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Aissa Mandi : our new good right back ?

Frenchalex25

Active Member
Jun 5, 2005
582
470
Dear All,

This has been a very long time since I last posted on sc.
There are more and more discussions topics about “next season”.
The players on their way out of the club. The things to improve (our defense-back 4).

I didn’t watched many spurs games this season even if I saw many “highlights” of Spurs games.
That’s why I have paid special attention to the “Ratings” topics that have followed each game.
Most comments are very interesting and this allows us to get a rather clear idea of the way the players performed.

There is no consensus in the sc website about the performances of some “1st team ”players. (or at least on the players who are regularly playing). (Vertonghen, Dier, Fazio, Bentaleb, Mason, Chadli, Lamela, Townsend).

We can understand the arguments of people who have been pleased or disappointed by the performances of these players. As it appears that these players have sometimes performed well and sometimes they have performed badly this season 2014-2015.

There is consensus in the sc website about the performances of some “1 st teamers” who have performed rather well or very well this season. (Lloris, Eriksen, Kane or even Rose).

It seems there is a consensus in the sc website on some players that almost never play.
Soldado: seems to be a good guy and a good player but his english nightmare will be soon finished.
Adebayor. I won’t comment more but it seems that we all finally see the obvious.
And hopefully, they almost never played (Soldado) or never play (Adebayor).

But I want to speak here about the right back position. I don’t want to develop too much about the critics to Kyle Walker. It seems there is a general consensus on Kyle Walkers’ performances.
They are bad and sometimes terrible.

He used to be very good (imo) to start counter-attacks but that is less and less the case.
An even if he can launch an attack on the right side, this is pointless as his attack will end with a cross intercepted by the opposite defense.

And I am glad most of you have finally opened their eyes about the terrible defending of Kyle Walker.
(I won’t discuss why on here as there are already many subjects about this on sc).
But I am wondering what THFC talent scouts have been paid for.

More and more of us have been aware of Walker’s limited defensive skills for several years now.
We don’t need the best right back on the world; we just need a right back who can defend. Walker unfortunately can’t do that.

Some of you will consider me obtuse (dull) but even if football is a collective work, forwards must focus on the attacking work, midfielders must try to “control” the middle of the pitch and defenders must first prevent others teams to score.

It is almost impossible to achieve Top 4 when you concede an average 1.5 goal per game….
Amongst the 5 players that have played regularly on the back 4, this season Rose at LB – Verts-Fazio- Dier for the 2 CB spots and Walker at RB, only Rose at LB seems to have played regularly to a good level.

Fazio and Dier have both looked very average with both of them making stupid mistakes that can’t be tolerated to such a level. These stupid mistakes can’t be tolerated in a team and in a club trying to habe better results.
Even if Dier seems to be better lately. I

I will now speak about a player some of you may know and is current Stade de Reims right back.

His name is Aissa Mandi.

Aissa Mandi was born in 1991 in Châlons en Champagne in the Department of Marne (F-51). Chalons is located 50 kil south of Reims.
Most of you going on holidays in the south of France (or anywhere in the east of France) probably know where Reims and Chalons are located. Indeed, these 2 cities are alongside the A26 french highway more commonly known as “l’autoroute des Anglais” – “ the highway of English people”.
A26 highway runs between Calais – Lille – St Quentin – Reims – Chalons and Troyes.
As for me, my family lives in Pontarlier (F-25) close to Swizerland and I also drive from south to north on the A26 highway each time I drive to Reims to see a game.
I support Reims for family reasons.

When I see all the English people driving on their way back to UK with their family, I wish some of them being spurs fans and to decide to make a stop for the night in Reims.
And that he / she / they would decide to go to the Stade Delaune to see Mandi playing.

As usual, this will be a very long post from me (feel free to read it or not).
 

