2021

The optics of him telling the female journo she didn't deserve an answer wasn't great either.

Alienated Dele, alienated Bale. Now the media are out for blood too.

-Afri-Coy- · Feb 5, 2021

SUIYHA said:
I don't think anyone outside of East London expects West Ham to be where they are now come the end of the season, but the point remains - they only have a couple of players that should be able to get into our team yet they look like an organised, functional unit under a manager that has been widely mocked for the past eight years.

It's easy to say players aren't good enough when playing in a disfunctional team. Lennon, Defoe and Dawson were just overhyped crap English youngsters under Jol and Ramos. Danny Rose and Kyle Walker were absolute liabilities under Sherwood. There are plenty of players in our squad that I don't think are good enough, but there are also plenty that we've seen player far better than they are doing now and you have to ask why that is.

Like I said in my original post you can probably split this squad down the middle in terms of who is good enough and who isn't. Our problem is it seems that the ones who aren't good enough are the leaders and tone setters of the dressing room. Negativity breeds more negativity, and vice versa.

But I do agree with the above, I just don't think we should put the majority of the blame on Mourinho we have been consistently shit and made the same mistakes or had the lack of intent for 3 years now.

Rout-Ledge · Feb 5, 2021

Trees said:
1 question that no one seems to have asked. Can we financially afford to sack him ?

Levy wouldn’t hire a manager he couldn’t afford to sack.

-Afri-Coy- · Feb 5, 2021

Rout-Ledge said:
Levy wouldn’t hire a manager he couldn’t afford to sack.

And it has been mentioned that there are clauses to protect us from a huge financial outlay.

muppetman · Feb 5, 2021

Bloody hell, I think about 80% of posts are from the same 5 or 6 people repeating the same stuff - is this what furlough does?

Styopa · Feb 5, 2021

It is starting to sound like some people are so invested in the idea of Mourinho that they are willing to overlook all of his faults and absolve him of all blame.

I mean of course if we had better players we probably would be doing better. Then again I bet West Brom would be doing better if they better players too. And Sheffield United. And Newcastle. And Leeds. And Arsenal. And Everton. And Leicester. In fact is there any team in the league that wouldn't be doing better if they had better players?

glacierSpurs · Feb 5, 2021

easley91 said:
Anyone suggesting a squad overhaul is needed, as much as I agree, it won't happen this summer. Not in a financially hit world due to covid. No way.

I think squad overhaul doesn't necessarily mean buying a whole lot and selling a whole lot. Promoting some youngsters to first team, integrate those who are coming back from loans, I think we are quite healthy in maintaining a very young core of fresh blood.

But that begs a question, will they be ready? Normally I don't think so, but to see our first teamers playing soooo horrendously bad currently, I really think there is no big deal in letting the young ones swim in the deep. I bet there will be bound to be a couple of them striving to prove themselves than some of the current senior players enjoying the paycheck staying comfortable doing fuck all.

And importantly Levy needs to understand these senior players will be losing their values, so don't expect to reap back anything worth from selling them.

rez9000 · Feb 5, 2021

mr ashley said:
Yeah but that wasn’t really the point I was making.

I think they are very well versed in how things work in the professional game. Self preservation on the pitch takes the pressure off them as individuals and heaps it on the manager.
I think that’s what we are seeing now sadly. They know how this plays out.
It’s awful watching it happen, but the wage they get paid has nothing to do with it.
You can call it unprofessional if you like - sadly I’d argue it’s part of being a professional - you protect yourself first.
agree that it’s not acceptable

And likewise, it wasn't the main thrust of my point; the enormity of their salaries was more to highlight their lack of perspective - that what they're pissing and moaning about is really small potatoes in the grand scheme of things.

Sure, we all think our problems are the most important thing around, because they're our problems, but still...

nico97531 · Feb 5, 2021

talkshowhost86 said:
Being top for a week doesn't mean something has worked.

That's a preposterous way of looking at things.

If you win your first three games and then lose the rest is that success? Absolutely not.

Again, we had been on top for more than a week so what you said is still factually incorrect.

The point I made was that it obviously worked for a while from the start of the season until end of the year. I understand your frustration with Jose but please don’t tried to change the fact.

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