Chelsea Vs Tottenham: Match Thread

[phil]

Chelsea broke their transfer ban it seems, with the signing of Howard Webb. He did well for them Id say.

Nonsense. As I've written elsewhere in the thread, I was as close to the incident as Webb and I would not have given the penalty.

Watching MOTD last night, I had the advantage of seeing the incident in slow motion from 4 different angles. One of those angles showed that Carvalho had made contact with Keane. Keane carried on a further stride before going down making it look like a dive.

Referees do not have the advantage of instant replays. Unless the referee is absolutely sure that there has been contact, he cannot give a penalty. I would rather referees err on the side of the defence rather than give dubious penalties such as the one Webb gave last year at OT, the one away at Seville, and the Ronaldo dive at WHL.

Perhaps football needs to follow cricket, tennis, rugby and American football in allowing the captain/manager a limited number of 'challenges' that will be referred to an 'umpire' with access to replays.

 

[danielneeds]

This thread is highlighting why Andy Gray gets paid big bucks to be a pundit and you let, well, don't.

Forget the blame game for the opener. Ashley Cole had no right being in that spot. Ancelotti's full backs are in outrageous positions. Look. He's the furthest forward player in a blue shirt. And he's the left back.

In fact, it would have been almost negligent to have put a man on him. It would have committed resources in an area that was already light due to the two men at the near post (who King and the Bass were responsible for).

Charlie took a good position and was beaten by a super cross. Upset though I am, respect should be paid to Bosingwa especially but all the Chelsea team for playing their roles so well.

You only have to follow the logical argument about what would have happened if Charlie OR Lennon had decided to stick to Cashley. The simple answer is that Bosingwa would almost certainly have delivered an equally great cross for Ballack or Lampard or another player and created another good goalscoring chance.

Face it. Chelsea are and were bloody good and we have many mitigating factors. I'd rather we lost this one when the odds are stacked against us, so we can get better for matches that are in the balance.

Well called. The fact is when the opposition team makes so many great runs from deep you are bound to fail to pick up one or two. Chelsea were unbelievably clinical too, they basically scored with their only three real attempts on target.

I still don't get why people are criticizing Harry for matching their diamond, it was worth a go, and if we had taken our chances in the first twenty minutes it could have been a different game. The fact is the better team won though, we just have to keep working hard and improving, and hopefully start getting some defenders fit and getting some clean sheets.

 

[Rocksuperstar]

Nonsense. As I've written elsewhere in the thread, I was as close to the incident as Webb and I would not have given the penalty.

Watching MOTD last night, I had the advantage of seeing the incident in slow motion from 4 different angles. One of those angles showed that Carvalho had made contact with Keane. Keane carried on a further stride before going down making it look like a dive.

Referees do not have the advantage of instant replays. Unless the referee is absolutely sure that there has been contact, he cannot give a penalty. I would rather referees err on the side of the defence rather than give dubious penalties such as the one Webb gave last year at OT, the one away at Seville, and the Ronaldo dive at WHL.

Perhaps football needs to follow cricket, tennis, rugby and American football in allowing the captain/manager a limited number of 'challenges' that will be referred to an 'umpire' with access to replays.

And that's why divers win and honest players who try to play on suffer.

Dude, just because he didn't come crashing to the ground it doesn't mean it wasn't a foul. As Keane so eloquently pointed out to the referee, if it wasn't a foul then he would have to be booked for the dive.

Either the ref or the linesman should've picked that up. It's called football for a reason, it involves skill and determination, it's not called dupe-the-ref-ball. This modern attitude to "winning" goes against everything a great man once said; "It's no use just winning, we've got to win well."

And it's true - i would rather have a hundred Robbie Keanes jumping clumsy tackles and stepping over scything legs than a top heavy one made of rich-tea biscuits, even if referees are too suckered into the play acting to understand how to officiate properly now.

 

[InOffMeLeftShin]

It is difficult to really blame the referee on this one. Yes he didn't give the decision, but when you see it from his view even in slow motion it didn't look like contact. I'm sure at full match speed it was impossible. Not sure if the lino would have had a better view.

Chelsea should have had a pen too when BAE purposely blocked a freekick with his arm, and that was missed too.

We were just beaten by a very good team who are in form. We will bounce back, but we have to stop looking for excuses and keep improving.

 

[CosmicHotspur]

Which was exactly the point I tried to make, but was rubbished for, earlier in the thread. Perhaps I didn't explain what I meant well enough.

We were beaten by the better team - penalty decisions not given and any other factors we care to bring into it. We looked good at the outset and should have found the back of the net, but we didn't and we paid for it dearly.

We faded and they got into their stride and did the business.

I think Harry was right when interviewed. He said we were a good side and could only get better and I believe that. We have key players out through injury, Modric and Woody in particular, and it will make a difference when we're playing at full strength again.

I agree with the comment about Crouch - I'd have had him as a starter - but it's so easy with hindsight, isn't it ...

 

[chrissivad]

This thread is highlighting why Andy Gray gets paid big bucks to be a pundit and you let, well, don't.

Forget the blame game for the opener. Ashley Cole had no right being in that spot. Ancelotti's full backs are in outrageous positions. Look. He's the furthest forward player in a blue shirt. And he's the left back.

Ashley Cole has always got forward and overlapped the midfeild. he has no right to be there?, thats what an attacking fallback does, he as done the same for Arsenal and for England

In fact, it would have been almost negligent to have put a man on him. It would have committed resources in an area that was already light due to the two men at the near post (who King and the Bass were responsible for).