THFCSPURS19

The Speaker of the Transfer Rumours Forum
Jan 6, 2013
37,894
130,530
Dear All,

This has been a very long time since I last posted on sc.
There are more and more discussions topics about “next season”.
The players on their way out of the club. The things to improve (our defense-back 4).

I didn’t watched many spurs games this season even if I saw many “highlights” of Spurs games.
That’s why I have paid special attention to the “Ratings” topics that have followed each game.
Most comments are very interesting and this allows us to get a rather clear idea of the way the players performed.

There is no consensus in the sc website about the performances of some “1st team ”players. (or at least on the players who are regularly playing). (Vertonghen, Dier, Fazio, Bentaleb, Mason, Chadli, Lamela, Townsend).

We can understand the arguments of people who have been pleased or disappointed by the performances of these players. As it appears that these players have sometimes performed well and sometimes they have performed badly this season 2014-2015.

There is consensus in the sc website about the performances of some “1 st teamers” who have performed rather well or very well this season. (Lloris, Eriksen, Kane or even Rose).

It seems there is a consensus in the sc website on some players that almost never play.
Soldado: seems to be a good guy and a good player but his english nightmare will be soon finished.
Adebayor. I won’t comment more but it seems that we all finally see the obvious.
And hopefully, they almost never played (Soldado) or never play (Adebayor).

But I want to speak here about the right back position. I don’t want to develop too much about the critics to Kyle Walker. It seems there is a general consensus on Kyle Walkers’ performances.
They are bad and sometimes terrible.

He used to be very good (imo) to start counter-attacks but that is less and less the case.
An even if he can launch an attack on the right side, this is pointless as his attack will end with a cross intercepted by the opposite defense.

And I am glad most of you have finally opened their eyes about the terrible defending of Kyle Walker.
(I won’t discuss why on here as there are already many subjects about this on sc).
But I am wondering what THFC talent scouts have been paid for.

More and more of us have been aware of Walker’s limited defensive skills for several years now.
We don’t need the best right back on the world; we just need a right back who can defend. Walker unfortunately can’t do that.

Some of you will consider me obtuse (dull) but even if football is a collective work, forwards must focus on the attacking work, midfielders must try to “control” the middle of the pitch and defenders must first prevent others teams to score.

It is almost impossible to achieve Top 4 when you concede an average 1.5 goal per game….
Amongst the 5 players that have played regularly on the back 4, this season Rose at LB – Verts-Fazio- Dier for the 2 CB spots and Walker at RB, only Rose at LB seems to have played regularly to a good level.

Fazio and Dier have both looked very average with both of them making stupid mistakes that can’t be tolerated to such a level. These stupid mistakes can’t be tolerated in a team and in a club trying to habe better results.
Even if Dier seems to be better lately. I

I will now speak about a player some of you may know and is current Stade de Reims right back.

His name is Aissa Mandi.

Aissa Mandi was born in 1991 in Châlons en Champagne in the Department of Marne (F-51). Chalons is located 50 kil south of Reims.
Most of you going on holidays in the south of France (or anywhere in the east of France) probably know where Reims and Chalons are located. Indeed, these 2 cities are alongside the A26 french highway more commonly known as “l’autoroute des Anglais” – “ the highway of English people”.
A26 highway runs between Calais – Lille – St Quentin – Reims – Chalons and Troyes.
As for me, my family lives in Pontarlier (F-25) close to Swizerland and I also drive from south to north on the A26 highway each time I drive to Reims to see a game.
I support Reims for family reasons.

When I see all the English people driving on their way back to UK with their family, I wish some of them being spurs fans and to decide to make a stop for the night in Reims.
And that he / she / they would decide to go to the Stade Delaune to see Mandi playing.

As usual, this will be a very long post from me (feel free to read it or not).
Is Mandi any good?
 

Frenchalex25

Active Member
Jun 5, 2005
582
470
I will develop my argument further.

1 - Aissa Mandi is a loyal servant and supporter of his club.

