The Mauricio Pochettino thread

Shadydan · Dec 17, 2017

PeeEyeEmPee said:
yes. logic suggests he would have. what you really need to be asking is could Pochettino have won 6 trophies in his very first season at Barca, created one of the greatest club sides of all time, gone on to not just win but absolutely crush the competition in Germany, then come to England and (in his first season, admittedly, absolutely decimate the league before Christmas? if your answer is yes, it then begs the question why he's not been able to squeeze even more out of this team and squad than he has managed so far.

don't get me wrong, I actually really like Pochettino, and think he's done a very good job at Tottenham so far, but seeing some of our fans hailing him as the best in the league/Europe/the world, putting him up there with the Guardiolas and Mourinhos, and refusing to acknowledge any criticism of him whatsoever is cringey as fuck. he's won nothing in the game, so his methods and philosophy at this point remain unproven, so on what is this unshakeable faith based exactly? yes Man City have spent a ludicrous amount of money, but it's not as though they've bought the absolute superstars of world football, so the money alone doesn't account for the quality of football they are now playing. that takes insanely good coaching. forget yesterday's result, we're predominantly struggling against teams that put men behind the ball, because our passing and movement is so one-paced and pedestrian. do you honestly believe these wouldn't be significantly better under Pep? people on swear that there isn't a great deal between some of our players and theirs, and that players like Kane (who I absolutely agree with), Eriksen and Alli are world-class or thereabouts, so surely it's reasonable to believe they're capable of much better than this? why are we so far behind Man U and Chelsea too? are their squads also so much better than ours?

We really need to get real. Pochettino is a very good manger, but he's not in the same league as the true elite yet, and there's no guarantee he ever will be.

Pochettino has managed Espanyol, Southampton and Tottenham in his career, that's three teams who don't have the best resources in their respective leagues and are/were up against financially doped teams, what exactly are you expecting? How can you say his methods and his philosophy remain unproven seeing as he has a proven track record of improving teams and players?

Why are you only taking into account this season which totally ignores the work he done last season? Why weren't we struggling against teams who sit back and put 10 men behind the ball last season, we scored 86 goals in the league and we were blowing teams away, this season we are struggling with injuries and we are in stadium transition and suddenly Poch is Mr average lol okay then

PeeEyeEmPee · Dec 17, 2017

if what you've taken from my post is that I'm calling him average, even with me explicitly stating he's a very good manager that's done a very good job, then it's probably not worth my entering into discussion with you, as you'll only hear what you want to.

Spurs72 · Dec 17, 2017

Shadydan said:
Dier was fine a few weeks ago, he was in great form heading into November and had some real stand out games as a CB until he hit a sticky patch, also keeping Dier in the team has allowed to fill in two positions where we are weak.

Think you're being a little naive in regards to Walker, he wanted to leave so benching him wouldn't have made an iota of difference and even if he would have kicked up a fuss he would be seen as a disruption and a distraction so we would have been fucked either way which is the point I'm making, I think we dealt with it the right way IMO.

What do you mean when you say Money isn't a factor?

That's a strange comparison mate, why would KDB want to come to a us, we sold Walker to City because he wanted to go to City.

KDB to Us or Walker to City imho is not a Strange, they are both very good players right, Why is it ok for us to sell a star to City but not ok for City to sell a Star to us, Do we know for a fact that he demanded to go up North ?

Money is not a factor to me, I am really not to stressed if Walker went for 50 or 60 Mill, of course Levy wanted to get the most out of this Deal, I just think Walker could have been persuaded to stay.

Not Naive if we let players push us around all the time then what expectations do you have for this Team, Bench him and send a message , then maybe we would not have Rose pulling the Crap that he pulled.

Dier has never been my Favourite so can't really discuss him without bias tbh.

allpaths · Dec 17, 2017

Gb160 said:
Exactly, the way people are going on about Walker like he's the reason City are so bloody good right now...if we refused to sell him they'd have just gone and bought someone else of similar quality.

City wins the prem no matter who is playing right back, but the defensive balance that Walker brings to City will allow them to compete seriously for Champions league and the fa cup. Defensively he can do things that no other fullback in world football can do, nobody can beat him for pace, he's strong in the air and tackle, with excellent stamina allowing him to cover massive amounts of ground. He basically played as a third centerback yesterday and still bossed our left flank. We definately didnt need to hand the most athletic defensive fullback over to city.

tiger666 · Dec 17, 2017

allpaths said:
Defensively he can do things that no other fullback in world football can do.

