The Rugby Thread

[Gbspurs]

Swing Low should not be banned - Johnson

Boris Johnson says he does not think Swing Low, Sweet Chariot should be banned after the Rugby Football Union announced it would review the song's use.

www.bbc.co.uk

I'm not a rugby fan so I may be walking into a political nightmare but I don't get this. Surely a song written by a 19th century slave being adopted in popular culture for the purpose of bringing people together is the antithesis of racism?

I understand heritage is important but surely banning everything that has links to the past does nothing more than whitewash history and not show how we have grown?

 

[Yid-ol]

Swing Low should not be banned - Johnson

Boris Johnson says he does not think Swing Low, Sweet Chariot should be banned after the Rugby Football Union announced it would review the song's use.

www.bbc.co.uk

I'm not a rugby fan so I may be walking into a political nightmare but I don't get this. Surely a song written by a 19th century slave being adopted in popular culture for the purpose of bringing people together is the antithesis of racism?

I understand heritage is important but surely banning everything that has links to the past does nothing more than whitewash history and not show how we have grown?

So wanted to make a joke about using that word... But now too scared to

Caught them talking about this on sky sports and they said you will struggle to ban, the alternative is to educate everyone on the history of it and see if people then chose not to sign it, as the woman on said she would stop digging it after finding out the meaning behind it.

 

[Gbspurs]

So wanted to make a joke about using that word... But now too scared to

Caught them talking about this on sky sports and they said you will struggle to ban, the alternative is to educate everyone on the history of it and see if people then chose not to sign it, as the woman on said she would stop digging it after finding out the meaning behind it.

Exactly, education has to be the way forward. I can't imagine the damage that censoring history will do longterm. More than happy for the song to go (doesn't affect me either way as not a fan) but the reasons behind it have to be right.

 

[spursfan77]

Exactly, education has to be the way forward. I can't imagine the damage that censoring history will do longterm. More than happy for the song to go (doesn't affect me either way as not a fan) but the reasons behind it have to be right.

No good has ever come of that.

 

[Barmy_in_Palmy]

Swing Low should not be banned - Johnson

Boris Johnson says he does not think Swing Low, Sweet Chariot should be banned after the Rugby Football Union announced it would review the song's use.

www.bbc.co.uk

I'm not a rugby fan so I may be walking into a political nightmare but I don't get this. Surely a song written by a 19th century slave being adopted in popular culture for the purpose of bringing people together is the antithesis of racism?

I understand heritage is important but surely banning everything that has links to the past does nothing more than whitewash history and not show how we have grown?

I have no horse in this but for the sake of devils advocate;

It’s cultural appropriation, it’s not the England rugby fans song to sing, just like you couldn’t name the England Rugby team the English N*****s and then claim that the fans chanting it brings everyone together. Or similar to another sports teams who’s non Jewish fan base like to refer to themselves as the “Yid Army”. The argument there is that by chanting “Yid Army” they are fighting against anti Semitic fans, while a lot of Jewish people just find it offensive.

 

[Yid-ol]

I have no horse in this but for the sake of devils advocate;

It’s cultural appropriation, it’s not the England rugby fans song to sing, just like you couldn’t name the England Rugby team the English N*****s and then claim that the fans chanting it brings everyone together. Or similar to another sports teams who’s non Jewish fan base like to refer to themselves as the “Yid Army”. The argument there is that by chanting “Yid Army” they are fighting against anti Semitic fans, while a lot of Jewish people just find it offensive.

Most songs sung at football or rugby could be banned if it's not their song to sing.

 

[Japhet]

I have no horse in this but for the sake of devils advocate;

It’s cultural appropriation, it’s not the England rugby fans song to sing, just like you couldn’t name the England Rugby team the English N*****s and then claim that the fans chanting it brings everyone together. Or similar to another sports teams who’s non Jewish fan base like to refer to themselves as the “Yid Army”. The argument there is that by chanting “Yid Army” they are fighting against anti Semitic fans, while a lot of Jewish people just find it offensive.

Cultural appropriation would imply that the song was 'stolen' from black slaves. I doubt very much that there was any of that going on when the song was adopted 40 odd years ago by English rugby. It was always just a call to arms for low scrummaging and I doubt the origins of the song were widely known at that time. Should BLM want to adopt the song then English rugby should yield to that but I don't see any evidence of that being sought.

 

[Gbspurs]

I have no horse in this but for the sake of devils advocate;

It’s cultural appropriation, it’s not the England rugby fans song to sing, just like you couldn’t name the England Rugby team the English N*****s and then claim that the fans chanting it brings everyone together. Or similar to another sports teams who’s non Jewish fan base like to refer to themselves as the “Yid Army”. The argument there is that by chanting “Yid Army” they are fighting against anti Semitic fans, while a lot of Jewish people just find it offensive.

I'll happily admit I'm not informed on the pitfalls of cultural appropriation but would this go on to suggest that white people can only sing songs made by white people and visa versa or is it only an issue where racial language is used? I feel like it's the latter (certainly with your example of N word and Yid) but as I'm not aware of any racial language in that song I'm worried it's the former which just seems wrong and counter progressive if we are ring fencing everyone. I do appreciate it's a complex issue and if it does offend people it should be reviewed.

 

[teok]

Who forgot that we didn't finish the 6 nations this year? Seems so long ago now.

This is the schedule:

Aug 15: Prem starts
Oct 17: Euro finals
Oct 24: Prem Final; Ire v Ita
Oct 25 Eng v BaaBaas
Oct 31 Eng v Ita; Wal v Sco; Fra v Ire
Nov 7/8 Rest
Nov 14/15 Pool games
Nov 21/22 Pool games; Prem starts
Nov 28/29 Pool games; Prem
Dec 5/6 Test Comp Finals; Prem
Dec 12/13 European Cups start

 

[teok]

Imagine of footballers responded like this.

 

[teok]

 

[Japhet]

Sad to hear that Jack Clifford has retired at 27 due to persistent shoulder problems. He showed a lot of promise.

 

[teok]

Well I thoroughly enjoyed all the games last night. Sale are basically a mini south africa and just bully you. They had exeter on the ropes last night but exeter came back and won.

Bristol are now a proper pat lam team with semi radrada (that guy is nuts). I can see them pulling in really big crowds and becoming one of the top teams in the prem. They can beat anyone on their day.

I was enjoying it so much I completely forgot about the uefa cup final (just caught the last few mins).

 

[tototoner]

 

[teok]

Wasps 19 year old hooker scored a hat trick on his debut. I think he is a converted centre. He looks quality.

 

[teok]

Radrada and Earle for bristol last night. They are great watch when they get going.

Orange, Orange, Orange

Watch "Orange, Orange, Orange" on Streamable.

streamable.com

 

[Japhet]

Tom Youngs Mk2. Be handy if he can throw staighter than a paper plane on a windy day.

 

[teok]

Fantastic from exeter to beat toulouse.

 

[markt]

Who forgot that we didn't finish the 6 nations this year? Seems so long ago now.

This is the schedule:

Aug 15: Prem starts
Oct 17: Euro finals
Oct 24: Prem Final; Ire v Ita
Oct 25 Eng v BaaBaas
Oct 31 Eng v Ita; Wal v Sco; Fra v Ire
Nov 7/8 Rest
Nov 14/15 Pool games
Nov 21/22 Pool games; Prem starts
Nov 28/29 Pool games; Prem
Dec 5/6 Test Comp Finals; Prem
Dec 12/13 European Cups start

Looking forward to this restarting. Feels like unfinished business after the France game. You would hope with just Italy left we hold on to that top spot. France Ireland should be a fun watch too.

 

[tototoner]