He makes me think of those players who could and would give their everything for their only club.
And stay in the same club for years.
He has played in Reims since the age of 8 and has been a supporter of the club also.
Most famous case would be Gerrard (Liverpool). Even if he will join the MLS and LA Galaxy but it is more about having an other life experience for him.
And I also feel because Liverpool FC didn’t give him back what he has given to this Club for so many years.
Daniele De Rossi or Francesco Totti were also the same kind of players who have stayed in their “Club family” rather than living their club for more silverware elsewhere.
Many others can be named all over the world but he is the kind of player who sees his Club like his Family.
And why should he leave his family ?
Contrary to Gerrard, De Rossi or Totti, Mandi doesn’t play in a very good football club like FC Liverpool or As Roma.

And Mandi is aware he will hardly win anything in Reims in the coming years.
Especially because Le Stade de Reims (still regarded as a “big club” in France because of its history) had gone bust before reviving from his ashes and playing again in French Ligue 1 for the season 2012-2013
I won’t go in details to much about Stade de Reims history.

He will try his best to save Reims from relegation this year before thinking about his future.
If Reims unfortunately doesn’t remain in Ligue 1 at the end of this season, he stated that he could stay for one other year in order to help Reims to reintegrate Ligue 1 as early as next year (season 16-17).
If Reims goes down, I nevertheless am not convinced Mandi to stay for 1 more year. (for many reasons).

Mostly because Caillot decided to perpetuate the Club in french elite.
And Stade de Reims just finished buiding the new professional training centre Louis Bleriot
that includes afootball academy less than 1 year ago.
The whole project was inaugurated on last summer 2014 and costed around ….8M Euros.
http://www.pss-archi.eu/immeubles/FR-51055-46636.html
http://www.lunion.com/region/8-millions-d-euros-pour-le-futur-centre-de-vie-des-rouge-ia0b0n254807
Some pics on here.
https://plus.google.com/u/0/photos/108315469555164962478/albums/6030633371367164737

President Caillot sees the bigger picture and he will “sacrifice his son” Mandi for the greater benefit of the club and its future.
I don’t blame him for that and many Reims fans understand that.

Fans just expect Caillot making as much money as possible from Mandi’s sale.
Between 8M€ and 10M€ would be fair for Reims and the buying club.
Levy did it with several spurs players and rightly so.
In my opinion, the institution will always be more important than any individuals.

2 - Many good clubs have been interested in him.
Last summer, he could have gone in others clubs (Paris St Germain, Lyon or St Etienne) just to names the most famous clubs.
Last summer, Arsene Wenger thought about bringing him to the Emirates in order to replace Bacary Sagna.

3 links about that in french (summer 2014)
http://www.africatopsports.com/2014/05/21/aissa-mandi-lalgerien-dans-le-viseur-darsenal/
http://www.dzfoot.com/2014/05/20/arsenal-garderait-un-oeil-sur-aissa-mandi-44433.php
http://foot-africain.fr/aissa-mandi-viseur-dun-grand-club/

1 link in english (very interesting piece of reading).( May 2014).
This article was about Mandi’s ability to replace Sagna.
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2065767-scouting-report-aissa-mandi-arsenals-bacary-sagna-transfer-replacement

This bleacher report is “slightly biased” as the “journalist” probably never saw the guy playing. But I felt important to share the article with you all.
When it is written that “it is often wasteful in the attacking half hence why he misplaces 86.4percent of his crosses”.
I have no idea where this statistics comes from but I have seen manygames of Reims these last 3 seasons (home + away + on tv) and I have hardly been chocked with the quality of Mandi’s crosses.
Regarding “his mental errors”, it was just lazy journalism to show mistakes from Mandi out of their context.

