Harry Winks - Leicester City

[The Opinionated Lurker]

A new manager would probably bench Winks within a month but because he’s one of Poch’s favourites he’s in no danger of losing his spot. Sad

 

[double0]

Well exactly, it is a ridiculous argument. Winks just needs to be dropped and be used as a squad player who fills in when required but he is certainly not a first 11 level player. Anyone who wants to shoe horn him into an attacking role because they can't bear to see him dropped even though he offers nothing as an attacking player needs to be sectioned. We have an abundance of attacking players who are much better than Winks, even horribly under performing players like Alli and Eriksen are still better options.

Can you name our strongest 11?

 

[Mr Pink]

I'm just tired of the hope that things are going to be different, and they're not.

This little period since Bayern really has confirmed that, several times now.

You know when something is done.

 

[Primativ]

Can you name our strongest 11?

Well really you’re just asking me about midfield and attack aren’t you?

Sissoko NDombele as the midfield two. Sissoko to play more conservatively and break up play which he can do when asked. He’s also better than Winks at transitioning up the field.
Id just throw GLC in personally. There is no way he can be as useless as Eriksen is.

That would be the midfield three. Urgent priority in January would be to find a good DM. Sissoko could then become more of a squad player.

Front three Son, Kane, Lamela.

 

[Gassin's finest]

What is a "pivot"? I also hear he's a transitional player whatever that means. The players you mention there Xavi/Modric, Scholes are play makers they also chip in with goals and assists. Winks has 2 goals in 4 years and 1 assist, I'm sorry but it is ridiculous to eve mention those greats with such an average player like Winks. Completely different players. We have seen first hand what a quality player Modric was, he was the assist before the assist. He would open up defenses, and make those incisive passes to tea up attacking opportunities. Winks simply hasn't got the ability to do this. Sideways and backwards..

1) I already caveat-ed that I wasn't comparing quality.
2) Those players are Pivots.

How to use a pivot player defence

Look at the top teams around the world and all the best have a ball-playing defensive midfielder or what we call a pivot linked to a great goalkeeper. Spurs have Eric Dier, Chelsea bought Leicester City’s N’Golo Kante in the summer, Bayern Munich have Xabi Alonso and Juventus have Claudio...

www.soccercoachweekly.net

 

[Gassin's finest]

Lo Celso & Ndombele can do that and add to the attack. It’s useless to have a player who will only recycle possession and quite literally nothing else.

It depends on the system being used.

We play for the most part a 451... But without a DM. We play it with Sissoko (a box to box, water carrier) and Winks (a Pivot) and are not suited to those positions at all. Which is what everyone agrees on. For that system to work properly we need to have a proper DM, with a Pivot (as we did with Wanyama/Dembele, and Parker/Modric for example).

Hence, to get the best out of Winks you need to play him further forward, and not defensively like he is.

 

[double0]

I'm just tired of the hope that things are going to be different, and they're not.


This little period since Bayern really has confirmed that, several times now.

You know when something is done.

We get rid of Pochettino mid season. We appoint another manager the players have a rebirth play out of their skins sign new contracts all is rosey in the garden again. Levy’s smiling because his missed the bullet doesn’t have to spend big in the market we go on to win a trophies ... Pochettino assigned to Histroy as another AVB.

We back Pochettino give him what his been crying out for the last two years. He turns the place around learnt from his mistakes sets us on another project this time with success.

Who knows . Stick or twist.

 

[dtxspurs]

It depends on the system being used.

We play for the most part a 451... But without a DM. We play it with Sissoko (a box to box, water carrier) and Winks (a Pivot) and are not suited to those positions at all. Which is what everyone agrees on. For that system to work properly we need to have a proper DM, with a Pivot (as we did with Wanyama/Dembele, and Parker/Modric for example).

Hence, to get the best out of Winks you need to play him further forward, and not defensively like he is.

But why would we want Winks to play further up the field over Ndombele or Lo Celso?

 

[Gassin's finest]

But why would we want Winks to play further up the field over Ndombele or Lo Celso?

I didn't say that. I said it depends on what system we play.

 

[Primativ]

I didn't say that. I said it depends on what system we play.

What system would make Winks playing further forward an acceptable or correct decision? It doesn’t matter what system we play, we have about 8 better options in attacking positions than Winks.

You see the problem in admitting that Winks can’t play attacking roles when you’ve already admitted he can’t play defensive roles, is that it requires admitting he shouldn’t be in the team because he excels at nothing.

