Player Watch Player Watch: Ryan Sessegnon

Japhet · Aug 16, 2020

spids said:
We should not be babysitting Aurier on the right, let alone Sessegnon on the left. We need FBs who are up to the job from the get go.

I agree, but the only time we looked comfortable with that was when Dier was dropping from CM into a back 3. We don't have much natural width up front either. I'm not sure whether the 'lop sided' fullback tactic was brought about by necessity or preference tbh.

Who’s our next manager? · Aug 16, 2020

JamieSpursCommunityUser said:
Bet that went down well with Ryan’s twin brother who has just broken into their first team.

Perhaps Ryan has been playing with them all along and we’ve had Stephen.

Who’s our next manager? · Aug 16, 2020

spids said:
At a club with CL aspirations every year any young player has to be very special to get in the team at 21/22. Kane was. Dele was. Rooney at Everton broke the mould at 16! Foden at Man City, although he is having to be very patient, is another special player. Sessegnon is not in that category for me. He is a player who needs to continue developing before he is ready for a top 4 team. Buying players like him was great when we were consistently a 7th/8th/9th/10th team and were good enough for our first team and developed on the job. But we have to aim higher now. Buying Sessegnon and Clarke (combined £35M) was a mistake last summer when it was obvious the first team needed a good overhaul, and this is where I do have a lot of sympathy for Poch.

Spot on,great point.

Archibald&Crooks · Aug 16, 2020

morris25 said:
He was a big mistake, he isn't a top player and doesn't have the attributes to be either a great winger or LB.
Sell and move on

What the 20 year old player who's made about a half a dozen scattered appearances.

Wow.

sausage · Aug 16, 2020

spids said:
Rooney at Everton broke the mould at 16!

Random anecdote, but I happened to be at a first team friendly at Chester in maybe the season before he broke through, and their fans were gushing about him then as we were about Edwards (but obviously it was prior to the internet hype/football manager type stuff).
The main difference is the manager. Owen and Rooney simply wouldn't have broken through under managers like Pochettino who seems to require young players to have graduated Pochiversity with a 1st class degree in 'readiness'.
The bedrock of United's current success is down to Van Gaal, who chucked a load of young players in and gave them the chance. Very much like Pochettino's first season, which gave him a bit more kudus towards the young player developing reputation, but it pretty much disappeared after that.
I recall Redknapp being more than happy to chuck a bunch of high squad numbers out in cups and friendlies - he gave Kane 6 games when he was 18, for example. Compare that to Parrot, who is now capped at senior level, who has had less despite being high-rated.

What I'm basically angling at is that, despite the myth and reputation, it's the footballing "dinosaurs" that seem to do more for young players than any of these so call modern over-thinkers. I hope Mourinho is still a dinosaur in that regard, as Sess obviously has a lot of talent - although from what I've seen it's more attacking than defending.

mr ashley · Aug 16, 2020

Over the years we’ve signed several highly sought after young players, who have developed into some of the best players in the country.
Lennon
Walker
Bale
Dele
To name but four.
It looks like we’ve identified Aarons as our next target.
We’re pretty good at this type of transfer ( you could argue were the best in the country at it, hence our resurgence.
Sessegnon is one of these players. Just because Fulham tried him everywhere ( because he was their best player at 18), doesn’t mean he isn’t going to become a great overlapping fullback (which is the position I think his skill set leads to)

He may need time to develop (Bale did).
He might not play every game immediately (Dele didn’t)
If we decide that we can’t give him the games at the level he needs (certainly not championship, questionable about even PL), then a loan like Ethan Ampadu to RB Leipzig would be the next best thing. In fact, they might even be interested in that if Angelino has returned to Man City.
But we just need to be patient.

emiley heskey · Aug 16, 2020

mr ashley said:
Over the years we’ve signed several highly sought after young players, who have developed into some of the best players in the country.
Lennon
Walker
Bale
Dele
To name but four.
It looks like we’ve identified Aarons as our next target.
We’re pretty good at this type of transfer ( you could argue were the best in the country at it, hence our resurgence.
Sessegnon is one of these players. Just because Fulham tried him everywhere ( because he was their best player at 18), doesn’t mean he isn’t going to become a great overlapping fullback (which is the position I think his skill set leads to)

He may need time to develop (Bale did).
He might not play every game immediately (Dele didn’t)
If we decide that we can’t give him the games at the level he needs (certainly not championship, questionable about even PL), then a loan like Ethan Ampadu to RB Leipzig would be the next best thing. In fact, they might even be interested in that if Angelino has returned to Man City.
But we just need to be patient.