In April 2014; he scored 2 own goals during the beating of Reims by PSG.
The first one was pure bad luck.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tPiJDflFfsc
The second one was mainly due to the fact if was almost the end of the game and Mandi was one of the very few Reims players that hadn’t capitulated yet.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=obcS8Yrzl3w

Writing that Mandi is “frenetic, gung-ho, off-the-cuff and reckless” is just false.
 

Frenchalex25

Active Member
Jun 5, 2005
582
470
I hardly remembered him having a bad game (even vs the bigger teams).

This year, he is sometimes included in the best Ligue1 side of daily sportspaper “L’équipe”.

This is kind of an achievement in itself for Mandi considering he is part of the worst Ligue 1 defense (53 goals conceded).

It isn’t Mandi’s responsibility to play with 3 very average players in the back line.

Last spring 2014, Reims President Jean Pierre Caillot decided that 1 player (out of the 2 players) could go in the summer if he (as a president) received good financial offer from clubs interested by them.

But Caillot made it clear that only 1 of these 2 would leave during summer 2014.
These 2 players were Grzegorz Krychowiak and Aissa Mandi.

Polish international Krychowiak was an happy guy and a regular starter as a midfielder in Reims.
He has always been very appreciated by the Reims assistance but he wanted a new challenge abroad
more in accordance with his talents and ambitions.

Mandi has played in Reims from his early age and has played all his football for le Stade de Reims.
He has also been very appreciated by the Reims assistance as he is young, has played for the club
from his childhood and is very talented.

He also played the World Cup in Brazil with Algeria next summer (as right back).
Algeria only lost 2-1 vs Germany (after extra time) in the Round of 16.

While Krychowiak was only working on his transfer, Mandi was in Brasil playing a world Cup and wasn’t in a rush to leave the club.
As a consequence, on the 22.07.14, Krychowiak signed a 4 years contract with Spanish side FC Sevilla.
He quickly established himself as a firm 1st teamer in Sevilla.

Caillot therefore declared Mandi wasn’t for sale during summer 2014.
Mandi is very likely to leave Reims this summer 2015 and it is reported that Caillot wants 8 M Euros for the player.

There are also figures that Mandi would be rated between 3 and 4 M Euros but these figures could be considered as “ridiculously” low for a player of that quality.
Any figure between 8M € and 10M € would reflect more the real value and qualities of the player.( £6M – £7.5M).
Caillot won’t accept anything less that 8 M € for him.

Paris doesn’t need a right back any longer as they finally decide to sign Ivorian Toulouse right back Serge Aurier last summer.
Unless Dani Alves left Barcelona this summer. If this to happens Aurier (PSG) or Fabinho (Monaco) can be seen as potential remplacements in Barcelona.

As a consequence, if Paris comes in for Mandi again this summer , this would be a done deal.
Indeed, as a child, Mandi was a Paris fan and Paris would have no problem at all to pay the 8 M€ required by Caillot.

As Mandi is a very loving family man (his family still live in Chalons) and is very attached to his region of Champagne and the city of Reims, Paris would probably be the best option to him.
He would be at the highest level in the club he supported as a child and Paris and Reims are only located 2 hours from each other by car and 45 minutes by TGV train.
However, the concurrence would be very hard for a first team place and the atmosphere and
quality of support at the Parc des Princes has dramatically deteriorated over the last few years.
Paris' support is awful.

Lyon would be Mandi’s second best option as Hubert Fournier is looking for a long term replacement
to french international Christophe Jallet.(32 years old).
Jallet is still doing very good at Lyon but Lyon is looking for Jallet’s long term successor and
Mandi is the obvious best solution for that.
Mandi has worked with Fournier from September 2009 until June 2014.
Fournier was assistant coach in 2009-10 and was appointed Head Coach of Reims
at the beginning of season 2010-11 until June 2014.

Mandis’ adaptation to Lyon would be very fast with many other young talended lads like him.
(Lacazette, Fékir, Tolisso, Njie, Ferri and Grenier who will be back from injury very soon).

