Player Watch: Marcus Edwards

JayB · Sep 18, 2017

Blake Griffin said:
that's because, contrary to popular belief, it's not actually just a case of wanting want all da yoof in the first team regardless of whether they're good enough/deserve it or not. as much as i like tob and think he will have a bright future here, his body of work so far at youth level simply doesn't merit senior inclusion when compared to edwards.

what i personally find very odd, is how every part of pochettino's management can be critiqued and debated but his use of youth players can't be questioned? why must his decisions in that area be blindly obeyed but everything else is fair game?

Totally agree. What makes me mad is not that Poch isn't giving youth a chance (obviously when his comments point to TOB and KWP being involved that is not the case), but rather that Edwards specifically offers something that we are lacking.

We struggle mightily against teams that park nine players behind the ball and try to eek out a draw, and Edwards' ability to beat defenders on the dribble is absolutely a viable approach to opening up those kinds of teams. No one else in the squad has that ability so I was really hoping he'd have an opportunity to earn a spot on the bench.

Hopefully it's just a case of Edwards still not being at the fitness levels that Poch requires after recovering from injury and not that Poch feels he needs to develop more physically. If it's the former he'll hopefully be involved soon but if it's the latter he may not figure at all this season.

felmani26 · Sep 18, 2017

Trix said:
I'm going back a while but last I heard it was his physicality that was lacking easily being brushed aside in training etc. His talent has never been in doubt, but he needs to improve on his core strength/balance, which hopefully will come in time. Throwing him in against a load of fully grown Championship players at Wembley who are hoping to take a scalp, probably is not the best course of action tbh.

With all due respect, he's hardly going to be asked to come in and jostle with big lumbering center forwards whilst defending high balls into the penalty box is he?

The physicality (or lack of) factor just seems an all too convenient crutch for so many managers when it comes smaller, skillful players of Edwards' stature. In all probability we will likely have put the game to bed after 65mins so to bring him on, give him a taste of playing first team football, at Wembley no less, with little pressure on his shoulders out on the wing can surely only bring positives.

coys200 · Sep 18, 2017

Disconosebleed said:
Is TOB as big as that? I've only seen him a few times and didn't notice him being particularly big or tall, but I'll defer to your greater knowledge. I think I might have a problem with depth perception (these sheep are small, those ones are far away), Onomah is apparently six foot but he's always looked pretty small to me.

Get your eyes tested mate onomah is 6 1" and already a bit of a beast.TOB must be about 6ft and prob still growing,will defo be a unit by 20.

Hercules · Sep 18, 2017

coys200 said:
Get your eyes tested mate onomah is 6 1" and already a bit of a beast.TOB must be about 6ft and prob still growing,will defo be a unit by 20.

TOB for the records is 6ft 1; Josh is 6ft 2 and bit inches.

Streetspur77 · Sep 18, 2017

felmani26 said:
With all due respect, he's hardly going to be asked to come in and jostle with big lumbering center forwards whilst defending high balls into the penalty box is he?

The physicality (or lack of) factor just seems an all too convenient crutch for so many managers when it comes smaller, skillful players of Edwards' stature. In all probability we will likely have put the game to bed after 65mins so to bring him on, give him a taste of playing first team football, at Wembley no less, with little pressure on his shoulders out on the wing can surely only bring positives.

No it could easily bring negatives. If Edwards comes on and has a terrible performance, because he's not ready, his confidence will be destroyed and some will get frustrated with him, especially considering the messi comparisons

I'm all for people having debates, this is a forum after all, but right now there can be no criticism of the decision because no one except people who watch Edwards train with the first team can have any idea if he's ready for men's football, so they have nothing to base their argument off

felmani26 · Sep 18, 2017

Streetspur77 said:
No it could easily bring negatives. If Edwards comes on and has a terrible performance, because he's not ready, his confidence will be destroyed and some will get frustrated with him, especially considering the messi comparisons