If Leipzig can take angelino on loan, then obviously they can take ryan sessegnon on loan as well

TEESSIDE1 · Aug 16, 2020

mr ashley said:
Over the years we’ve signed several highly sought after young players, who have developed into some of the best players in the country.
Lennon
Walker
Bale
Dele
To name but four.
It looks like we’ve identified Aarons as our next target.
We’re pretty good at this type of transfer ( you could argue were the best in the country at it, hence our resurgence.
Sessegnon is one of these players. Just because Fulham tried him everywhere ( because he was their best player at 18), doesn’t mean he isn’t going to become a great overlapping fullback (which is the position I think his skill set leads to)

He may need time to develop (Bale did).
He might not play every game immediately (Dele didn’t)
If we decide that we can’t give him the games at the level he needs (certainly not championship, questionable about even PL), then a loan like Ethan Ampadu to RB Leipzig would be the next best thing. In fact, they might even be interested in that if Angelino has returned to Man City.
But we just need to be patient.

Given their ages there’s not a lot of difference between Sess and Bale. Bale was both neither a left back or left winger for his 1st season or so. Bale as with Sess both had raw pace, the ability to glide passed the opposition and attacking intent. The only real stand out difference between the two was that Bale was known from scoring from free kicks. Sess has lots of next level potential attributes but needs time to develop. There’s a massive difference between having someone with exceptional raw ability and someone with an obvious ceiling.

Who’s our next manager? · Aug 16, 2020

emiley heskey said:
If Leipzig can take angelino on loan, then obviously they can take ryan sessegnon on loan as well

Is that the same Angelino ,the singing dustman from Only Fools and Horses who got his props from Crown Topper and Mattesons?

Hoopspur · Aug 16, 2020

sausage said:
Random anecdote, but I happened to be at a first team friendly at Chester in maybe the season before he broke through, and their fans were gushing about him then as we were about Edwards (but obviously it was prior to the internet hype/football manager type stuff).
The main difference is the manager. Owen and Rooney simply wouldn't have broken through under managers like Pochettino who seems to require young players to have graduated Pochiversity with a 1st class degree in 'readiness'.
The bedrock of United's current success is down to Van Gaal, who chucked a load of young players in and gave them the chance. Very much like Pochettino's first season, which gave him a bit more kudus towards the young player developing reputation, but it pretty much disappeared after that.
I recall Redknapp being more than happy to chuck a bunch of high squad numbers out in cups and friendlies - he gave Kane 6 games when he was 18, for example. Compare that to Parrot, who is now capped at senior level, who has had less despite being high-rated.

What I'm basically angling at is that, despite the myth and reputation, it's the footballing "dinosaurs" that seem to do more for young players than any of these so call modern over-thinkers. I hope Mourinho is still a dinosaur in that regard, as Sess obviously has a lot of talent - although from what I've seen it's more attacking than defending.

We played Everton in the youth FA Cup Final at WHL. I was lucky enough (through a ballot) to go along to a pre match chat given by David Pleat. He told the small audience there before the match that we should watch out for a wonderkid called Rooney who is 15. Rooney scored 2 goals. Everyone knew about Rooney and his qualities then. He was ready and everyone knew it.

Cochise · Aug 16, 2020

We bought him for what he could be, but you gotta play the lad in order for him to reach that potential.

wrd · Aug 16, 2020

For me his best attribute seems to be that he's so ridiculously intelligent when it comes to his decision making in the final 3rd. If you manage to get a LB who can make the correct runs and passing given the fullback is typically the extra man then we will benefit immensely.

thelak · Aug 16, 2020

spids said:
At a club with CL aspirations every year any young player has to be very special to get in the team at 21/22. Kane was. Dele was. Rooney at Everton broke the mould at 16! Foden at Man City, although he is having to be very patient, is another special player. Sessegnon is not in that category for me. He is a player who needs to continue developing before he is ready for a top 4 team. Buying players like him was great when we were consistently a 7th/8th/9th/10th team and were good enough for our first team and developed on the job. But we have to aim higher now. Buying Sessegnon and Clarke (combined £35M) was a mistake last summer when it was obvious the first team needed a good overhaul, and this is where I do have a lot of sympathy for Poch.

The last time we were consistently a 7th-10th team As you say was 11-12 years ago

buying guys like Sessegnon (Dele, Dier etc etc) and then working out is what made us first a top 6 and then a top 3-4 team

our expensive signings on the other hand have largely flopped

agree Jack Clarke is a bizzare one though

C0YS · Aug 16, 2020

sausage said:
Random anecdote, but I happened to be at a first team friendly at Chester in maybe the season before he broke through, and their fans were gushing about him then as we were about Edwards (but obviously it was prior to the internet hype/football manager type stuff).
The main difference is the manager. Owen and Rooney simply wouldn't have broken through under managers like Pochettino who seems to require young players to have graduated Pochiversity with a 1st class degree in 'readiness'.
The bedrock of United's current success is down to Van Gaal, who chucked a load of young players in and gave them the chance. Very much like Pochettino's first season, which gave him a bit more kudus towards the young player developing reputation, but it pretty much disappeared after that.
I recall Redknapp being more than happy to chuck a bunch of high squad numbers out in cups and friendlies - he gave Kane 6 games when he was 18, for example. Compare that to Parrot, who is now capped at senior level, who has had less despite being high-rated.