Lyon‘s 60000 seater brand-new Stadium is also very important to keep and bring new players to the club.
This new stadium will be inaugurated on December 2015 and first football will be played in January 2016.

Unless some crazy money to arrive on Aulas’desk this summer, Lacazette has absolutely no reason to leave the Club and Aulas doesn’t need to sell his best players any longer.
If Kane had the possibility to play CL footie with Spurs in a brand new stadium, would he leave ?

Lyon President Aulas would try to negotiate the price of Mandi but considering CL revenue and
the new stadium revenue from next season, he would pay the price required for Mandi.

Clubs came back knocking on Reims’ doors this winter 2014 -2015 for winter market.
http://europe-mercato.com/mercato-reims-aissa-mandi-suscite-les-convoitises-73452/
(Lyon and St Etienne still being the main serious clubs to be welcome Mandi).

As Reims have been having a very complicated season mainly due to
the departure of Krychowiak and more importantly the unexpected departure of Hubert Fournier to Lyon,
this season has been a nightmare for any Reims supporter.(I am one of those).

New manager Jean Luc Vasseur has had a very difficult first season in Ligue 1 and at the Club
and has shown his limits already this season to manage a Ligue 1 side.
From tonight Tuesday 8 th August, Vasseur isn’t Reims Head Coach any longer.

Things are even getting worse for Reims fans because of the brilliant run of Troyes (current leader of Ligue 2)
and will very probably play in Ligue 1 next season whereas Reims is more and more likely to play in Ligue 2 next year.
In our respective countries (or even in uk) , I guess any spurs fan gets a “second team” after Spurs.
 

DaSpurs

Well-Known Member
Jan 20, 2013
11,816
13,655
Difficult to debate such a passionate and well-reinforced argument.

However, personally I think we should leave RB alone. I don't think fans lend enough credit to the fact that Walker had invasive pelvic/groin surgery through some very important muscle groups, and are giving him a bit too hard of a time. After him, right back is one of our strongest positions in youth. Between Yedlin, Fredericks, and the upcoming KWP I see no need to further block them. Fredericks has by all accounts done quite well in the Championship this season with a strong Middlesbrough, and I suspect is being planned to slot into the second choice next season, maybe even supplemented or even competed against by Yedlin. KWP will be a Prem player someday, no question IMO. So I don't think we should block these upcoming prospects.
 

Frenchalex25

Active Member
Jun 5, 2005
582
470

Quite a few English Premier League clubs would be interested by the very good value and qualities of Mandi
8 M€ to buy such a quality player shouldn’t be any problem for any Premier League Club

Especially considering crazy new deal and money spent by english broadcasters like Sky to ensure they can show EPL games in the next years.
I see some great german clubs or some decent Spanish clubs also being interested in him.

Before his Round of 16 vs Germany, former Algerian international Rabah Madjer makes a few comments about the current algerian players for a german paper.
http://www.abendzeitung-muenchen.de/inhalt.wm-achtelfinale-gegen-deutschland-algeriens-held-madjer-hier-stellt-er-seine-elf-vor.52602f9b-71b4-423e-879a-6c4511283a9b.html

Aissa Mandi:
Rechtsverteidiger mit Zukunft. Technisch perfekt, wird bald ein besseres Verein als Reims finden.
Momentan zu unentschlossen im Offensivspiel.“

Translation in english
Rightback with a (good) future. Perfect technic, he will soon find a better team than Reims.
Sometimes “indecisive” in attacking play.


After his Round of 16 vs Germany, german paper Züddeutsche Zeitung wrote :
http://www.sueddeutsche.de/sport/algerien-in-der-einzelkritik-pflastermann-laesst-deutschland-zittern-1.2025302-2

Aïssa Mandi:
Eine der jungen Entdeckungen von Trainer Vahid Halilhodžić. Reifte als Rechtsverteidiger bei Stade Rennes zum Stammspieler und absolvierte drei blitzsaubere Spiele in der Vorrunde. Spielte wieder eine bärenstarke Partie, zumeist gegen Mesut Özil.
War stets zur Stelle, wenn einem Gegenspieler der Ball versprang, was überraschend häufig der Fall war. Der 19-Jährige steht vor einer erfolgreichen Karriere.