But you dont 'put a man on him' you pick him up when he gets forward. More zonal, so as ballack wasn't moving forward and Lennon cut inside Corluka should have picked up Cole

Charlie took a good position and was beaten by a super cross. Upset though I am, respect should be paid to Bosingwa especially but all the Chelsea team for playing their roles so well.

It was a fantastic cross, a bloody nightmare for any defender as its in between the back 4 and the keeper, forces the deneders to defend facing their own goals and the attackers have the run on them. But Bosingwa was given too much space for the cross as well BAE has a habbit of not closing players down quick enough, or standing a yard too much off them.

You only have to follow the logical argument about what would have happened if Charlie OR Lennon had decided to stick to Cashley. The simple answer is that Bosingwa would almost certainly have delivered an equally great cross for Ballack or Lampard or another player and created another good goalscoring chance.

Face it. Chelsea are and were bloody good and we have many mitigating factors. I'd rather we lost this one when the odds are stacked against us, so we can get better for matches that are in the balance.

and to do so we need to pick up on the defencive frailties we have had this season (this isn't the first game...) and improve them

 

[WhiteStripe]

Simple facts:
1.It was a penalty.
2.The referee has to a)book Keane for diving or b) give a penalty.
3.Chelsea should have had 1 penalty as Ekotto handballed.
4.Crouch should have had a penalty based on the fact Cole was not even attempting to get the ball when he pushed him.

 

[WexfordTownSpur]

Simple facts:
1.It was a penalty.
2.The referee has to a)book Keane for diving or b) give a penalty.
3.Chelsea should have had 1 penalty as Ekotto handballed.
4.Crouch should have had a penalty based on the fact Cole was not even attempting to get the ball when he pushed him.

Still think we didn't do enough to win the game, especially second half.....

 

[WhiteStripe]

Still think we didn't do enough to win the game, especially second half.....

I 100% agree, and to be honest if we had had a pen, and scored at 1-1, I had no confidence in our defence to stop them scoring again.

That said, it is a hell of a lot easier to dominate a match at 2-0 up, rather than at 1-1.

 

[worcestersauce]

I think the idea that we were beaten by the better team may have some merit but had we found the back of the net and won would we be saying we didn't deserve it? I don't think so.
The fact is that we did match them and didn't really look second best while Ledley was playing and until he went off we'd had more shots on goal, his injury put heart into chelsea and yet we still got chances, there is no excuse for the poor penalty decision, which reinforced chelsea's confidence and was another knock to our resolve and ultimately did have an effect on the outcome bearing in mind that it would have to have been a red card if given.
Maybe we've just done something to upset Howard Webb.

Crucial injuries and poor decisions will make the difference against a team as good as chelsea and ultimately they were the critical factors unlike last week when we were eventually well beaten by a far better side on the day.

Nevertheless I can't shake off the sense that this is just one game and it's importance shouldn't be overstated, we ain't going to win the title this year so losing to the two teams that are going to contest it may not in the end make a great deal of difference to our season.

 

[BringBack_leGin]

Nonsense. As I've written elsewhere in the thread, I was as close to the incident as Webb and I would not have given the penalty.

Watching MOTD last night, I had the advantage of seeing the incident in slow motion from 4 different angles. One of those angles showed that Carvalho had made contact with Keane. Keane carried on a further stride before going down making it look like a dive.

Referees do not have the advantage of instant replays. Unless the referee is absolutely sure that there has been contact, he cannot give a penalty. I would rather referees err on the side of the defence rather than give dubious penalties such as the one Webb gave last year at OT, the one away at Seville, and the Ronaldo dive at WHL.

Perhaps football needs to follow cricket, tennis, rugby and American football in allowing the captain/manager a limited number of 'challenges' that will be referred to an 'umpire' with access to replays.

I too was extremely close to the incident. As I said in my little summary, I was in line with the 6 yard line on the side of the incident and only a few rows up (tackle crunches could be heard) as I was taken to the match by my Chelsea supporting friend. For me it was plainly obvious that the man had been taken and the ball not touched, and that was at the instant it happened, not with any replay or hindsight benefit.

As for the bit in bold, that's a great idea.

while Corluka was murdered by Cole and Malouda, and was nowhere near Cole for the goal. I find this inexcusable, because Corluka can deal with pacey opponents, but he needs to pull his finger out.

I would like to qualify the above a little. The part that I'm saying is inexcusable is not that he was nowhere near Cole, but that he was murdered by pace throughout the game, and this is because I remember very well his job on a flying, on form Ashley Young last season.

 

[Bobishism]

I would like to qualify the above a little. The part that I'm saying is inexcusable is not that he was nowhere near Cole, but that he was murdered by pace throughout the game, and this is because I remember very well his job on a flying, on form Ashley Young last season.

To counter; how about when Rooney and Ronaldo ripped him a new one in the 5-2 defeat last season?

 

[BringBack_leGin]

To counter; how about when Rooney and Ronaldo ripped him a new one in the 5-2 defeat last season?

Yes, he was awful that night against two players both in the top 5 in their position on the planet doubling up on him while on the form of their lives in a game where our entire team lost its cool in the second half and even the usually infallible ledley king was made to look poor, not to mention the much loved wilson palacios, the immune from criticism luka modric and just about every other player in our side.

 

[Luka Lennon]

Yes, he was awful that night against two players both in the top 5 in their position on the planet doubling up on him while on the form of their lives in a game where our entire team lost its cool in the second half and even the usually infallible ledley king was made to look poor, not to mention the much loved wilson palacios, the immune from criticism luka modric and just about every other player in our side.

:rofl: Brilliant

same thing happened yesterday, Lenno tucked in offered him very little/ no support and Cole and Ballack/Malouda stitched him up real good

samething happened to Ekotto on the left. Ancellotti tactically merked us on the flanks