What I'm basically angling at is that, despite the myth and reputation, it's the footballing "dinosaurs" that seem to do more for young players than any of these so call modern over-thinkers. I hope Mourinho is still a dinosaur in that regard, as Sess obviously has a lot of talent - although from what I've seen it's more attacking than defending.

If thats the case then Jeffers, Anichiebe and Baxter would have made it too.

There is no 'main difference' turning top young talent into top players is incredibly complex, and regardless where you are the odds are that most hyped talents will not make it to the top.

For what its worth Kane had made no appearances at all in the first team at Parrotts age group. He made those 6 appearances, in the Europa League which we haven't qualified for in some time, in the season coming.

OK its true Van Gaal handed debuts to a lot of Man utd players, but only Lingard and Rashford have made it from 15 players who got their debuts. All but 3 of those players are playing in lower league football, most going for a nominal fee.I think it is hyperbolic to say there current good run of form is down to Van Gaal.

spids · Aug 16, 2020

thelak said:
The last time we were consistently a 7th-10th team As you say was 11-12 years ago

buying guys like Sessegnon (Dele, Dier etc etc) and then working out is what made us first a top 6 and then a top 3-4 team

our expensive signings on the other hand have largely flopped

agree Jack Clarke is a bizzare one though

Dele (£5M) and Dier (£3.5M) came pretty much straight into the first XI and were good enough to improve us. Dele in particular as amazing as a young player making the step up.Sessegnon has not been close to our starting XI, or an impact sub, under either Poch or Mourinho, and it really was a waste of £25M. If he has cost £5M I could understand it. Spending £35M combined last summer on Sessegnon and Clarke was really bad business for us seeing as our first XI was in drastic need of a good freshen up. I cannot help but think Clarke was a favour by Poch to Bielsa, who then did not use Clarke after we loaned him back. Very strange business.

McFlash · Aug 16, 2020

I can't believe that people can be so impatient with young players.
To write the likes of Sess and Clarke off at their ages is bloody ridiculous!
If you haven't torn up the Prem by the age of 20 you're obviously no good?! It's no wonder some of these kids can suffer from confidence issues, if they get wind of what some fans think.

Anyone with half a brain could clearly see that both of these kids were signed for their potential, not to burst straight into the first team. Give them a chance to grow and learn Ffs.

archiewasking · Aug 16, 2020

Archibald&Crooks said:
What the 20 year old player who's made about a half a dozen scattered appearances.

Wow.

And who scored against Bayern, possibly the best side in world football currently, in one of those few appearances.

spursfan77 · Aug 16, 2020

sausage said:
Random anecdote, but I happened to be at a first team friendly at Chester in maybe the season before he broke through, and their fans were gushing about him then as we were about Edwards (but obviously it was prior to the internet hype/football manager type stuff).
The main difference is the manager. Owen and Rooney simply wouldn't have broken through under managers like Pochettino who seems to require young players to have graduated Pochiversity with a 1st class degree in 'readiness'.
The bedrock of United's current success is down to Van Gaal, who chucked a load of young players in and gave them the chance. Very much like Pochettino's first season, which gave him a bit more kudus towards the young player developing reputation, but it pretty much disappeared after that.
I recall Redknapp being more than happy to chuck a bunch of high squad numbers out in cups and friendlies - he gave Kane 6 games when he was 18, for example. Compare that to Parrot, who is now capped at senior level, who has had less despite being high-rated.

What I'm basically angling at is that, despite the myth and reputation, it's the footballing "dinosaurs" that seem to do more for young players than any of these so call modern over-thinkers. I hope Mourinho is still a dinosaur in that regard, as Sess obviously has a lot of talent - although from what I've seen it's more attacking than defending.

I think more people are only now starting to look back and at the Poch years and realise this. Lots of us have been saying it for the years he was with us. Sherwood actually brought through more players than Poch and I never like to say a good word about him!

In a few years time it will be looked back on an era of complete missed opportunity in many ways.

fortworthspur · Aug 16, 2020

give him a proper season under one manager without injuries or a 4th month COVID suspension of play before judging him.

mr ashley · Aug 16, 2020

spids said:
Dele (£5M) and Dier (£3.5M) came pretty much straight into the first XI and were good enough to improve us. Dele in particular as amazing as a young player making the step up.Sessegnon has not been close to our starting XI, or an impact sub, under either Poch or Mourinho, and it really was a waste of £25M. If he has cost £5M I could understand it. Spending £35M combined last summer on Sessegnon and Clarke was really bad business for us seeing as our first XI was in drastic need of a good freshen up. I cannot help but think Clarke was a favour by Poch to Bielsa, who then did not use Clarke after we loaned him back. Very strange business.

Guarantee that no-one would be talking about value for money of these signings if we hadn’t had our transfer budget cut by the pandemic.

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