Translation in english :
One of the discovery of coach Vahid Halilhodžić. Developed himself as right back in Stade Rennes (in fact Stade Reims) as a regular starter and delivered three very clean games in the group stages.
Played again a powerful game (especcially vs Mesut Özil.). Was always to his position when an opponent played the ball, and not surprised frequently by the trap.
The 19 years old (in fact 23 years old in 2014) is at the beginning of a successful career.
 

Thegibb

New Member
Aug 22, 2013
12
13
Dier very average?!

You said it yourself mate, you haven't seen many games which is perhaps why you've got this so wrong. Dier is a quality young defender, who has everything necessary to be a top top defender. Yes, he's made a few mistakes and had the odd bad game but that's to be expected of a young player in his position.

Dier will be a great player for Spurs and England, whilst the chap you mentioned will likely never play at White Hart Lane, let alone for Spurs.
 

Frenchalex25

Active Member
Jun 5, 2005
582
470
3) Mandi has all the basic skills that makes him a good defender…

Mandi can defend accurately and cleanly (he doesn’t concede stupid penalties).
I won’t speak too much on Walker about that as thousands of words have already been written on that subject on this forum.

Mandi gets a footballing brain and he has most of the time the right positioning and retains the ball very well.
More importantly, he let his football do the talking and doesn't say nonsense.

He knows when he must go forward or when he must stay in a more defensive position on the pitch.
As a defender, he defends first and quite well.

Mandi knows how to read the game and has already (too) much responsibility in the team and uses the ball very wisely
because as Reims has very little control of the ball this year, this leads him to use every ball possession wisely and to be smart in his decision making.

He is also vice captain of the team. Even if, on merit, but he should be captain already.

Considering that Reims doesn’t score many goals, he knows he has to have a leading role in creating attacking movement.

He starts most of the Reims attacking process on the right side of the pitch to bring danger in the opposing half.

Whenever Reims doesn’t control the game (most of the time this season), he is also trying to develop very fast counter attacks. (very useful to adapt quickly and successfully to EPL).
Walker also tries to go forward very often but usually forgets he gets paid to do the defensive work first.

Mandi is polyvalent and can play anywhere in the back line.
His preferred usual position is right back but he can play as a centre back or even as a left back if needed.

Mandi is a solid player who isn’t scared of any opponents and is doing very well in duels (even in the aerial duels).

Mandi is very good at tackling and at intercepting ball from the opponent.

Mandi scores goals, is good in the air and gets great defensive and offensive header.
(4 goals so far this season)

Day 4 vs Lens (header).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WQwhCA3LDdc
Day 13 vs Lille (header)

Day 18 vs Evian (header)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WhCeXS2V3Ik
Day 28 vs Nantes
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wVmmPJpoZtQ

He has been a regular starter in the Reims squad since the season 2011-2012 for Reims’ last season in french Ligue 2 (Championship). He was aged 20 at the time.

During his season 2014-2015, Aissa Mandi has continued to be an obvious 1st teamer in Reims in 25 games (out of 31 games).
He picked up an injury in french Ligue 1 matchday N°10 (18.10.14) in Nantes.
After his injury in Nantes, he also missed French Ligue 1 matchday N°11 and N°12.

In January 2015, he missed French Ligue 1 matchdays N°20-N°21-N°22 and N°23 because he was on international duty in ANC in Equorial Guinea with his national side of Algeria with his mate Nabil Bentaleb.