Fucking hell ...

PeeEyeEmPee · Dec 17, 2017

allpaths said:
Defensively he can do things that no other fullback in world football can do

do you watch any other football?

allpaths · Dec 17, 2017

tiger666 said:
Fucking hell ...

you're thinking of young kyle walker not the present day player. Whose better defensively, maybe Aziplicueta but Walker covers a lot more ground. No other fullback really compares if you bother to think about.

spursfan77 · Dec 17, 2017

I bet he wishes it worked bollocking players nowadays. I get the feeling with some of our lads that one word out of place to them and they'd get the hump.

Gb160 · Dec 17, 2017

Spurs72 said:
KDB to Us or Walker to City imho is not a Strange, they are both very good players right, Why is it ok for us to sell a star to City but not ok for City to sell a Star to us, Do we know for a fact that he demanded to go up North ?

It's called the food chain mate, it's why we can prise the best players from smaller clubs than us, we can offer them more money, and a greater chance of success, which is what City did to us with Walker.
I'm amazed that you can't see that City are much higher up the food chain than we are.
People need to just get over the whole Walker deal.

Spurs72 · Dec 17, 2017

Gb160 said:
It's called the food chain mate, it's why we can prise the best players from smaller clubs than us, we can offer them more money, and a greater chance of success, which is what City did to us with Walker.
I'm amazed that you can't see that City are much higher up the food chain than we are.
People need to just get over the whole Walker deal.

So Obviously you did not see my post when I said hes sold, lets move on from this FFS, and I know its the food chain smh.

Gb160 · Dec 17, 2017

Spurs72 said:
So Obviously you did not see my post when I said hes sold, lets move on from this FFS, and I know its the food chain smh.

I saw it but evidently you don't really understand it.

Shadydan · Dec 17, 2017

Spurs72 said:
KDB to Us or Walker to City imho is not a Strange, they are both very good players right, Why is it ok for us to sell a star to City but not ok for City to sell a Star to us, Do we know for a fact that he demanded to go up North ?

Money is not a factor to me, I am really not to stressed if Walker went for 50 or 60 Mill, of course Levy wanted to get the most out of this Deal, I just think Walker could have been persuaded to stay.

Not Naive if we let players push us around all the time then what expectations do you have for this Team, Bench him and send a message , then maybe we would not have Rose pulling the Crap that he pulled.

Dier has never been my Favourite so can't really discuss him without bias tbh.

Because KDB is already playing for a team who are more or less guaranteed of picking up trophies and will be in or amongst the top of the league at the end of the season, he's also earning a wage which I'd imagine we wouldn't get anywhere near so these two scenarios are not alike.

Yeah but look you nor me control the club's finances nor do we have a clue how much we earn or how much we can spend, what I do know is that the club have obviously taken the factors surrounding the transfer into account and sold made the best decision for us financially. Money is obviously an issue due to the stadium build which suggests the reason why we need to be frugal in this current climate.

As I said before benching him really isn't a smart option, and If you think Rose who clearly wanted out in the summer wouldn't have done the same thing as he did then you are mistaken, once a player decides to leave at that age where they haven't really won anything and have other clubs calling for their services it's difficult to keep them.

DanielCHillier · Dec 17, 2017

allpaths said:
you're thinking of young kyle walker not the present day player. Whose better defensively, maybe Aziplicueta but Walker covers a lot more ground. No other fullback really compares if you bother to think about.

Antonio Valencia

Shadydan · Dec 17, 2017

PeeEyeEmPee said:
if what you've taken from my post is that I'm calling him average, even with me explicitly stating he's a very good manager that's done a very good job, then it's probably not worth my entering into discussion with you, as you'll only hear what you want to.

I know you didn't call him average, I'm exaggerating to make a point although the rest of my post is a rebuttal to yours.

allpaths · Dec 17, 2017

PeeEyeEmPee said:
do you watch any other football?

most top fullbacks are better gonig forward then they are defensively. Most struggle to defend one v one. Kyle Walker is as good as a shut down one v one defender as it gets. What hurts Walker is his reputation from his younger days, that no spurs fans seem capitable to forget.

DanielCHillier said:
Antonio Valencia

That's a very good shout, it's tough to tell how strong he is against the best dribblers as united always defend with numbers and deep. he is right up there but would have been unavailable to city.