I'm all for people having debates, this is a forum after all, but right now there can be no criticism of the decision because no one except people who watch Edwards train with the first team can have any idea if he's ready for men's football, so they have nothing to base their argument off

In the circumstances I just caveated, there would be no justification for this response from any fan with a modicum of sense.

mpickard2087 · Sep 18, 2017

Chris Flynn said:
I disagree on this. I think Winks is trusted and would have been in the line up for some of the recent games if he hadnt been returning from an injury. The ammount of times he was brought on last season when we were losing or drawing tells you that. Is he ahead of Dembele? Of course not yet, not many would be. Will he start a lot of games this season? I would say definatly. I get your point that potch seems to prefer bigger athaletic players but you cant ignore Winks or say 'i know hes injured but...'. I think he proves if youre good enough youre big enough

That's fair enough, I personally think he's only trusted to be a back-up though, I'd like to be wrong, I hope I'm wrong, but I'm not sure he's ever going to be in contention to be a first pick.

Blake Griffin · Sep 18, 2017

Streetspur77 said:
No it could easily bring negatives. If Edwards comes on and has a terrible performance, because he's not ready, his confidence will be destroyed and some will get frustrated with him, especially considering the messi comparisons

I'm all for people having debates, this is a forum after all, but right now there can be no criticism of the decision because no one except people who watch Edwards train with the first team can have any idea if he's ready for men's football, so they have nothing to base their argument off

so, was he ready a year ago when he got 20 minutes against gillingham then? he even put in a more cohesive piece of attacking play during that cameo than the likes of nkoudou or sissoko have managed in their time here. pochettino also said that had he not gotten injured then he'd have been in line to be involved against liverpool(in the next round) but here we are a year later and he's apparently now not physically up to playing a small part against barnsley.

TaoistMonkey · Sep 18, 2017

TaoistMonkey said:
he'll be off soon

Another Dick bag not understanding the use of the Spam rating.

Cravenspurs · Sep 18, 2017

Blake Griffin said:
so, was he ready a year ago when he got 20 minutes against gillingham then? he even put in a more cohesive piece of attacking play during that cameo than the likes of nkoudou or sissoko have managed in their time here. pochettino also said that had he not gotten injured then he'd have been in line to be involved against liverpool(in the next round) but here we are a year later and he's apparently now not physically up to playing a small part against barnsley.

Yeah his cameo consisted of more 1-2's with the forward line then we see with most of our team. It is baffling to hear this and somewhat discouraging since we just need more players that take the defenders on. We have a very talented side, but Sonny is basically the only player that lines his defender up and takes him on. More technical ability is badly needed and ME has that in abundance. He could be a super sub of sorts and I really think you just have to throw people into the fire every now and then.

GKN has the ability to take people on, but all we have seen from him is this slide shuffle thing he does down the left flank and then pass it infield. He has been less than impressive IMO and ME could do no worse (broken record in this thread).

Trix · Sep 18, 2017

felmani26 said:
With all due respect, he's hardly going to be asked to come in and jostle with big lumbering center forwards whilst defending high balls into the penalty box is he?

The physicality (or lack of) factor just seems an all too convenient crutch for so many managers when it comes smaller, skillful players of Edwards' stature. In all probability we will likely have put the game to bed after 65mins so to bring him on, give him a taste of playing first team football, at Wembley no less, with little pressure on his shoulders out on the wing can surely only bring positives.

It's nothing to do with being small it's about him being physically weaker. Plenty of small players get by because they have good core strength and balance. With all due respect you and others are watching him against players his age-ish, where as the coaching team are watching him against our other very physical first team players. As has already been said in the last few pages... There are others of the same age and/or build who will be playing a part on Wednesday so his size or age clearly isn't the deciding factor on his non selection for this game.

Streetspur77 · Sep 18, 2017

Blake Griffin said:
so, was he ready a year ago when he got 20 minutes against gillingham then? he even put in a more cohesive piece of attacking play during that cameo than the likes of nkoudou or sissoko have managed in their time here. pochettino also said that had he not gotten injured then he'd have been in line to be involved against liverpool(in the next round) but here we are a year later and he's apparently now not physically up to playing a small part against barnsley.