Mandi was also elected as right back in the best 11 of the ANC.
http://www.lequipe.fr/Football/Actualites/A-ayew-bedimo-mensah-et-mandi-honores/535341

I don’t wish Walker any bad but he clearly isn’t up to required standard for a club trying to get silverware and reaching top 4.

Walker recent injury vs Burnley might allow Yedlin to get some time on the pitch and it will allow us to see what he can do.

Yedlin seems to be a promising young player but I am wondering what such a young guy who played only 1 year
in a very weak league like MLS can bring now to a Champion’s League chasing club like Tottenham.

I’d like our club to make an offer for Mandi during this summer as the guy is an hard working quality player and a clever man.

I think he already understands what “loves for the club” means as both Mandi like Mason , Bentaleb, Kane, Rose, etc…
is a “product of a football academy” who has served his club for many years.

London is a very “french oriented” city with thousands of french people living in London.
And I expect at least 4 french speakers to stay at the club next year.
Lloris, Bentaleb, Chadli, Stambouli.

This could be used as an argument for an easier integration in that squad.
I also see the presence of Bentaleb as a hugely important asset to bring Mandi to the Lane.
They seem to have a good connection between themselves.(tweeter)

If some of you personally know Bentaleb, this would be interesting to have Bentaleb‘s view on Mandi ?

If some of you get the possibility to see Reims playing in the next few weeks, do not hesitate to make a match in Delaune
(no problem to buy tickets on matchdays) to make your own opinion of Mandi’s performances.

Alex
 

@Bobby__Lucky

Well-Known Member
Aug 20, 2013
2,933
3,982
Difficult to debate such a passionate and well-reinforced argument.

However, personally I think we should leave RB alone. I don't think fans lend enough credit to the fact that Walker had invasive pelvic/groin surgery through some very important muscle groups, and are giving him a bit too hard of a time. After him, right back is one of our strongest positions in youth. Between Yedlin, Fredericks, and the upcoming KWP I see no need to further block them. Fredericks has by all accounts done quite well in the Championship this season with a strong Middlesbrough, and I suspect is being planned to slot into the second choice next season, maybe even supplemented or even competed against by Yedlin. KWP will be a Prem player someday, no question IMO. So I don't think we should block these upcoming prospects.

I have felt that since Walker returned, although he has played reasonably well, he isn't quite right. I think I recall his injury was quite severe and was made worse by playing with injury. Wether this is mental or not, I'm not sure, but he doesn't look right. Allowing for his often lapses in concentration regardless.

Agreed though, I think the reveiws of fredricks have been very good particularly in the tackles stats and seems a pro-active rather than timid member of their team. There is no need for further RB's, like you said our stable is well stocked.
 

eViL

Oliver Skipp's Dad
May 15, 2004
5,841
7,965
Difficult to debate such a passionate and well-reinforced argument.

However, personally I think we should leave RB alone. I don't think fans lend enough credit to the fact that Walker had invasive pelvic/groin surgery through some very important muscle groups, and are giving him a bit too hard of a time.

I'm sorry, but you could understand this argument if it was just pace and fitness Walker was lacking.

Truth is, the absolutely basics of a full-back's game.. tracking his man, defending his post, getting down the line and crossing while the opposing defence are on the back foot are not affected by injury. It's down to a distinct resistance to coaching - unfortunately the same affliction a certain Mr Townsend is suffering.
 

DaSpurs

Well-Known Member
Jan 20, 2013
11,816
13,655
I'm sorry, but you could understand this argument if it was just pace and fitness Walker was lacking.

Truth is, the absolutely basics of a full-back's game.. tracking his man, defending his post, getting down the line and crossing while the opposing defence are on the back foot are not affected by injury. It's down to a distinct resistance to coaching - unfortunately the same affliction a certain Mr Townsend is suffering.

