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Dele Alli at Everton

Timberwolf

Well-Known Member
Jan 17, 2008
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Wow... I agree it’s hard to see where Dele fits in this squad but the level of scorn for a kid who was genuinely a superstar for our club for years...
Mindboggling. The memories this guy gave us. The Real Madrid game; the assist for Moura in Amsterdam; the goal vs Palace in his first few games...

the kid set new standards for a new standard club. It’s horrific the way someof you are treating him. Embarrassing.

he goes he stays whatever- he was a genuine star for us. Jesus...
I think most people in this thread appreciate Alli, recognise him as a great talent and are thankful for what he's done. He's scored so many incredible goals for this club and he will always be a huge part of our rise under Poch.

However, that doesn't mean we can't critique how he plays or question his attitude. I don't see much genuine scorn in this thread, more a sense of frustration that has grown gradually over the past few years.

The memories will always be there, but when it comes to picking a squad, as callous as it may sound, sentiment can't come into it. Do you honestly think that if we were languishing in mid table and Madrid came sniffing, Dele would stick around just for the memories? He'd be gone, like all of our other stars of years gone by. I still respect and have fond memories of them but these things go both ways. That's just football.
 

Thanksandy

Well-Known Member
Aug 27, 2005
130
267
Dele’s main issues are twofold presently. His only one trick is to race into the box and arrive at the end of a cross. There’s little value in his all round play. So when he doesn’t really show up for those crosses either, there’s little use for him. In addition, when Kane is playing the role he is now and you are trying to get Gareth Bale match fit, then there’s just no slot left for somebody who isn’t doing his one trick.

I don't believe that is his only trait. He has a smart football brain and when he is in good form, he can see a pass and put in some clever through balls and and has good interplay with his teammates.
His finishing can be better at times, but he has still scored a number of technically superb goals, both inside and outside of the box and he has shown he is a threat in the air.
Unfortunately, like Lamela, he is guilty of holding onto the ball too long at times and he can slow down our play , which is frustrating. He misses chances that you would expect him score with, but we can't deny what he has done for us in the past and his stats are still impressive for a midfielder.
I just hope he can start to get back to that form from a few years back, because if he did, alongside Kane, Bale, Son, Ndombele etc, that would be incredible and I wouldn't like to be Mourinho trying to leave him out.
 
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midge

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Jul 28, 2011
400
784
Ali is a instinctive player. He plays best when he does not have to think about it. When he does, his game slows down

He was at his best during the early years with all his fancy tricks and crazy celebrations with Son .

His form took a dive once that died off. He needs to some how change his instinct to intelligence.
 

Everlasting Seconds

Well-Known Member
Jan 9, 2014
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I disagree that he is a one trick pony


I don't believe that is his only trait. He has a smart football brain and when he is in good form, he can see a pass and put in some clever through balls and and has good interplay with his teammates.
His finishing can be better at times, but he has still scored a number of technically superb goals, both inside and outside of the box and he has shown he is a threat in the air.
Unfortunately, like Lamela, he is guilty of holding onto the ball too long at times and he can slow down our play , which is frustrating. He misses chances that you would expect him score with, but we can't deny what he has done for us in the past and his stats are still impressive for a midfielder.
I just hope he can start to get back to that form from a few years back, because if he did, alongside Kane, Bale, Son, Ndombele etc, that would be incredible and I wouldn't like to be Mourinho trying to leave him out.
Thanks, Andy
 

mil1lion

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May 7, 2004
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But we don't play 433
So people actually disagree with fact :rolleyes:
Maybe I'm just imagining Hojbjerg alongside Winks and Ndombele in front or Hojbjerg alongside Sissoko and Ndombele in front
We haven't played 433 yet but only time will tell if we go that way. I think Jose sticks to his trusted 4231 though.

I don't think it's really a matter of Alli suiting the formation as much as suiting playing deep on the counter. I always feel that he is worse the deeper he gets. His best form was when we pressed high up the pitch, once we started to get pegged back more he struggled.

I would still keep him unless we really need to raise money for a top center back. I think we should look to sell Sanchez and Foyth to raise that money though since we would need to offload centre backs to make way anyway. Selling Alli doesn't seem necessary and when you consider the trouble Son had with consistency at a similar age there is always hope for Alli. As long as he's happy to compete he's a great player to have in the squad.
 

Timberwolf

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Jan 17, 2008
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So people actually disagree with fact :rolleyes:
Maybe I'm just imagining Hojbjerg alongside Winks and Ndombele in front or Hojbjerg alongside Sissoko and Ndombele in front
We haven't played 433 yet but only time will tell if we go that way. I think Jose sticks to his trusted 4231 though.

I don't think it's really a matter of Alli suiting the formation as much as suiting playing deep on the counter. I always feel that he is worse the deeper he gets. His best form was when we pressed high up the pitch, once we started to get pegged back more he struggled.

I would still keep him unless we really need to raise money for a top center back. I think we should look to sell Sanchez and Foyth to raise that money though since we would need to offload centre backs to make way anyway. Selling Alli doesn't seem necessary and when you consider the trouble Son had with consistency at a similar age there is always hope for Alli. As long as he's happy to compete he's a great player to have in the squad.
I think when we play with Ndombele or Lo Celso instead of Alli, there's a notable difference in their position. It might not be an orthodox 4-3-3 exactly, but they have a tendency to drop deeper and link with the other midfielders a lot more rather than staying high up as part of the attacking unit as Alli does.