 

[skaz04nik]

I am wondering which year, month and date Poch will stop using Winks as DM? Losing position again and again...

one:

two:

three:

 

[Thewobbler]

What system would make Winks playing further forward an acceptable or correct decision? It doesn’t matter what system we play, we have about 8 better options in attacking positions than Winks.

You see the problem in admitting that Winks can’t play attacking roles when you’ve already admitted he can’t play defensive roles, is that it requires admitting he shouldn’t be in the team because he excels at nothing.

I think poch really likes him though. The thing he said about ndombele and the big difference quote I reckon he thought the reporter was having a dig at winks so he said what he did.

 

[Tottenhamboy85]

I am wondering which year, month and date Poch will stop using Winks as DM? Losing position again and again...

one:
View attachment 57392
two:
View attachment 57393
three:
View attachment 57394

Didn’t we play a midfield two yesterday? If so shouldn’t you be throwing these at Sissoko too

 

[skaz04nik]

Didn’t we play a midfield two yesterday? If so shouldn’t you be throwing these at Sissoko too

Have a look at the in-game movement.
Winks was clearly instructed to play DM. Sissoko was (trying) to get the ball to the final 3rd

 

[Tottenhamboy85]

Have a look at the in-game movement.
Winks was clearly instructed to play DM. Sissoko was (trying) to get the ball to the final 3rd

Looking at winks average position that @coys200 posted him and Sissoko are pretty much both in the DM position.

For me you can’t throw this at one without the other but hey that’s just me

 

[Primativ]

Looking at winks average position that @coys200 posted him and Sissoko are pretty much both in the DM position.

For me you can’t throw this at one without the other but hey that’s just me

Sissoko was the box to box player and Winks was the DM. Look who drove the ball forward in the first minute which led to our goal.

The thing is Sissoko brings other things to the team hence why he plays box to box. Winks is supposed to be the DM because he does nothing else well yet he can’t even do DM. So why is he in the team?

 

[Glenn&Chris]

He simply isn’t good enough. Can’t defend as he’s not physical enough, cant tackle, he offers zero in attack, can’t pick a meaningful pass as he hasn’t got the ability or the vision, doesn’t score goals and poor at shooting, can’t cross, look at mason mounts who is younger than winks cross for the goal on Saturday. Winks can’t do that, what is he? He’s a cookie cut modern day footballer who is nice and tidy but ultimately does nothing, links defence with defence and occasionally midfield. He just isn’t very good and offers nothing. Amazing how much he’s rated by some spurs fans but most are coming round now, all my mates who I go to the games now see this. It’s pretty obvious really.. but he’s a “pivot” ?

 

[Primativ]

He simply isn’t good enough. Can’t defend as he’s not physical enough, can tackle, he offers zero in attack, can’t pick a meaningful pass as he hasn’t got the ability or the vision, doesn’t score goals and poor at shooting, can’t cross, look at mason mounts who is younger than winks cross for the goal on Saturday. Winks can’t do that, what is he? He’s a cookie cut modern day footballer who is nice and tidy but ultimately does nothing, links defence with defence and occasionally midfield. He just isn’t very good and offers nothing. Amazing how much he’s rated by some spurs fans but most are realising this..

They are slowly coming round. The rest won’t accept it until he’s sold to Cardiff in a couple of years, and even then they’ll say that was a mistake.

 

[Haddock]

I've never rated Winks but I'll say this in his defence: As this Spurs isn't functioning as a team at the moment, it's not strange that we see a lot of poor individual performances.

Anyway, if we look at City and Liverpool they are both playing with designated DM specialists in Rodri / Fernandinho and Fabinho. It's a tired ol' saying but it's really not rocket science why we're looking so defensively disorganised at the moment. We really do miss a fit Wanyama and Dier from two seasons ago.

And unfortunately this relates to Winks. Pochettino obviously rates him highly and he probably loved the idea of taking an academy player and turning him in to a top four CM under his guidance. But as shown time and time with Pochettino - his main fault as a coach is that he fails to acknowledge when he's wrong. He's just to stubborn to admit that his own decisions didn't plan out as predicted.

Anyway, this wasn't a dig at Winks per say. He's a good squad player and I love the fact that his Spurs through and through but I'm also certain he's not good enough to warrant being a nailed on starter.

 

[Tottenhamboy85]

Sissoko was the box to box player and Winks was the DM. Look who drove the ball forward in the first minute which led to our goal.

The thing is Sissoko brings other things to the team hence why he plays box to box. Winks is supposed to be the DM because he does nothing else well yet he can’t even do DM. So why is he in the team?

Then why is Sissoko in the CB position in the third clip? Surely he should be the one covering the edge of the box.

Basically it boils down to neither winks or Sissoko have positional awareness to play next to each other.