He's always lacked on the mental side, it's true, but his ability to compensate seems gone long term injuries can wreck havoc on a player's psyche. You don't see it on the professional level because they have good lifestyles, but at the amateur and lesser levels long-term injuries can hold devastating effects. Just found out the other day about a baseball player in town who was seeing a psych doc I rounded with, and committed suicide six months after an ACL tear. There's a lot of evidence out there that with dedicated athletes, the loss of repetitive motion and the hormonal axis it establishes can have massive impact on a player's psychological well-being once it's heavily altered.

It doesn't excuse Walker's mistakes, but I think he needs time and I think people are being far too hasty to jump down his thread this shortly after a major injury and a majorly invasive surgery. Last season, Rose was the scapegoat. He looks to have improved substantially. So why not a player who we've seen in the past perform well, and after having time to recover more from such extreme circumstances?
 

eViL

Oliver Skipp's Dad
May 15, 2004
5,841
7,965
He's always lacked on the mental side, it's true, but his ability to compensate seems gone long term injuries can wreck havoc on a player's psyche. You don't see it on the professional level because they have good lifestyles, but at the amateur and lesser levels long-term injuries can hold devastating effects. Just found out the other day about a baseball player in town who was seeing a psych doc I rounded with, and committed suicide six months after an ACL tear. There's a lot of evidence out there that with dedicated athletes, the loss of repetitive motion and the hormonal axis it establishes can have massive impact on a player's psychological well-being once it's heavily altered.

It doesn't excuse Walker's mistakes, but I think he needs time and I think people are being far too hasty to jump down his thread this shortly after a major injury and a majorly invasive surgery. Last season, Rose was the scapegoat. He looks to have improved substantially. So why not a player who we've seen in the past perform well, and after having time to recover more from such extreme circumstances?

I really hope he does - as I'm sure most Spurs fans do.
 

only1waddle

Well-Known Member
Jun 18, 2012
8,215
12,427
He's always lacked on the mental side, it's true, but his ability to compensate seems gone long term injuries can wreck havoc on a player's psyche. You don't see it on the professional level because they have good lifestyles, but at the amateur and lesser levels long-term injuries can hold devastating effects. Just found out the other day about a baseball player in town who was seeing a psych doc I rounded with, and committed suicide six months after an ACL tear. There's a lot of evidence out there that with dedicated athletes, the loss of repetitive motion and the hormonal axis it establishes can have massive impact on a player's psychological well-being once it's heavily altered.

It doesn't excuse Walker's mistakes, but I think he needs time and I think people are being far too hasty to jump down his thread this shortly after a major injury and a majorly invasive surgery. Last season, Rose was the scapegoat. He looks to have improved substantially. So why not a player who we've seen in the past perform well, and after having time to recover more from such extreme circumstances?


People were on Rose's case because his attitude was shit, didn't track back, looked like he didn't give a fanny, his attitude is first class this season.
Walker has always been capable of stupid moments and its not getting better, regardless of surgery he isn't a particularly clever or gifted footballer, or even one capable of doing the basics right, the thing Walker does have is a great attitude but it doesn't cancel out the stupid shit.
 

DaSpurs

Well-Known Member
Jan 20, 2013
11,816
13,655
People were on Rose's case because his attitude was shit, didn't track back, looked like he didn't give a fanny, his attitude is first class this season.
Walker has always been capable of stupid moments and its not getting better, regardless of surgery he isn't a particularly clever or gifted footballer, or even one capable of doing the basics right, the thing Walker does have is a great attitude but it doesn't cancel out the stupid shit.

I don't deny that. He made one of the stupidest moves I've ever seen a defender make at any level when he gave Hazard the ball on the touchline with no man in sight in fall 2012. Stunningly stupid.

But nonetheless, I don't think he deserves the vitriol he's received this term. And you're excluding that many, many of the arguments against Rose were that his positioning was off and he simply did not know how to defend. Lo, he has been our most consistently performing defender this term. I think Walker has shown enough in the past he deserves more time, and does not deserve the vitriol this close to such a majorly impacting surgery.
 
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