In reality it's probably somewhere between a 4-2-3-1 and a 4-3-3 - and the fact that people are arguing about it proves as much - but the main take away is that if we want someone who is capable of dropping deeper and linking the attack and midfield, Ndombele and Lo Celso are a lot better at that than Alli. The downside is they don't offer the same goal threat, which is why we either need more goals from Lucas/Bale/Bergwijn or elsewhere to make up for it. The fact we've scored so many suggests it's not a problem at the moment, but in the long term we'll need goals from other areas of the pitch to make up for the loss of Eriksen and Alli.

I think Lo Celso should be scoring more, while Aurier, Reguilon and even Hojbjerg should score a few. Though ideally we want Bale to step up and give us 3 reliable goal scoring forwards as Lucas is far too unreliable and Bergwijn isn't quite there yet.
 

mil1lion

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I think when we play with Ndombele or Lo Celso instead of Alli, there's a notable difference in their position. It might not be an orthodox 4-3-3 exactly, but they have a tendency to drop deeper and link with the other midfielders a lot more rather than staying high up as part of the attacking unit as Alli does.

In reality it's probably somewhere between a 4-2-3-1 and a 4-3-3 - and the fact that people are arguing about it proves as much - but the main take away is that if we want someone who is capable of dropping deeper and linking the attack and midfield, Ndombele and Lo Celso are a lot better at that than Alli. The downside is they don't offer the same goal threat, which is why we either need more goals from Lucas/Bale/Bergwijn or elsewhere to make up for it. The fact we've scored so many suggests it's not a problem at the moment, but in the long term we'll need goals from other areas of the pitch to make up for the loss of Eriksen and Alli.

I think Lo Celso should be scoring more, while Aurier, Reguilon and even Hojbjerg should score a few. Though ideally we want Bale to step up and give us 3 reliable goal scoring forwards as Lucas is far too unreliable and Bergwijn isn't quite there yet.
Whoever plays that advanced central role (Ndombele at the moment) definitely should chip in with some goals. I fancy Doherty and Reguilon to score more than Aurier and Davies. I'm sure Bale will score more than Moura as well so we should be ok in that regard. We also have more potential of goals from the bench now with Vinicius, Lamela, Alli, Moura and Bergwijn all likely to be second choice.
 

mil1lion

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We've used it twice this season
I don't recall the games but sure we'll switch to a 433, 442 or 352 at times but so far since Jose took over it's usually 4231. I just don't get the suggestion that Alli doesn't fit the formation when we often play a midfield 2 with 1 pushed on (Alli's best position).
 

Cornpattbuck

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Jul 23, 2013
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People were writing off NDombele after last season. People were writing off Hojbjerg after two matches. Let's see what happens.

It feels obvious Dele has either been given a project to work on or an ultimatum.

Hope he works it out, as he can be more than a trick shot specialist if he wants to be.
 
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Shadydan

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Jul 7, 2012
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I don't recall the games but sure we'll switch to a 433, 442 or 352 at times but so far since Jose took over it's usually 4231. I just don't get the suggestion that Alli doesn't fit the formation when we often play a midfield 2 with 1 pushed on (Alli's best position).

Away to Southampton and Man Utd

 

bubble07

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Dec 27, 2004
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People were writing off NDombele after last season. People were writing off Hojbjerg after two matches. Let's see what happens.

It feels obvious Dele has either been given a project to work on or an ultimatum.

Hope he works it out, as he can be more than a trick shot specialist if he wants to be.

It doesnt matter if he does well in training now. There is no place in this formation for him. It's as simple as that. He is in Ndombeles position and Dele cant do what he can
 

mil1lion

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Away to Southampton and Man Utd

We played Ndombele in front of Winks and Hojbjerg at Saints and then Lo Celso in front in the 2nd half, then Ndombele in fromt of Sissoko and Hojbjerg at Utd. Ndombeleis playedmore advancedthan Hojbjerg, Winks and Sissoko. Whether he will with Sissoko remains to be seen. I'd be interested to see an average heat map of where Alli and Ndombele typically cover on the pitch. I don't think there would be a big differenc.
 

Shadydan

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Jul 7, 2012
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We played Ndombele in front of Winks and Hojbjerg at Saints and then Lo Celso in front in the 2nd half, then Ndombele in fromt of Sissoko and Hojbjerg at Utd. Ndombeleis playedmore advancedthan Hojbjerg, Winks and Sissoko. Whether he will with Sissoko remains to be seen. I'd be interested to see an average heat map of where Alli and Ndombele typically cover on the pitch. I don't think there would be a big differenc.

I'd imagine that is taken from an average heat map.
 

wrd

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Aug 22, 2014
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He's gonna have to reasses his game and adapt to try and fit into the positions we have. If I was him I'd be looking at Sissokos position and wondering If I can adapt my game to that role and looking to add the defensive work rate that Sissoko brings and seeing if I can match it whilst also being a better footballer. Give Jose something to think about and maybe Joss might prefer to only play one of Lo Celso or Tanguy at any time (hope not). His alternative is trying to take that spot that Moura, Bergwijn and Lamela are currently sharing.

I'd be looking at this situation thinking that Jose doesn't have a spot for my role and I need a complete overhaul if I want to make it back in. He has the ability to offer something different than Moussa in that spot but will need to offer the same defensively.
 
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