PeeEyeEmPee · Dec 17, 2017

Shadydan said:
I know you didn't call him average, I'm exaggerating to make a point although the rest of my post is a rebuttal to yours.

if you're having to exaggerate to make a point, it's an indicator that maybe said point doesn't hold up particularly well on its own.

the fact remains that Pochettino has won nothing, and so it's baffling that he can be viewed as being among the very best managers, or the best himself, and also that there there can be this absolute belief in his philosophy and methods such that his approach must never be questioned or criticised.

last season was great, but it's now in the past. teams have gotten better at playing us, and we've not responded to the challenge particularly well so far. not entirely the manager's fault, of course, but a lot of the responsibility rests with him. yes other teams have strengthened, but we can only have expected that to happen. yes we've had injuries, but again you expect those to happen too. and yes we're playing at Wembley rather than White Hart Lane, but we've known for an absolute certainty, and well in advance, that that would be the case. how well have we prepared for each of these?

Colonel_Klinck · Dec 17, 2017

City like it or not are up there with Madrid and Barcelona now. Unlimited funds. Even Chelsea have been blown out of the water and can’t compete. I know it doesn’t sound right but it isn’t just Madrid/Barca that come calling for your players anymore. It is only going to get worse as well unless UEFA grow some balls and see it for what it is, state sponsored doping. City will become more and more dominant in the next few years. If they keep Pep happy it’s going to be a fight for 2-4th places.

Spurs72 · Dec 17, 2017

Shadydan said:
Because KDB is already playing for a team who are more or less guaranteed of picking up trophies and will be in or amongst the top of the league at the end of the season, he's also earning a wage which I'd imagine we wouldn't get anywhere near so these two scenarios are not alike.

Yeah but look you nor me control the club's finances nor do we have a clue how much we earn or how much we can spend, what I do know is that the club have obviously taken the factors surrounding the transfer into account and sold made the best decision for us financially. Money is obviously an issue due to the stadium build which suggests the reason why we need to be frugal in this current climate.

As I said before benching him really isn't a smart option, and If you think Rose who clearly wanted out in the summer wouldn't have done the same thing as he did then you are mistaken, once a player decides to leave at that age where they haven't really won anything and have other clubs calling for their services it's difficult to keep them.

If you cannot bench him then he has All the power so if Rose head is turned then I guess it is on the Club and Poch because (The Club) are powerless to stop any player that wants to Leave, and it is on Poch for not finding a adequate replacement

Shadydan · Dec 17, 2017

PeeEyeEmPee said:
if you're having to exaggerate to make a point, it's an indicator that maybe said point doesn't hold up particularly well on its own.

the fact remains that Pochettino has won nothing, and so it's baffling that he can be viewed as being among the very best managers, or the best himself, and also that there there can be this absolute belief in his philosophy and methods such that his approach must never be questioned or criticised.

last season was great, but it's now in the past. teams have gotten better at playing us, and we've not responded to the challenge particularly well so far. not entirely the manager's fault, of course, but a lot of the responsibility rests with him. yes other teams have strengthened, but we can only have expected that to happen. yes we've had injuries, but again you expect those to happen too. and yes we're playing at Wembley rather than White Hart Lane, but we've known for an absolute certainty, and well in advance, that that would be the case. how well have we prepared for each of these?

The point holds up perfectly fine but if you want to focus the last few words of my post when in fact the bulk of my post is in response to yours then be my guest.

Yes the fact remains that Poch has won nothing but taking into account who he's managed compared to the managers you mentioned then the comparison is nonsense, how do you compare managers who have managed with different budgets and resources, it's very difficult to compare. I don't understand your logic of ignoring last season..so in that case are we going to ignore the previous achievements of the manager's you mentioned then because it's only fair if that's your argument.

Isn't it better to wait until the end of the season before casting a judgement on him rather than giving him an appraisal after a defeat which is pretty much knee jerk.

Shadydan · Dec 17, 2017

Spurs72 said:
If you cannot bench him then he has All the power so if Rose head is turned then I guess it is on the Club and Poch because (The Club) are powerless to stop any player that wants to Leave, and it is on Poch for not finding a adequate replacement

It's no different to any other club, look what happened with Neymar and Barcelona. You cannot stop player power but you can help control it.

Forums

What's new

Matches

Sportsbook

Members

The Mauricio Pochettino thread

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Don't Call It A Comeback

Well-Known Member

Large Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well done boys. Good process

Don't Call It A Comeback

Well done boys. Good process

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Don't Call It A Comeback

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Similar threads