Well he had a year of injuries after that(correct me if I'm wrong) which may have easily set him back physically. Or poch also mentioned his confidence which may have taken a hit

Truth is we don't know but we aren't in the position to know as fans, whereas poch is. I don't get what the criticism is suggesting, that poch has some kind of vendetta against Edwards?

thebenjamin · Sep 18, 2017

Isn't he just back after one long injury or a series of injuries?

worcestersauce · Sep 18, 2017

Trix said:
It's nothing to do with being small it's about him being physically weaker. Plenty of small players get by because they have good core strength and balance. With all due respect you and others are watching him against players his age-ish, where as the coaching team are watching him against our other very physical first team players. As has already been said in the last few pages... There are others of the same age and/or build who will be playing a part on Wednesday so his size or age clearly isn't the deciding factor on his non selection for this game.

Interesting similarity with a young Harry Kane, Harry was a big enough unit as a teenager and was successful against his age group but was why some people couldn't see his quality on the odd occasion he played for the first team as an eighteen year old.
It's why some people still weren't sure when he came into the team at twenty one by which time he had developed enough to take on the big bullies of the premier league.
I really am no expert on Marcus but he's not a Rahim Sterling whose game is based so much on speed which is already apparent as a teenager, he is far more than that and is still a work in progress.

LexingtonSpurs · Sep 18, 2017

My assumption with the "physicality" is that Poch wants him to be stronger - not bulked up stronger, but core muscle stronger.

If I had to guess, I'd say he is about a year away from being ready to compete (at a high level) against grown men. Throwing him into that situation now is not going to make him stronger (or better), and unnecessarily risks physical injury.

Letting him compete in the Youth Cup, and with the U23s, is the best path for his development imo. Off the pitch he can focus on strengthening, and on the pitch, he can focus on running a match. I think some people want to rush players too quickly, and then knock them when the players don't play up to standards.

The club, including Poch, obviously think highly of Edwards - he captained the Youth Cup squad. He has an important role on that squad, and I assume with the U23s - where he is getting to play against bigger/stronger players.

Bus-Conductor · Sep 18, 2017

Chris Flynn said:
Winks

3 league starts in the last 43, now can't even get a start in a CM3 over Sissoko. And the only thing Sissoko does better than Winks as a CM is be big.

Hengy1 · Sep 18, 2017

Bus-Conductor said:
3 league starts in the last 43, now can't even get a start in a CM3 over Sissoko. And the only thing Sissoko does better than Winks as a CM is be big.

Tbf he's still struggling with his ankle

Bus-Conductor · Sep 18, 2017

Trix said:
I'm going back a while but last I heard it was his physicality that was lacking easily being brushed aside in training etc. His talent has never been in doubt, but he needs to improve on his core strength/balance, which hopefully will come in time. Throwing him in against a load of fully grown Championship players at Wembley who are hoping to take a scalp, probably is not the best course of action tbh.

He's less easily knocked off a ball than Alli.

Spurs 1961 · Sep 18, 2017

He has missed a year of development so it's not surprising that he needs some more games under his belt and time to improve his physical condition. If Poch is being careful with him then so be it as I would hate to see him thrown in too early and fail

DEFchenkOE · Sep 18, 2017

Can't understand this one, I really don't see what GKN offers over Edwards apart from being a little bit stronger and French. He doesnt have the dribbling ability or end product of Edwards.

I'd be very frustrated if I was in his position tbh. Especially if I'm captain of a youth team and someone 2 years younger than me is getting opportunities in the first team.

For me the worst thing is that we actually need a player with Edwards abilities in our team. If we had a squad full of players that could take people on then I could understand it. But we're severely lacking in this area so I can't see how it would hurt putting him on the bench tomorrow and bringing him on for 10 minutes.

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